Should christians refer to GOD as Allah

  • Thread starter Thread starter DRIVING_BEAR
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
swariffin said:
In Indonesia, we call God the Father (not Jesus, not the Holy Spirit) as “Allah Bapa”. Literally the word Bapa means Father and the word Allah means God. Allah in this case means exactly as God. So, the words are interchangeable without necessarily lose the meaning. The ancient hebrew used Adonay, Ellohim, YHWH, El Shaddai or Jahwe/Jehovah to refer to our God the Father. I do not believe that our God really cares. Sure He does not mind for us to call Him in a certain name. He knows that we are looking for Him, and He will be happy. Interestingly, some of our moslem brothers (the hardliners) promote to ban non-moslem to use the word “Allah”. Such promotion did not make any ground to other moslems as far as we know. By the way, the Catholic are minority here in Indonesia. But, I disagree to the Bishop to use the word Allah just for the purpose of promotion to the our moslem brothers. We can use any name to refer to God the Father, but we can not use a certain name/word just for a purpose other than worshipping God.
Click to expand...
Wonderful to hear from a fellow Catholic in Indonesia! Since “Allah” is an Arabic word, it should be used in that language. Each language has its own word for God, the father. The Muslim hardliners have hi-jacked God’s name for their own, evil purposes. They lie when they use the name, because the father of lies, the evil one, plants those ideas in their heads.

You’re in my prayers.

The peace of Christ.
 
Nepenthe said:
Not ‘perhaps cognate.’ It is cognate.
Click to expand...
Thanks for clarifying.
So you have a problem with Latin mass? ‘Deus’ or ‘Deo’ aren’t okay with you?
Click to expand...
‘Deus’ is the LATIN word for God; It’s unnecessary to refer to God as ‘Deus’ when speaking in languages other than Latin. (I don’t have any problems with the EFotORR, by the way) If someone called God Deus in English, fine. But this Bishop tries to discourage saying theDutchword forGod.
As for canonizing the Buddha, the RCC did that quite a long time ago. You may have heard of a St. Josaphat, perhaps? Same guy.
Click to expand...
Yes, I’ve heard of that. But did the CC do it to please Buddhists, if St. Josaphat WAS Siddhatta Gottama?

Here in Japan, many (Catholic) family altars look like Buddhist ones, but does that mean the West should also imitate what Japanese Catholics are doing to please Buddhists? Did Japanese Catholics try to placate them by making their home altars look like Buddhist ones?
 
Aramis said:
I’ve no problem with Arabic (or related semitic language speakers) using the word Allah when speaking in that language.

I do have a problem with the Bishop suggesting that non-semitic speakers should do so.

I’ve a bigger problem still with the stated reasoning of appeasing gnostic heretics.
Click to expand...
👍 Ditto
 
He should be called Allah if that is the tongue of the believer. Otherwise, Heavenly Father, Holy Spirit, or Jesus Christ work just fine.
 
A rose by any other name would smell just as sweet! What id in a name? We refer to God in several different ways. What would be wrong with Allah? It refers to God.
 
mollydoggie2 said:
A rose by any other name would smell just as sweet! What id in a name? We refer to God in several different ways. What would be wrong with Allah? It refers to God.
Click to expand...
“I will bow down toward your holy temple and will praise your name for your love and your faithfulness, for you have exalted above all things your name and your word.”
  • Psalm 138:2
I don’t speak Arabic, so I don’t refer to God as Allah. I don’t speak Spanish so I don’t refer to God as Dios. I don’t speak French so I don’t refer to God as Dieux. I don’t speak…well, you get the idea. There’s nothing wrong with calling God Allah, so long as your not doing it to gain the favor of Muslims, or for the vanity of sounding “inclusive”. Why would the issue even arise if you don’t speak Arabic, or if you’re not praying with Arabic speaking Christians. If you are praying in English, I’m sure your Arab Christian brethren will lovingly tolerate your use of “God”.
 
I would say that Christians should use their native word for god to refer to God. Thus, Arabic-speaking Christians (as well as those whose Liturgical language is Arabic or Aramaic) should refer to him as Allah. However, based on the reactions in this thread, for example, Christians for whom the above doesn’t apply should not use “Allah”.
 
mollydoggie2 said:
A rose by any other name would smell just as sweet! What is in a name? We refer to God in several different ways. What would be wrong with Allah? It refers to God.
Click to expand...
**2-Page essay on why ALLAH has nothing at all to do with even the Jewish “Yahweh”**** let alone the Christian God in Trinity

**
The Dutch bishop and other Muslim fellow travelers think they can buy a fake peace with Islam by playing relativistic word games and extreme historical revisionism, as a part of an “inter-faith” dialogue.
But Muslims understand much better than do post-modern Europeans that ecumenical appeasement is a symptom of a Judeo-Christian civilization that
Click to expand...
has grown weak and indeed is in it’s final death throws…
 
TNT said:
2-Page essay on why ALLAH has nothing at all to do with even the Jewish "Yahweh" let alone the Christian God in Trinity
Click to expand...
But, under the traditional Catholic approach, that is incorrect.

In Catholic theology, when people worship one God–like the Jews or Muslims–it is considered to be the one true God. In Acts 17:23, St. Paul tells pagans they are worshipping the one true God:

“For passing by, and seeing your idols, I found an altar also, on which was written: To the unknown God. What therefore you worship, without knowing it, that I preach to you.”

Here are some more sources for this idea that Muslims worship the one true God:

Pope St. Gregory VII (11th century) to a Muslim prince: ‘Almighty God, who wishes that all should be saved and none lost, approves nothing in so much as that after loving Him one should love his fellow man, and that one should not do to others, what one does not want done to oneself. You and we owe this charity to ourselves especially because we believe in and confess one God, admittedly, in a different way, and daily praise and venerate him, the creator of the world and ruler of this world.’

Catechism of Pope St. Pius X : 12 Q. Who are infidels?
A. Infidels are those who have not been baptised and do not believe in Jesus Christ, because they either believe in and worship false gods as idolaters do, or though admitting one true God, they do not believe in the Messiah, neither as already come in the Person of Jesus Christ, nor as to come; for instance, Mohammedans and the like.

Catholic Encyclopedia: As in ecclesiastical language those who by baptism have received faith in Jesus Christ and have pledged Him their fidelity and called the faithful, so the name infidel is given to those who have not been baptized. The term applies not only to all who are ignorant of the true God, such as pagans of various kinds, but also to those who adore Him but do not recognize Jesus Christ, as Jews and Mohammedans.

Also see this chapter on Islam in Hillair Belloc’s "Great Heresies."
ewtn.com/library/HOMELIBR/HERESY4.TXT

Second Vatican Council: The Church regards with esteem also the Moslems. They adore the one God, living and subsisting in Himself; merciful and all- powerful, the Creator of heaven and earth, who has spoken to men; they take pains to submit wholeheartedly to even His inscrutable decrees, just as Abraham, with whom the faith of Islam takes pleasure in linking itself, submitted to God.
 
Per the OP:

Unless the tradition or custom of your particular Church is to pray in Arabic and refer to God as such, I think we should refrain from using the term Allah, as in non-Arabic speaking places it implies certain notions about God that are false. It would be misleading to use Arabic in non-Arabic places.
 
Nepenthe said:
As for canonizing the Buddha, the RCC did that quite a long time ago. You may have heard of a St. Josaphat, perhaps? Same guy.
Click to expand...
This is the Ukranian St. Josaphat Bishop and Martyr we are talking about to right? :confused:
Is there another St. Josaphat?

As for calling God “allah” I object to it unless if you are an individual who uses the term as in reffering to the Holy Trinity in an Eastern Rite Liturgy or an Arabic Liturgy. However, using “allah” as a term for God to please Muslims is not appropriate. Please pray for the bishop, however do not slander or condemn him.
 
May God be with you.

As Christians who believe in a Trinitarian God, we cannot call God Allah because Allah is one.

I believe there is more to the story than the media posted (now there’s a surprise!!!) So I think some personal digging is in order to get to the truth.

God bless you!
 
Donna_P said:
May God be with you.

As Christians who believe in a Trinitarian God, we cannot call God Allah because Allah is one.
Click to expand...
The Trinitarian God is one too. Again, when St. Paul discovered the pagans worshiping one God, he said it was the true God–and they saw Him as one person and not three.
 
CathMass said:
However, using “allah” as a term for God to please Muslims is not appropriate. Please pray for the bishop, however do not slander or condemn him.
Click to expand...
It is reasonable to use the same term as the Muslims, if so doing will reduce misunderstanding. The problem is that it might give the wrong message about the status the Church gives to Mohammed’s loqutions. The bishop is wrong, but politically, not theologically.
 
mollydoggie2 said:
A rose by any other name would smell just as sweet! What id in a name? We refer to God in several different ways. What would be wrong with Allah? It refers to God.
Click to expand...
The problem is not in the denotation (the absolute definition of the word) but in the connotation of the word (what people think it means.) The denotation of the word is “God” but the connotation of the word is “the God of Islam who gave the Koran to Muhammad.” This can only lead to confusion in the minds of Catholics and non-Catholics alike.
 
Athanasian creed:
Code: 
“Now the catholic faith is that we worship One God in Trinity and Trinity in Unity, neither confounding the Persons nor dividing the substance. For there is one Person of the Father, another of the Son, another of the Holy Spirit. But the Godhead of the Father, of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit, is One, the Glory equal, the Majesty coeternal.”
Islam vehemently rejects the doctrine of God as revealed.

Islam denies the Trinity:
Code: 
"Certainly they disbelieve those who say: Surely Allah is the third (person) of the three; and there is no god but the one God, and if they desist not from what they say, a painful chastisement shall befall those among them who disbelieve" (Sura 5:73).

“O People of the Scripture! Do not exaggerate in your religion nor utter aught concerning Allah save the truth. The Messiah, Jesus son of Mary, was only a messenger of Allah, and His word which He conveyed unto Mary, and a spirit from Him. So believe in Allah and His messengers, and say not "Three" - Cease! (it is) better for you! - Allah is only One Allah. Far is it removed from His Transcendent Majesty that He should have a son” (Sura 4:171).
Islam denies the Father and the Son:
Code: 
“The Christians say: The Messiah is the son of Allah; these are the words of their mouths; they imitate the saying of those who disbelieved before; may Allah destroy them" (Sura 9:29-30).

“It does not befit GOD that He begets a son, be He glorified” (Sura 19:35).
Islam denies the Deity of Christ:
Code: 
“The Messiah, Jesus the son of Mary, was no more than God’s apostle” (Sura 4).

“They do blaspheme who say: "Allah is Christ the son of Mary” (Sura 5:72).

“And when Allah saith: O Jesus, son of Mary! Didst thou say unto mankind: Take me and my mother for two gods beside Allah? he saith: Be glorified! It was not mine to utter that to which I had no right” (Sura 5:116).

“In blasphemy indeed are those that say that Allah is Christ the son of Mary” (Sura 5:17).
Clearly then, the Qur’an denies:
Code: 
1. The Trinity;
2. The Sonship of Christ;
3. The Deity of Christ.
  1. The essential Fatherhood of God.
John 3:
36 He that believeth in the Son, hath life everlasting; but he that believeth not the Son, shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him.

John 5:
23 That all men may honour the Son, as they honour the Father. He who honours not the Son, honours not the Father, who hath sent him.

1 John :
10 He that believes in the Son of God, has the testimony of God in himself. He that believes not the Son, makes him a liar: because he believes not in the testimony which God hath testified of his Son.​

12 He that hath the Son, hath life. He that hath not the Son, hath not life.

2 John:
Whosoever transgresses, and abides not in the doctrine of Christ, has not God. He that abides in the doctrine of Christ, he has both the Father and the Son.​

Nope, not the same God at all.​

However, I admit, the Ecumenical gods are very much the same god.
 
Not the same god:
B16:
**“Violence is incompatible with the nature of God and the nature of the soul.”
**
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top