Should Government Take over Health Care?

[Fawkes]

Short answer; No.

Longer answer: The only way the g’ment should be involved in healthcare reform is by doing the exact opposite of what they are currently doing. The only real solution is through tort reform. Suppress the slimy trial lawyers, instead of inviting them into the bed of the Congress.

Deregulate, deregulate, deregulate. Foster a true competition between healthcare providers AND insurance companies.

Take away the benefit of health insurance from employers. This would free up funds for the companies, therefore being able to hire more people, reinvest in their business, and increase wages. This also forces people to shop their own insurance, thereby driving down insurance premiums through competition.

Am I the only one that didn’t sleep through basic economics? Because this all seems very elementary.

 

[gakroeger]

Short answer; No.

Longer answer: The only way the g’ment should be involved in healthcare reform is by doing the exact opposite of what they are currently doing. The only real solution is through tort reform. Suppress the slimy trial lawyers, instead of inviting them into the bed of the Congress.

Deregulate, deregulate, deregulate. Foster a true competition between healthcare providers AND insurance companies.

Take away the benefit of health insurance from employers. This would free up funds for the companies, therefore being able to hire more people, reinvest in their business, and increase wages. This also forces people to shop their own insurance, thereby driving down insurance premiums through competition.

Am I the only one that didn’t sleep through basic economics? Because this all seems very elementary.

Tort reform is indeed the biggest need with regard to health care reform. Like most of the problems we face today, those in power are connected to the problem makers so closely that they refuse to address the real problems and continually place the blame elsewhere to keep people from focusing on the real issues.

There can be no question that the single greatest reason for the sky rocketing cost of medical care is the enormous cost of those in the medical field to protect themselves against ridiculous law suits. In our area in Southwest Florida one cannot walk by a television set and not hear expensive commercials begging people to come to their legal offices for free consultations on how they can sue some medical organization or person to gain untold wealth at no cost them. Where do people think this money comes from but those who need medical care? Doctors, hospitals, clinics, and everyone involved in health care must pass on to their patients the high cost of carrying malpractice insurance. Yes, we need legal protection but we do not need lawyers promoting unwarranted law suits and spending billions of dollars advertizing for people who would otherwise never consider a law suit. This administration points to we the people as a “special interest group” when in fact they and their lawyer lobbyist are the “special interest group”. Most of those in power are lawyers and are the problem.

We have whole businesses that have thrived on advertizing to those who may be eligible for expensive power driven wheel chairs and other nice but maybe unnecessary equipment that drains Medicare of funds needed for genuine serious health issues. We have heard this administration talk about limiting needed medical care for the elderly but have not heard them talk about the waste in Medicare caused by those profiteering from others needs.

Same is true of other problem areas such as abortion; this administration is in bed with Planned Parenthood and the entire pro choice pro abortion crowd.

It is so clear and obvious to anyone with an open mind; however, many have been so politically entrenched that they cannot see the forest for the trees.

 

[TEPO]

Donn’t get too up in arms over him, business is his whole world.

Up in arms over who? The poster? npatrol:

 

[TEPO]

As long as healthcare uses a business model, profits will come before people.

Thats a wild claim. Any “service” is not a God given right… Nobody works for other people for free -not even in Canada or Europe. The government cannot change this.

It comes down to this: some people want to keep government small, and some people unfortunately dont care about size of government. I think that your allegiance to a particular political party has blurred your concern on this important issue -because certain parties promote their subjects to overlook these issues, which in turn, undermines you! Perhaps your party affiliation has caused this problem for you. You should not show allegiance to your party, but to God.

Big government is not the answer.

 

[TEPO]

Is it true that what it all boils down to is: some people want to keep government small, while others dont care?

Why do we always have to settle for only the options that “big brother” allows us to see? If you are so loyal to your party -that you follow its every move and in turn ignore the real threat of large govornment, then you have lost your own stride. You have willfully become one of their subjects.

Please understand the Catholic stance.

osjspm.org/major_themes.aspx
5.Role of Government and Subsidiarity

The state has a positive moral function. It is an instrument to promote human dignity, protect human rights, and build the common good. All people have a right and a responsibility to participate in political institutions so that government can achieve its proper goals.

The principle of subsidiarity holds that the functions of government should be performed at the lowest level possible, as long as they can be performed adequately. When the needs in question cannot adequately be met at the lower level, then it is not only necessary, but imperative that higher levels of government intervene.

So the key role government needs to play here is to lift the ban on interstate competition. You see, we dont need government to take over healthcare… It is unnecessary since we already have a healthcare system for the poor… -Medicaid-

In fact, Catholic Social Teaching on government is geared more toward third world countries where people have no rights and no dignity. Places where government must do everything. The United States is obviously much more advanced than that. Our job here is to keep government at its lowest level…

 

[aspawloski4th]

Short answer; No.

Longer answer: The only way the g’ment should be involved in healthcare reform is by doing the exact opposite of what they are currently doing. The only real solution is through tort reform. Suppress the slimy trial lawyers, instead of inviting them into the bed of the Congress.

Deregulate, deregulate, deregulate. Foster a true competition between healthcare providers AND insurance companies.

Take away the benefit of health insurance from employers. This would free up funds for the companies, therefore being able to hire more people, reinvest in their business, and increase wages. This also forces people to shop their own insurance, thereby driving down insurance premiums through competition.

Am I the only one that didn’t sleep through basic economics? Because this all seems very elementary.

Treating life or death matters like mere busniness is morally wrong. Companies started having health benefits as a way to compete for employees, yes businesses should not only have to compete for customers they should have to compete for the personal to serve those customers too. Now businesses dont compete foranything. They are in colusion together agiainst all of us.

 

[gakroeger]

Treating life or death matters like mere busniness is morally wrong. Companies started having health benefits as a way to compete for employees, yes businesses should not only have to compete for customers they should have to compete for the personal to serve those customers too. Now businesses dont compete foranything. They are in colusion together agiainst all of us.

This is a pretty broad and ambiguous statement. If you mean it is morally wrong to sell health insurance can you support that statement with any Church teaching?

To place all business in the same category as being in collusion against all of us is a tremendous stretch. Some businesses like some people and some politicians are corrupt; it is untrue and unfair to claim that they all are.

This being stated and looking at how our representatives have decided that our health care plan is not good enough for them, why would you trust them to devise and run a health care plan for you. I would rather trust several for profit companies competing in a fair market for our business.

Too many people do not realize that the government does not have any money of their own. All the money they have is ours and they have collected it from us through taxes. Since they are spending more than we have given them, they are now deficit spending our children and grand children’s money that they have not even earned yet.

Is this really what you want?

 

[Ella]

Please understand the Catholic stance.

In fact, Catholic Social Teaching on government is geared more toward third world countries where people have no rights and no dignity. Places where government must do everything. The United States is obviously much more advanced than that. Our job here is to keep government at its lowest level…

Are the public health care systems in Spain and Italy against ‘the Catholic stance’? What about the Vatican?

 

[josephdavid]

Are the public health care systems in Spain and Italy against ‘the Catholic stance’? What about the Vatican?

Let me expand on this. Does the Public Option deny you who can see in regards to doctors, specialists or hospitals? No.

Does the current bills being offered in the House and Senate have pre-existing conditions? No

Do you have to go with the public option? No… However! There are some that want to add on that if you do not have health insurance they force you to have one of the 2 (public or private) I say no to that. however in general the answer is no.

Is the subsidiarity currently doing a good job in providing for all and it is equal and affordable? The answer is no.

This does not violate Catholic principles. If the answers were yes. Then I would agree and not support investigating and perhaps creating a public option.

Now outside of that. I personally would like to see our governement act responsibly by not rushing this into vote just so they can secure re-election and secure their six figure salaries AND their public option that all Congressment and President have access to!

Take time make earnest regulation to the current private industry (remove exception of anti-trust regulation, remove pre-existing conditions. etc). At the same time fix the problems with Medicare (although small, meaning 94% like their Medicarre), to eliminate fraud and wasteful practices that currently happen in Medicare (such as not able to negotiate with the pharma companies). Then offer Medicare to everyone regardless of income level, at just rate to all.

However, sadly that will not get done. Why? Because both parties are bought and paid for by the health care industries (millions by the insurance industries and pharma industries). So they will mess this up and go half way. The private industries will continue to raise premiums (up 150% in 10 years versus 30% in wages) and pay for their million and billion dollar salary. Futher contributing to the demise of what can be a wonderful nation.

 

[gakroeger]

Are the public health care systems in Spain and Italy against ‘the Catholic stance’? What about the Vatican?

Have you read the Bishops statement?

 

[fultonfish]

Donn’t get too up in arms over him, business is his whole world.

Actually, I worked in government. First hand experience at witnessing unChristian inefficiency and corruption.

 

[Lynxdk]

This is a pretty broad and ambiguous statement. If you mean it is morally wrong to sell health insurance can you support that statement with any Church teaching?

Do you have any real idea how many people in the US lack the basic necessities? Food, shelter, basic medical care? Let alone including the whole world in that, millions upon millions without. I really don’t understand how a group of people can get so up in arms about abortion issues, and yet it stops there. Once they’re born, they’re on their own.

How is it right that people die from medical issues that could other wise have been treated if they had even basic healthcare while insurance CEO’s make millions of dollars a year? Do you seriously need a specific Church Teaching ™ to tell you there’s something not right about this stuff?

 

[gakroeger]

Do you have any real idea how many people in the US lack the basic necessities? Food, shelter, basic medical care? Let alone including the whole world in that, millions upon millions without. I really don’t understand how a group of people can get so up in arms about abortion issues, and yet it stops there. Once they’re born, they’re on their own.

How is it right that people die from medical issues that could other wise have been treated if they had even basic healthcare while insurance CEO’s make millions of dollars a year? Do you seriously need a specific Church Teaching ™ to tell you there’s something not right about this stuff?

Yes, I do have an idea, I work visiting and helping the poor on a regular basis. We need to help each other and not rely on the government to play robin hood. The government has proven over an over they are incapable.

 

[yinandyang]

I was hoping to be able to throw my two cents into the national argument regarding the government change to healthcare that is being proposed to us by our civil servants today, and also I was hoping to ask some questions as well. I’ve personally thought and struggled with this political issue for some years now, long before it became headline news. A few points come to mind, which I would like to share.

First though, I wanted to ask a question that I never hear mentioned. Why don’t we start with the root of the problem? I believe most people who support a government change to healthcare feel we have a healthcare crisis issue due to economics, (i.e. cost, supply and demand etc). Well, why don’t we start by telling doctors and hospitals they shouldn’t charge so much for their services? It’s just something I was wondering about, personally I believe in the free market, but if people are so interested in changing things and having the government dictate pricing, then why not start with doctors and hospitals? They’re the root of the problem, due to the absorbinant amount of money they charge people. The insurance companies just offer a way for people to pay those outrageous costs, right? People aren’t forced to “buy into” the insurance companies plans, but they are forced to accept the doctor’s and hospital’s prices, aren’t they?

I remember my mother telling me stories when I was little about how the doctor would actually come to your house when you were sick and only charge you 5 (that’s right 5) dollars. The costs today are ridiculous, and look at how lavish doctors live today, with their million dollar houses, fancy cars, yatchs etc. And the hospital business I’m sure is a multi billion dollar industry as well. Why do the insurance companies get all the blame? It’s just a question I had before I moved on to my main points. Any answers would be greatly appreciated.

My first point on this issue is that if the government becomes more involved and possibly takes over healthcare, then it will be in charge of providing a nationwide service to people as well as being responsible for monitoring itself at the same time. To me this sounds very dangerous. I think that if anyone proposed to get rid of the government oversight committees that monitor the private sector, then the same people promoting this government take-over (ie the Obama administration and the Democrats) would be up in arms, and rightly so. The reason, obviously, is because then the private sector would be left to monitor itself as well as provide services, and this would lead to unfathomable amounts of corruption and evil. Is it really that hard to admit then, that a government takeover, where the government provides the services and then is in charge of monitoring itself, would be just as corrupt and evil, if not more so, given the power of the federal government?

Also, if we’re going to governmentalize healthcare, why stop there? Why shouldn’t we nationalize every business that now provides food (fast food businesses, restaurants, grocery stores etc)? Food is actually more necessary than healthcare for survival is it not? I know this might sound silly (hopefully it does) but I think the point needs to be made.

And why stop there, let’s governmentalize everything else why we’re at it, that way our economy can never get this bad again, right? Wait a minute though, that’s what Communistic Russia did, and their economy actually DID collapse, long before ours took the hit that it did…

(I’ll continue in my next post)

 

[yinandyang]

And let’s not forget, the Catholic Church is supposed to be one of the greatest opponents of Communism in the world. I just wish the Bishops would continue in their anti-communistic beleifs when it comes to government healthcare as well. They however, have been, (through fundraising) and still are supporting what I feel is an administration that not only supports Communistic ideology but also supports abortion, gay marriage/rights, stem-cell research, public education over private schools etc (which is mind boggling to me, since the Catholic Church is one of the biggest providers of private education in the country).

All of this is quite a shock, and unbelievable to me, since these are things the Church says it is in opposition of. Do we really think that God is going to say, “Oh OK well you voted for a group of people that inacted legislation that killed millions of babies, that promoted homosexual marriage/behavior (which is an abomination unto the Lord, let’s be honest here people), that promulgated stem cell research, promoted atheistic public education, attacked Chrisitanity, destroyed our nations morals, and corrupted our civil institutions with unprecidented power and greed, but hey at least they did set up a horrendous healthcare system and raised your taxes”?

It’s time for us to break out the smelling salts and come back to reality folks.

I love the Catholic Church and the Bishops, as well as the rest of the clergy, with all my heart, and would gladly lay down my life for the faith, but we must always stand up for truth, even within the Church Itself, or we are nothing but hypocrits and liars. I hope my words are taken as coming from a loving heart that only wishes to see the Lord’s will manifest Itself here on earth.

To me, politics and power grabbing, as well as government greed (wanting to tax us to death and have complete control over every aspect of our lives) seem to be the driving forces behind this initiative. I know those who don’t agree with me will probibly end up calling me a right wing radical or will come up with some other clever “sound bite” like insult, but that’s OK. I know that we, the people, are right on this issue and that God agrees with us and is with us, no matter who tries to take away our liberties and freedoms.

Subsidiarity should be the driving idea for all Catholics when we examine this issue. In the case of government, bigger is not always better, actually more often than not bigger is badder, or worse. This has been shown countless times, even here in America, by programs such as Medicare and the like.

We need less government control, more competition, more accountability, more tax breaks for those in need, and we need to allow the Church, and also demand from the Church, that It needs to stand up and take It’s place in providing services for things like healthcare ( through religious hospitals) and education (through religious schools), which would cut costs tremendously, and minister in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ at the same time, all the while providing excellent services to those in need. Let’s not replace the Church and the private sector, with big government please. God can use this debate to further His kingdom if we only let Him by going along with His will.

I thank everyone, in advance, for reading this and for those who respond, for their insight and opinions.

May God, in His infinite wisdom and goodness guide this nation, and every other nation, so that we, as His creation, may make His will manifest fully here on earth; In the name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit, Amen.

Mother Mary pray for us.

 

[fultonfish]

Since healthcare services are so important, should we be willing to force certain individuals to become healthcare professionals, if for example they didn’t want to be in that field, but they took tests that indicated they had a natural ability in that field?

 

[fultonfish]

Do you have any real idea how many people in the US lack the basic necessities? Food, shelter, basic medical care?

Actually, no one lacks for basic necessities: food, shelter, basic medical care.

Between the government, private charities and religious groups, the basics are taken care of. That’s why there are so many welfare programs ranging from soup kitchens, food pantries, all sorts of counseling and social workers, Medicaid, and the ability to walk into emergency rooms and clinics for free health care.

If someone wants more than the basics, they have to be somewhat more creative that may include more extensive charitable or government assistance or worst case, taking a job.

The reason why people work is that they want more than just the basics or they want access to more than just the basics. If their desire to work was purely altruistic, then they would gladly work for free. However, most people want some financial remuneration that will allow them to pay for their material needs and wants.

 

[josephdavid]

Have you read the Bishops statement?

Yes she did. Did you? They are worried about abortion.Any Bill made to Law will be enacted by the Dept. of HHS. Which is undre the Hyde Amendment. They can not fund any medical procedure which is abortion.

 

[josephdavid]

And let’s not forget, the Catholic Church is supposed to be one of the greatest opponents of Communism in the world. I just wish the Bishops would continue in their anti-communistic beleifs when it comes to government healthcare as well. They however, have been, (through fundraising) and still are supporting what I feel is an administration that not only supports Communistic ideology but also supports abortion, gay marriage/rights, stem-cell research, public education over private schools etc (which is mind boggling to me, since the Catholic Church is one of the biggest providers of private education in the country).

All of this is quite a shock, and unbelievable to me, since these are things the Church says it is in opposition of. Do we really think that God is going to say, “Oh OK well you voted for a group of people that inacted legislation that killed millions of babies, that promoted homosexual marriage/behavior (which is an abomination unto the Lord, let’s be honest here people), that promulgated stem cell research, promoted atheistic public education, attacked Chrisitanity, destroyed our nations morals, and corrupted our civil institutions with unprecidented power and greed, but hey at least they did set up a horrendous healthcare system and raised your taxes”?

It’s time for us to break out the smelling salts and come back to reality folks.

I love the Catholic Church and the Bishops, as well as the rest of the clergy, with all my heart, and would gladly lay down my life for the faith, but we must always stand up for truth, even within the Church Itself, or we are nothing but hypocrits and liars. I hope my words are taken as coming from a loving heart that only wishes to see the Lord’s will manifest Itself here on earth.

To me, politics and power grabbing, as well as government greed (wanting to tax us to death and have complete control over every aspect of our lives) seem to be the driving forces behind this initiative. I know those who don’t agree with me will probibly end up calling me a right wing radical or will come up with some other clever “sound bite” like insult, but that’s OK. I know that we, the people, are right on this issue and that God agrees with us and is with us, no matter who tries to take away our liberties and freedoms.

Subsidiarity should be the driving idea for all Catholics when we examine this issue. In the case of government, bigger is not always better, actually more often than not bigger is badder, or worse. This has been shown countless times, even here in America, by programs such as Medicare and the like.

We need less government control, more competition, more accountability, more tax breaks for those in need, and we need to allow the Church, and also demand from the Church, that It needs to stand up and take It’s place in providing services for things like healthcare ( through religious hospitals) and education (through religious schools), which would cut costs tremendously, and minister in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ at the same time, all the while providing excellent services to those in need. Let’s not replace the Church and the private sector, with big government please. God can use this debate to further His kingdom if we only let Him by going along with His will.

I thank everyone, in advance, for reading this and for those who respond, for their insight and opinions.

May God, in His infinite wisdom and goodness guide this nation, and every other nation, so that we, as His creation, may make His will manifest fully here on earth; In the name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit, Amen.

Mother Mary pray for us.

Show me how this is communism ?

 

[pathia]

Actually, no one lacks for basic necessities: food, shelter, basic medical care.

Between the government, private charities and religious groups, the basics are taken care of. That’s why there are so many welfare programs ranging from soup kitchens, food pantries, all sorts of counseling and social workers, Medicaid, and the ability to walk into emergency rooms and clinics for free health care.

Sure, this is why I stumbled around homeless for six months and raided trashcans of fast food restaurants for food. I had to shift around several cities until I found a homeless shelter willing to let me just spend the night, I was not allowed in about a dozen of them before that, they didn’t want me using either bathroom, so asked me to try another shelter, and so did the next once…rinse and repeat.