Should I say something

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Anglewannabe

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I have a friend from church. What I really like about her is she is a devout Catholic. Sadly most people I meet go to church out of habit and do not see the point of following all the church teachings. And people like her are few and far between.

However, it has gotten to the point where her husband has hurt my feelings once too often and I want to speak up but I don’t know how. He has a good career and I am sure he is a hard worker. However, he is one of those people who seems to get his worth as a human from his career success and thinks he is a notch above everyone else because of it. He will often make uncharitable remarks. For example, if someone else’s kid is struggling in school he will say things ‘Well, we do need people to pump gas’. Being unemployed these comments really hurt me. I just feel like screaming ‘If he was not pumping gas, how would you get to drive your fancy car’.

And, it is very obvious his wife shares his attitude. If they were secular people, I would brush it off more easily. But when I see all they do for the church yet have no compassion for me, I am baffled. They are so busy making sure the church has greeters and readers and Eucharistic ministers which are all positive things. But Jesus told us to ‘love each other as I have loved you’ and to care for the widow and orphans. I might not be a widow or an orphan, but at this point I am one of the unfortunates of society and when they are around me, it is so obvious that is one part of the bible they don’t practice.

To be honest, I don’t expect them to help me because I know there is nothing they can do to help me find a job (except perhaps pray). And I understand it is my responsibility to apply for jobs. But when ‘John Smith’ looses his job and I say ‘How sad, I must remember to pray for him’ and this guy says ‘I am not surprised the guy was lazy’, I am finding it REALLY hard to keep biting my tongue.

Honestly, my biggest fear is anything I say to this guy, he will be polite to my face but in the back of his mind (and possibly behind my back) he will be saying ‘that Angie is so wrong’

Any words of wisdom?

Angie
 
I’m Really sorry… but there is nothing you can do about this Drip. !
They annoy the Daylights out of me as well… Whatever you say, they always have some Smart Comeback… and because your unemployed,they say…
Well no wonder he/she can’t get a job… etc … looser etc…
it’s easier said than done… but ignore the comments… if you can… you can’t win…
I’m sure there would be a Bible Quote someone will come up with…
 
Id avoid them, you dont need to be around folk like that who bad mouth others, they may not even be as holy as they seem, their helping the church may be so that they get attention eg"look at us, we are better than you "…
 
crystal_waters said:
they may not even be as holy as they seem, their helping the church may be so that they get attention eg"look at us, we are better than you "…
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I hate to admit it to myself, but I think you are on to something. I think one advantage of them helping out is they get to control everything. Sadly, they are in a way the ‘glue’ that keeps a lot of the social church activities going. The only way to totally avoid them would be to find another parish to get involved in.

I know the following is my hurt talking and might be self centered but here it goes : I wonder if perhaps God wants me to confront them in a polite way in order for them to see where they are wrong so they can become more holy.

I just feel that to walk away without first trying to speak up and trying to work it out is me running from my problems. After all, I can’t keep switching churches every time I am mad at someone

Angie
 
Is there a part of you that is jealous that this couple has had material success in life?

I can see myself saying something along the lines of, “Well, we need people to pump gas.” Not in a nasty way, but it’s true that not everyone has the capacity or the desire to pursue higher education, and yes, we do need people to fill every kind of job. I don’t think it’s rude to point that out.

Maybe this is just a guy that says what he’s thinking and lacks tact? Was the man who lost his job a little lazy? It isn’t necessary to say so, obviously, but some people just don’t have good filters for what constitutes polite conversation.

It doesn’t sound like this person is trying to hurt you or like he is targeting you for these comments; he’s just kind of a loudmouth. If you are at all on the sensitive side, and prone to getting your feelings hurt, his personality might not be a good fit for a close friendship. I’d simply limit contact and smile and walk away if he starts to bug you.
 
Phil_Marinus said:
I’m Really sorry… but there is nothing you can do about this Drip. !
They annoy the Daylights out of me as well… Whatever you say, they always have some Smart Comeback… and because your unemployed,they say…
Well no wonder he/she can’t get a job… etc … looser etc…
it’s easier said than done… but ignore the comments… if you can… you can’t win…
I’m sure there would be a Bible Quote someone will come up with…
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1 Corinthians 15:10

Douay-Rheims Bible
‘But by the grace of God, I am what I am; and his grace in me hath not been void, but I have laboured more abundantly than all they: yet not I, but the grace of God with me.’

Or to put it simply - ‘There but for the grace of God go I’ {and as an addendum} ‘goes he’.
 
When I read your post I thought of a remark by a late-18th century Protestant minister: The Church is not a hotel for saints, it is a hospital for sinners."

Aren’t we all sinners in some way or ways? Even those heavily involved in important and wonderful ways in each parish?

I’m sorry the couple has hurt you, but please work on forgiving them, don’t look for bad motives, and look for and appreciate their goodness and service.

Maybe God is using you in ways you don’t know about – maybe you are being called to be a light of love and humility for the couple. Or maybe God intends for you to improve in the area of forgiveness.

Each and every one of us has so much growth to accomplish in our earthly pilgrimages. We’re all hypocrites – striving to be good, striving to be a model for others as we share our Lord’s Good News in what we say and do, and falling short so much of the time in our journeys toward moral perfection and toward our heavenly Father.

Don’t demonize that couple. They love God, and they love the Church, and they probably love the unemployed or underemployed more than you know. They’re just not fully aware that they’ve got to work on that arrogance or insensitivity of theirs. Pray for them.
And rejoice for them and with them, because of the goodness God has given them.

Hang in there, the world is cruel, sometimes especially to the needy. I hope you find a job soon. Remember you are loved.

**Rejoice in the Lord always. I shall say it again: rejoice! Your kindness should be known to all. The Lord is near. Have no anxiety at all, but in everything, by prayer and petition, with thanksgiving, make your requests known to God. Then the peace of God that surpasses all understanding will guard your hearts and minds in Christ Jesus.

Finally, brothers, whatever is true, whatever is honorable, whatever is just, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is gracious, if there is any excellence and if there is anything worthy of praise, think about these things. Keep on doing what you have learned and received and heard and seen in me. Then the God of peace will be with you.

(Philippians 4:4-9)**
 
Not to sound trite, but (and I am sure you already are) pray for them. And for yourself, for wisdom. I find most situations require little (name removed by moderator)ut by me. So why are they in your path? That is the rub. Continue to be light and love. We each sow our own seeds, we water others’. Encourage those elements of their lives that are most like Christ’s. Follow me, as I follow Christ.

Hope this helps and yes, I have said a prayer for you and your friends today too.

Dave
 
Yes I think you should say something…but not what you think you should say.
The most important thing you can “say” to this couple will be said in two ways.
  1. Through your example of Christian Love…and
  2. Through comments that you might make, not directed at them, but in response to certain things that they might say.
So - continue to cultivate your loving nature, outlook and gratitude for all that God has given you, seek the good in others and pray for guidance in dealing with thoughtless and unkind remarks. God will help you to find the words.

Myself…I have a rather odd sense of humor and when you relayed the comment, “well we need people to pump gas”…I immediately thought…"I wonder where they live. 😃
Where I live everyone pumps their own gas.

That said…I think that your initial thought was quite right. While his comment might have been said in a disparaging way, it was also quite true. We DO need people in every sort of task and each person, no matter what their job, their skill level, their education, is worthy of our thanks and our respect. Just think what our lives would be like without people doing such jobs.

Commenting in some way similar to this…that is expanding on what he has already said and turning it from a put down to something more loving and profound can, over time, begin to penetrate his consciousness.

In any event, it will allow you the opportunity to show Christ through your words and actions which I think is what you are feeling God calling you to.

Peace
James
 
There are actual people who pump gas? Like, I HATE pumping gas. I would love for someone to do that for me. I would even tip them!

I digress.
I agree with JackieMom. I don’t feel like he is trying to be rude. Maybe I have thicker skin? 🤷
 
The husband is tactless, period. In this economy to say that anyone who loses a job “deserves it” because of their laziness shows a total ignorance that people are suffering.

I don’t care if he does EVERY SINGLE job in the parish, I have real questions about individuals who can’t muster basic decency in everyday conversation.

You do not need contact with this person in your life. Pray for him, but remember your real reason for going to Church is NOT to be best buddy with this guy
 
JackieMom said:
I can see myself saying something along the lines of, “Well, we need people to pump gas.” Not in a nasty way, but it’s true that not everyone has the capacity or the desire to pursue higher education, and yes, we do need people to fill every kind of job. I don’t think it’s rude to point that out.
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I can see it this way, as well. I wonder if the pain and/or embarrassment of being unemployed makes you see judgement and condemnation where there is none? I ask because I sometimes feel insecure about my employment and I have to be careful to not project my own doubts and snarkiness onto other, innocent people.

If he had wanted to be cruel about it, he could have said something like, “He’s not going to get anywhere in life without a good education. What does he think he’s going to do, pump GAS all his life?” In comparison, “We need people to pump gas!” seems almost like a cheerful acknowledgement that there is a decent place in society for everyone, regardless of their intellectual achievements.

🤷
 
I am sorry that you have to deal with this couple at church which should be a peaceful sanctuary for you. But insensitive people can be found everywhere so don’t change your parish yet. You do have the option of calmly and politely yet sincerely disagreeing with him. Practice ahead of time what you would say so you are ready for his remarks. It won’t change him but at least you will feel better knowing that you gave your differing opinion. Some people have very little empathy for others UNTIL something unfortunate happens to them. Only then can they feel the pain. Try not to care what he thinks. And do pray for them because they need it. You could also go to another parish for confession and ask for advice. Best wishes in your job search. I’ll pray for you today.
 
Make an appointment with your own priest and say what you’ve said here. I know he probably won’t be able to tell you if anyone else has complained, but it wouldn’t hurt to ask. If there are others who have a problem with this man, they might have said something as well. Or if you overhear someone else say they have the same problem with this person, suggest to them that they talk with your priest as well. Then ask the priest to talk with him. Perferrably in private. If it comes from you, he may take it wrong or use it as an excuse to hurt you more. If the priest tells him that there are several concerns about his behavior, he might listen. Your priest may be able to tell him so that it doesn’t cause a bigger issue. That, I think, is the real problem.

Oops! I’m starting to ramble. Better shut up now before I become redundant. :eek:
 
First of all, no one should ever be jealous of another’s success, we are all successful in our own ways, as Jesus said, “For the Father knows what you have need of, look at the lilies of the field, look at the sparrows” something along those lines.

Secondly, that couple does sound like they are making themselves look good in front of the church. There is such a term called brown-nosing. That is exactly what they are doing. For I have come across people like that. The only consolation you will have is that God will give them their dues in time. He knows what they are doing.

Thirdly, I am never afraid to speak my mind when I feel righteously angered, I would have told that couple to their face, “Thou shalt not judge” if they put anyone down like that man who lost his job and that person calls him lazy! That is just wrong!
 
When people make disparaging remarks about other’s employment, it is my suspicion that a deep fear of worthlessness and being viewed as a “loser” underlie and motivate the speaker to make fun or belittle.

Your friends probably feel this way. Deep within, they are afraid of losing their jobs, or being seen as having accomplished very little, or being useless, etc. They treat others how they most fear being treated in an attempt to vent the negativity and disapproval away from themselves. The thought process might be subconscious but be something like this:

Thought #1: “I’m dissatisfied with my career, what a loser, how pathetic I am!”

Thought/Action # 2: “Well…at least I’m better than that gas pumper guy, or that lazy bum! Ha yeah! What useless human beings! I’m definitely better than them at least…right…I mean I have to be right…???”

In an attempt to suppress thoughts and feelings like #1, often people with this particular struggle will lash out against others in order to escape the inner turmoil they experience.

Yes, this is a moral failing, and a character weakness…but no one of us is perfect, and often times people like this achieve so much and do a lot of good, even if inner pain and anxiety is the primary motivation rather than love.

My advice is to ignore comments like this, and refrain from talking about work at all with these people. Talk about anything else, family, faith, politics, entertainment, sports, etc. You cannot heal them, only God can heal their inner pain, and if you try to bring attention to their moral failings in this area they will blow you off as an overly sensitive person. It won’t do any good at all.

They will continue to make comments like this until they realize that we’re meant to be human “beings” and not human “doings.” This process of realization will be slow, and you cannot rush them along it by telling them that they are mean. When they do say mean things, just do your best to ignore it. By ignoring their comments and changing the subject, you are refusing to acknowledge their desire for confirmation of their assertion. They desperately want you to either agree or disagree because the former alerts them to the presence of a compatriot and the latter confirms their fear that unemployment or lack of achievement really is** contemptuous and embarrassing.

I know this stuff because, unfortunately, I am this type of person. Also, I have spent years around other people with varying degrees of this same problem. It is an epidemic among people who achieve (or try to achieve) a lot (not bragging please don’t misunderstand). Often I will be angry with myself for failing to write several books by now, or completely understand God, or tour Europe, etc. It is completely ridiculous, and at my worst I can make others miserable. I know I have hurt others in the past, and I have had people point it out to me or take offense but I would immediately internally dismiss them as “overly sensitive” or “know-nothings” or some other such unkind term. It didn’t help at all.

One time in confession a priest detected this spiritual sickness in me (I think), and as a penance told me I had to pray for the unemployed. He told me not to ask for them to find employment, but rather that God would fill their lives with peace. It was then that I began to “connect the dots” so to speak and I am now in recovery! One day at a time…
 
PumpkinCookie said:
When people make disparaging remarks about other’s employment, it is my suspicion that a deep fear of worthlessness and being viewed as a “loser” underlie and motivate the speaker to make fun or belittle.

Your friends probably feel this way. Deep within, they are afraid of losing their jobs, or being seen as having accomplished very little, or being useless, etc. They treat others how they most fear being treated in an attempt to vent the negativity and disapproval away from themselves. The thought process might be subconscious but be something like this:

Thought #1: “I’m dissatisfied with my career, what a loser, how pathetic I am!”

Thought/Action # 2: “Well…at least I’m better than that gas pumper guy, or that lazy bum! Ha yeah! What useless human beings! I’m definitely better than them at least…right…I mean I have to be right…???”

In an attempt to suppress thoughts and feelings like #1, often people with this particular struggle will lash out against others in order to escape the inner turmoil they experience.

Yes, this is a moral failing, and a character weakness…but no one of us is perfect, and often times people like this achieve so much and do a lot of good, even if inner pain and anxiety is the primary motivation rather than love.

My advice is to ignore comments like this, and refrain from talking about work at all with these people. Talk about anything else, family, faith, politics, entertainment, sports, etc. You cannot heal them, only God can heal their inner pain, and if you try to bring attention to their moral failings in this area they will blow you off as an overly sensitive person. It won’t do any good at all.

They will continue to make comments like this until they realize that we’re meant to be human “beings” and not human “doings.” This process of realization will be slow, and you cannot rush them along it by telling them that they are mean. When they do say mean things, just do your best to ignore it. By ignoring their comments and changing the subject, you are refusing to acknowledge their desire for confirmation of their assertion. They desperately want you to either agree or disagree because the former alerts them to the presence of a compatriot and the latter confirms their fear that unemployment or lack of achievement really is** contemptuous and embarrassing.

I know this stuff because, unfortunately, I am this type of person. Also, I have spent years around other people with varying degrees of this same problem. It is an epidemic among people who achieve (or try to achieve) a lot (not bragging please don’t misunderstand). Often I will be angry with myself for failing to write several books by now, or completely understand God, or tour Europe, etc. It is completely ridiculous, and at my worst I can make others miserable. I know I have hurt others in the past, and I have had people point it out to me or take offense but I would immediately internally dismiss them as “overly sensitive” or “know-nothings” or some other such unkind term. It didn’t help at all.

One time in confession a priest detected this spiritual sickness in me (I think), and as a penance told me I had to pray for the unemployed. He told me not to ask for them to find employment, but rather that God would fill their lives with peace. It was then that I began to “connect the dots” so to speak and I am now in recovery! One day at a time…
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You are so right. And yes, maybe we should do just that. Just love the couple or speakers and talk positive things around them. So that maybe they will connect the dots like you did. Maybe I am wrong in saying that to their face “Thou shalt not judge” cuz it would prolly backlash. Loving the speakers and doing and talking positivity around them is what I would call “reverse psychology”. Giving them the kind of reaction they were not expecting.
 
Anglewannabe said:
I have a friend from church. What I really like about her is she is a devout Catholic. Sadly most people I meet go to church out of habit and do not see the point of following all the church teachings. And people like her are few and far between.

However, it has gotten to the point where her husband has hurt my feelings once too often and I want to speak up but I don’t know how. He has a good career and I am sure he is a hard worker. However, he is one of those people who seems to get his worth as a human from his career success and thinks he is a notch above everyone else because of it. He will often make uncharitable remarks. For example, if someone else’s kid is struggling in school he will say things ‘Well, we do need people to pump gas’. Being unemployed these comments really hurt me. I just feel like screaming ‘If he was not pumping gas, how would you get to drive your fancy car’.

And, it is very obvious his wife shares his attitude. If they were secular people, I would brush it off more easily. But when I see all they do for the church yet have no compassion for me, I am baffled. They are so busy making sure the church has greeters and readers and Eucharistic ministers which are all positive things. But Jesus told us to ‘love each other as I have loved you’ and to care for the widow and orphans. I might not be a widow or an orphan, but at this point I am one of the unfortunates of society and when they are around me, it is so obvious that is one part of the bible they don’t practice.

To be honest, I don’t expect them to help me because I know there is nothing they can do to help me find a job (except perhaps pray). And I understand it is my responsibility to apply for jobs. But when ‘John Smith’ looses his job and I say ‘How sad, I must remember to pray for him’ and this guy says ‘I am not surprised the guy was lazy’, I am finding it REALLY hard to keep biting my tongue.

Honestly, my biggest fear is anything I say to this guy, he will be polite to my face but in the back of his mind (and possibly behind my back) he will be saying ‘that Angie is so wrong’

Any words of wisdom?

Angie
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Well, I probably don’t qualify in the “words of wisdom” category…If I had heard that “well we need people to pump gas” comment, I would have popped right back with, “And polish your shoes, eh, Your Highness?” 😃

I mean seriously. :rolleyes: What world is he living in?

I would literally harass him (and her) if I heard things like this come out of their faces. All with good humor of course, and praying at the same time, but I would razz him until he had to see that he was insulting others. Or, he might just get sick of me not playing into his superiority act that he’d avoid me. Sometimes humor can be used in ways that affect people unexpectedly.

I know, I already told you I’m not wise, but people like this just cheese me off.

:mad:
 
TheRealJuliane said:
Well, I probably don’t qualify in the “words of wisdom” category…If I had heard that “well we need people to pump gas” comment, I would have popped right back with, “And polish your shoes, eh, Your Highness?” 😃

I mean seriously. :rolleyes: What world is he living in?

I would literally harass him (and her) if I heard things like this come out of their faces. All with good humor of course, and praying at the same time, but I would razz him until he had to see that he was insulting others. Or, he might just get sick of me not playing into his superiority act that he’d avoid me. Sometimes humor can be used in ways that affect people unexpectedly.

I know, I already told you I’m not wise, but people like this just cheese me off.

:mad:
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Yes, exactly! That speaker just makes me want to smack him! lol. 😃
 
Thank you everyone for your responses. I will try and answer most of the points that have been brought up.

1-) Am I sensitive because I am not working. DEFINITELY and I know that. However, I also believe that if it were not for all my times of unemployment (this is not the first time), I would probably be condescending like this man so I can see that God has used this to make me more compassionate. However, I do not think this man can cash in on the fact that I am sensitive to further hurt me. It is like blaming the victim mentality which I will not stand for. I don’t want him to stop talking about his success, I want him to quit making rude comments when I am around. If he wants to take his mocking the unemployed elsewhere, I am NOT the moral police and he can do that. But I repeat, I no longer want those comments around me

2-) As for not making comments directed at them but about the subject, I tried that and it does not work. I once tried to point out all the work some people were trying to do to help themselves and he just interrupted me mid-sentence and said ‘You are wrong’. He just does NOT listen to other points of view

3-) As for the suggestion deep down this man is insecure about his career and just makes those comments to deal with his fear. That is quite a strong possibility. However, I do not think it is my business to suggest that to him. My job is to assert myself and tell him what comments are not acceptable to me. As to his motive for making them, that is something he can choose if he wishes to work on.

The more I think about it, the more I do believe I need to speak up, I am just trying to find the words to do it. How does this sound. ‘We obviously have different opinions and I can respect yours. However, as your sister in Christ, I am asking you to consider my feelings and not talk about other people’s failures in a negative way around me. It makes me wonder what you are thinking of me’

Angie
 
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