Should the Pope apologize?

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What was “misconstrued?” They understood him perfectly - and then they went out and proved him right by murdering nuns and burning down churches.

The Pope has nothing to apologize for.
 
CSN said:
What prevents an apology? Pride?
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There is a big difference between the passion of pride and compromising the faith. He apologized that the muslims misunderstood him. That is enough.
 
CSN said:
I disagree.

The Pope should apologize, even if his words were misconstrued.

It seems analogous to making a joke, but then someone taking it completely the wrong way.

If the counterparties are offended, then as Catholics, we should apologize.

What prevents an apology? Pride?
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But do they really have reason to be offended? Have you actually read the pope’s lecture, CSN?
 
He apologized, then the muslims went on a war-path and proved him right anyways.:eek:

AngelJan
 
CSN said:
I disagree.

The Pope should apologize, even if his words were misconstrued.

It seems analogous to making a joke, but then someone taking it completely the wrong way.

If the counterparties are offended, then as Catholics, we should apologize.

What prevents an apology? Pride?
Click to expand...
There was a moderate muslim in O’reilly Factor last night and he said that the pope has nothing to apologize. And the pope’s speech is a good challange for the intellectual muslims to engage in a friendly dialogue. To resolve the problems in religion by using reason instead of violence. I admire the pope’s love for his fellow men. He is paving the way for future dialogue, for men to engage in reason instead of violence.🙂
 
CSN said:
I disagree.

The Pope should apologize, even if his words were misconstrued.

It seems analogous to making a joke, but then someone taking it completely the wrong way.

If the counterparties are offended, then as Catholics, we should apologize.

What prevents an apology? Pride?
Click to expand...
The Holy Father did it already. The question should be… will the “offended” parties be open-minded enough to accept the apology? Or is the “book” too close to their faces it’s blocking their vision? Or will they wait first on how their imams interpret that apology? Oh well… :rolleyes:
 
I went to an evening Bible study yesterday and as I was leaving (around 8:30 p.m.) I encountered 4 police officers in front of my church. One of the ladies in our group asked them what they were doing there, and he responded, “Because of what the Pope said, we have to provide security.” This is sad and disgusting. I live in New York City and lived through 911. A cousin of mine and a former neighbor died in the World Trade Center. I visited the devastated area a couple of days after the attack, and it looked like a war zone. I saw the hundreds of posters of the “missing.” Thousands of lives were lost. And who perpetrated all of this? Radical Muslims! I wish the international Muslim community would demand an apology from Osama Bin Laden and his cronies! Why don’t they ask for him to be crucified or pass a special resolution in their parliaments condemning his actions? The Pope’s comments were harmless and how do many of them react? With violence! That just exposes their hypocrisy.

God bless
 
Hello,
CSN said:
I disagree.

The Pope should apologize, even if his words were misconstrued.

It seems analogous to making a joke, but then someone taking it completely the wrong way.

If the counterparties are offended, then as Catholics, we should apologize.

What prevents an apology? Pride?
Click to expand...
I say that the sky is blue. You are very much offended that I dare to say this. Should I now apologize?
 
I am glad the Pope spoke up, and I think he has responded in an appropriate manner. I don’t think there was any way he could have pleased them no matter how he said it.

I admire the Pope, and feel he is doing the right thing by speaking out, and I don’t think he did it to cause trouble, but to get people to think what they are doing. Jesus was not very popular as I recall.

“Do not think that I have come to bring peace upon the earth. I have come to bring not peace but the sword.” Matt. 10:34

“You will be hated by all because of my name, but whoever endures to the end will be saved.” Matt. 10:22

It is not easy to be a christian, but we have God’s help in doing his will.

Just my two cents.
 
jmcrae said:
Check THIS out (QuickTime video - well worth the download) - it is a must-see. 👍
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Good video. It is actually its own thread from a few days ago.

I know an man from Israel here. He had a very good point when he told me, “How do you have diplomacy with someone when the only way that they will be satisfied is if you are dead?”

We all know Jesus said, “When they strike one cheek, give them the other.” I am sure he didn’t mean let them kill you. But I have a question and it might sound stupid, but I would love to hear some opinions.

As Christians, we should love our neighbors, but how do we respond to a faction that wants to kill us? If we kill them, we are just as bad as they are. We can’t do it by faith alone. James 2:14-26 says we must have works with our faith. So, what should we do…hope it dies down, bomb em, pray, what???
 
DiscerningDave said:
As Christians, we should love our neighbors, but how do we respond to a faction that wants to kill us? If we kill them, we are just as bad as they are. We can’t do it by faith alone. James 2:14-26 says we must have works with our faith. So, what should we do…hope it dies down, bomb em, pray, what???
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What we do now, is we prove that woman right.

That means that while we don’t let them stomp all over us (we have the right to self-defense), we also don’t stoop to their level, or get revenge after the fact. We don’t perpetuate the whole, “you killed my brother so I have to kill your sister;” “well, you killed my sister so I have to kill your child,” etc. ad infinitum. (this is what Jesus meant by forgiving our enemies - we can say, “Yes, that was really bad,” but we don’t take revenge.) But yes, if they are coming after our sister and we can do something about it, then we have a right to defend her, and sometimes that might mean that they end up dead. Doesn’t mean we hate them; just that we needed to prevent them from harming our sister.
 
I read that the Pope issued something like an apology. He didn’t say “I’m sorry for what I’ve done,” but it was something more like, “I’m sorry that many Islamic groups have misunderstood my quotation.”

Truly, the Pope did nothing wrong - the quote was from an intellectual discourse he wrote about faith and reason. Benedict’s point was that faith requires a rational basis, and that faith spread by the sword has no rational basis.

Even though the Pope did nothing wrong, I believe it was in the best interest of the Church that he did apologize. Did you hear the story of the nun who was shot and killed by Islamic extremists because of this? It is best to heal the relations now. We can’t put gas on the fire, especially now, when there are our Catholic brothers and sisters serving the Church in Middle Eastern countries. Islam may be a religion of the sword, but Catholicism, and all Christianity for that matter, is a religion of reason, of peace! How so? Take the good example of the nun who was killed…She died forgiving her assailants. We too should work for that same peace and forgiveness.
 
Welcome to the forums, Skizzey and Pray4peace! I hope you enjoy your time here. Skizzey I would like to make a small but (I feel) significant correction to what you said:
Skizzey said:
Truly, the Pope did nothing wrong - the quote was from an intellectual discourse he wrote about faith and reason. Benedict’s point was that faith requires a rational basis, and that faith spread by the sword has no rational basis.
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Not quite. What he was saying is that it is not rational to spread faith by the sword. Do you see the difference?
 
Actually, no, I don’t see the difference. It seems to me like we’re saying the same thing! In any case, what I mean in my statement is what you mean in yours. But if there’s some distinct difference I’m not seeing, please let me know! Thanks.
 
JMJ_coder said:
Hello,

I say that the sky is blue. You are very much offended that I dare to say this. Should I now apologize?
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Almost every argument can be refuted with extreme examples that lead to absurdity.

My joke analogy is plausible, but you are comparing that to a statement that is a) completely innocuous; and b) completely true.
 
Skizzey said:
I read that the Pope issued something like an apology. He didn’t say “I’m sorry for what I’ve done,” but it was something more like, “I’m sorry that many Islamic groups have misunderstood my quotation.”

Truly, the Pope did nothing wrong - the quote was from an intellectual discourse he wrote about faith and reason. Benedict’s point was that faith requires a rational basis, and that faith spread by the sword has no rational basis.

Even though the Pope did nothing wrong, I believe it was in the best interest of the Church that he did apologize. Did you hear the story of the nun who was shot and killed by Islamic extremists because of this? It is best to heal the relations now. We can’t put gas on the fire, especially now, when there are our Catholic brothers and sisters serving the Church in Middle Eastern countries. Islam may be a religion of the sword, but Catholicism, and all Christianity for that matter, is a religion of reason, of peace! How so? Take the good example of the nun who was killed…She died forgiving her assailants. We too should work for that same peace and forgiveness.
Click to expand...
I too read that the pope apologized. But many people here are saying he should not even have done that. He did the right thing, I believe…
 
Atreyu said:
Welcome to the forums, Skizzey and Pray4peace! I hope you enjoy your time here. Skizzey I would like to make a small but (I feel) significant correction to what you said:

Not quite. What he was saying is that it is not rational to spread faith by the sword. Do you see the difference?
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Compare and contrast the two statements:
  • faith spread by the sword has no rational basis.
  • it is not rational to spread faith by the sword.
The first is saying that any faith that is spread by the sword has no rational basis. The second is that it is not rational to spread faith by the sword. I think the first statement somewhat confuses cause and effect.
 
I had the opportunity to hear Newt Gingrich speak tonight, and someone from the audience asked what he thought about the Pope’s comments. His response was that the excerpt that the Pope chose was very direct and incredibly insulting- but that the Pope is very much the intellectual, and that he probably knew exactly what he was doing when he said it
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I agree with Gingrich, the Pope probably knew exactly what he was doing when he made that statement.

Up till now, the CC has remained mostly silent about the turmoil in the Middle East, and the disputation between Israel and Palestine.

I think this was Benedicts way of introducing the CC’s presence into the situation. Also, I have a hard time believing that the Pope (intelligent and experienced in politics as he is), inadvertantly made a comment like that. I tend to think he knew it would cause a reaction with the muslim world, and that reaction was probably well anticipated before the comment was made.

The Vatican is a political power in the world, they didn’t get that status by making “slips of the tongue”. They are no different than any other political platform… they use the media to accomplish their agenda.

John
www.gideonsword.net
 
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