Sin of the occult?

[silverwings_88]

As a formal occultist, buddhist, new age, wiccan and pentecostal (and now a Catholic), is it necessarily a sin or a danger against Yahweh to use an occult alphabet for journal writings? (I’m too lazy to be creative and invent on my own.) I wish to keep a religious journal on my thoughts on the Lord, and other than the Latin alphabet, any other alphabet that was created for latin or any of the cabbalistic alphabets were to fulfill occultic purposes of secrecy and conjuration. I wish to also write those latin prayers in such alphabets to memorise the latinate versions of our anglicised forms of prayer. But before I do this spiritual exercise, I am quite worried that I may be causing myself a new sin by writing Christian prayers in occultic alphabets, despite the aesthetic quality I see in them.

What are your opinion on this? Please answer soon!

 

[puzzleannie]

are you following all of these paths at once, or is this a summary of your spiritual journey and seeking? I am at a loss to understand what you mean by occult alphabets, other than runes or something. If the means you are using for keeping your journal are drawn from the occult they are sinful and dangerous by definition, if this is what you are asking. I strongly urge you to seek spiritual direction from a competent Catholic director for assistance that best meets your needs, and to assure you are liberated from all evil influences arising from your past activities.

Did you know that as part of the RCIA (rites of Christian initiation) that converts to the CAtholic faith celebrate, are minor exorcisms for exactly that purpose, since in many parts of the world, converts have been exposed to occult practices or religions of many kinds.

 

[silverwings_88]

puzzleannie:

are you following all of these paths at once, or is this a summary of your spiritual journey and seeking? I am at a loss to understand what you mean by occult alphabets, other than runes or something. If the means you are using for keeping your journal are drawn from the occult they are sinful and dangerous by definition, if this is what you are asking. I strongly urge you to seek spiritual direction from a competent Catholic director for assistance that best meets your needs, and to assure you are liberated from all evil influences arising from your past activities.

Did you know that as part of the RCIA (rites of Christian initiation) that converts to the CAtholic faith celebrate, are minor exorcisms for exactly that purpose, since in many parts of the world, converts have been exposed to occult practices or religions of many kinds.

No, lol. Now I am a catholic and loving it. I have done so much research, and the Catholic foundation was the most plausible to me.

The thing is though, I adore differrent scripts and alphabets and languages. But I wish to use something for my Catholic journal, as I wish to become a priest. The problem is, there is no such different script for the Catholic church other than the Latin language and roman alphabet.

yes, I realise that pagan catholicism is very very predominant. For example, my grandmother on my deceased grandfather’s birthday, she would leave food on a plate so that his spirit would come and visit and spiritually partake and eat the food. I know that she is a very humble catholic, but this practice is very paganistic in the sense. This is why I’m asking the question for the usage of some sort of written script as a way of veiling my journal lest I give some one the key.

What other alternative alphabets have been given for latin then? Bcuz the only ones that I know of were used for the occult.

 

[silverwings_88]

puzzleannie:

are you following all of these paths at once, or is this a summary of your spiritual journey and seeking? I am at a loss to understand what you mean by occult alphabets, other than runes or something. If the means you are using for keeping your journal are drawn from the occult they are sinful and dangerous by definition, if this is what you are asking. I strongly urge you to seek spiritual direction from a competent Catholic director for assistance that best meets your needs, and to assure you are liberated from all evil influences arising from your past activities.

Did you know that as part of the RCIA (rites of Christian initiation) that converts to the CAtholic faith celebrate, are minor exorcisms for exactly that purpose, since in many parts of the world, converts have been exposed to occult practices or religions of many kinds.

No, I am now a catholic and enjoying it. The problem is that I wish to veil my Catholic journal, so I can record my thoughts without worry of unsuspecting eyes, and I am lazy to create such. Since I wish to write latin prayers, the only alternative latin alphabets that I know of were used for the occult, such as the Theban alphabet or the Cabbalah. Is there any other script then that I could use to convey latin that existed historically?

 

[puzzleannie]

silverwings_88:

The thing is though, I adore differrent scripts and alphabets and languages. But I wish to use something for my Catholic journal, as I wish to become a priest. The problem is, there is no such different script for the Catholic church other than the Latin language and roman alphabet.

What other alternative alphabets have been given for latin then? .

what about Greek and Hebrew, certainly valuable language studies for anyone aspiring to the priesthood, and to study the Scripture in its original languages. If you have an interest in the Eastern Rites or Orthodox churches, studies in those languages written in Cyrillic alphabets would be helpful. What about modern and late medieval German, in which some of the first Bible translations were made?

I would venture to guess that all alphabets, including our own, have at some point been used to write occultic books, but that the letters themselves are neutral. Have you ever seen the Book of Kells and similar writings of sacred texts by the Irish monks of the dark ages, which preserve that beautiful script? Looking at any font library, you can find beautiful fonts with which to write in English (or Latin).

by the way, “pagan Catholicism” is an oxymoron. Some Catholics may preserve ethnic and cultural customs which do not derive directly from Church teaching, and which may even be remnants of former pagan practices, but the Church has proven its genius by “baptizing” pagan customs by catechizing peoples to see the reality of divinely revealed truth that can sometimes hide in shadow within pagan rituals and practices.

 

[Lisa4Catholics]

I feel like as long as you don’t use a language in an occultic manner you don’t have to worry about it.Some cults use the Saints in that way but we don’t avoid them because of the abuse of a few.God Bless

 

[CredoDownunder]

silverwings_88:

No, I am now a catholic and enjoying it. The problem is that I wish to veil my Catholic journal, so I can record my thoughts without worry of unsuspecting eyes, and I am lazy to create such. Since I wish to write latin prayers, the only alternative latin alphabets that I know of were used for the occult, such as the Theban alphabet or the Cabbalah. Is there any other script then that I could use to convey latin that existed historically?

In what sense do you wish to “veil” your journal? Do you want people to be unable to read it if they opened it, or do you mean something else?

I ask because when I was involved in the occult, to “veil” something involved sorcery, whereas you may simply be wishing to write in code.

 

[silverwings_88]

CredoDownunder:

In what sense do you wish to “veil” your journal? Do you want people to be unable to read it if they opened it, or do you mean something else?

I ask because when I was involved in the occult, to “veil” something involved sorcery, whereas you may simply be wishing to write in code.

I just wish to write in code or some alphabetical cipher, mostly intended for latin But with something in relevance to the Catholic church… I was attracted to the Theban alphabet as a Wiccan, as it was originally used as a latin cipher, but now, it is used by many witches for their book of shadows or grimoires, so my book on God could be easily mistaken for a wiccan Book of Shadows!

 

[puzzleannie]

thought of you today, saw in the magazine One, by the Catholic Near East Welfare Association, pictures of ancient Ethiopian sacred Christian texts with a beautiful script, resembles cross between hieroglyphics and Greek, on large parchment pages, simply beautiful.

If you write evil things with any script, the script is not to blame, your sin is to blame and its evil intent. The same script can be used to write things of God.

What I find most disturbing is your concern, which seems overdone, of someone looking into your journal and drawing conclusions of any kind. If you have an intent to write something that a spiritual director cannot see, I would be very careful. In any case if you are discerning for the path of your spiritual direction, you should be in the hands of a competent director. My first advice, to seek the remedy of the sacraments and rituals of the Church for deliverance from any remnants of evil influence, still stands. Such a prayer is one of the optional rites at the beginning of the catechumenate, and minor exorcisms are part of the rites of Lent.

In any case if “the only alphabets I know of, other than latin, are those used in occult practices” that means that a lot of your intellectual content has been drawn from those sources, and you are desperately in need of orthodox education, study and catechesis before you can begin to aspire to the priesthood.

 

[springbreeze]

Dear friend

If you have rejected the belief, uses and practices of your former spiritual inclinations and truly desire to depart and severe all ties with your past pursuit of the occult and become in the Catholic church a new creation of Christ, then my best advice to you is to remove yourself from any attachment to your past beliefs and this includes the alphabets and styles of writing used in such beliefs.

If you are so worried someone will read any writings you may make, then put them on your computer and password them so only you knows how to get into them.

This severing of your past involvement with the occult is very important to your journey in faith and for it to flourish in Christ Jesus

God Bless you and much love and peace to you

Teresa

 

[Scullinius]

Springbreeze offers excellent advice.

 

[silverwings_88]

Thank you for your concern. I will still keep a journal, and I must acquire a spiritual director soon if possible from the vocations office here. Then I shall create a new cipher myself, just for my amusement and practice of the latin prayers, but for my normal spiritual ponderings, I’ll stick to whatever my (future-existent) spiritual director can read!

I was thinking of taking elements from written Aramaic and vowel insertions from Hebrew, and the letters could be based in a Greek-Latinate-Gothic mixture (The Gothic script was created by a Bishop before falling into disuse because it was supposedly pagan as well, despite that it derived the structures from greek and latin!). Besides, I should get familiar with such biblical scripts anyhow (Greek, Hebrew, and maybe for a past time, Aramaic!)

It’s so hard though, to cut all ties of my former perceptions upon religion, because it truly enhanced my view on religious paths, and actually brought me to the Catholic church. Wicca gave me frightful dreams of the Devil, though I brushed it off being Wiccan, but it gave me the inclination that Satan’s presence is very real. Buddhist ideals gave me faithful morals of steadiness and patience, both wonderfully sourced from the Holy Spirit. Wicca gave me the air that everything in nature is sacred. All the religions I had had a piece of what Catholicism has to offer, and it took me 14 years of my life to truly understand that the Catholic church was the true church instituted by Christ Himself. Now I’m 16, and I’m finally going to take Confirmation soon for Easter.

I will go to my Fr. and ask for his advice too during confession. I’ve been thirsting to take the Body **and **Blood of Our Lord again, since I haven’t for a while… confessions are once a week only!

I just hope creating a cipher won’t deviate my Catholicity!

Dominus Vobiscum! And Thank you for your beautiful expressions of concern; it makes me feel loved!

 

[BlessedBe13]

silverwings_88:

Wicca gave me frightful dreams of the Devil, though I brushed it off being Wiccan, but it gave me the inclination that Satan’s presence is very real.

No offense, but “Wicca” did not give you dreams of “Satan”. Wicca being a religious practice that has nothing to do with Satan, Wicca would not be “giving” you these supposed dreams. Perhaps your mind or even some “higher power” gave you these dreams. The only connection I could see is that you may have felt guilty about practicing an “alternative” religion such as Wicca, possibly because you assumed it had something to do with “evil”, and your guilt mainfested in your dreams as “Satan”. I myself have been practicing Wicca and not once have I had any dream or experience involving Wicca. Nor have any of the other WIccans I have spoken to.

Now I’m 16, and I’m finally going to take Confirmation soon for Easter.

I also wonder, considering your age, how seriously you took any of these religion that you formerly practised. My guess is that you dabbled in all of these, found they were not to your liking for whatever reason (perhaps too involved than you had previously thought) and moved on. Since I’m assuming that you did not start studying religion when you were 2 (probably not until much later), there is no way you could have really gotten to know any of your “former religions” in any real meaningful way. Not to say you know nothing of them, but to have jumped around so much and only be 16, your studies could not have been too in depth.

Correct me if I’m wrong, but as a former Catholic, I thought that confirmation only occurred at the age of 18 (and older). Or was that only in my area, or is that simply a “traditional age”?

 

[Shiann]

BlessedBe13:

No offense, but “Wicca” did not give you dreams of “Satan”. Wicca being a religious practice that has nothing to do with Satan, Wicca would not be “giving” you these supposed dreams. Perhaps your mind or even some “higher power” gave you these dreams. The only connection I could see is that you may have felt guilty about practicing an “alternative” religion such as Wicca, possibly because you assumed it had something to do with “evil”, and your guilt mainfested in your dreams as “Satan”.

It is beyond my comprehension how you can, from a Catholic perspective, ***positively and authoritatively * ** assert that these dreams were not “of Satan”. Then in almost the same breath, show your lack of knowledge of simple Catholic traditions. The dreams could most certainly be coming from an evil source- the most evil of which is Satan himself.

I myself have been practicing Wicca and not once have I had any dream or experience involving Wicca. Nor have any of the other WIccans I have spoken to.

If you recieve nothing spiritual from Wicca- why do you “practice it”?

I also wonder, considering your age, how seriously you took any of these religion that you formerly practised. My guess is that you dabbled in all of these, found they were not to your liking for whatever reason (perhaps too involved than you had previously thought) and moved on. Since I’m assuming that you did not start studying religion when you were 2 (probably not until much later), there is no way you could have really gotten to know any of your “former religions” in any real meaningful way. Not to say you know nothing of them, but to have jumped around so much and only be 16, your studies could not have been too in depth.

These are logical observations, but I’m not sure what bearing they have on his question.

Correct me if I’m wrong, but as a former Catholic, I thought that confirmation only occurred at the age of 18 (and older). Or was that only in my area, or is that simply a “traditional age”?

This is incorrect. The Eastern Orthodox Church offers the Rites of Baptism, Communion and Confirmation all together to infants. Many of our Roman Catholic parents and grandparents were as young as 10 when they were confirmed. Today, Confirmation is offered to catechists in high school. Confirmation candidates today are anywhere from 15 to 18 but it depends on the diocese.

 

[mtr01]

BlessedBe13:

Correct me if I’m wrong, but as a former Catholic, I thought that confirmation only occurred at the age of 18 (and older). Or was that only in my area, or is that simply a “traditional age”?

Must have been your area. In most places Confirmation is celebrated in 8th-10th grade in the normal course of events (of course one can be confirmed at any point after that). Eastern Catholics are actually Confirmed (Chrismated) as infants – they are Baptized, receive the Eucharist and Chrismated at the same time.

 

[BlessedBe13]

Shiann:

It is beyond my comprehension how you can, from a Catholic perspective, ***positively and authoritatively ***assert that these dreams were not “of Satan”. Then in almost the same breath, show your lack of knowledge of simple Catholic traditions. The dreams could most certainly be coming from an evil source- the most evil of which is Satan himself.

I never said that these dreams did not come from “Satan”. I said these dreams did not come from Wicca. There is a difference - please read more thoroughly before jumping to conclusions.

If you recieve nothing spiritual from Wicca- why do you “practice it”?

**My mistake. I meant I have had no dreams or experiences involving Satan. I have had plenty of spiritual experiences through my religious practices, just none having to do with Satan. **(since I can’t edit my previous post, I bolded this to clarify what I meant)

These are logical observations, but I’m not sure what bearing they have on his question.

Just observations. I just don’t feel that he took any of his previous religions seriously enough to actually know what they were about in any real depth. That’s why I found his assertion that his Satan dream came from Wicca, absolutely ridiculous.

This is incorrect. The Eastern Orthodox Church offers the Rites of Baptism, Communion and Confirmation all together to infants. Many of our Roman Catholic parents and grandparents were as young as 10 when they were confirmed. Today, Confirmation is offered to catechists in high school. Confirmation candidates today are anywhere from 15 to 18 but it depends on the diocese.

Thank you for letting me know. That’s why I said I wasn’t sure. I just know that in the churches I had attended as well as the churches friends of mine had attended, the confirmation age was 18.

 

[BlessedBe13]

mtr01:

Must have been your area. In most places Confirmation is celebrated in 8th-10th grade in the normal course of events (of course one can be confirmed at any point after that). Eastern Catholics are actually Confirmed (Chrismated) as infants – they are Baptized, receive the Eucharist and Chrismated at the same time.

Thank you for that clarification. Thinking about it, I had my first reconciliation in first grade and first communion in the second grade (while I was still in a Catholic school). After third grade my parents moved us to public school but had us go to CCD. My 4th grade CCD class was preparing to receive their first Reconciliation, but had already received Communion in second grade (which I had thought was weird since I thought it was supposed to be the other way around → Reconciliation before Communion). I only went to CCD for one year and was never confirmed, but I know that my friends had it done when they turned 18.

 

[Shiann]

BlessedBe13:

I never said that these dreams did not come from “Satan”. I said these dreams did not come from Wicca. There is a difference - please read more thoroughly before jumping to conclusions.

My mistake. I meant I have had no dreams or experiences involving Satan. I have had plenty of spiritual experiences through my religious practices, just none having to do with Satan.

Just observations. I just don’t feel that he took any of his previous religions seriously enough to actually know what they were about in any real depth. That’s why I found his assertion that his Satan dream came from Wicca, absolutely ridiculous.

The problem here is that from a Catholic perspective, they COULD be comming from his dabbling in the occult (wiccan). This is the perspective from which his question originally stemmed, and the perspective of my answer. Catholics have a specific responsibility to avoid occult religions, including wiccan, regardless of your personal experiences or that of your friends and accquaintances.

That said-

Silverwings-
As someone said before, alphabets are morally neutral. It is the intent of the user which conferrs the “right or wrong” of the situation.

If you love the asthetic look of the alphabet for artistic value- I see no harm. But if you believe that you could be succeptible, or tempted by things “not Catholic” (we’ll leave it at that), I believe you would be best served to avoid those things until you become stronger in your knowledge of the Faith, and stronger in your connection with God and the Holy Spirit.

Thank you for letting me know. That’s why I said I wasn’t sure. I just know that in the churches I had attended as well as the churches friends of mine had attended, the confirmation age was 18.

No problem.

 

[Exporter]

Silverwings, You wrote,“As a formal occultist, buddhist, new age, wiccan and pentecostal (and now a Catholic), is it necessarily a sin or a danger against Yahweh to use an occult alphabet for journal writings?”

Did you mean former? So you are 16 and for over ten years you have matriculated through 5 different “religions” or “cults”. That may be a world record. And the thing that disturbs me the most is: even though you want to cling to occultism (by writing a journal is strange letters) you say you want to be a Priest. I assume you mean Catholic Priest.

One thing we in the Catholic Church DO NOT need is another Whacko Priest. What you are asking this forum is Whacko. You may be perfectly alright, but this fettish for “hiding” your writings is wrong. If you are planning to write Christian Prayers with a SPRINKLING of occultism, you are treading on dangerous ground.

I have been Roman Catholic for almost 50 years and never have I heard of a layman keeping a journal. If you want a book with the prayers - buy a Daily Missal.

 

[silverwings_88]

Exporter:

Silverwings, You wrote,“As a formal occultist, buddhist, new age, wiccan and pentecostal (and now a Catholic), is it necessarily a sin or a danger against Yahweh to use an occult alphabet for journal writings?”

Did you mean former? So you are 16 and for over ten years you have matriculated through 5 different “religions” or “cults”. That may be a world record. And the thing that disturbs me the most is: even though you want to cling to occultism (by writing a journal is strange letters) you say you want to be a Priest. I assume you mean Catholic Priest.

One thing we in the Catholic Church DO NOT need is another Whacko Priest. What you are asking this forum is Whacko. You may be perfectly alright, but this fettish for “hiding” your writings is wrong. If you are planning to write Christian Prayers with a SPRINKLING of occultism, you are treading on dangerous ground.

I have been Roman Catholic for almost 50 years and never have I heard of a layman keeping a journal. If you want a book with the prayers - buy a Daily Missal.

I’m sorry, I didn’t meant to give that impression… but I have already made myself an alphabet to use rather than the occultic ones anymore, stemming for Greek, Aramaic, Latin, and Hebrew as a consonantal and vowel alphabet (I thought it be safer to just stay away from things of the like). Not only do I want to write in this book something that I could devote as a tribute to all the different alphabetical (writing systems) cultures that contributed to Christianity, but as an aspiring linguist who is aiming to preach in different languages, I do hope that when I get my spiritual director, he or she wouldn’t mind if I wrote in French or Spanish or Esperanto, and even Latin! I already know enough French and Esperanto and abit of Spanish… now for the rest…

Yes, I am aware that magick is evil, even if it is used for good purposes. Yes, I’ve learned my lesson as a Wiccan. I have not been dabbling, since I embraced all the celtic celebrations, and learned of our beliefs of the afterlife (such as Summerland) and bringing the Goddess into one’s life. Because it was a religion of tolerance, I accepted it, being bisexual, and had the preconceived notion that all Christians hated such people. Wicca offered much tolerance, which made me stay for such a long time.

As a person who is serious on religion and faith practices, I am slightly offended by such an assumption that I would merely ‘dabble’ due to my youth. It is impractical to be so judgemental that the mentality of a teenager is that of unexperience and thus a ‘phase.’ Two years of solid solitary wicca was enough ground for me to learn of such material, as I practiced an angelic version of Wicca. Nevertheless, being so swept up by such beauty, that wicca held for the sacredness of nature and the sense of the transcendent divine, I forgot that Catholicism had those elements too…

Catholicism had all the elements sufficient for my life, and without Jesus, I could have still be a devoted Wiccan. I may be young, and I may still have more to learn, but my religious quest was not dabbling, nonetheless. My Wiccan years were not dabbling at all, and I hated that many teenagers who come into this faith system do it only be rebellion of by greed of having power. But not all fit in one size!

Oh, and daily missals? They’re wonderful, but I want to choose what I put in my journal, such as writing in the prayers for the Divine Mercy, or the Litany of Loreto (in Latin), both wonderful prayers not found in our missals! Neither the seven sorrows and joys of Mary, the Litany of Bl. Kateri Tekakwitha, etc.