Sinful not to be Patriotic?

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Is it a sin to not be patriotic to one’s country, even to detest the country’s culture?
 
ialsop said:
Is it a sin to not be patriotic to one’s country, even to detest the country’s culture?
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I think there is a difference to be noted between nationalism and patriotism.

That being said, patriotism is a healthy love of one’s nation.

As G K Chesterton I believe it once said (paraphrased)-You wouldn’t say “My mother, drunk or sober”, why do people say “My nation, right or wrong?”

As far as culture, I don’t think its wrong to dislike culture, it’s a matter of taste at a point methinks.
 
Hobbes42 said:
I think there is a difference to be noted between nationalism and patriotism.

That being said, patriotism is a healthy love of one’s nation.

As G K Chesterton I believe it once said (paraphrased)-You wouldn’t say “My mother, drunk or sober”, why do people say “My nation, right or wrong?”

As far as culture, I don’t think its wrong to dislike culture, it’s a matter of taste at a point methinks.
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Well…but I am not even “Patriotic” in a healthy way…

I do NOT feel patriotic about my nation at all. It has committed horrible crimes, I dont agree with the “Deist enlightenment” philosophies in which it was founded on, nor the current liberalism that rules it. I do not like the fact that it openly allows and encourages pornography, vulgarity, abortion, violence, war as a means to an end, torture as “enhanced interrogation”, NSA spying, prejudice to immigrants, sexism, racism, and oligarchical treatment of celebrities, or how the poor and homeless have super hard times in this country. I detest the immorality, redefinition of marriage, and relativism. And the hostility towards religion and extreme, bitter secularization. And how the media gets people to believe anything. I detest this culture, and frankly I find it hard to salute my flag…the stripes and the stars have no special attraction to me. On Independence Day I dream of a peaceful revolution against this system rather than celebrating it. I hate the attitude of eating competitions while the world is starving, crying on Patriot Day and cheering when we reduce a whole city to dust. ASL Ice bucket challenge while Iraqi christians die of thirst. Abusing drugs and corrupt medical industry when people are dying of ebola.

On the other hand, I am EXTREMELY patriotic to the Church. I hail the Church’s flag, want the re-institution of Christian Europe, and support the Church and it’s mission completely.

Is it a sin to detest one’s nation? Is my complete lack of attraction to my country and embarrassment at being called “american” a sin? Thats a more specific question with an explanation.
 
In general, I would say no, it’s not a sin. As long as we remember, “Render to Caesar what belongs to Caesar; Render to God what belongs to God”
 
phil19034 said:
In general, I would say no, it’s not a sin. As long as we remember, “Render to Caesar what belongs to Caesar; Render to God what belongs to God”
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True, which is, imo, meaning that we should not be too concerned with overthrowing things. I have adopted a passive compliance with America, but at the same time a passive resistance. So it’s weird. What belongs to Ceaser? Not this land, not me, not my family, HOWEVER maybe my money, but thats ok he can have that. This economy is in such a bad shape Id love to get rid of the coins with ceaser on them…
 
When I attended the Catholic grade school, there were many Italian great-grandmothers (who had been born in Italy).
They did not become American citizens.
They would say the Pledge of Allegiance.
They spoke Italian.
They spoke English.
They liked Italy.
They liked the United States.
 
Ialsop, if you are describing the USA, you are wrong; embarrassing yourself; and factually false.

There has been no nation which has been a greater champion of human rights; a greater enemy of tyranny and evil; and a greater defender of life and liberty than the USA.

Please don’t hijack this thread with your childish anti-USA silliness. Don’t like the USA? Try Russia; Bolivia; some African nation that still allows legal slavery (as many do) or a thousand places in between.

Better yet, pay a visit to an american war grave at someplace like Normandy and reflect a bit on the stuff you are spewing.

It is not a sin to be patriotic. IMHO it is a sin to willfully blind oneself to history.
 
Love your neighbor. Love one another. It doesn’t mean you have to be happy with your government and its laws. The sin, or rather the spiritual illness, might come in when you let yourself be filled with fear, anxiety, or hatred, when you stop helping those in need, when you put your faith in material goods (guns, gold), or when you lose hope. If things are not right, how can you make it better? Be a light shining against the darkness.
 
You know what? It IS his thread!

That said, don’t ask 1 question then try to play “gotcha!” when the answers roll in. If the real question regards the merits of the USA, fine - Lets do it, and we can compare NSA spying to communist Russia; third world banana military dictatorships; or Middle East nations where Christians get beheaded or stoned, and the OP can tell us how bad the USA is compared to those cesspools, right after he has a nice hot dinner and before he gets ready for bed in his nice warm house that so much of the world would love to have.
 
Beryllos said:
Uh, it’s his thread. He started it. Let’s work with it. 🙂
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Thank you, yes. It is MY thread.
Anyways, I listed a long litany of criticism. To the person who called it childish, I ask: “Which one of those criticisms was false?” If they are all true, how can we say the USA achieved human rights?
 
PolarGuy said:
You know what? It IS his thread!

That said, don’t ask 1 question then try to play “gotcha!” when the answers roll in. If the real question regards the merits of the USA, fine - Lets do it, and we can compare NSA spying to communist Russia; third world banana military dictatorships; or Middle East nations where Christians get beheaded or stoned, and the OP can tell us how bad the USA is compared to those cesspools, right after he has a nice hot dinner and before he gets ready for bed in his nice warm house that so much of the world would love to have.
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Exactly my point!!! I am not saying we are destitute and under-privileged, i am saying we are OVER-privileged to the point of being un-just, while the rest of the world suffers. As I said, crying on Patriot day while we bomb cities, eating competitions while the world starves, and ice bucket challenge while iraqi christians die in the desert. How is that fair? I am very thankful to have so many blessings, but at times I wish I did not. It is a temptation for me to forget the poor, the persecuted.
 
Your criticisms are all false. Every one. Are there racists? Sexists? So? You’ll find those anywhere…but they’re a lot less prevalent in the USA than anywhere else in the world.

One of the best things about the USA is that you’re free to leave…unlike many other nations. But then you don’t see people flooding to Guatemala, do you?
 
ialsop said:
Exactly my point!!! I am not saying we are destitute and under-privileged, i am saying we are OVER-privileged to the point of being un-just, while the rest of the world suffers. As I said, crying on Patriot day while we bomb cities, eating competitions while the world starves, and ice bucket challenge while iraqi christians die in the desert. How is that fair? I am very thankful to have so many blessings, but at times I wish I did not. It is a temptation for me to forget the poor, the persecuted.
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Isn’t it nice to live in a nation that protects your right to hate it with the strongest military in the world? In many places, you would be actively prosecuted for voicing even a fraction of your laundry-list of complaints.

America is not God’s kingdom, but it is a nation founded on an essentially Christian idea–that we are all endowed by our Creator with certain inalienable rights; every human being has equal dignity and worth. We haven’t always been perfect in observing this principle, but it is a founding principle that constantly calls us to renew the way our nation treats its citizens.

Our system has produced such luxury that the great struggle you yourself have is looking beyond your material comforts and asking, why don’t others have this stuff? Answer: they don’t live here.
 
Boo hoo hoo, the USA stinks because we’re overprivileged.

If we are “overprivileged” as a nation it’s because our people earned it. We earned it with blood shed for others; by hard work and toil; and by individual sweat times millions of people. We’ve earned it with sacrifice of money and time for other nations. We’ve earned It with ingenuity that gave the world heavier than air air travel; faster the the speed of sound travel; the light bulb; landing on the moon; and countless other advancements. We’ve given the world religious freedom on a scale never seen; free press including the right to criticise the government. To quote a truly great american George Patton, Americans love a winner and will not tolerate a loser…and you don’t like the ALS ice bucket challenge??? Please. Remember that’s people giving to charity.

No nation is perfect. But seriously…how about a bit of respect for the countless thousands who sacrificed for the USA? Maybe that might be in order as you think about this.
 
ialsop said:
Exactly my point!!! I am not saying we are destitute and under-privileged, i am saying we are OVER-privileged to the point of being un-just, while the rest of the world suffers. As I said, crying on Patriot day while we bomb cities, eating competitions while the world starves, and ice bucket challenge while iraqi christians die in the desert. How is that fair? I am very thankful to have so many blessings, but at times I wish I did not. It is a temptation for me to forget the poor, the persecuted.
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I’ve got news for you:

A big reason why some people suffer is that they are their own worst enemy. It is possible for a poor person to be selfish.

Case it point: eating competitions. That’s how some people make a living. As for the global starving, do you have any idea how difficult it is to get food and resources to people who need it?

It’s not as simple as sending a letter in the mail or even an airdrop. A lot of places around the world are corrupt.

Just be thankful for what you have and give until it hurts. Sitting around complaining and feeling guilty isn’t good, and I promise you that a lot of people in the Third World don’t want your pity or your guilt.
 
Well, thank you to the people who actually answered my question instead of arguing with me.

Amazing how arrogant America is. As if America never makes any mistakes and the rest of the world is horrible and so America needs to fix it.
 
Another thought - ialsop, if you really want to help others in third world countries, you could always join the Peace Corps - you know, that program where US people go to other nations to help them voluntary.

Have you ever seen anyone from some other country come here to help US citizens in need?

No, I didn’t think so.
 
PolarGuy said:
Another thought - ialsop, if you really want to help others in third world countries, you could always join the Peace Corps - you know, that program where US people go to other nations to help them voluntary.

**Have you ever seen anyone from some other country come here to help US citizens in need?

No, I didn’t think so**.
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Lol why would they? We have all we could ever indulge on, we dont need material help. We need spiritual help. And actually there was an underground church in China that prayed for America to experience persecution so as to have a spiritual renewal. American life is so based on the material, it often neglects the fact that spiritually, we are MUCH MUCH weaker than most nations. And that is what I am getting at: spiritual health. Economics, politics, its not the issue. The issue is that it is hard to accept a nation that has become a spiritual monster.
 
Also americans look to the government, rather than the church, to solve disputes, resolve conflicts, head causes, work against injustice and poverty, work for peace…why not look to support the Church when they do these things? The Church is FAR more important than America.
 
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