Six reasons NOT to send your daughter to college

[Jaberwocky]

See, with exception of very bright children who start college a few years before their 18th birthday, I do think that people who go off to college are no longer children. They are young men and women who could very easily go off and try to make their way through the world. They are adults, as most are either 18 or older.

So I think any disagreement we have is perhaps stemming from the issue of when to say a person is an adult.

Legally, at 18 a person is an adult. But most people forget what we already know about the development of the human brain. The long term decision making is actually impaired due to it not being developed at the age of 18. This development only completes in the mid twenties.

science.howstuffworks.com/life/teenage-brain.htm

So a young person may be very smart at academic work but that does not translate to decision making. You cannot really blame them either because they are biologically impaired i.e. like Children in that regard.

 

[Jaberwocky]

yes I agree we have to avoid sin but the way you avoid sin is by teaching your kids what is right from.what is wrong. hiding people.from the risk only causes what had happened in the US, that one day people who were hidden from the risk found out the real.world and ran to the risk (this happens very frequently between Muslims too, the minute they get away from their sin free environment they run to comment every possible sin) the reason why some many people in college is uncharted is not because of the college per se, is because of the culture in the US, because of the brainwashing that goes around, and because they aren’t taught any better at home.

So I did not respond to the other comments because I did touch upon them in replies to others. On the rape issue, I should point out that I did not say campuses = more rape. I only said that the most prominent place for rape on campus is at a party which someone on campus is likely to attend rather than someone who lives at home.

Now about the above comment, how would you answer the following question.

Is it good to allow an unmarried teenage girl and a boy to sleep in the same bed alone after informing them of right and wrong?

How you view the need to avoiding sin / near occasion of sin is dependent on how you formulate the answer to the above (and I think you already know how I answer it).

So I do agree with you that passing down the faith is important. That is certainly required or your children will think you are “caging” them rather than doing something good for them by keeping a close eye on them and taking prudent measures. But just as required is the prudent measures to avoid the occasion of sin.

What we as a society sometimes fail to understand is that both are important. Muslims fail because they require blind obedience without always teaching the faith and passing it down. It’s more cultural for them. Catholics today fail because they lack the prudence. So both camps just think there is no solution but keep doing what they do.

I disagree with both these camps. I think both are necessary.

 

[kmcarl56]

I couldn’t even finish the program. I started feeling a little ill. He talks about keeping the family together and strong which is great! It is the father’s duty to do so. However, today there are approximately 51% of divorces in couples of little or no faith, and 49% of divorces in marriages who regularly attend and are members of a church, incuding the Catholic church.

So many fathers are leaving their families with a mother to raise their children alone. Do you want that mother to have to work flipping burgers or cleaning people’s houses to keep food on the table, clothes on her children’s backs, school supplies, plus pay for rent and utilities? So many fathers do not pay child support because they stay out of work, job-hop, or get paid “under the table” to keep from having to help support the children they brought into this world.

I see many young people who are living with someone, but are not married to that person. Girls and women have children from different men, but have never been married. Some of these young people were raised in good Catholic and Christian homes. However, with the statistics as they are, these young people do not see any future in marriage. The children born into such situations are being taught in schools by mostly female teachers, who have gone to college to get an education so that they can teach our children what they need to know to live their lives productively, and that means boys and girls.

If we want to reunify the family unit, which is desperately needed, then it is up to us as parents, especially the father, to teach our children the importance of staying in the Word regardless of what other people are doing. Support your children by giving them credit for knowing the difference between the rules of society and the rules from God. Listen to them when they fear that they are straying from the Truth. Help them by praying with them and for them.

Formal education of women is not the problem. The lack of men to teach their families the importance of unity and faith in the Lord is the problem. Teach both girls and boys the importance of remaining pure until the sanctity of marriage. Teach both boys and girls that the world is full of temptations and evil, but that they can be stronger than Satan because they have the power and wisdom of Christ at their right hand.

We take our children’s wellbeing for granted because we put them into the hands of others to raise them. It is sad that so many women have to work now to help support their families, but that is just a fact and result of an economy primarily run by men.

It was never my goal in life to stay barefoot, pregnant, and dumb. I am not a feminist by any means, but I did have to carry some of the weight of my family’s support. I did get my BA, but not until I was 36 years old. My kids went to kindergarten at the universities that I attended so I was moments away from them at any given time. If I had a daughter, I would encourage her to further her education so that she could bring up intelligent, enlightened children of her own: children who would be raised to love and obey God and become successful and productive Christian people… And the cycle would continue to repeat itself for the betterment and sustenance of the family unit.

This man needs to pull his head out of the sand, and see what the world is really dishing out so that we all can know what and how to fight it, and that includes the wives who must stand by her man… not 6 steps behind him.

 

[kmcarl56]

I am thinking of a high school valedictorian I know that elected to become a beautician. Her high school counselors nearly went bananas, but she wanted to do hair. Her parents saw that this was the kind of work she wanted to do and that suited her, and they didn’t fight her about it. I know another very good student who became an electrician, and another who specialized in welding and diesel mechanics. If you consider the ones who got a four-year degree but got it at a technological institute instead of a liberal-arts university–I am thinking of all the people I know who went to the Oregon Institute of Technology in Klamath Falls–then I know a lot of very bright people who have good jobs in careers that suit them very well but who did not get a traditional liberal arts education at a 4 year university, and they did it at a much-reduced cost. (Oregon also has several community colleges with very good technical programs, too, probably because we still have a large agricultural and timber presence in the state. You can’t outsource the guy who keeps your logging trucks and farm equipment running.)

I also know a lot of people with BAs and MAs who are working in fields totally different than their majors. I also know of a lot people with BAs and MAs who are working in menial jobs because there are no jobs in their fields. There are also some homeless people who are well-educated but have lost everything they have due to a poor economy.

What one does with their education is not always by choice. It is sometimes simply out of necessity. And the truth is, that in the world economy we have today, countries all over the world need educated women to help support their families. The world also needs the skills of female doctors, scientists, inventors, engineers, and even mechanics, linemen, and loggers, to move the economy forward for all people.

We are all in this together, guys! Thank God for smart people!

 

[EasterJoy]

I don’t know what the stats are, but I would venture to guess that the “vast groups” were the ones who were already engaging in that kind of activity and/or didn’t have much parental or spiritual guidance in their formative years. In other words, they will probably get themselves involved in those kinds of activities whether or not they go to college. They will connect with those kinds of people anywhere they go. Again, most of the people I know who were/are involved in that kind of activity were people who did it before going to college.

When you have kids who had the proper instructions, support and encouragement from parents, most of the time, they will make the right choices. Sometimes they don’t. Everyone is human. Many older adults who pretty much make the right decisions will make the wrong ones as well. But it is my belief that when you have the right upbringing, you usually surround yourself with the right kinds of people when you are at that age. I attended a city university with people from all walks of life and beliefs. I was able to find the right kinds of people whether they agreed with my morals, beliefs and values or people who differed, but respected my beliefs. I know I wasn’t unusual and believe there are many others who are like that out there.

Yes and no. The ones most likely to party and get themselves into trouble in college are the ones who were already sneaking around and doing it in high school and/or who have spent months or years dreaming of college as the place where they will finally slip Mom and Dad’s watchful eye. Of course those who come to college with their stupid-behavior game plan in place will accomplish the most stupid behavior in the shortest amount of time. There is no doubt about that, but make no mistake: Some of these bad-behavior over-achievers will start with next to no pre-college experience in actual carousing.

Having said that, some of the students from the strictest homes are the most notorious offenders, because they have only been kept from evil, rather than being trained to see for themselves where the glamor and charm and other advertising claims of evil always fall short upon delivery. The ones who do not know that sin is a cheat are extremely vulnerable to running off the deep end into the arms of Old Scratch. IOW, when it comes to self-imposed resistance to evil, “the right” upbringing does not mean the strictest upbringing.

So, with that caveat about what “proper” is, I’d say that many students and perhaps most students who come to college with the firm desire to avoid the crowd who believes that “fun” means giving yourself over to your passions in the loudest manner available will find a way to avoid that crowd, and will also find some fellow students who are delighted to have comrades in sanity.

The questions are this: How well do you know your son or daughter? Is a sane college experience what they really want, or does he or she only know what sound bites to give to you in order to get their freedom card? You know that the control you have over an adult child is limited, and the days during which you will have any direct control over your 18 year old are fading fast. How are you going to spend the years during which your influence will change from influence you have always dictated over to the influence they will choose to accept? Have you prepared for that? If not, what is your next move?

 

[Cat]

Raise your daughters in the Faith, and you don’t have to worry about it.

I think that singling out daughters is pretty sexist. And I hate charges of sexism 99% of the time. Train your sons to respect women and there would be no problem.

Sadly, this isn’t the way it always works out.

I agree, we should raise our children in the Christian faith. Yes, yes, yes!

But all of us know parents who did EVERYTHING right, who raised their children in the Christian faith and managed to strike a perfect balance between strictness and granting appropriate freedoms at the appropriate age, had fair and appropriate rules, utilized appropriate discipline techniques, provided a healthy clean home with good food, rest, relaxation, and health care, had enough money to provide necessities and some luxuries, but didn’t overindulge their children, sent their children to a great school where they received a wonderful education, didn’t over-schedule them into a bazillion extra-curricular activities, etc. etc…

…but the kids still went wrong when they turned 18 or 21.

Don’t you all know a family like that? I do. I know several families like that. In one family, the parents did everything well–they were awesome parents, and all the other kids turned out pretty good–except the oldest daughter, who at age 18, ran off to live with her boyfriend. Shocking and so sad.

So very sad.

We need to be very humble when it comes to raising children, and grateful when they do turn out right. Raising them in the Christian faith is no guarantee that they will turn out well or that they will resist temptations.. We can never judge families where the children didn’t turn out well.

The one thing we can count on is the Lord’s promise in Proverbs that if we raise up a child in the way he should go, when he is old, he won’t depart from it. Sometimes, children spend a lifetime “wrong,” and their parents don’t live to see them return to the right path when they are old.

 

[Jaberwocky]

Sadly, this isn’t the way it always works out.

I agree, we should raise our children in the Christian faith. Yes, yes, yes!

But all of us know parents who did EVERYTHING right, who raised their children in the Christian faith and managed to strike a perfect balance between strictness and granting appropriate freedoms at the appropriate age, had fair and appropriate rules, utilized appropriate discipline techniques, provided a healthy clean home with good food, rest, relaxation, and health care, had enough money to provide necessities and some luxuries, but didn’t overindulge their children, sent their children to a great school where they received a wonderful education, didn’t over-schedule them into a bazillion extra-curricular activities, etc. etc…

…but the kids still went wrong when they turned 18 or 21.

Don’t you all know a family like that? I do. I know several families like that. In one family, the parents did everything well–they were awesome parents, and all the other kids turned out pretty good–except the oldest daughter, who at age 18, ran off to live with her boyfriend. Shocking and so sad.

So very sad.

We need to be very humble when it comes to raising children, and grateful when they do turn out right. Raising them in the Christian faith is no guarantee that they will turn out well or that they will resist temptations.. We can never judge families where the children didn’t turn out well.

The one thing we can count on is the Lord’s promise in Proverbs that if we raise up a child in the way he should go, when he is old, he won’t depart from it. Sometimes, children spend a lifetime “wrong,” and their parents don’t live to see them return to the right path when they are old.

I think that 18-21 age is the most risky time period (due to the brain development and our tendency to give more freedom). If you can keep them without doing something too far outside the faith till they reach 21, they usually mature very quickly after that and start to see the reason behind everything you were saying themselves. That was my personal experience growing up.

But what happens in our society is the opposite. 18 (or 17 here) is the age when we give them a lot of freedom and independence. It is at the very age where they are becoming prone to making impulsive decisions with short term risk evaluation.

So perhaps it is time where we adjusted our parental attitudes and be more active for a bit more longer in shielding the children. To do so, maybe above else we need to build the habit of obedience as a virtue in our kids to obey and trust us even when they may not understand why. Keeping them occupied in studies till that age also helps but that too requires obedience and discipline.

 

[Burt_Macklin]

I think that 18-21 age is the most risky time period (due to the brain development and our tendency to give more freedom). If you can keep them without doing something too far outside the faith till they reach 21, they usually mature very quickly after that and start to see the reason behind everything you were saying themselves. That was my personal experience growing up.

But what happens in our society is the opposite. 18 (or 17 here) is the age when we give them a lot of freedom and independence. It is at the very age where they are becoming prone to making impulsive decisions with short term risk evaluation.

So perhaps it is time where we adjusted our parental attitudes and be more active for a bit more longer in shielding the children. To do so, maybe above else we need to build the habit of obedience as a virtue in our kids to obey and trust us even when they may not understand why. Keeping them occupied in studies till that age also helps but that too requires obedience and discipline.

How do you go about keeping an adult at home? This whole discussion has been had as if there isn’t a legal adult who you can only hope to direct but not force towards a wise decision. If you attempt to exert too much control you’re giving the Army recruiters some low hanging fruit to go after.

That is what I don’t get about the author. He really writes as if his daughter needs his permission to leave the house and enroll in college. Yea, good luck in keeping a woman from something that she really wants.

 

[marymary1975]

Is it good to allow an unmarried teenage girl and a boy to sleep in the same bed alone after informing them of right and wrong?

How you view the need to avoiding sin / near occasion of sin is dependent on how you formulate the answer to the above (and I think you already know how I answer it).

So I do agree with you that passing down the faith is important. That is certainly required or your children will think you are “caging” them rather than doing something good for them by keeping a close eye on them and taking prudent measures. But just as required is the prudent measures to avoid the occasion of sin.

What we as a society sometimes fail to understand is that both are important. Muslims fail because they require blind obedience without always teaching the faith and passing it down. It’s more cultural for them. Catholics today fail because they lack the prudence. So both camps just think there is no solution but keep doing what they do.

I disagree with both these camps. I think both are necessary.

If you say to your teenage kid that sleeping on the same bed of another teenage kid of the opposite sex is wrong but you allow it at your home that is double.morals and that is the reason why so many people is screwed up today. That is exactly the same as saying to your kids hey don’t do drugs while I am shooting myself with cocaine in front of them.
Telling your kids that something is wrong is completely useless if you do it yourself. Parents need to preach with the example. And maybe that is the problem.that for most people saying don’t do this or that is very easy but when it comes to their personal lifestyle do the opposite and that is what their kids learn, again that is exactly where the whole problem comes. And no I can’t imagine how you would answer as the question iS a double standard.

I think.where we differ is on the age group we are talking. We are talking here about adults. How successful is the parent of a grown up man or woman in taking prudent measures to make the adult child avoid an occasion of sin? If we were talking about 11 - 13 years old I totally agree with you but you can’t do that to an adult. If you didn’t teach your adult child the skills when he/she was a kid so he/she would be able to take responsible decisions as an adult and to avoid sin by himself/herself without your help and to be a functional.human being as an adult, and instead you expect to do what you were supposed to do during the teenage years when your kid is an adult, I am sorry but you failed at parenting.

 

[marymary1975]

How do you go about keeping an adult at home? This whole discussion has been had as if there isn’t a legal adult who you can only hope to direct but not force towards a wise decision. If you attempt to exert too much control you’re giving the Army recruiters some low hanging fruit to go after.

That is what I don’t get about the author. He really writes as if his daughter needs his permission to leave the house and enroll in college. Yea, good luck in keeping a woman from something that she really wants.

Exactly, this is my point. Good luck forcing your adult child to stay at home and keeping a watchful eye on an adult. You are going to drive them quicker to the sin.

 

[marymary1975]

I don’t know what the stats are, but I would venture to guess that the “vast groups” were the ones who were already engaging in that kind of activity and/or didn’t have much parental or spiritual guidance in their formative years. In other words, they will probably get themselves involved in those kinds of activities whether or not they go to college. They will connect with those kinds of people anywhere they go. Again, most of the people I know who were/are involved in that kind of activity were people who did it before going to college.

When you have kids who had the proper instructions, support and encouragement from parents, most of the time, they will make the right choices. Sometimes they don’t. Everyone is human. Many older adults who pretty much make the right decisions will make the wrong ones as well. But it is my belief that when you have the right upbringing, you usually surround yourself with the right kinds of people when you are at that age. I attended a city university with people from all walks of life and beliefs. I was able to find the right kinds of people whether they agreed with my morals, beliefs and values or people who differed, but respected my beliefs. I know I wasn’t unusual and believe there are many others who are like that out there.

 

[JimG]

Exactly, this is my point. Good luck forcing your adult child to stay at home and keeping a watchful eye on an adult. You are going to drive them quicker to the sin.

Nowadays the problem is often more like “how do I get them out of the house?!”

 

[kmcarl56]

I would really like to see the look on this guy’s face when he is about to have emergency surgery to save his life…and Oh My Heavens, in walks a female surgeon!

 

[Sarabande]

Yes and no. The ones most likely to party and get themselves into trouble in college are the ones who were already sneaking around and doing it in high school and/or who have spent months or years dreaming of college as the place where they will finally slip Mom and Dad’s watchful eye. Of course those who come to college with their stupid-behavior game plan in place will accomplish the most stupid behavior in the shortest amount of time. There is no doubt about that, but make no mistake: Some of these bad-behavior over-achievers will start with next to no pre-college experience in actual carousing.

Having said that, some of the students from the strictest homes are the most notorious offenders, because they have only been kept from evil, rather than being trained to see for themselves where the glamor and charm and other advertising claims of evil always fall short upon delivery. The ones who do not know that sin is a cheat are extremely vulnerable to running off the deep end into the arms of Old Scratch. IOW, when it comes to self-imposed resistance to evil, “the right” upbringing does not mean the strictest upbringing.

So, with that caveat about what “proper” is, I’d say that many students and perhaps most students who come to college with the firm desire to avoid the crowd who believes that “fun” means giving yourself over to your passions in the loudest manner available will find a way to avoid that crowd, and will also find some fellow students who are delighted to have comrades in sanity.

The questions are this: How well do you know your son or daughter? Is a sane college experience what they really want, or does he or she only know what sound bites to give to you in order to get their freedom card? You know that the control you have over an adult child is limited, and the days during which you will have any direct control over your 18 year old are fading fast. How are you going to spend the years during which your influence will change from influence you have always dictated over to the influence they will choose to accept? Have you prepared for that? If not, what is your next move?

Yes, I think you are completely correct on that. And you are right, there are some pretty bad offenders who came from very strict backgrounds. The problem with them was, as you mentioned, they were so sheltered in the strictest form that in some ways it made temptation look glamorous and appealing.

My children are far from college years, but this is something I have been thinking about and discussing with my husband. One of my biggest fears when they are young adults is that they will make the wrong decisions once they are out on their own. So, we’re already brainstorming different preemptive parenting “strikes” that would be effective enough to be sure our children will not go down the wrong paths. And I know nothing is foolproof. But I do think the question you raised, “How well do you know your child?” is key to the decision of where you send your child or advise your child of what should be the proper educational path to take.

 

[Sarabande]

Nowadays the problem is often more like “how do I get them out of the house?!”

I think for those kinds of parents, THAT has probably exacerbated the problem with college kids choosing the wrong lifestyle. These parents have been looking forward to the day of getting them out and putting in the minimum requirements of parenting, so they miss out on the nuances of parenting which ensures a proper moral compass and spiritual strength.

 

[marymary1975]

So I think any disagreement we have is perhaps stemming from the issue of when to say a person is an adult.

Legally, at 18 a person is an adult. But most people forget what we already know about the development of the human brain. The long term decision making is actually impaired due to it not being developed at the age of 18. This development only completes in the mid twenties.

science.howstuffworks.com/life/teenage-brain.htm

So a young person may be very smart at academic work but that does not translate to decision making. You cannot really blame them either because they are biologically impaired i.e. like Children in that regard.

We do disagree here too. While is true that certain things in nature may give you a propensity, that is in no way determinative. Any scientist would tell you everything is 50-50 nature and environment. If what you point were really true, then how do you have 17 years old making better decisions than 40 years old? How do you have people at 17 being more mature than many people in their 30’s? Again that is just a cheap excuse to justify certain behaviors.

 

[marymary1975]

I think for those kinds of parents, THAT has probably exacerbated the problem with college kids choosing the wrong lifestyle. These parents have been looking forward to the day of getting them out and putting in the minimum requirements of parenting, so they miss out on the nuances of parenting which ensures a proper moral compass and spiritual strength.

Exactly, this is the real problem! You have all these parents who feel that their kids bug them and parenting is a burden and all the do is counting the seconds for the moment they don’t have to get freedom from the kids. Even in elementary school all you hear is the parents complaining that vacacion should be shorter so they don’t have to deal with the kids at home and then we expect those kids to not fall into sin??

 

[marymary1975]

I would really like to see the look on this guy’s face when he is about to have emergency surgery to save his life…and Oh My Heavens, in walks a female surgeon!

:jrbirdman::stretcher:

 

[EasterJoy]

Yes, I think you are completely correct on that. And you are right, there are some pretty bad offenders who came from very strict backgrounds. The problem with them was, as you mentioned, they were so sheltered in the strictest form that in some ways it made temptation look glamorous and appealing.

My children are far from college years, but this is something I have been thinking about and discussing with my husband. One of my biggest fears when they are young adults is that they will make the wrong decisions once they are out on their own. So, we’re already brainstorming different preemptive parenting “strikes” that would be effective enough to be sure our children will not go down the wrong paths. And I know nothing is foolproof. But I do think the question you raised, “How well do you know your child?” is key to the decision of where you send your child or advise your child of what should be the proper educational path to take.

Yes. It also helps to impress it upon high school students that adults don’t always drink and certainly do not need to drink excessively in order to have a successful social event. Keep in mind that when I went to college, it was still the early '80s, and drinking to excess was still something that a lot of adults did. Mothers Against Drunk Driving was only formed in 1980. MADD and others like them have made a big difference!

IOW, when a lot of parents were in college, there were an awful lot of kids whose parents were a lot stricter about the alcohol use of their children than they were about their own use. This is a far less common double-standard these days. Because of health classes at school, children are more likely than not to come home and give Mom and Dad a lecture about the possible adverse health effects of their nightly glass of wine!

If it is any consolation (and it should be), the incidence of both alcohol use and alcohol abuse in both high schools and colleges has been dropping over the last 20 years. In fact, researchers used breathalyzers to test college students at University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill on Thursday, Friday, and Saturday nights about 15 years ago and found that 66% of the students returned home with absolutely no blood alcohol content. (hsrc.unc.edu/news_room/1999-08-10_nationally_unique_breathalyzer.cfm) The administration published these results for the benefit of all students being pressured to drink, but especially freshmen: "*There are two main goals we’re trying to accomplish with the ‘2 out of 3’ campaign. Our first goal is to share important information with students and the public — that the majority of Carolina students don’t drink on a typical weekend night and we’ve got scientific, reliable data to prove it.

“The second goal is equally important. That is to reassure impressionable first-year students — who just left their homes and are eagerly seeking a new ‘family’ on campus — that they don’t have to drink alcohol to find their niche here, because most of their classmates don’t drink much, or at all, either*.”

[The UNC Highway Safety Research Center study was conducted in October and November 1997. Center researchers interviewed 1,846 students between 10 p.m. and 3 a.m. in front of UNC-CH residence halls and fraternity and sorority houses, and at several off-campus apartment complexes with large student populations. Of those, 1,790 students voluntarily provided a breath-alcohol measurement. Researchers conducted interviews on all nights of the week, Foss said, and there is no indication that drinkers were less likely to provide a breath sample.

The study was funded with $350,000 from the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration and the N.C. Governor’s Highway Safety Program.]