Smoking is intrinsically disorderd

[nilofc]

The punishment for Sin is Pleasure.

It leads you farther away from God because of the pleasure this gives you. In the end, you end up defending your sins.

Ultimately, this grave sin can cause you your soul. Would you rather be suffering in hell afterwards by basking in the pleasure of your sins now?

 

[that1dude]

…oh so easy to prove…

Catechism of the Catholic Church:

Offenses Against Chastity

2352 By masturbation is to be understood the deliberate stimulation of the genital organs in order to derive sexual pleasure. "Both the Magisterium of the Church, in the course of a constant tradition, and the moral sense of the faithful have been in no doubt and have firmly maintained that masturbation is an intrinsically and gravely disordered action."138 “The deliberate use of the sexual faculty, for whatever reason, outside of marriage is essentially contrary to its purpose.” For here sexual pleasure is sought outside of "the sexual relationship which is demanded by the moral order and in which the total meaning of mutual self-giving and human procreation in the context of true love is achieved."139

Awesome. You give an example of how your mind is disordered. Some dudes tell you something and you just believe it? It seems so authoritative because there are numbers associated with it. Can you back up your claims without appealing to random authority? Are you afraid of logic? I understand that you only have so much time. But don’t be afraid to take a few weeks and answer in you own words. I wouldn’t be surprised if you could not even decipher in plain English, the words you quoted. i.e. : ""For here sexual pleasure is sought outside of “the sexual relationship which is demanded by the moral order and in which the total meaning of mutual self-giving and human procreation in the context of true love is achieved.” Can you explain what this means?

 

[nilofc]

Awesome. You give an example of how your mind is disordered. Some dudes tell you something and you just believe it? It seems so authoritative because there are numbers associated with it. Can you back up your claims without appealing to random authority? Are you afraid of logic? I understand that you only have so much time. But don’t be afraid to take a few weeks and answer in you own words. I wouldn’t be surprised if you could not even decipher in plain English, the words you quoted. i.e. : ""For here sexual pleasure is sought outside of “the sexual relationship which is demanded by the moral order and in which the total meaning of mutual self-giving and human procreation in the context of true love is achieved.” Can you explain what this means?

Actually we believe the teachings of the Catholic Church because it alone possess the fullness of the truth. It also makes the most sense. And besides the scriptures tells us so… 1 Tim. 3:15.

Trust me, I’ve been in your situation before…I know how it feels like to defend your sins just because you derive pleasure from it. I’ve been there.

But nothing is farther from the truth. Nothing is more disordered than Sin.

Stop Sinning.

 

[that1dude]

The punishment for Sin is Pleasure.

It leads you farther away from God because of the pleasure this gives you. In the end, you end up defending your sins.

Ultimately, this grave sin can cause you your soul. Would you rather be suffering in hell afterwards by basking in the pleasure of your sins now?

I’m guessing that you are one of the few super-naturalists who would say “The punishment for Sin is Pleasure”. Not only is that statement crazy, it is also completely nonsensical. If it were true, then it would imply that your god is evil.

 

[that1dude]

Actually we believe the teachings of the Catholic Church because it alone possess the fullness of the truth. It also makes the most sense. And besides the scriptures tells us so… 1 Tim. 3:15.

Trust me, I’ve been in your situation before…I know how it feels like to defend your sins just because you derive pleasure from it. But nothing is farther from the truth.

Stop Sinning.

Trust me, I’ve been in your situation before…I know how it feels like to defend superstitions. You say that you believe in the “teachings” and that it makes the “most sense”. Yet you do not have the honesty or integrity to be specific and explain yourself. Pick a “teaching” and defend it with your words.

 

[nilofc]

I’m guessing that you are one of the few super-naturalists who would say “The punishment for Sin is Pleasure”. Not only is that statement crazy, it is also completely nonsensical. If it were true, then it would imply that your god is evil.

What is evil is when you take the good and call it evil…and take evil and call it good.

Drug-use and Masturbation whom you said done in moderation is good…is actually evil. And berating someone who accepts and believes the teaching of the Catholic church is not good.

Isaiah 5:20:
Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil; that put darkness for light, and light for darkness; that put bitter for sweet, and sweet for bitter

 

[stringbeanduck]

You are some authority on the use of “sexual faculties”? Ever actually think about it? The wind blows and my shirt tickles my nipples. Wonderful feeling. Humans have an array of sexual feelings that are wonderful to explore and appreciate. It is extremely evil to denigrate God by describing his designs as “disordered”.

Are you defending masturbation? Its also extremely evil to denigrate God by misusing his sexual designs for ones own pleasure.

 

[nilofc]

Trust me, I’ve been in your situation before…I know how it feels like to defend superstitions. You say that you believe in the “teachings” and that it makes the “most sense”. Yet you do not have the honesty or integrity to be specific and explain yourself. Pick a “teaching” and defend it with your words.

Are you catholic?

 

[stringbeanduck]

Are you catholic?

I was about to ask the same thing.

 

[that1dude]

What is evil is when you take the good and call it evil…and take evil and call it good.

Drug-use and Masturbation whom you said done in moderation is good…is actually evil. And berating someone who accepts and believes the teaching of the Catholic church is not good.

OK. You said I took the good and called it evil. But you don’t give any reasoning to support this. At least try.

Berating someone who is wrong, is GOOD. correct?

Smoking is evil? Beer is evil? Aspirin is Evil? Choking chickens is evil? How old are you? Respectfully: do you have some mental deficiency?

 

[nilofc]

Bishop Fulton Sheen once said…

You do not really need to defend the Catholic Faith, it is like a lion inside a cage. Just open the door…

You wanted me to defend the teachings of the Catholic Church…of course I will… Masturbation is a sin because it is a sin against chastity.

Chastity is not being able not to do what you want to do…that is abstinence… Chastity is being able to use the beauty of intercourse inside the bounds of marriage.

Anything outside that…is either fornication or adultery.

 

[nilofc]

OK. You said I took the good and called it evil. But you don’t give any reasoning to support this. At least try.

Berating someone who is wrong, is GOOD. correct?

Smoking is evil? Beer is evil? Aspirin is Evil? Choking chickens is evil? How old are you? Respectfully: do you have some mental deficiency?

Smoking, Beer, Aspirin, Choking chickens…where did you get all these assumptions?

Stop masturbating it is a grave sin.

 

[cargau]

Look, first let me say that I am not here to judge you. You may, in fact, not be committing a sin because you need full knowledge that the act is disordered, which, you do not.

So, I am not going to go off on your sinfulness. For one thing, I have no business assessing another man’s soul. I have enough to do for my own.

But, you are visiting a Catholic website. We Catholics do place a great deal of gravity on the edicts of the Holy See. You see, we believe that our Church is guided by the Holy Spirit. That is because that is what Jesus promised us. So, even when we don’t always understand all of the details surrounding such a position, we tend to trust the Church because we trust Christ. There is a word for that, it is called humility.

You may think that is not sensible (and you are entitled to your opinion) but we do not. This debate cannot be won because we view this from different perspectives.

I would encourage to at least try to understand the Church’s position. Really meditate on it because there really is a great deal of wisdom in it.

You will definitely be in my prayers tonight.

 

[that1dude]

Are you catholic?

I like to say “ethnic catholic”. In other words, I was reared by catholics, went to catholic schools until around 16th birthday. Still attend all my huge families’ religious weddings and funerals. Still participate in the easters and xmas, etc…

 

[nilofc]

I like to say “ethnic catholic”. In other words, I was reared by catholics, went to catholic schools until around 16th birthday. Still attend all my huge families’ religious weddings and funerals. Still participate in the easters and xmas, etc…

Ok… I will be praying for you. Peace Bro.

 

[Catherine_S]

Debate. Is Smoking an intrinsically disordered act, and if so, why isn’t it considered grave matter? Is it not a selfish act? Is it not a misuse of our lungs?

*Is driving a car an intrinsically disordered act at this point in history and if so, why isn’t it considered a grave matter? *
*Is it not a selfish act? *
Is it not the misuse of all lungs especially those of our children?

I do not smoke nor do* I drive** a car, our lungs are a gift and I am interested in the depth of sin in both of these actions.*

Cars, Trucks and Buses cause more air pollution than any thing else!
Is this a grave sin?
Is it a selfish act.
*You can’t choose the air you breathe in and you need **enormous **amounts of it - 26,000 breaths worth a day. That adds up to 14,000 litres or about 150 bathtubs full. So, even small amounts of pollution can **really *add up.
*The health effects can range from triggering or worsening of asthma, eye, throat and lung irritations and respiratory diseases. These can put extra strain on other systems of the body and lead to heart and circulation problems (cardio pulmonary). Young people and the elderly are **most *at risk.
.

 

[nilofc]

Look, first let me say that I am not here to judge you. You may, in fact, not be committing a sin because you need full knowledge that the act is disordered, which, you do not.

So, I am not going to go off on your sinfulness. For one thing, I have no business assessing another man’s soul. I have enough to do for my own.

But, you are visiting a Catholic website. We Catholics do place a great deal of gravity on the edicts of the Holy See. You see, we believe that our Church is guided by the Holy Spirit. That is because that is what Jesus promised us. So, even when we don’t always understand all of the details surrounding such a position, we tend to trust the Church because we trust Christ. There is a word for that, it is called humility.

You may think that is not sensible (and you are entitled to your opinion) but we do not. This debate cannot be won because we view this from different perspectives.

I would encourage to at least try to understand the Church’s position. Really meditate on it because there really is a great deal of wisdom in it.

You will definitely be in my prayers tonight.

Amen! Nicely said…my sentiments too. We don’t follow the church’s teachings blindly but we are instructed by St. Paul to walk by faith and not by sight.

The Church is the Pillar and the Foundation of the Truth.

 

[pprimeau1976]

Masturbation is not intrinsically disordered because it involves impure thoughts but because it is a misuse of our sexual faculties.

Just like smoking is a misuse of our breathing facilities.

How about this line of reasoning,

1. 
   *]God gave the apostles, and henceforth the Church the power to bind and loose. “Whatever you bind on earth shall be bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.” (Matt 18:18).
   *]The Church, through it’s catechism, teaches that masturbation is gravely sinful.
   *]Since the Church recognizes it as gravely sinful, God recognizes it as gravely sinful.
   And notice that you cannot use that line of reasoning with smoking.

 

[ForwardProgress]

True…but it should!! That’s my point. Which means nothing since I’m just a lowly lay person.

 

[that1dude]

Smoking, Beer, Aspirin, Choking chickens…where did you get all these assumptions?

Stop masturbating it is a grave sin.

These are not assumptions. Theses are things that I have heard Catholics call evil: Drugs and masturbation (choking the chicken).

Use your words, your logic, and your reasoning skills to explain to me why masturbation is wrong. You can’t do it. I will win the debate. Do not refer to your bible. I can justify slavery with your bible.