So whats the deal with Jesuits?

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Melchior said:
You know, I’d have thought that someone with the letters “SSPX” in their profile would be a little more forgiving of other orders all things considered. I’m sure you wouldn’t want others to judge the SSPX based on a few representatives, no?
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First, off, I have nothing to forgive the Jesuits for. They are currently, under the guise of Catholicism, teaching heresy and tolerating immorality on practically every college campus they administer. I am not sure you know what the SSPX is if you think it is about forgiving heresy or immorality.
 
Young_Thinker said:
I like the Jesuits, but, for some reason, they typically hate to wear cassocks (I am trying to keep this discussion a little light-hearted).
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In the same vein, when I started high school in 1968, they all wore cassocks. By the time I graduated in 1972, they all wore nasty polyester sport coats with wide lapels and Peter Max poster ties. They were indistinguishable from the Fuller Brush Man.
 
Trying to generalize about Jesuits today is about as useless as trying to characterize ALL catholics. They’re all human and subject to the same sinfulness as the rest of us.

Fun story: I once asked a local Dominican priest what the differnce was between the Jesuit and Dominican orders. He said the Dominican orders originally got established to combat the spreading of the Albigensian heresy and the Jesuit order was founded largely in response to the protestant heresy. I asked him which order had been more successful in its mission. He said “Have you met an Albigensian lately?” 😃

OK, it’s just a joke I heard.

But the Jesuits really did once have the reputation and common goal of standing AGAINST the introduction of erroneous teaching and had as a pillar of their mission to defend that authority of the pope. In my lifetime, their mission has distinctly shifted and the order overall appears more committed to the scientific method and the idea of free philosophical inquiry and debate unrestrained by any external authority than they do in the idea that God has revealed himself to us through Christ and established the Church to be the safeguard of that revelation.

They’ve been quite financially successful at that mission too. The nearby Jesuit Loyola University in Chicago has an annual operating budget larger than the Vatican’s!
 
giuseppeTO said:
In the same vein, when I started high school in 1968, they all wore cassocks. By the time I graduated in 1972, they all wore nasty polyester sport coats with wide lapels and Peter Max poster ties. They were indistinguishable from the Fuller Brush Man.
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It must have been rather shocking.
 
Charlotte408 said:
so they’re not some ‘secret’ militia of the vatican…lol…with a ‘black pope’ thats supposedly the most powerful man in the world??

lmbo…I’m laughing as I type it it sounds so ridiculous…but I wonder what basis people have for these kinds of claims…
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its the lack of trust prevalent in our society today. people always think there’s a more evil, more sinister plot behind everything. thats why we have so many conspiracy theorists, people who think like The Da Vinci Code all the time. you tell them something, they don’t accept it for what it is. something always has to have some bigger, darker motive behind it

its sad really. but thats the way it is. people just can’t trust what they’re told. perhaps the lack of faith in God, who is the one who is behind everything but for the good of all. with the lack of God in their life, they try to look for that thing that is behind everything, but see it in a negative way. thus you have these ton of conspiracy theorists. if only they turn to God.
 
giuseppeTO said:
First, off, I have nothing to forgive the Jesuits for. They are currently, under the guise of Catholicism, teaching heresy and tolerating immorality on practically every college campus they administer. I am not sure you know what the SSPX is if you think it is about forgiving heresy or immorality.
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And clearly things like breaking vows of obedience (if they took them at all) is no big deal, right? Vows are such trivial things after all. I wonder what my wife would think if I treated my vows to her the way members of the SSPX treated their vows of obedience?

What you’re failing to see is that every order has issues with some of their members. Humans, even Saints, are not perfect. Why, some of them aren’t even good people sometimes (St. Jerome, anyone?) The SSPX has issues just as much as any other order. Disobedience, superiority complex, and the fact some of them say “we are totally legit” when they actually aren’t yet all the way there yet are examples of some things you can find within the SSPX. Why, I wouldn’t be shocked if there was some heretics within the SSPX who say such heresies as the OF isn’t valid, V2 was a mistake and not valid, and condemning the practices of other orders.

Your flagrant generalizations of the Jesuits is not surprising in the least, as it merely reinforces stereotypes that some hold. I trust you know that when you place upon yourself the badge of SSPX, even on the Internet, you represent them. This is no different than me, as I make my Franciscan spirituality very clear. I know that when I say “I follow his way of life and live according to his rules” that I need to act a certain way, otherwise an impression could be left that is not desired. You sir, whether you know it or not, are doing the same. And I can’t say it’s a positive one, as several people say this;
*
People: “Some Jesuits are bad, but there’s some good ones. Just like any order”.

You: “They are currently, under the guise of Catholicism, teaching heresy and tolerating immorality on practically every college campus they administer”.*

You’re not creating a good impression of the SSPX by doing this. Especially considering that people could easily judge the entire SSPX based on disobedience and extremism that in some cases borders on schism. You are, unknowingly perhaps, fostering this stereotype with your refusal to see that the entire order Jesuits should not be judged based on the actions of some of their members.

I try not to be one of those people, as I know better than to judge an entire group of people based on personal experiences. Judging a whole group of people based on a large sample size would mean I wouldn’t be married, because let me tell you I’ve had far more negative relationship stories than positive before I met my wife.

I have no ill-will towards any orders, including the SSPX. Obviously I have a favorite one, but that doesn’t mean I go around saying “DOMINICANS ARE HERETICS AND THEIR MASS AND RITE(S) ISN’T VALID!!11!11!!eleven”
 
giuseppeTO said:
First, off, I have nothing to forgive the Jesuits for. They are currently, under the guise of Catholicism, teaching heresy and tolerating immorality on practically every college campus they administer. I am not sure you know what the SSPX is if you think it is about forgiving heresy or immorality.
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SSPX are a Protestant group under the guise of ultra-orthodox.
Split with the Magisterium and you split with the church.
 
Major_Minor said:
SSPX are a Protestant group under the guise of ultra-orthodox.
Split with the Magisterium and you split with the church.
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Please tell me you are kidding and then I’ll conclude you just have a bad sense of humour.
 
thats right

there’s a difference between a schismatic group and a protestant group
 
Charlotte408 said:
so they’re not some ‘secret’ militia of the vatican…lol…with a ‘black pope’ thats supposedly the most powerful man in the world??

lmbo…I’m laughing as I type it it sounds so ridiculous…but I wonder what basis people have for these kinds of claims…
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It pains me to answer your questions…my husband attended a Jesuit high school 50 yrs. ago. He graduated in 1958 while this order was considered one of the very best. They were scholarly, manly men who brooked no nonsense from their students & taught Traditional Catholicism.

NOW?

Jesuits Implode

By George Neumayr

Published 3/13/02 12:03:00 AM

"Were Ignatius of Loyola alive today, the Jesuit order he founded wouldn’t ordain him.** His once-formidable society is now a corrupt club for homosexual dilettantes and anti-papal dissenters. Real Catholics need no longer apply. **

The order is in the throes of a collapse as historically significant as its suppression in 1773. This disintegration, known to traditional Catholics for years (and to bishops too cowardly to stifle its corruption), is now even admitted by liberal pundits. Garry Wills’ article about the book “Passionate Uncertainty: Inside the American Jesuits” appears in the New York Review of Books under the title, “Jesuits in Disarray.” Jonathan Kirsch, a Los Angeles Times reviewer of the same book, notes that the order is in demographic free fall: **“former Jesuits now outnumber active Jesuits in the United States.” **

freerepublic.com/focus/news/645814/posts

The homosexual Jesuits also outnumber the heterosexual Jesuits & this has hurt them deeply. The type of men who used to become Jesuits were, as I said before, scholars & MEN & the young men they taught respected them. Not so much anymore. They lost so many Seminarians as this type of men …shall we say…weren’t “comfortable” within the seminaries & they lost some of the Brightest & the Best. They have definitely embraced homosexual unions & are pretty iffy on “Women’t Reproductive Rights” (abortion).

Bonnie Morris, an adjunct assistant professor of women’s studies at Georgetown University, said some Catholic colleges employ faculty supportive of causes at odds with the church, from gay rights to the use of contraceptives. “I’m openly gay, and I’m teaching at a Jesuit institution,” said Morris, who added that Georgetown (one of their most prestigious Universities) is developing a Lesbian, Gay, Bisexual, Transgender Center.
Meanwhile, traditional Jesuits who stay and seek to recover the order’s original spark find themselves sent to a theological " North pole.

We have a Jesuit prep school about 60 mis. from our home. I have watched it for the past 40 yrs. & it is so sad. I, who once hoped that I’d be able to send my children to that school…would not send them now if it was free.
 
Ockham said:
Read post #34.

Read.

Learn.

Understand.
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if one is severed from the Church, it means their position is not only wrong, its dangerous to the beliefs of other Catholics. i will never choose the SSPX over the Jesuits until the day the SSPX would be in full communion with the Church again. only then will i reevaluate my position
 
Charlotte408 said:
oooOOOooo hello brother patrick!!! lmbo…

Thats what we’re lacking in my town…young…‘studly’ christian men. But thats a whole 'nuther thread…
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:rotfl::rotfl::rotfl::rotfl::rotfl:

Sorry to say (for you :p) Br Pat took a vow of chastity lol
 
There is defacto union and dejure. Check out the Guelph website I provided then compare it to sspx.com. Tell me who is more Catholic?
 
Major_Minor said:
SSPX are a Protestant group under the guise of ultra-orthodox.
Split with the Magisterium and you split with the church.
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that is one of the most offensive things i have heard this month, you sir (if you actually believe this) are totally ignorant of the ENTIRE issue.

www.sspx.org
 
VetA said:
that is one of the most offensive things i have heard this month, you sir (if you actually believe this) are totally ignorant of the ENTIRE issue.

www.sspx.org
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Yet seriously, are you surprised?

Modernists, progressives or liberals, whatever you want to call them are always quick to hurl insults like “extremist”, “far right”, and the inevitable “Nazi”. As proven in this thread and most others they can’t match arguments fact for fact so they resort to insults and distraction.

The SSPX was excommunicated for holding true to two thousand years of apostolic tradition. In contrast, how many priests, bishops, and cardinals go about their daily business in complete defiance of Church law yet remain in ‘good standing’?

The Jesuits are a prime example of what can happen when the Deceiver is pulling the strings. Why is it anytime a member of their order appears on television they are not wearing the collar? Why is it they get on television so often?

The leader of my local house is infamous for his outdoor liturgy on hay bails and communing with nature. Quite the contrast from the order that sent missionaries into the most dangerous parts of the world.
 
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