Socialized healthcare

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I just wanted to apologise to Vern and to anybody else trying to follow this thread, I let myself get hot-headed last night, and got carried away attacking American market values just for the sake of it. I’m sorry, that was uncalled for.
Hey, some of us were enjoying watching you guys going on about just who was the best endowed!
 
I just wanted to apologise to Vern and to anybody else trying to follow this thread, I let myself get hot-headed last night, and got carried away attacking American market values just for the sake of it. I’m sorry, that was uncalled for.

I still disagree with private healthcare, because I think health is a right not a privilege, and I think the US private system is extremely wasteful of resources compared to some of the hybrid public/simulated-market systems in Europe, but my attacks on America in general were just aimed at goading a response, and for that I’m sorry.
Yet our experience is that the freer the market, the more efficient it is. Certainly our example of socialized medicine, the Veterans Administration, is not model of efficiency. We need to move in a different direction.
 
At least people in Sweden and Denmark are treated with dignity as their unemployed people are sent to “labor market political activities” while people in the United States merely receive small benefits.
 
At least people in Sweden and Denmark are treated with dignity as their unemployed people are sent to “labor market political activities” while people in the United States merely receive small benefits.
Is there an English version of that post?😉
 
The headline unemployment rate in Sweden is only 5-5.5%, but this number is extremely misleading as it only includes a small number of the people who the government pays not to work. Many unemployed are sent to so-called “labor market political activities” who have no meaningful purpose then to reduce the headline unemployment number. Including them, unemployment is 8%. And if you also include the enourmous number of early retirees and people who live of sickness benefits, the real unemployment rate is more like 25% rather than 5%. The number of early retirees are 540,000, more than double the number of officially unemployed.
stefanmikarlsson.blogspot.com…mic-logic.html
As for unemployment, the seemingly low numbers in Denmark reflect in fact the same kind of manipulation of statistics that the Swedish government have been using. While official unemployment in Denmark was only 133,500 or 4.8% in March 2006, there were in the fourth quarter (latest available number in Denmark’s statistical data bank )some 117,600 people or 4.2% in so-called “arbejdsmarkedspolitiske foranstaltninger(=“labor market political activities”, what in Sweden is refered to as “AMS-åtgärder”)”. This means that Denmark have even more hidden unemployment in that respect than even Sweden, where “only” 3.2% (144,000) were put away in “labor market political activities” . And while the total level of hidden unemployment is still lower than in Sweden as Denmark have less people in early retirement and on “sick leave”, hidden unemployment is still a lot higher than in most other OECD countries.
stefanmikarlsson.blogspot.com…exicurity.html
The headline unemployment rate in Sweden is only 5–5.5%, but this number is extremely misleading as it only includes a small number of the people who the government pays not to work. Many unemployed are sent to so-called “labor market political activities” — activities whose only purpose is to reduce the official unemployment rate.
mises.org/story/2259

I regret that the unemployed cant go to “labor market political activities.”
 
Wow!!

Let’s be sure to imitate Sweden and get our unemployment up to 25%!!

This is like the British claim to have 95% literacy.

In the US, we use the term “functional illiteracy” and define it as, “Unable to read the lable on a foot package or a simple child’s story. Unable to fill out an application form.”

The British use the term “literacy” and define it as, “Having attended five or more years of school.”😛
 
Wow!!

Let’s be sure to imitate Sweden and get our unemployment up to 25%!!

This is like the British claim to have 95% literacy.

In the US, we use the term “functional illiteracy” and define it as, “Unable to read the lable on a foot package or a simple child’s story. Unable to fill out an application form.”

The British use the term “literacy” and define it as, “Having attended five or more years of school.”😛
I just want the “labor market political activities” to be imitated.
 
I just wanted to apologise to Vern and to anybody else trying to follow this thread, I let myself get hot-headed last night, and got carried away attacking American market values just for the sake of it. I’m sorry, that was uncalled for.

I still disagree with private healthcare, because I think health is a right not a privilege, and I think the US private system is extremely wasteful of resources compared to some of the hybrid public/simulated-market systems in Europe, but my attacks on America in general were just aimed at goading a response, and for that I’m sorry.
Not a problem DL82…please accept my apologies for any taunting from my end.

I think we will see some change in our system here, but I hope it is a public/private solution. Everyone seems to assume it has to be all private or all public (of course, even our current system isn’t all private). I would hope that we can find a middle ground that takes care of everyone’s needs.
 
From the NY Times- not exaclty a conservative paper.

*"*Since last year, when the landmark law took effect, about 340,000 of Massachusetts’ estimated 600,000 uninsured have gained coverage. Many are now searching for doctors and scheduling appointments for long-deferred care." In western Massachusetts, in Amherst, a doctor by the name of Katherine Atkinson, family physician doctor, has a 3,000-patient practice, which was closed to new patients for several years, has taken on 50 newcomers since she hired a part-time nurse practitioner in November. About a third were newly insured, Dr. Atkinson said. Just north of here in Athol, the doctors at North Quabbin Family Physicians are now seeing four to six new patients a day, up from one or two a year ago." But the problem is that there aren’t enough doctors to handle all of these people, who were required to go get health insurance and are now going to the doctor. For example, Dr. Katherine Atkinson, her next opening for a physical is not until May of 2009, a year from now. For a standard physical, she is booked through 2009." *

I think the problem is a lack of family practice doctors, most MDs go into speciality where the big bucks await.

One things for sure ya won’t be seeing a bunch of MD’s rushing to go into practice in Mass. LOL

Just goes to show like my daddy always said -“Don’t wish for something too hard cause ya just might get it.”*
 
Wait a minute! During the Clinton admnistration, didn’t the President say we had too many doctors, and sponsor legislation to pay medical schools not to graduate so many doctors?:whacky:
 
I just wanted to apologise to Vern and to anybody else trying to follow this thread, I let myself get hot-headed last night, and got carried away attacking American market values just for the sake of it. I’m sorry, that was uncalled for.

I still disagree with private healthcare, because I think health is a right not a privilege, and I think the US private system is extremely wasteful of resources compared to some of the hybrid public/simulated-market systems in Europe, but my attacks on America in general were just aimed at goading a response, and for that I’m sorry.
I wouldn’t bother apologising, considering some of the posts from the ‘other side’ are pretty goading. You see, anyone who doesn’t ascribe to the no-life-outside-of-work mantra is lazy, and anyone who doesn’t believe that your ability to stay alive should be dictated solely by your income is a liberal.
 
I wouldn’t bother apologising, considering some of the posts from the ‘other side’ are pretty goading. You see, anyone who doesn’t ascribe to the no-life-outside-of-work mantra is lazy, and anyone who doesn’t believe that your ability to stay alive should be dictated solely by your income is a liberal.
Wow…you are far too cynical. 😃
 
Wow…you are far too cynical. 😃
Well he/she got the name honest I’d say LOL.

And we just can’t get y’all to admit there is a sizeable populace who are NOT gonna work 40 hours a week, heck they are NOT gonna work 20 if they can get out of it. LOL
 
We need to first define what socialism is and we can then answer the question. Socialism is an economic system where the state owns and controls the means of production.

Now, there are several proposals out there, none of which are actually socialized medicine. There are proposals for single-payer, mandates to purchase private insurance or medical savings accounts…along with all sorts of in-between ideas.

As an editorial note, there are those who say that single-payer is socialism. What is ignored is the fact that the doctors and hospitals would remain as they currently are, whether public or private owned, which means that the state does NOT own and control the means of production; therefore, not socialist.
I disagree on your interpretation of the single payer system not controling the means of production. If there is a single payer ,the government, or a system established by the government and under its rules all health care providers are controlled by this system. Look at Medicare/Medicad now. It just covers seniors and poor people and wields huge influence on how our health care system operates. Imagine if everyone in our country was forced into this single payer program. Where would those health care providers go if they opted out of that program? Canada? There is no way “that the doctors and hospitals would remain as they currently are, whether public or private owned”. If the government controls how much providers get paid and for what services who cares who owns the buildings. He who controls the purse strings controls the country. Be very careful who you vote to give that control to.
 
Well he/she got the name honest I’d say LOL.

And we just can’t get y’all to admit there is a sizeable populace who are NOT gonna work 40 hours a week, heck they are NOT gonna work 20 if they can get out of it. LOL
He/she? I think that is a different thread. 😛
 
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