Socialized healthcare

[cynic]

fine, don’t anwer the question then.

 

[vern_humphrey]

fine, don’t anwer the question then.

Fine, don’t anwer the question then.

 

[Al_Masetti]

I went to the doctor with my son who couldn’t hear properly and was expecting a hearing test but the doctor offered to remove his tonsils for ‘only’ £700. It wasn’t in the U.K. When I returned home I was told that in that case removing of tonsils would have been an unnecessary operation. The hearing test showed that he can hear perfectly well and they started looking for different reasons why my son is constantly asking ‘what’ and turning the TV up. It also may be the lack of concantration as he is becoming bilingual.
Or dentist who want to remove all fillings just to put new ones, more expensive etc.
This is just an example but I know people (in that country) who would pay for a private doctor consultation but are scared that they might be treated unfair. Sometimes they are so desperate they will spend all their money for nothing (unnecessary tests, operation).
It’s known that people from the U.K. go to another countries for medical treatment as it is cheap and often better than they can expect with NHS. That’s why some medical staff take advantage of them thinking: They have money and they’ll pay for it.
Both the poor and the rich are used by medical business. It’s all about making money.
Of course I’m not saying all private clinics treat their patients to make profit. I go over there for dentist treatment as I’m fed up with NHS. But I’ve known that doctor for years and I can trust him.

This is exactly why everyone must manage their own case.

This is exactly why everyone must get second and third and fourth opinions, regardless of the inconvenience, unless it is an absolutely dire emergency … [car wreck, immediate threat of loss of life] …

 

[Al_Masetti]

I was just watching BookTV and they had Grover Norquist on.

Very relevant to this discussion.

You can see his discussion on www.booktv.org and also by visiting www.atr.org

I just ordered his book from Amazon.

“Leave Us Alone”

Fabulous discussion.

Check out his web site and the BookTV discussion.

 

[cynic]

You don’t believe that bread cast upon the waters comes back a hundred-fold?

scoring points for the afterlife is more important than the outcome for the recipient?

What I’d like to ask is, if everybody is supported by the government, who’s left to pay those heavy taxes?

Especially when those on the left reject the proposition that they should work up to potential and bear their share of the load?

even if everyone able to worked a 40 hour week there’d be enough money to go around for those who genuinely can’t support themselves. Granted there are those who don’t work who could, seperate issue. You havn’t aswered the question, why is education for children a universal right, to be funded by government (‘extortion’ from the taxpayer). but assistence for healthcare isn’t?

 

[vern_humphrey]

scoring points for the afterlife is more important than the outcome for the recipient?

even if everyone able to worked a 40 hour week there’d be enough money to go around for those who genuinely can’t support themselves. Granted there are those who don’t work who could, seperate issue. You havn’t aswered the question, why is education for children a universal right, to be funded by government (‘extortion’ from the taxpayer). but assistence for healthcare isn’t?

If assistance for healthcare is a right, why isn’t free food, free housing, free cars, free trips to Acapulco and free liposuction?

Universal education isn’t charity. It’s what we Catholics call “Social Justice” – arranging society so people who would otherwise be poor can become prosperous and contribute to society.

But, of course, since the government runs education, it doesn’t work. In our 50 largest cities, the combined high school dropout rate is about 50%.

Let the government take over medicine, and the results will be as dismal as they are for education.

 

[LCMS_No_More]

:doh2: oh dear, even giving to charity is supposed to ‘get’ you something.

This in a country who’s central ideology is money, no surprise… What I’d like to ask is, if nobody should be forced by government to help out with anyone elses healthcare, then why do you believe they should for education?

Think about it. Would a right-winger do ANYTHING just because it’s the right thing to do and there is no gain in doing so?

I predict that a certain denizen of someplace in the country will come back with a smarmy: “Would any left-winger do ANYTHING…”

Not the point, of course, because I’m not a left- or right-winger.

 

[cynic]

If assistance for healthcare is a right, why isn’t free food, free housing, free cars, free trips to Acapulco and free liposuction?

.

Someone who is lacking in food or shelter can remedy the situation… by getting a job. Someone who has cancer, or is seriously ill, cannot ‘work’ themselves out of being sick. Even if they could have afforded to insure themselves, what are you going to do, let them die?

 

[vern_humphrey]

Someone who is lacking in food or shelter can remedy the situation… by getting a job. Someone who has cancer, or is seriously ill, cannot ‘work’ themselves out of being sick. Even if they could have afforded to insure themselves, what are you going to do, let them die?

How many times do I have to post a economically viable and compassionate alternative to socialized medicine on this forum?

 

[Al_Masetti]

Interesting Mindszenty Report newsletter on socialized medicine.

Check it out.

mindszenty.org/report/index.html

 

[BamaRider]

Al- When I clicked on the linky in question to the URL it sent me to PDF file that didn’t open. Can ya give us the short version of what the Cardinal said?

 

[cynic]

How many times do I have to post a economically viable and compassionate alternative to socialized medicine on this forum?

and your solution would (msa + government subsidy) appears to be at odds with some of your earlier statements.

For eg:

The fact that you want someone else to pay for it, instead of giving of your own labor sums it up perfectly.

 

[Al_Masetti]

Al- When I clicked on the linky in question to the URL it sent me to PDF file that didn’t open. Can ya give us the short version of what the Cardinal said?

Hmmmmm.

The PDF file opened right up for me.

Do you have the Acrobat reader?

There’s a little button at the right side of the sentence that will let you down load Acrobat Reader.

 

[jman507]

and your solution would (msa + government subsidy) appears to be at odds with some of your earlier statements.

For eg:

You could put it **msa **+ government subsidy. In that case the person with the msa is the most active hand in the financial decisions.

 

[goofyjim]

Of course I still remember someone saying that a 40 hour work week is considered sloth. HA

 

[vern_humphrey]

and your solution would (msa + government subsidy) appears to be at odds with some of your earlier statements.

It only appears that way to people with linear thinking processes.

You see, my committment is Catholic, not socialist. I want to do what works, not what Karl Marx would do.

 

[Al_Masetti]

Of course I still remember someone saying that a 40 hour work week is considered sloth. HA

There are still 168 hours in a week. What does one do to fill those hours?

 

[goofyjim]

There are still 168 hours in a week. What does one do to fill those hours?

How about clean the house, do the laundry, shop for groceries, enjoy a little tv or radio, sleep during the night? It is not sloth to work a 40 hour week. It should be all that is necessary. One can burn out easily putting in more time than 5 eight hour days.

 

[vern_humphrey]

How about clean the house, do the laundry, shop for groceries, enjoy a little tv or radio, sleep during the night? It is not sloth to work a 40 hour week. It should be all that is necessary. One can burn out easily putting in more time than 5 eight hour days.

My grandfather, at the age of 14, drove a covered wagon across the plains – from Nebraska to Oklahoma. He and his father cleared the land (acquired in the land rush), built a log house, then squared up the rest of the timber by hand and sold it as railroad ties. They got 50 cents apiece, and for a long time it was their only source of income – other than the washing my great-grandmother did.

My dad worked all over the world, in oil exploration camps. I have worked all over the world, mostly in military traning.

That kind of work is what it takes to realize the American dream – to provide properly for one’s children and for one’s old age.

When people decide they shouldn’t have to work hard to prosper, they will not prosper.

 

[goofyjim]

My grandfather, at the age of 14, drove a covered wagon across the plains – from Nebraska to Oklahoma. He and his father cleared the land (acquired in the land rush), built a log house, then squared up the rest of the timber by hand and sold it as railroad ties. They got 50 cents apiece, and for a long time it was their only source of income – other than the washing my great-grandmother did.

My dad worked all over the world, in oil exploration camps. I have worked all over the world, mostly in military traning.

That kind of work is what it takes to realize the American dream – to provide properly for one’s children and for one’s old age.

When people decide they shouldn’t have to work hard to prosper, they will not prosper.

Why is it that the only tiem one is working hard is hwne they are working according to your standards? One can work quite hard during 40 hours on the job and still have other things necessary to get done. We shouldn’t all have to conform to this 80 hour work ethic. If jobs paid decently 40 hours would be plenty enough to cover expenses and still invest for prosperity.