Socialized healthcare

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ALFREDENEUMAN said:
perhaps you might want to try an experiment. do everyrhing you can to wipe out all the information you have aboutcomputeer use. pretend you knpw nothing. go buy a used computerf, because you really want to learn. no instructionmanual, you live alone. etc, plug it in and go to it. you pick up an instruction book at the library and it reads like greek. then t ake all the tryping skills you have and forget you ever had them. a keyboard is a vast desert where one thing looks exactly the same as any other. then ther is the arthritis but ill leave that. perhaps it would be a good idea if we forbade all these kinds of people from usign the computer at alll. after all, what they write is hard to read, almost needs decoding machines, takes up extra time when you try to read it and three ofr four othert bad things. still carefull examination of what is written combnined with a lot of patience might just once and awhile produce from that jumbled meess an idea worth discussing. most likely not . still you have the option, which im sure was th very first thing considered by whoever put computers together… Make sure you have a key which says the reader xcan skip wat us written if he chooses to do so.
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Well, I started using computers when the storage device was a cassette tape recorder, and you had to write your own programs. I had about as much in the way of instruction books as you have – probably far less. Yet I managed to write programs that did things like multivariate statistics.

Go to your local library – they have plenty of computer books, including the famous “For Dummies” series that are designed to explain things very simply.

Now, I have arthritis, too – in fact, I’m going to have surgery for it in a couple of weeks – but that doesn’t preclude me from doing simple things like proof-reading what I write.

Go to your library, get a book (you can probably get tutoring in computers there, too) and learn to use your word processor and its capabilities.
 
ALFREDENEUMAN said:
you are a better man then i am gunga din
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You understand this is wholly a written medium?

Our only impression of you is what you write. If your writing is confused, misspelled and disjointed, what are we to think of you? Are you poorly educated and confused, or is it simply that you don’t respect the rest of us enough to craft a coherent and readable post?

Take the time to learn to use the word processing program, and make a good impression – otherwise, it’s like you came to a meeting unshaved, barefooted and in your pajamas
 
ALFREDENEUMAN said this when I asked him if he was from Mad Magazine-
no its me
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So I did some web surfing and found this jpg-

Nooo this is Alfred E. Neuman- of Mad Magazine fame. I’m thinkin ya need to take this and put it in your signature line or profile, now that would be cool :cool:
 
tell you what you tell me why tyou are so interested and i might tell you which if any i have choisen and why.
 
to vern humphrey. im sorrt truly. perhaps you would understand a little more (or not) if you believed something i believe about the world and the people in it. it is wise to start every relationship every time, the ralationship is renewew, (for exapmple family, start all over again every time a new meeting occurs) with the idea in the back of your mind that everybody ifromthe most angelic to the most dmonic is deoing the best that they can. they all are. me included. if you consider this as being correct perhaps you will do whatever you have to to understand that i am not doing what i do deliberately to offedn somebiody, nor not doing what i dont do noto offend anybody. i am doing the best that i can.
 
vern_humphrey said:
Actually not – a math teacher needs a degree in Education with some math courses, which is not a masters in math, and a far cry from a doctorate.

.
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To teach science subjects at university entrance level, where I’m from, you do.
vern_humphrey said:
A good CAI course knows the instant the student makes a mistake, analyzes the mistake, compares it with the student’s record to date, and segues the student into a remedation module.

.
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And if they still don’t get it? I found the information textbooks to be totally inadequate while at school. It took proper explanation from lecturers at uni to understand a few things (yes the ‘teaching’ at school wasn’t that good). I can’t imagine how a programme could be better than ongoing explanation from an adult well acquanted with the subject.
vern_humphrey said:
You can have 20 students taking the same lesson, but find each student’s experience is unique – because the lesson adapts for each student’s strengths and weaknesses.

.
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That simple is it? Problem solved! Or perhaps it only works for the bright kids…
vern_humphrey said:
Most people wouldn’t ask questions like those – since most people with any experience of CAI would understand how the systems work.
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Oh of course, stupid questions, sorry about that:doh2:Really.
 
ALFREDENEUMAN said:
to vern humphrey. im sorrt truly. perhaps you would understand a little more (or not) if you believed something i believe about the world and the people in it. it is wise to start every relationship every time, the ralationship is renewew, (for exapmple family, start all over again every time a new meeting occurs) with the idea in the back of your mind that everybody ifromthe most angelic to the most dmonic is deoing the best that they can. they all are. me included. if you consider this as being correct perhaps you will do whatever you have to to understand that i am not doing what i do deliberately to offedn somebiody, nor not doing what i dont do noto offend anybody. i am doing the best that i can.
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Do what??
 
Alfred

You keep posting. Don’t worry about what anyone else says on these forums. There are no rules requiring expert typing ability to post. Just peaceful participation.
 
im can remember going to a three day ynmposium in CAI about 35 years ago. being young, with mush for brains, i immediately fell,in love with the idea, went back to my school reported to the faculty which decided to spend a year of wrokshops on studying various aspects of CAI, conclusion,… there were certain parts of certain subjects that were most likely better taugh by uxing cai then by traditional method. however since noone really had attemmpted to teach byn the newest varients of what we call the traditional method we really couldnt compare them. it was very definitely felt that cai wouls be most efficient in a one on one situation where the student had not and could not master a specific part of a specific subject. (A given set in math for example, or to be very simple a positive plus a minus equals ? a minus pplus a plus equals. or something like that). being teacheras we natyurally felt, perhaps erroneously that for most things teacher involvement (although the method of it wwould have to change) was important. lota and lots of further info. lasgt conclusion…the cost os cai, although mush iof it is hidden, was far to much to condiser installing except in a language class
 
AlfredENeuman put this out for us to consider-
im can remember going to a three day ynmposium in CAI about 35 years ago. being young, with mush for brains, i immediately fell,in love with the idea, went back to my school reported to the faculty which decided to spend a year of wrokshops on studying various aspects of CAI, conclusion,… there were certain parts of certain subjects that were most likely better taugh by uxing cai then by traditional method. however since noone really had attemmpted to teach byn the newest varients of what we call the traditional method we really couldnt compare them. it was very definitely felt that cai wouls be most efficient in a one on one situation where the student had not and could not master a specific part of a specific subject. (A given set in math for example, or to be very simple a positive plus a minus equals ? a minus pplus a plus equals. or something like that). being teacheras we natyurally felt, perhaps erroneously that for most things teacher involvement (although the method of it wwould have to change) was important. lota and lots of further info. lasgt conclusion…the cost os cai, although mush iof it is hidden, was far to much to condiser installing except in a language class
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:ehh:
 
I’m really sickened the way some of the posters here treat Alfred. It shows a total lack of compassion. And this on a Catholic website of all things. Appalling. I officially call on the mods to put an end to this mistreatment of someone who is participating to the best of their abilities.
 
cynic said:
To teach science subjects at university entrance level, where I’m from, you do.
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Here, children don’t start school at university enterance level. Children in primary and secondary schools are taught by teachers with degrees in Education, not science, math, and so on.

And I’ll bet it’s the same in your country – or does your law require teachers in secondary schools to have PHDs in the subject field?
cynic said:
And if they still don’t get it? I found the information textbooks to be totally inadequate while at school. It took proper explanation from lecturers at uni to understand a few things (yes the ‘teaching’ at school wasn’t that good). I can’t imagine how a programme could be better than ongoing explanation from an adult well acquanted with the subject.
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It’s simple. Textbooks are never tested – that is, they do have to demonstrate that they can teach the subject, stand alone. CAI lessons, however must be validated on the target audience.

And, of course, CAI is monitored – if a lesson starts to perform below standard (perhaps due to a change in the target audience demographics), it is upgraded until it does perform to standard.
cynic said:
That simple is it? Problem solved! Or perhaps it only works for the bright kids…
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It works for everyone – in the BSEP program, we took kids in the military with sub-standard reading, writing and math skills and improved them markedly.
cynic said:
Oh of course, stupid questions, sorry about that:doh2:Really.
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If you were asking honest questions, it would be different. But you’re criticizing something you don’t understand.
 
your comments about educational level may be correct. tell you what. promise to pay teachers entry level wages, commensurate with their eductional level if they have doctors degrees and you might get more teacher with doctoral degrees. just remember, if you want to get the best people you can, the seciong you make doctoral degrees a firm requirement, you are going to be competeing with all the jobbs in society that require a doctoral degree. taxes might respond. please examine ther the curriculum at any college or university for teaching degrees. there is much much much more time devoted to subject matter than education courses, right or wrong. in this instance you are wrong. textbooks, one and only one item in the arsenal of material that a teacher has available to him to help teach. sometimes not even the most used or effective item there are all kinds of things that a teacher can and should use. and most that i know do use. texta sre tested all the time. it wiould be fair to say that they are tested for validity, content, comprehensiveness, interest every daybt student teachers, curriculum ciommittes, admiinistrators, parents, city councils, and evidently since he seems to know so myuch about education the president. i am not against anything you are saying, quite the contrary possibly, excepy your seeming ridea as to the simplicity of learning by cai as opposed. to anything else. cai is great in its place, but so are other thinngs. finally and perhaps most importantly. almost everybody outside the profession forgets the most important factor in comoparing either educational achievement today compaered to yesterday. you have, collectively, with purpose or no, assigned us tasks that no system was ever assigned, perhaps in all recorded histroy. you expect us to do things that were originally the responsibility of parentm, priests, rabbis, business men, employers, and the list goes on and on and on. and you have also taken a population of individuals who 100 yrars ago would not have been afforded the luxyry of an education, because society decided that they just couldnt benefit from it or didnt deserve it. we have this population,… yoiuve goven us almost nothing additional to help educate this population. yothe resources you allocate to us ro do these extra jobs are essentially the same as they used to be before we were assigned them. and then you sat back in tyour easy chair and said OK now do the job. thats insane. one last thing any program that take sasomething as complex as education and claims “it works for everybody” is and should be regarde immediately with suspicion.
 
goofyjim said:
I’m really sickened the way some of the posters here treat Alfred. It shows a total lack of compassion. And this on a Catholic website of all things. Appalling. I officially call on the mods to put an end to this mistreatment of someone who is participating to the best of their abilities.
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As am I – I am particularly sickened by the way others failed to offer him good advice to improve his posting.
 
vern_humphrey said:
As am I – I am particularly sickened by the way others failed to offer him good advice to improve his posting.
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As I said there is no requirement for excellent typing in these forums. No rule whatsoever. But there are rules for charity and the way some joke about him just seems uncharitable. If he used your method he would be so far behind in the conversation then we would complain about that.
 
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