Society of Saint Pius X

[hosemonkey]

BTW, nice screenname. I’m surprised Karl allows such here.

Funny, I the only place I here the calumnious “cult” associtiation in on the internet. No intellectually honest Catholic who values credibility engages in such. What one finds when they attend Society Masses are good normal Catholics, raising lots of good normal Catholic children and attending the Mass that good normal Catholics have always attended in a chapel that is financially in the green and free of scandal and liturgical abuse.

The unverifiable internet horror-stories from unknown entities are getting old and starting to be seen for exactly what they are, which is internet horror-stories from unknown entities.

Message to “Branch.” You like my screen name? It derives from the fact that I spent 30 years saving lives and property as a Firefighter/Paramedic. What did you think it meant? I stand by my post. I discovered that being Catholic meant being in union with the Holy Father and with the Magisterium. SSPX is dishonest in that they offer lip service only and are in fact schismatic and disobedient. I don’t know about the other “bishops” but I do know that Williamson is to the right of Attilla the Hun. I know him too.

 

[TimOliv]

Message to “Branch.” You like my screen name? It derives from the fact that I spent 30 years saving lives and property as a Firefighter/Paramedic. What did you think it meant? I stand by my post. I discovered that being Catholic meant being in union with the Holy Father and with the Magisterium. SSPX is dishonest in that they offer lip service only and are in fact schismatic and disobedient. I don’t know about the other “bishops” but I do know that Williamson is to the right of Attilla the Hun. I know him too.

:tiphat: (The closest they have to a saluting emoticon)

 

[lak611]

It basically means that while the sacrament happened it was done outside of the canonical jurisdiction given due to some irregularity.

A simple example is this:

A priest celebrates mass and changes around the words in the canon of mass but uses the proper formula for the consecration. The mass was valid because the basic ingredients where there to make the sacrament happen (confect the Eucharist) however his changing of the liturgical formula of the Eucharistic prayer was unlawful and hence illicit.

A sacrament should always be licit and valid but it can be invalid (no sacrament happened) which is always illicit but it can also be valid and illicit which is a sin of sacrilege on the head of the minister of the sacrament.

Thank you, Mosher. That was very helpful!

 

[Irish_High_King]

May I add my tuppence worth here?

Branch, I applaud your efforts to educate people here regarding the SSPX ‘schism’.

As for Moshe, I have one thing to say:

Abp Lefebvre and the SSPX are not in a formal schism, as Dario Cardinal Castrillion-Hoyos has stated. Had Abp Lefebvre wanted to create a separate Church (like the Orthodox) and not acted out of ‘grave necessity’ (as per Canon Law) then he would have been guilty of a schismatic act. Furthermore, you need to understand that the Motu Proprio given by JP2 was ‘on his own initiative’ - in other words, an opinion - which has no basis in Canon Law.

He was disobedient. This, in itself, does not constitute an act of schism.

 

[demerzel85]

May I add my tuppence worth here?

Branch, I applaud your efforts to educate people here regarding the SSPX ‘schism’.

As for Moshe, I have one thing to say:

Abp Lefebvre and the SSPX are not in a formal schism, as Dario Cardinal Castrillion-Hoyos has stated. Had Abp Lefebvre wanted to create a separate Church (like the Orthodox) and not acted out of ‘grave necessity’ (as per Canon Law) then he would have been guilty of a schismatic act. Furthermore, you need to understand that the Motu Proprio given by JP2 was ‘on his own initiative’ - in other words, an opinion - which has no basis in Canon Law.

He was disobedient. This, in itself, does not constitute an act of schism.

Abp Lefebvre ex-communicated himself, by his own actions. The claim of grave necessity with regard to available Tridentine Bishops also did not exist. At the end of the day the Pope is Supreme Legislator.

 

[mosher]

Abp Lefebvre ex-communicated himself, by his own actions. The claim of grave necessity with regard to available Tridentine Bishops also did not exist. At the end of the day the Pope is Supreme Legislator.

Bingo, and on matters of legislation the Pope does not need to act in concert with the other Bishops as he and he alone has full and immedeate jurisdiction.

A good site on this whole topic can be found here.

Mr. Grossklas is a well informed Catholic man with deep ties to the SSPX and is now a parishoner at St. John Cantius Parish which is home of the Society of Saint John Cantius.