Sola Scriptura is Absolutely biblical

[cfrancis]

This is not a Protestant vs Catholic arguement. All churches have erred in following the bible.

BUMP for Ron!

Quote:

Originally Posted by ron77nyc
The Church came before the Bible but that does not excuse obedience to the Bible. Here are some apostolic teachings that the Church does not follow.

Jesus said: “you have made the commandment of God of no effect by your tradition… in vain they worship Me, teaching as doctrines the commandments of men” (Matthew 15:6,9).

What about:
1 Corinthians 11:2
Now I praise you because you remember me in everything and hold firmly to the traditions, just as I delivered them to you.

2 Thessalonians 2:15
So then, brethren, stand firm and hold to the traditions which you were taught, whether by word of mouth or by letter from us.

2 Thessalonians 3:6
Now we command you, brethren, in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that you keep away from every brother who leads an unruly life and not according to the tradition which you received from us.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ron77nyc
“You shall not add to the word which I command you, nor take from it” (Deuteronomy 4:2). (This instruction is also repeated in Deut 12:32, Proverbs 30:6 and Revelation 22:18-19).

We agree, and the Catholic Church has abided by this.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ron77nyc
1 Cor 4:6 I have applied these things to myself and Apollos for your benefit, brothers, so that you may learn from us not to go beyond what is written, 2 so that none of you will be inflated with pride in favor of one person over against another.

Note, this is Paul writing in 1 Cor 4. Which, according to you, means Paul should not have written 1 Cor 11:2, 2 Thess 2:15, and 2 thess 3:6 (provided above).
In a bigger picture, Paul is saying, “don’t go beyond the OT…” which, according to your logic, makes his own writings - and the writings of all the NT - superfluous.

 

[distracted]

Search for yourselves, Jesus Christ wants so much to have a personal relationship with you.

then why doesn’t it say that in the bible? Nowhere does it say that the scirptures (esp New Testament) are sufficient…

How can all that God desires for us be put inot a book?? It is putting God into a box…

do you believe in osas also?

Then read Today’s Mass readings… in this same forum… (Non-Catholic religions) & many other scirpture passages…

 

[MDK]

This is not a Protestant vs Catholic arguement. All churches have erred in following the bible.
MDK;4295973:

All non-Catholic “churches” have erred by not being in sync with God’s Word, including the Scriptures, as they have taught their interpretations.

Ron,
Will you please change your profile so that it shows something other than Catholic for your Religion, or else please subscribe to the Catholic teachings so that your profile is accurate?

 

[Cinette]

This is not a Protestant vs Catholic arguement. All churches have erred in following the bible.

It is true that there are many Catholics who don’t know the scriptures. I was one of them but since I have come back to the Church I have tried to catch up. These forums and the Protestants, like yourself, do stretch me and force me to dig deep.

You do say some amazing things

 

[justasking4]

For whom?

For all of us

 

[ron77nyc]

Protestant vs Catholic… YES it is! There are just two options for christianity in this world either Catholic or not Catholic (protestant)

Where has the Catholic Church ever erred in following the bible. The Church now, not it’s believers.

1 Corinthians 5
Expel the Immoral Brother!
1It is actually reported that there is sexual immorality among you, and of a kind that does not occur even among pagans: A man has his father’s wife. 2And you are proud! Shouldn’t you rather have been filled with grief and have put out of your fellowship the man who did this? 3Even though I am not physically present, I am with you in spirit. And I have already passed judgment on the one who did this, just as if I were present. 4When you are assembled in the name of our Lord Jesus and I am with you in spirit, and the power of our Lord Jesus is present, 5hand this man over to Satan, so that the sinful nature[a] may be destroyed and his spirit saved on the day of the Lord.

This is how the bible instructs the Church on sexual immorality between 2 consenting adults. What would the apostles say about sex with children?

I hope you’re not going to tell me that this is the fault of the sinful believers and not the Church itself. And by the way I’m not singling out the Catholic Church. I realize all churches have this problem.

 

[Eric_Prine]

I’ve grown up Protestant- I’m a “Bible guy”. Been exposed to so many different versions and theologies w/in Protestant churches. Usually there are about 10 verses w/ are the anchors of their beliefs w/ other verses made to fit their belief. Hard to explain verses are ignored. you wouldn’t believe all the different beliefs, so many different people who disagree w/ are ‘right.’ It made me wonder why there wasn’t a New Testament book that is written like an instruction manual like the book of Exodus. Instead it’s easily misinterpreted narrative or sermons given to people we often don’t know their culture, arguments, conversation, etc that were going on. I nearly had my faith dissolved the more biblical I tried to become.
Catholicism has been filling in the gaps and answering all of the questions and holes I had in my beliefs. It shows itself to me as a living breathing faith, not some ancient confusing text where Christianity has to try to be re-discovered. (It was this way for me for a very long time.) I can’t even read my Bible anymore w/out it pointing me to the Catholic Church. So far the Catholic Church, the Bible, and the early history of the Church all seemed to be in line w/ each other. There have been a few things which have been stumbling blocks but then they’ve been getting worked out down the road. I really couldn’t imagine dedicating myself to any other church and I’ve tried out alot. conservative, liberal, calvinist baptist, arminian methodist, restoration movement, non-denominational, post modernist, etc.

 

[Lampo]

For all of us

No, I think YOU wish there was a list in the Bible that told what books should be included in the Canon so you wouldn’t have to rely on the teaching of the Catholic Church.

 

[justasking4]

Protestant vs Catholic… YES it is! There are just two options for christianity in this world either Catholic or not Catholic (protestant)

Where has the Catholic Church ever erred in following the bible. The Church now, not it’s believers.

Sadly it has not followed the Scriptures in a number of areas. Take this statement from the catechism:

"841 The Church’s relationship with the Muslims. "The plan of salvation also includes those who acknowledge the Creator, in the first place amongst whom are the Muslims; these profess to hold the faith of Abraham, and together with us they adore the one, merciful God, mankind’s judge on the last day.“330”

How it can be said Musilims worship the same God when they outright deny the Trinty, that Christ is God and died for our sins?

 

[justasking4]

No, I think YOU wish there was a list in the Bible that told what books should be included in the Canon so you wouldn’t have to rely on the teaching of the Catholic Church.

:aok:

 

[Lampo]

I hope you’re not going to tell me that this is the fault of the sinful believers and not the Church itself. And by the way I’m not singling out the Catholic Church. I realize all churches have this problem.

Why would you hope that? The truthful answer is Jesus built His Church on sinful men. Are you trying to imply that the Church sins?

 

[Lampo]

:aok:

I’m glad that you recognize your dependence on the Catholic Church. It’s quite a conundrum for you however. You are relying on the Authority of the Church in telling you that the Bible is the inspired, inerrant Word of God but at the same time trying to use Her book to prove a non-Biblical tradition of men.

 

[cfrancis]

Sadly it has not followed the Scriptures in a number of areas. Take this statement from the catechism:

"841 The Church’s relationship with the Muslims. "The plan of salvation also includes those who acknowledge the Creator, in the first place amongst whom are the Muslims; these profess to hold the faith of Abraham, and together with us they adore the one, merciful God, mankind’s judge on the last day.“330”

How it can be said Musilims worship the same God when they outright deny the Trinty, that Christ is God and died for our sins?

How many “Gods” do you think there are? By your reasoning, do the Jews not worship the same God, as they deny the Trinity, that Christ is God and died for our sins?
There is only one God - period.
Every non-Christian religion grasps only a shadow of the truth about that one God; each one identifies a specific Truth about God, none of them grasping the fullness of God.

 

[justasking4]

How many “Gods” do you think there are? By your reasoning, do the Jews not worship the same God, as they deny the Trinity, that Christ is God and died for our sins?
There is only one God - period.
Every non-Christian religion grasps only a shadow of the truth about that one God; each one identifies a specific Truth about God, none of them grasping the fullness of God.

Lets stay focussed for now on Musilims. If they deny the Trinity and Christ do you believe they are worshipping the same God as you and i?

 

[justasking4]

I’m glad that you recognize your dependence on the Catholic Church. It’s quite a conundrum for you however. You are relying on the Authority of the Church in telling you that the Bible is the inspired, inerrant Word of God but at the same time trying to use Her book to prove a non-Biblical tradition of men.

How is believing the Scriptures to be inspired-inerrant and the sole authority a non biblical tradition of men?
Secondly, when Jesus defended His teachings or engaged Satan what did He use?

 

[ron77nyc]

Why would you hope that? The truthful answer is Jesus built His Church on sinful men. Are you trying to imply that the Church sins?

We all know the Church sins. It is what they do with that sin and how it follows the instruction given in the Bible that we are talking about. The Church is to expose the deeds of darkness not cover them up. When we renew our baptismal vows we promise to have nothing to do with Satan and his ways. It loses something when the Church does the opposite of the profession it imposes on the faithful.

 

[cfrancis]

Lets stay focussed for now on Musilims. If they deny the Trinity and Christ do you believe they are worshipping the same God as you and i?

Why? The Jews fall into the same criteria you set forth: deny the Trinity and Christ.

And yes, as I believe there is only one God - a basic Christian belief - they - any non-Catholic religion - are worshipping the one God, but only one (or more) aspect of God, not the fullness of God. It is in the nature of God-created man to seek Him out and worship Him.

So, do Jews and Muslims worship a different god?

 

[ron77nyc]

Yes.

I can show you where to find them.
Try this for starters.

I know the definition of infallibility. I’ve read it many times. I would like someone, anyone to tell me exactly what are the infallible teachings of the Church.

 

[justasking4]

Why? The Jews fall into the same criteria you set forth: deny the Trinity and Christ.

And yes, as I believe there is only one God - a basic Christian belief - they - any non-Catholic religion - are worshipping the one God, but only one (or more) aspect of God, not the fullness of God. It is in the nature of God-created man to seek Him out and worship Him.

So, do Jews and Muslims worship a different god?

The Jews are in a diiferent category than Musilims. No doubt we are not worshipping the same God.

 

[ron77nyc]

All non-Catholic “churches” have erred by not being in sync with God’s Word, including the Scriptures, as they have taught their interpretations.

The Catholic Church only in the past 20 years started teaching salvation by faith. It was always a work your way into heaven by not sinning gospel before that. They still teach that you have to be perfectly sinless to enter heaven. Is anyone perfectly sinless besides the Blessed Mother? Therefore no one is going directly to heaven but they are first going to Purgatory. If that were the true gospel wouldn’t the apostles and Jesus have explained it that way?