Some ideas to respond effectively to the abuse crisis

[runningdude]

Require all clergy (any religious) to state on oath whether or not they have themselves abused minors … Penalty for refusal: excommunication. …

If you were already willing to risk all holy hell for the sin of child molestation, “excommunication” is hardly a meaningful penalty.

Appoint women to half the positions in the College of Cardinals and half the administrative positions in all diocese and the Vatican.

This fails to address the abuse scandal in anyway. Adult women are just as capable of molesting and/or covering up molestation as men.

Forbid in future all clergy to be alone with minors.

Already implemented.

Restore the married diocesan priesthood.

Again, does not address abuse in any meaningful way. Plenty of married men molest child, whether their own or others. Often, their wives cover it up, or pretend to not notice.

Repeal the restriction on homosexuals (not active) becoming priests because of the false idea [it is] cause of the abuse problem…

The restriction on persons with homosexual attraction on entering the priesthood has to do with church teaching regarding properly ordered sexuality.

Introduce an active programme to reduce the tendency to put priests on pedestals (clericalism)

Priests need a position of respect within the community to function.

Abandon/change vestments and clerical clothing associated in the minds of victims with their abusers.

Fails to address abuse in any meaningful way…

Amalgamate parishes so that priests may minister in larger teams with proper oversight and management.

This suggestion has merit. Historically, pastors and associate priests lived in community.

Develop a programme using good science to instruct children in clear terms about unacceotable actions by adults…

Already implemented

Install cameras … where clergy may be alone with children.

Since 2002, clerical abuse incidents have been nearly eliminated. Programs aimed at protecting children must include supervision in all areas of parish life, as predators are far from limited to clergy. All adult volunteers (and even youth volunteers) must be properly trained and supervised around children to limit opportunities for abuse.

Ensure face-to-face confessions are visible to others, or… are eliminated.

Confession must remain private. Youth programs can offer confession where other adults are in the waiting area, while the confession itself is private. We must not harbor undue fear of priests, while creating a safe and vigilant environment that precludes predatory individuals from isolating and grooming vulnerable youth.

 

[FiveLinden]

Please note that my suggestion are aimed as much at restoring the reputation of the Church as stopping child abuse. Saying that one or more of my ideas does not affect child abuse forgets the reputation issue.

 

[SeriousQuestion]

The reputation issue doesn’t really matter at this point.

 

[Crocus]

Not only don’t we want them to be Priests, we don’t want them in the general population either!

That’s an interesting concept. Whatever shall we do with these persons? Do we segregate them once proven to be offenders, or immediately after psychological assessment?

 

[pnewton]

A person can be detained, in handcuffs, in a patrol car, and driven to jail, incarcerated under an investigative hold, then charged in a day or two, or released.

But reporting what one knows does not get people arrested or detained. One change that does need to happen is this fear of reporting. We have to be able to report suspicious behavior to the parish (or diocese, if it is the priest) and suspicious criminal behavior to the police. These are two different things. Skipping VIRTUS or not implementing diocesan mandated policies is suspicious behavior, but that should go to the Church, as it is not criminal, for example.

I think instead of wringing our hands over what the Church to do, we should focus on what we should do. Obey safety guidelines. Report those who flaunt these guidelines. And if you think there may have been a crime, call the police. No arrest will happen until after the incident is investigated, so do not stay silent out of cowardice.

 

[Peeps]

If a person sounds the alert, either by reporting to the Church or to the police, and then they turn out to be incorrect, they are essentially blacklisted forever, and will lose any friends they had, lose any service opportunities they were involved with, and probably lose the respect and trust of everyone in their parish.

They could possibly even be in trouble in their workplace if the word gets out that they are whistle blowers. Yes, there are laws to protect whistle blowers in the workplace, but…

…it’s all so exhausting. We live exhausting lives anyway, especially those people with young children and teenagers, and the very idea of bringing all that political and social mayhem into their lives, and visits from lawyers, and reporters, and other people who agree and disagree with them-- is just overwhelming to so many people who want nothing more than to live a peaceful life, work, play, relax, and try to stay as healthy and stress-free as they can.

I can see why people are very hesitant to speak up. They realize that their lives will completely change, and they just can’t face the discombobulation and the conflict that will no doubt follow them for the rest of their lives.

Although some people (like me) are energized by conflicts and debates and mayhem (maybe because I work in a hospital lab under constant “STAT” conditions!), others are completely drained by any rocking of their boat (my husband), and they stay away from ANYTHING that might create conflict, argument, and upset in their lives.

Sigh. Why are we all so mean to each other?

 

[Elf01]

The reputation issue doesn’t really matter at this point.

I disagree. I do think that the abuse cases have been drastically reduced since the scandals broke. While making sure to retain policies that are working to prevent abuse and cover ups we also need to work on restoring the Churches credibility.

I think beginning with excommunications of abusers and those who covered it up would help there. Making it automatic in canon law should be done too.

 

[GUYMAN]

Church leaders need to stop talking about protecting the “little ones” . Not that protecting children isn’t important, but its been addressed for years now. The PA abuse report was about the abuse or harassment of young men - seminarians, priests, and others. Young men - not little kids. The Church has a cancer of actively homosexual clergy. They need to face up to it and address it.

 

[Pattylt]

Not only don’t we want them to be Priests, we don’t want them in the general population either !

If proven to be offenders, they should be in jail. If psychological assessment shows them to be a danger to the public, they should be in a mental institution until judged by the legal system. We have ways of protecting the public and we should use them.
I do agree that an accusation should be investigated (by civil authorities) without compromising identity until guilt is known. No identity protection after that. The public has a right to know. It’s why we have sex offender registries.

 

[FiveLinden]

Thank you everyone for your comments. As an unbeliever I think it would be wise for Catholics to pay attention to issues of reputation. I am sorry the present circumstances are causing pain to many who have never caused any harm.

 

[Peeps]

From what I have read of the facts of the various abuses in the Catholic Church, this post is correct.

The title of the thread is “some ideas to respond effectively to the abuse crisis.”

My answer is “with complete honesty, no matter what public opinion is.”

Sadly, I fear that if the Catholic Church DOES face up to it and honestly addresses the homosexuality connection with the largest number of the abuse cases, the Church will be even MORE attacked and despised by the non-Catholic public, and also, sadly, by Her own members.

Even here on CAF, there is consistent denial of the homosexuality connection. People claim that homosexuals are the “scapegoats”. And posts like this one invoke responses ranging from “outrage” to “reported to moderators.”

We simply have to be honest.

If I (and others who are more knowledgeable) are incorrect, then we need to know it and be corrected…

But when even the secular media reports that the majority of the Pennsylvania cases are between homosexual priests and young men/older boys, then it’s hard to keep saying that homosexuals are not the main perpetrators.

I think we’ve all been lulled into complacency by the entertainment media into accepting not only homosexuals as regular great people, but their behavior as well. Shows like Will and Grace present homosexuals as sweet, hard-working guys. Yes, there are plenty of sweet, hardworking guys among the homosexuals and many of them are doing everything they can to live godly lives, but that doesn’t negate the facts: the majority of the abuse cases were homosexuals grooming young men and older boys.

Is the homosexual community, including all the various LBGTQ groups, releasing statements condemning “grooming” behavior? Please post the links.

I hope I’m wrong, but the impression that I’m getting is that the LBGTQ community doesn’t necessarily find “grooming” horrific. If you read any of the gay publications that you can pick up in any urban homosexual “boys town”, there seems to be a lot of acceptance of behaviors that many people would find repulsive.

Yes, I do realize that there are pedophiles among the abusive priests. But the facts seem to show that the majority of the offenders are pederasts. If these are truly the facts, we have to be honest and face it and stop thinking that all those priests were pedophile sickos. It would appear that most of those priests were homosexuals doing what homosexuals consider “normal.”

 

[semper_catholicus]

All of these solutions are non-solutions. And also, how will the laity implement them? What we need to do to respond effectively is to pray and fast.

 

[FiveLinden]

Is the homosexual community, including all the various LBGTQ groups, releasing statements condemning “grooming” behavior? Please post the links.

Is the heterosexual community, including all the Catholic family groups, releasing statements condemning grooming behaviour?

 

[Peeps]

Not sure what you’re asking. If this doesn’t answer your question, please post again.

The article published on this website a few days ago by Christopher Check denounces this behavior. So, yes, there are people and organizations who ARE speaking out against “grooming.”

At the moment, I think that many heterosexuals (I don’t believe there is a concrete “heterosexual community”) are afraid to say anything because they will appear intolerant and “homophobic.” In this day and age, those traits can be the cause of losing a job and losing a reputation. Also, of course, many of us have homosexuals relative and friends, and we don’t want to cause them hurt because we believe (or at least we hope) that none of them practice this behavior.

And I think a lot of heterosexuals aren’t aware of “grooming.”

Does this answer your question?

 

[PJM]

1. Require all clergy (any religious) to state on oath whether or not they have themselves abused minors or endangered minors by actions such as cover-ups or transfer of offenders without full safeguards. Penalty for refusal: excommunication. Penalty for a false oath: excommunication. Penalty/future for those admitting wrong-doing: to be decided by tribunals including non-Catholic experts holding public session (with provision for suppression of information when required).

REPLY: They take an Oath from GOD: if that is insufficient; nothing will help but prayer

1. Appoint women to half the positions in the College of Cardinals and half the administrative positions in all diocese and the Vatican.

REPLY: [a] women cannot become Cardinals: Because Jesus was male & therefore ONLY a male can make the Eucharist happen and exactly how does THAT help?

1. Forbid in future all clergy to be alone with minors.

REPLY: I think that is already in place. BUT This does not address the underlying and foundational issue of homosexuality

1. Restore the married diocesan priesthood.

REPLY: I see an agenda behind this, but NO benefit to this suggestion

1. Repeal the restriction on homosexuals (not active) becoming priests because of the false idea it gives of the cause of the abuse problem. Replace this restriction with examination and exclusion of anyone who has any level of sexual attraction to children, or to anyone with undeveloped or impaired judgement (this includes adolescents).

REPLY: Forgive my FRANKNESS BUT Homosexuality IS THE ROOT Problem. Active homosexuality is as GRAVE a sin as molestation of children

1. Introduce an active programme to reduce the tendency to put priests on pedestals (clericalism).

REPLY: YOU’RE KIDDING right: They are Ordained {called by God} Can make Jesus TRULY present and FORGIVE SINS…. And that’s NOT SPECIAL?

1. Abandon/change vestments and clerical clothing associated in the minds of victims with their abusers.

REPLY: Am I {we} to suppose there is NO Agenda behind your post?

These vestments replicate Jesus and the Apostles garb

1. Amalgamate parishes so that priests may minister in larger teams with proper oversight and management.

REPLY: Something like this may occur for a time do to the FLUSHING-OUT that will be required to eradicate the problem

1. Develop a programme using good science to instruct children in clear terms about unacceotable actions by adults and other children, what they should do, and how they will be kepy safe. Take special care of children with special needs.

REPLY:I ABSOUTELY AGREE; much has already been done or begun in this effort

1. Install cameras in sacristies and other places where clergy may be alone with children.

REPLY: Not a bad idea except the priest would ultimately be in charge of the cameras and media

1. Ensure face-to-face confessions are visible to others, or that they are eliminated.

REPLY: NO! The Privacy and Secrecy of the Confessional MUST be maintained

Thanks for your suggestions,

Patrick

 

[cathapolo]

“Restore the married diocesan priesthood.” - This never existed in the first place.

Again, the whole problem is about homosexuality.

I recommend the following sermon by well known Novus Ordo priest Fr. Robert Altier on this whole issue:

 

[Fauken]

Is the heterosexual community, including all the Catholic family groups, releasing statements condemning grooming behaviour?

The heterosexual community? Goodness gracious. If one was made, it would be immediately condemned as a hate group and be run into the ground by society in their “tolerance”.

 

[xwingz2]

Any person convicted in either civil or church ‘court’ shall have their pension rights dissolved. It’s one thing to “forgive”…which is the kind thing to do. However, to “retire” these individuals to a life of prayer and financial support is not a deterrent. These actions need deterrents: it’s called—"Your fired"

 

[pnewton]

These actions need deterrents: it’s called—“Your fired”

That could work if we first established a means of retirement support independent of the Church, like an IRA. As it is now, priests do not contribute to any retirement program and have no safety net.

 

[Bruised_Reed]

majority of the Pennsylvania cases are between homosexual priests

Are they though? Are most of the priests gay and where does it show that?