Some People!!

[Phemie]

Today came a phone call from one of our parishioners: she’s planning to get married next summer, to her Moravian fiancé.

The kicker? The Moravian Minister will be officiating and this gal wants nothing to do with a priest or the Catholic Church but wants to know if she can use the Catholic church since the Moravian church is too small to accommodate all her guests.

 

[Matthew_Holford]

Today came a phone call from one of our parishioners: she’s planning to get married next summer, to her Moravian fiancé.

The kicker? The Moravian Minister will be officiating and this gal wants nothing to do with a priest or the Catholic Church but wants to know if she can use the Catholic church since the Moravian church is too small to accommodate all her guests.

I hope you said yes she can.

 

[Phemie]

I hope you said yes she can.

She has been referred to the priest who is covering our parish at the moment. If he succeeds in making her understand the requirements for a valid marriage, perhaps she’ll agree to do what she must to get a dispensation for a lack of form wedding. Otherwise…

 

[Matthew_Holford]

She has been referred to the priest who is covering our parish at the moment. If he succeeds in making her understand the requirements for a valid marriage …

Good luck to him - sounds like he’s going to need it.

 

[JamestheOlder]

Today came a phone call from one of our parishioners: she’s planning to get married next summer, to her Moravian fiancé.

The kicker? The Moravian Minister will be officiating and this gal wants nothing to do with a priest or the Catholic Church but wants to know if she can use the Catholic church since the Moravian church is too small to accommodate all her guests.

I may be wrong (frequently happens), but I don’t think the priest can give her permission to use the church, if it is consecrated. She maybe could use the parish hall. Maybe the VFW could rent their hall to her?

She has serious problems anyway if she doesn’t want a priest to do the marriage, or witness it. How does she get by Diocesan requirements for marriage prep? Or doesn’t she care about that, either?

 

[po18guy]

From Wiki: “The Moravian Church, also known as the Bohemian Brethren (Latin: Unitas Fratrum, meaning Unity of the Brethren[1]), is a Protestant denomination. Its religious heritage began in 1457 in Kunvald, Bohemia, Czech Crown lands. It places a high premium on Christian unity, personal piety, missions, and music.”

Question: Do they place enough of a premium on unity to join in full communion?

Clearly, this is a Catholic who is in great need of catechesis.

 

[LoyalViews]

From Wiki: “The Moravian Church, also known as the Bohemian Brethren (Latin: Unitas Fratrum, meaning Unity of the Brethren[1]), is a Protestant denomination. Its religious heritage began in 1457 in Kunvald, Bohemia, Czech Crown lands. It places a high premium on Christian unity, personal piety, missions, and music.”

Question: Do they place enough of a premium on unity to join in full communion?

Clearly, this is a Catholic who is in great need of catechesis.

Answer: nope.

Moravians are a bit Protestant heavy-footed, as in, yeah, we should have unity but still, remain Protestant.

I agree, the lady needs more catchesis.

 

[po18guy]

Answer: nope.

Moravians are a bit Protestant heavy-footed, as in, yeah, we should have unity but still, remain Protestant.

I agree, the lady needs more catchesis.

Sadly, so many speak of unity, but, when push comes to shove, they retreat to their personal favorite doctrines. If they were really worried about unity, they would at least become Lutherans, would they not? It would be a start.

 

[Phemie]

Sadly, so many speak of unity, but, when push comes to shove, they retreat to their personal favorite doctrines. If they were really worried about unity, they would at least become Lutherans, would they not? It would be a start.

They are big on missionary work, they brought Christianity to the Inuit in my neck of the woods back in 1790.

As far as I can find out the Catholics didn’t make much effort in that area, although priests made some visits to the Catholics who happened to live here, having been brought here by the fur trade and the fishery. There is still no Catholic presence in that area today.

 

[Vico]

Phemie, is there any complicating issue with the Moravian church having doubtful baptism (because use of water is at the discretion of the minister)?

It could make it a non-sacramental marriage, even if the necessary dispensations and permissions were obtained.

 

[Phemie]

Phemie, is there any complicating issue with the Moravian church having doubtful baptism (because use of water is at the discretion of the minister)?

It could make it a non-sacramental marriage, even if the necessary dispensations and permissions were obtained.

As far as I know the local parish celebrates a Trinitarian Baptism. Our pastor verified that with theirs.

 

[Vico]

As far as I know the local parish celebrates a Trinitarian Baptism. Our pastor verified that with theirs.

I understand that they use the correct Trinitarian formula, but that some do not use water, which is required by the Catholic Church. (That is why they check Moravians that convert to Catholicism to see if water was used, or do a conditional baptism as a safeguard.)

Glad he checked.

 

[quiet52]

From what I understand, it depends on the bishop to decide whether Catholic churches can be used for any non-Catholic church events, and it must be for good reason. Because there is a Moravian church nearby, my guess is that the bishop won’t give his permission – especially because the non-practicing Catholic fiance is defying what it means to be Catholic.

As far as the non-practicing Catholic is concerned, her insistence on disregarding canonical form and her faith is just sad. I will pray for the priest who will be talking with her – that he will allow the Holy Spirit help him to find the words to help her reconsider her plans.

It seems as if she still appreciates being Catholic enough to want to use a Catholic church building.

 

[Matthew_Holford]

It seems as if she still appreciates being Catholic enough to want to use a Catholic church building.

Sadly I don’t think that is the case she seems to just want to use the Catholic church because it’s bigger and she probably thinks as a Catholic she has some right to use it. It sounds as if the Moravian church were bigger she’d be going for the wedding there.

 

[Kielbasi]

Today came a phone call from one of our parishioners: she’s planning to get married next summer, to her Moravian fiancé.

The kicker? The Moravian Minister will be officiating and this gal wants nothing to do with a priest or the Catholic Church but wants to know if she can use the Catholic church since the Moravian church is too small to accommodate all her guests.

Sounds like a gal with a lot of chutzpah.

 

[ANNE_2]

I may be wrong (frequently happens), but I don’t think the priest can give her permission to use the church, if it is consecrated. She maybe could use the parish hall. Maybe the VFW could rent their hall to her?

She has serious problems anyway if she doesn’t want a priest to do the marriage, or witness it. How does she get by Diocesan requirements for marriage prep? Or doesn’t she care about that, either?

I think you are correct. A parish Pastor may not give such permission, and I doubt a Bishop would since the Sanctuary is consecrated in all Catholic Churches.

CCC " 1183 The tabernacle is to be situated "in churches in a most worthy place with the greatest honor. The dignity, placing, and security of the Eucharistic tabernacle should foster adoration before the Lord really present in the Blessed Sacrament of the altar. "

CCC " 1383 The altar, around which the Church is gathered in the celebration of the Eucharist, represents the two aspects of the same mystery: the altar of the sacrifice and the table of the Lord.
This is all the more so since the Christian altar is the symbol of Christ himself, present in the midst of the assembly of his faithful, both as the victim offered for our reconciliation and as food from heaven who is giving himself to us.
For what is the altar of Christ if not the image of the Body of Christ?" asks St. Ambrose. He says elsewhere, “The altar represents the body [of Christ] and the Body of Christ is on the altar. we may be filled with every heavenly blessing and grace…”

CCC " 2120 Sacrilege consists in profaning or treating unworthily the sacraments and other liturgical actions, as well as persons, things, or places consecrated to God.
Sacrilege is a grave sin especially when committed against the Eucharist, for in this sacrament the true Body of Christ is made substantially present for us."