If something claims to be inspired that makes it so? Does that make the Koran, which claims to be inspired, the Word of God, too?
Let me ask you:
So you will seek a church that does not allow its members to bow down at all?
You do know that the Bible, esp. the OT, is full of places where people bow down, right? And it isn’t considered idolatry?
Perhaps there is a better way to “seek greater understanding”. Instead of entering a debate by taking up an anti-Catholic posture, have you considered just reading what the CC teaches?
I agree. God did give you your analytical ability, but the more effective use is “faith seeking understanding”. I find it concerning that you "questioning"contains so much anti-catholic thought. how will this strengthen your understanding of the Catholic faith? Certainly it is possible to learn by reading your enemies, but before you have read the Catechism? Seems kinda backwards.
Yes. Real Presence means Jesus is physically present. We believe quite literally what is written in the Scriptures. He said “this IS my Body” and “this IS my Blood”.
That is good! No, you don’t have to give such specifics here. I am very suspicious but am willing to accept what you have said here, and move forward.
Although there are examples of actual molecular change, I recommend that you don’t struggle too much with this. It is not a “philosophy”, but a divine revelation. It is a mystery, however, quite beyond the human ability to grasp, as Jesus explained “the flesh is of no avail” when attempting to grasp this mystery. Human ability falls short of it.
When did I say we should not bow down at all? God commanded us to neither bow down to or worship a graven image. Bowing in general is not condemned. I would hope that people at my church are not bowing to graven images, yes.
I never said that bowing is condemned. There is nothing wrong with bowing to your father-in-law.
Yes, this is a common saying, but it is just a denial of the Truth. The doctrinal differences do matter, very much. The Holy Spirit does not lead people in opposite directions. There is One Faith, and the doctrines of that One Faith are entirely consistent with what Jesus revealed to His Apostles.
As you learn about the history of the NT, you will find that not everyone had each document, and that there was fierce dispute about which ones were inspired, and which were not. The reason that a canon (rule) had to be made in 382 is because there were over 300 documents all claiming to be scripture, or believed by at least some groups to be.
These passages do not tell us that we must confess to a priest, but they do share a parallel with James 5:14-16, which tells us to confess our sins to one another and pray for one another. It also says that the “prayer of a just man availeth much”, which is probably why God wanted Nathan and Job to pray for their friends.
Is it not the worshipping of graven images that should worry you? For you already have acknowledged that bowing is permissible. And unless you know what’s in a person’s heart (something way beyond your pay grade
) then it seems that it’s impossible for you to determine whether a person who is bowing before anything is actually worshipping it, right?Have you ever confessed your sins to another Christian (not a priest), seeker?
It doesn’t matter if they are worshipping it. God commanded us to neither bow nor worship. Bowing without worshiping is condemned as well.Is it not the worshipping of graven images that should worry you? For you already have acknowledged that bowing is permissible. And unless you know what’s in a person’s heart (something way beyond your pay grade
Hi, seeker. Could you please answer the above questions? Thanks.
In that case, it is better that you avoid this posture anywhere near any objects, like kneeling at your bedside to pray. If you cannot know in your heart when you are kneeling that you are kneeling before God, and not the object, then your faith is very weak, and it is better to err on the side of caution.
Yes, it was better after I prayed for you at Mass, and realized you are not really a troll, after all.
I see. the CC was whole and entire before a word of the NT was ever written. The NT reflects the faith of the Church, but it is not the Source of it. Jesus is the Source. We are not “bible Christians” (those who extract their faith from the pages of the book), but we are founded upon the Apostles and Prophets.
No need. I will accept your testimony.
We revere the Scriptures very highly, but we don’t consider the Word of God to be confined within them.
Those signs written in the NT did have visible evidence, but they were selected because of that. What was written is there to confirm our faith. Most of the miracles Jesus did are not contained in the Scriptures, and there are many miracles that have no initial outside evidence at all, or that take a long time to manifest. There are some that can only be seen with the eyes of faith, such as Eucharist.
Dern!To all those who have helped me in this thread:
This will most likely be my last post in this thread. It is getting fairly time-consuming and I believe I have come to understand what I ultimately must be reconciled with before continuing. If I can come to accept the authoritative Church, then I will be able to accept all other Catholic doctrines with or without Scriptural evidence for them. Scriptural evidence for the establishment of the authoritative Church has been provided to me, and I will pray over it, read it, and re-read it profusely.
Thanks to everyone who replied, and I wish you all a merry Christmas season!
Since you’re on Christmas break from your high school classes I can’t think of a better way to spend your time…you don’t have homework now, right?To all those who have helped me in this thread:
This will most likely be my last post in this thread. It is getting fairly time-consuming and I believe I have come to understand what I ultimately must be reconciled with before continuing. If I can come to accept the authoritative Church, then I will be able to accept all other Catholic doctrines with or without Scriptural evidence for them. Scriptural evidence for the establishment of the authoritative Church has been provided to me, and I will pray over it, read it, and re-read it profusely.
Thanks to everyone who replied, and I wish you all a merry Christmas season!
If this were the case, then most of the NT would not qualify. Some of the authors were not even identified.
Yes, they do.Good point. There are denominations, however, that disagree with this notion and believe that doctrinal differences between protestants are the result of certain left-over doctrines from Catholicism, and that Catholicism is ultimately the problem (they like to go there a lot).
I can assure you that no human being transforms the Bread and Wine into the Body and Blood. Although the priest presides over the Sacrament, it is the HS who does the miracle.
It is a symbol, but also becomes that which it symbolizes.
Hmmm. He said “I am the bread of life”. He was born in Bethlehem, the city of Bread. He was laid in a manger, the grain trough. He is the manna that came down from heaven.
Catholics don’t use “proof texting”. Our faith comes from the Apostles, and we believe what they taught. What they believed is reflected in the Scripture, and we understand what is written in the light of the One Faith handed down to us.
Actually, that is EXACTLY what He does!
The fact that it was literal also does not take away from the fact that it is metaphorical. Symbols can contain that to which they point.
I can assure you that these Catholic apologists have not “missed” anything. Neither did the disciples of the Apostles, such as Irenaeus.
Hogwash.
Hmm…that is all? Then why did not God just tell Job and Nathan to pray?