Someone teach me forgiveness

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Stratos, ( If you’re still talking to me!), I’m sorry if I came across as mean or something, but you just seemed to me like you were just laying down, and giving up. Yes you were asking for ideas to help you, but you seemed like you were just “mouthing the words,” acting weak, and just going to let your marriage fall apart. I was trying to put some fight into you. Maybe satan is doing a number on you, maybe not, I don’t know, but you just keep giving into it, and it was really irritating me. It’s like you’re not even listening to God, or anything He says or stands for. I wanted to kick you in the butt and wake you up because you are making satan’s side stronger, you’re helping the enemy every time you give into this. You mentioned that someone said that you were too morally superior. Well if you are, then why not follow through with that and actually follow God’s words?

1 Corinthians 13:4-6:
  1. Love is patient, love is kind.
  2. It does not envy, it does not boast, it is not proud.
  3. It is not rude, it is not self-seeking.
  4. It is not easily angered.
  5. It keeps no record of wrongs.
  6. love does not delight in evil, but rejoices with the truth.
  7. It always protects,always trusts, always hopes, always perservers.
    See if you really follow God’s teachings or not!
 
Stratos,

I can’t imagine what you’re going through. Your honesty and sincerity, going back to your first posting are simply the stuff of heroes. If I could pray like you write. It read like a prayer to your Father God. And I hope you talk to Him just like you did in that first prayer. If not, print that out, and take it Adoration…and read it to Him…ask Him to teach you forgiveness. We can’t help but barely.

Maybe a help is to distinguish between forgiveness and forgetting and resentment.

A very short, but good book on this subject is this:

scepterpublishers.org/product/index.php?FULL=549

About 5 dollars.

Resentment is the re-sensing, reliving of an event. And it’s different from forgiving. This book helps tease these points apart. It can be read in about one or two readings.

Your wife found something in you that was stable, and loving, and giving, and it was that goodness that caused her to turn, as you point out. She needs to know and sense that Rock is still there for her. I suspect that is what God is waiting for you to say yes too.

“Yes…Lord, I can do even this with You, for You, and for my loving wife. With you, I can do even this…”

Please pray for “Barb” for me…she is the mother of 7, and she and her husband also take care of two of their parents…and her sister, and she just found out she has breast cancer. They give and give…and they give and now this. God will listen to your prayers because you’re a sincere man.

Thank you.
 
Stratos,
I wish you all the best, I will even keep you in my prayers. I hope you get your stuff together before it’s too late, and that you realise what a lucky man you are to have such a wonderful wife. Since I always take my own advice, and I don’t want to be irritated by you not fighting for your wife anymore, I am going to let it go. Please don’t throw what you have away, God gave you a wonderful gift.
Have a good life.
 
I see extreme love for his wife in this OP, and therefore perhaps problems with jealousy, and maybe low self-esteem? maybe??? jealousy can be so destroying, and I believe you can be jealous even of the past…Very possible. I feel jealous of a couple times my husband even looked at a couple other girls we were with. I have never forgotten those times. And they were 25 years ago…

MonicaCatholic is very right, the old wife is dead. She is a new creation in Christ.

Look at yourself, why do you not feel loved by her? What exactly is it??? Maybe if you look hard and deeply, you’ll discover it. Maybe you’re afraid she may leave you.

Just my 2 cents.

Good Luck. You are a very wonderful husband, she’s lucky to have you~
 
One thing to remember about spiritual attacks: while being far less severe than possession, another type of attack is known as harassment. Padre Pio, Saint John Vianney and many other holy Priests and Saints have suffered from it. The soul under assault has no control over the nature, intensity or timing of the attack - only his response to it. Thus, he simply cannot “get over it”, or move beyond it, or sometimes even pray his way through it. Padre Pio had physical fights with evil. Until and unless the attack is repulsed - fasting and prayer work wonders, its evil will continue to grow like a cancer on the soul. And, stratos’ soul is the target. The evil one will settle for destroying his marriage if he cannot have his soul. What to do? Our response must be to fast and pray, seeking spiritual guidance from a priest. This is serious business. That’s how I see it.
 
I want to thank you all. I asked for help and you helped to focus what I have been coming to see in an unfocused way.

Tuscany: I came to you guys and asked. You didn’t burst into my life unasked and blurt out opinions. You spoke with emotion. I took no offense.

I’m not fixed. That’ll be an ongoing process. You’ve pointed me in the direction I always new was the right way. As I was explaining before, I was a cradle Catholic going through the motions. Pretending. Prayer was recitation I had to do, not the begging I needed to do. It is different now.

I am well educated, have a high-paying job, and a position of some prestige. I have a beautiful house, beautiful wife, two good looking boys that are smart and well behaved. I thought all of that came about because of what I achieved. What I had done. What this past year has done for me is to make me see that none of it was due to me. All were gifts that I refused to see.

I’ll recover through Christ. I’ll recover when I finally ‘give up’ and understand who is in charge and start listening to His will. You’ve been a tremendous help. You will continue to see me around this site.

Allow me one more story to try and close out this thread? Let me tell you about the woman I married. My wife told me the truth while leaving out unnecessary gory details. That was the correct thing to do. Any ‘gory details’ I learned were because, in moments of weakness, I demanded to know. When I asked questions and demanded answers, she answered truthfully and without anger.

Over the year, when I have ‘lost it’, I have thrown those details back into her face. I knew that I was doing it to hurt her. I was doing it to tear her down. As I would do this, she would stand in front of me, look me straight in the eyes, and occassionally nod ‘yes’ to every charge I threw at her. She offered no defense whatsoever – and no anger. She knew I wasn’t well but she would never say it. I have done it to her dozens of times.

A day or two later as I would bottom-out and regain some of my senses, I would apologize on my knees (literally). She would say something like “I know you love me. I know you always have. You wouldn’t hurt if you didn’t. I have never loved anyone else. I couldn’t have – because I was a fool and I didn’t know what love was until I met you. My heart belongs to you completely. It has never belonged to anyone else. You aren’t going to run me off. I’m with you forever.” She would say it all better than I just did. But she took my anger and never returned it and only looked at me with clear, blue, loving eyes. She is a remarkable woman.

Please remember that my post was to fix me, not my wife.

Thank you all for being here, your support, and prayers.
 
Stratos,

Continued prayers for you and your family. In those weak past moments of cruel curiosity, you were not just tearing her up, you were crucifying our Lord. As we all do when we hurt people. You’re not alone, we’ve all done stupid things, and you know that Christ has the grace and power to save you. Ask God that you want to begin again and to love your wife with the love of your youth.

God probably looks at the two of you and sees to budding saints and he’s preparing you for even more generosity and heroic giving, and self-emptying, well beyond what he wants you to give to the wife He gave you. He has even bigger needs and plans for you. You both have shown that you have the mettle to love. Don’t be surprised to find the Cross at odd moments.

Bear it well, as you have in the past.

I prayed for you and for your wife at Mass this morning.

God Bless.
 
One final note: Notice the timing of your difficulties? Once you decided to draw nearer to God, “something” arrived unexpectedly to cause doubt and frustrate your journey? Your experience will help you to recognize the times when this occurs - and it always does seem to occur when one is delving deeper into faith.

Continuing prayers for you.
 
One final note: Notice the timing of your difficulties? Once you decided to draw nearer to God, “something” arrived unexpectedly to cause doubt and frustrate your journey? Your experience will help you to recognize the times when this occurs - and it always does seem to occur when one is delving deeper into faith.

Continuing prayers for you.
This is quite true po18guy! Right on~ Case in point…

When I was delving deeper into my faith, it was then I feel Satan began attacking my husband in his weakest areas. Almost in the exact year so I found out! Following the Lord will and does require a lot of hardships/sacrifice. No one said being a Christian would be easy. It’s actually the hard road. The one most infrequently taken. For the road is wide most take, the road is narrow, for the true believer, and yes, wrought with challenges.

“Only dead fish swim with the current, it’s the live ones which swim upstream”

God Bless…May we all overcome our life’s challenges with God’s help***👍
 
The prayer for the drug addicted and the alcoholic and
Those in desperate need of surrender to God,
Pray it without ceasing.

THE SERENITY PRAYER
God grant me the serenity
To accept the things
I cannot change;
Courage to change those
Things I can and
Wisdom to know the
Difference.
Amen,

Peace, Carlan
 
Married 20+ years. We married late. My wife was my first and only partner. My wife had a horrible upbringing (not her fault), one result of which is that she had many (-many-) partners prior to meeting me.

My wife is beautiful, wonderful, loving, and totally devoted to me. She has been faithful to me and I to her. I think of all her prior experiences as her ‘wandering in the desert’. She had to live all the bad before she could recognize good – she found it in God and says she saw it in me. She is a better person than I am now. She’s a better Christian and a better Catholic. She’s a better human being. She’s dealt with it and moved on.

Early in our relationship, she sat me down and had the ‘here is what you must know’ conversation. It was very sad and very hard, hard, hard to hear. Drugs. Causual relationships. Abortions. She was honest, sad, and repentant. Always has been. I loved her. We married and have wonderful children and a wonderful life, almost.

Now 20+ years later, I have become nearly obsessed with her prior life. I’ve been seeing a psychologist for a year and have worked through a lot of the issues. But I CANNOT GET OVER the thoughts of her with others. It is killing me and going to kill the marriage. I have periods where I can’t even look at her because it just hurts too much.

I’ve reached the point where I know only God can fix my problem. I now realize I really can’t run my life; I need God to do that. I beg for forgiveness and beg to learn forgiveness.

How do I overcome the rage and hate? Anger at my wife for not waiting for me. Utter hatred at the men who were so abusive. Anger at the world. I feel I can’t even confess the anger and hate, because I know that it will just continue.

I am just at a total loss. I beg God to fix me. So far my prayers are unanswered.
Stratos,

You and I are members of the exact same “club.” Unfortunately, it’s not a club anyone wants to be a member of. In fact, I wouldn’t wish it on my worst enemy.

If you refer to a thread I posted on here a couple of days ago, entitled “Wife Lied About Her Sexual Past,” you’ll get an idea of what I am talking about. The thread is located about 7 or 8 threads above where yours appears on this forum.

I have been married nearly 30 years. Before getting married, my wife (fiance, at the time), assured me that she was a virgin. I felt very strongly that one should not engage in sexual intercourse prior to marriage. I followed the rule of saving myself for marriage, and I would not marry someone who did not share my beliefs.

Eleven years into our marriage, my wife disclosed to me that she had engaged in premarital sex with one of her boyfriends in college. I was absolutely devasted by the news. In fact, it was more of a crushing blow to me than when I received word that my mother had passed away.

Then, during the winter of this year (6 or 8 months ago), 18 years after I learned of that sexual partner, I found out that there was a second sexual partner that she had before we met. Then, just last night, she told me about a third partner.

When you say, “I can’t get over the thoughts of her with others,” I share your pain from the bottom of my heart. It’s something that I’ve been struggling with since learning of her first partner nearly 19 years ago. The pain has been compounded by learning of the second and third partners. The haunting images of my wife being with other men simply does not seem to go away. I don’t know whether you experience this or not, but for me the pain is strongest when engaging in sex with my wife, since that activity seems to “open the floodgates” to the haunting reminders of my wife having been with other men.

I’m not trying to hijack your thread, but I simply wanted to let you know that you are not alone in this. And, from what I can tell, our “club” has a lot of members who are in exactly the same situation as us.

Based on my experience in trying to deal with this problem, two things seem to help:
(1) Prayer, and (2) Keeping extremely busy. Neither has been a complete remedy for the problem, but it does help. And, you will find that some days are much better than others.
I always pray to God that the good days outnumber the bad.

Most of all, don’t let anyone tell you to “just get over it.” Unless someone has actually been through what we’ve experienced, they simply don’t know how much it hurts.

Wouldn’t it be great if there were some support groups sponsored by the Catholic Church to address the needs of those who are experiencing what we are? Wishful thinking, I know.

Wishing you all the best!
 
Hmmmm…I wonder if you are angry about something else and using your wife to project your feelings on? Why the anger after all this time? Nobody can change the past. Your wife did not know that you would come into her life. She did not know there was a better way of living because she was not brought up that way.

Stop letting this issue take up “rent” in your head. Refocus your thoughts on something else or better yet, Someone Else (which is why the rosary is good for this). Every time the negative and hateful thoughts come, let go of them and let God take over.

I was terribly betrayed by my adulterous ex-husband and could spend all my time and thoughts and energy focusing on the injustice of it all. But that will help no one, especially not my children if I were always so angry and obsessive about things I cannot change. So I have learned to really let go and let God take over. It is a truly freeing process, although not an easy one. But it is the only way to go.

I agree with the others here that you seem to be under spiritual attack.
 
Now 20+ years later, I have become nearly obsessed with her prior life.
THIS leaps out at me.
I take it you did NOT have issues before about your wife’s past relationships and past history?

*Is there something wrong at the present time that might be a trigger for your present obsession? Just wondering. Mind, I’m not a shrink, far from it.
*
Actually…HA! I NEED one…but that’s another book…

In any event…look at it this way…if the pain your wife endured by past abuse was something she was able to go beyond and carry on, then you shouldn’t have to carry anger around for the person(s) who harmed her.
She’s put it aside, and you need to also. I can understand why you would feel that way…someone you love so dearly was harmed in such a way, and you could not rescue her…but…well, she wasn’t IN your life then. It’s done.
You need to put it away….it’s just going to eat at your soul, and damage what you DO have with your wonderful wife, you know?

As to the prior relationships…that’s the past. That’s done, too.
This, this intrigues me. If someone had a prior relationship, and it’s pretty damn CLEAR that the relationship NO LONGER EXISTS and there’s NO threat to your own, why does that concern you? I really can’t wrap my mind around that.

I was married to 2 men, both had prior marriages, and needless to say they had to deal with their ex wives on a pretty regular basis…(b/c of the kids) and I never had any animosity toward either ex. Fear, perhaps…b/c they might hate ME:o…but never anything other than that.
My first husband’s ex…I thought she was very nice, and we were…well, not best pals, but we got along ok, or I’d like to think we did.
The second husband’s ex…well, she hated me, sad to say. Oh, well. She died before we were able to have any kind of an amicable relationship. Sad.
 
Stratos,

You and I are members of the exact same “club.” Unfortunately, it’s not a club anyone wants to be a member of. In fact, I wouldn’t wish it on my worst enemy.

Based on my experience in trying to deal with this problem, two things seem to help:
(1) Prayer, and (2) Keeping extremely busy. Neither has been a complete remedy for the problem, but it does help. And, you will find that some days are much better than others.
I always pray to God that the good days outnumber the bad.

Most of all, don’t let anyone tell you to “just get over it.” Unless someone has actually been through what we’ve experienced, they simply don’t know how much it hurts.

Wouldn’t it be great if there were some support groups sponsored by the Catholic Church to address the needs of those who are experiencing what we are? Wishful thinking, I know.

Wishing you all the best!
Just know that, at some level, the evil one is behind this. You bear the guilt, since you have succumbed to the temptation. Such attacks on the Sacrament of Matrimony, or any of the Sacraments, always come from the evil one. He knows your button to push and your weakness, just from watching you throughout your life. Notice that if your wife had drunk or used drugs, you would not have this reaction. Along with the world’s assault on marriage (to include re-defining what God has established), look around the forums. Marriage is under attack. Who would do this?

Examination of conscience. Contrition. Reconciliation. Catholic-based counseling. Whatever it takes to preserve the two fleshes made one.
 
Stratos,

You and I are members of the exact same “club.”
Yeah, but in this guy’s case (Stratos) his wife was totally forthcoming from the start and has given no related offense that he’s reported since. In fact IMHO she has been the big one here.

Stratos, your description of what she told you as you were apologizing for throwing her self confessed past in her face (after 20 years) almost brought tears to my eyes. Regardless of what she did before you were married 2 decades ago, you have a woman there most men would kill for. You are tormenting the both of you over NOTHING.

Good God man, pray for her and with her, hold her, look into her eyes and tell her what a glorious specimen of womanhood she is and how gracious she’s been for putting up with you lately.
She is yours. KNOW that and thank God for it. I hate ta break it ta ya, but there are other offenses even more deadly than immorality, like unforgiveness of ancient prehistoric long confessed and repented sin.

You have no right to hold something to her account that God does not and only evil came come of it. Now you’ve coaxed her into filling your head with perverse painful fantasies of her with other men so you can hold them between the two of you.

Shame on you sir!!! Cease and desist immediately!!! She is worth more than that even if you somehow think you are not and the shed blood of Christ is affronted when you deny it’s cleansing power like this.
 
Yeah, but in this guy’s case (Stratos) his wife was totally forthcoming from the start and has given no related offense that he’s reported since.
correct. painful truths are not lies. there’s a galaxy of difference between them.
the shed blood of Christ is affronted when you deny it’s cleansing power like this.
yes.
 
I have always known that the problem was mine. A question asked was ‘you didn’t have these feelings for 20 years, why now?’ I did have problems with the issue from time to time during the 20 years; it made me very unhappy, but it didn’t consume my every waking thought.

Icedtea: I think I understand your pain. Mine was unlike anything before and overwhelming. Severe depression set in, I saw doctors and begain taking medication. What kind of severe depression? I tried to explain to someone once that on bad days you wished you were dead and on good days you didn’t care much one way or the other. My heart has been torn more times than I care to think. At this point, it is nothing but scar tissue.

Many here have pointed to a spiritual source of the problem. I now think I am inclined to agree. Too many coincidences. I also have, I think, and advantage you may not have: my wife is a convert and I was her sponsor. I got to stand there with my hand on her shoulder as she (we) pledged what we believe to be true. Now when I feel myself slipping into a bad thought pattern, I close my eyes and visualize that moment as clearly as I can. I repeat what others here have said: This is a new woman, all others have died. And I pray until it passes. All of this has worked more than anything else.

To the poster who said ‘you have a wife other men would kill for’, that I DO know to be true. I have a woman who has lived every false promise and now knows them to be false. Since we have met, there have been many times when I was the one who was weak and she was the one who was strong. Example: back when dating, one weekend night I got the urge to smoke pot. When I said “Let’s go”. She turned to face me, put her hands on each of my elbows, squeezed hard and said “NO, I don’t do that anymore.”

She’s the one who would get me up at 6 on Sunday and say we are going to church.

In short, she is a woman who was never given a chance to do what was right. I didn’t ‘give’ it to her, but I was the only one who allowed her to go grab what she always wanted. I just didn’t get in the way. She’s better than me.

OK, so where does all this go? You want to tell me that my sin may be worse than anything in her past? I won’t argue. You want to tell me that that other woman is dead and that she is a new creation? I’m just now starting to understand that - I didn’t really understand it before. I am redirecting my thoughts to that as hard as I can. I am learning how to pray, real prayer, for probably the first time and I am nearly praying constantly.

I am now starting to believe what I had before only heard: that God is my only answer. Since my first post, I have felt things change.
 
by Stratos. OK, so where does all this go? You want to tell me that my sin may be worse than anything in her past? I won’t argue. You want to tell me that that other woman is dead and that she is a new creation? I’m just now starting to understand that - I didn’t really understand it before. I am redirecting my thoughts to that as hard as I can. I am learning how to pray, real prayer, for probably the first time and I am nearly praying constantly.
I am now starting to believe what I had before only heard: that God is my only answer. Since my first post, I have felt things change.
Thank you Lord for the grace to love and forgive. Thank you for granting that grace to Stratos. We give you the honor and Glory , Lord, and ask you to continue to fill him with every bodily and spiritul grace.Amen.
God grant him peace, Carlan
 
Most of all, don’t let anyone tell you to “just get over it.” Unless someone has actually been through what we’ve experienced, they simply don’t know how much it hurts.

Wouldn’t it be great if there were some support groups sponsored by the Catholic Church to address the needs of those who are experiencing what we are? Wishful thinking, I know.

Wishing you all the best!
Icedtea… I know I posted on your other thread as well… but I wanted to chime in here…
I don’t want you to leave with the impression that anyone is saying “just get over it”.
In fact, I am also in your little “club” of being hurt by my spouse’s past… so I DO understand.
I have always known that the problem was mine. A question asked was ‘you didn’t have these feelings for 20 years, why now?’ I did have problems with the issue from time to time during the 20 years; it made me very unhappy, but it didn’t consume my every waking thought.

Icedtea: I think I understand your pain. Mine was unlike anything before and overwhelming. Severe depression set in, I saw doctors and begain taking medication. What kind of severe depression? I tried to explain to someone once that on bad days you wished you were dead and on good days you didn’t care much one way or the other. My heart has been torn more times than I care to think. At this point, it is nothing but scar tissue.

Many here have pointed to a spiritual source of the problem. I now think I am inclined to agree. Too many coincidences. I also have, I think, and advantage you may not have: my wife is a convert and I was her sponsor. I got to stand there with my hand on her shoulder as she (we) pledged what we believe to be true. Now when I feel myself slipping into a bad thought pattern, I close my eyes and visualize that moment as clearly as I can. I repeat what others here have said: This is a new woman, all others have died. And I pray until it passes. All of this has worked more than anything else.

To the poster who said ‘you have a wife other men would kill for’, that I DO know to be true. I have a woman who has lived every false promise and now knows them to be false. Since we have met, there have been many times when I was the one who was weak and she was the one who was strong. Example: back when dating, one weekend night I got the urge to smoke pot. When I said “Let’s go”. She turned to face me, put her hands on each of my elbows, squeezed hard and said “NO, I don’t do that anymore.”

She’s the one who would get me up at 6 on Sunday and say we are going to church.

In short, she is a woman who was never given a chance to do what was right. I didn’t ‘give’ it to her, but I was the only one who allowed her to go grab what she always wanted. I just didn’t get in the way. She’s better than me.

OK, so where does all this go? You want to tell me that my sin may be worse than anything in her past? I won’t argue. You want to tell me that that other woman is dead and that she is a new creation? I’m just now starting to understand that - I didn’t really understand it before. I am redirecting my thoughts to that as hard as I can. I am learning how to pray, real prayer, for probably the first time and I am nearly praying constantly.

I am now starting to believe what I had before only heard: that God is my only answer. Since my first post, I have felt things change.
Indeed, so may issues like this are of spiritual origin… being attacked by the memories.
Prayer, constant, real, intense prayer is the answer… begging for the gift of being able to truly forgive.
Medical help also can play a role… these things aren’t mutually exclusive - in fact, God can help us through many means - counseling and medication can be part of that… so don’t avoid God’s hand simply because it appears to be coming from a different source… it’s all through Him.

Prayers for you both… :o
 
OK, so where does all this go? You want to tell me that my sin may be worse than anything in her past? I won’t argue. You want to tell me that that other woman is dead and that she is a new creation? I’m just now starting to understand that - I didn’t really understand it before. I am redirecting my thoughts to that as hard as I can. I am learning how to pray, real prayer, for probably the first time and I am nearly praying constantly.

I am now starting to believe what I had before only heard: that God is my only answer. Since my first post, I have felt things change.
Be strong Stratos. This feeling seems to have come “out of the blue” and I think it is a spiritual attack. Be close to God, I think sometimes we have to endure emotional trials. We don’t know why, but it will make us stronger in the end. We’ll pray for you.
 
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