T
TOP
Guest
Scanner, my family just started to practice again 2 1/2 years ago. I wasn’t confirmed until I was 34. So I’m not an old pro, but I had a look at my son’s missal and learned alot myself.
Tim
Tim
- Status
S
Scanner
Guest
Well, we hit our first snag.
The wife agreed but she thinks he should start at the church he played basketball at. . .since I guess there is a sense of community and knowing it.
Here is the church’s website:
shorefellowship.com/
You can click on what they believe.
It’s basically in a gymnasium, has a big screen TV’s all over, a coffee shop in the lobby with a bookstore. I’m out of my element to say the least. It reminds me more of a community center vs. a church but I will concede that’s a socialized Catholic’s take so that may be unfair. I’m sure I have pre-conceived notions.
It seems like good works are a bit downplayed in salvation.
The problem is I’ll admit I am uncomfortable in that I don’t really know much about Protestant religions, which makes it difficult to shepperd my son through things. It would be hard for me to worship there and I’m afraid he’ll pick up on my discomfort (kids are great radars).
This is about him, not about me so I’ll have to meditate on this and how I can be a good parent, keep the household peace, and have him explore his spirituality.
The wife agreed but she thinks he should start at the church he played basketball at. . .since I guess there is a sense of community and knowing it.
Here is the church’s website:
shorefellowship.com/
You can click on what they believe.
It’s basically in a gymnasium, has a big screen TV’s all over, a coffee shop in the lobby with a bookstore. I’m out of my element to say the least. It reminds me more of a community center vs. a church but I will concede that’s a socialized Catholic’s take so that may be unfair. I’m sure I have pre-conceived notions.
It seems like good works are a bit downplayed in salvation.
The problem is I’ll admit I am uncomfortable in that I don’t really know much about Protestant religions, which makes it difficult to shepperd my son through things. It would be hard for me to worship there and I’m afraid he’ll pick up on my discomfort (kids are great radars).
This is about him, not about me so I’ll have to meditate on this and how I can be a good parent, keep the household peace, and have him explore his spirituality.
C
cascherman
Guest
Okay, forgive me for being a little blunt, it is meant not to be offensive in the slightest, but it seems like there is a little bit of a conflict in the fact that you are not comfortable in the element of his basketball church or in the element of the Mass.
It sounds like he just wants to learn about God. Plain and simple, which, in my opinion, is one of the purest forms of worship, no preconceived notions or prejudice, and no walling up to truth in any form.
I actually feel, like others in this thread, that you are being called to the Church through your sons desire.
So, if it were me, I would learn as much as I can and find a place for myself. We truly hope it is with us in Christ’s original Church, but it truly is your prerogative and your son will look up to your decision, because it will affect how he learns about his God.
I will pray for you and your son.
It sounds like he just wants to learn about God. Plain and simple, which, in my opinion, is one of the purest forms of worship, no preconceived notions or prejudice, and no walling up to truth in any form.
I actually feel, like others in this thread, that you are being called to the Church through your sons desire.
So, if it were me, I would learn as much as I can and find a place for myself. We truly hope it is with us in Christ’s original Church, but it truly is your prerogative and your son will look up to your decision, because it will affect how he learns about his God.
I will pray for you and your son.
V
vocatio
Guest
Scanner,
I am a little sad that you are doing this, because that is similar to where we transitioned through from a church of Christ. We went to a non-denominational church that in essence was really Baptist. I used to attend a Baptist and mass frequently growing up. Long story short. It will be very confusing for a 10 year old. However, I understand the draw. Our children were equally drawn to it. They make it so much fun!.. But what part about leaving the Church is fun…the part when you discover you’ve been dupped into a lack of the fullness of the truth? The part when many of them renounce the Catholic Church as apostate? I’ve been there, done that and literally have many of the T-shirts. I where them to show Catholics where we came from and to show Protestants that I know their stuff too. I have lots of wonderful memories in that tradition.
But my own 13 year old rejected when I told him that he can go to one of the events similar to that. He had had enough because they don’t believe anything real. They think you don’t have to do anything to be saved. This is typically a once saved always saved and while you are pleased that your son feels good doing this they are brain washing him to believe something that is not real. In turn when he grows up and is not properly catechized he will venture out of the Catholic Church and plan Protestant probably getting married to a Protestant and never raise his children in the truth. If that’s what you want then it’s up to you. But if you want your children and grandchildren to be raised in truth, then take him to a Catholic youth group. Take him to CCD and make life better for him. Anyone that thinks Protestant Churchs gives them better anything is missing what the Catholic Church teaches and does.
Read “The Lamb’s Supper” by Dr. Scott Hahn. Your view of the mass will change. Listen to his conversion story and the 4th cup. This will make it all make better sense. Baptists typically believe in the "rapture and tousand year reign. So many others. We went to the non-denominational church that started the “small groups”. It is quite the shallow experience that I do not miss anymore. Another thing is the marginalization of certain people that do not meet certain critiria. Depends on the type of congregation. I was going to be a preacher and my wife just wouldn’t allow it and it wasn’t until her conversion to Catholicism that she finally ellaborated. Her daddy was a bishop in our previouis faith. Her 2 oldest brothers are preachers. She says that she would never tell a preacher or a bishop what she tells a priest. She gave our priests a run for the money to make sure she could trust them. The dynamics are quite different in Protestant faiths. Trust is not the same. They have lots of issues and cover it up quickly. I know, I married into it and my mother was also from a similar faith tradition rooted in man’s mistaken interpretation.
If your faith were strong and you were well educated in the faith, I say go for it but explain to your son that this is very different and that we will only observe. No altar calling, same as joining in some congregations - ours. Also, start a group for your kids age if one does not exist yet. Get some good resources to properly educate your son. This is the ripe age that we used to try to get hold of those poor lost Catholics. I’m embarrassed about it now. But it’s true. Of course they will lie, that’s okay if they can save your soul. This is not always true for all faiths. We just came right out and told you that your soul is in jeapardy. I was not quite that rough, but most around me are still that way. That is why I don’t advertise that we are Catholic now. We just do like St. Francis and “preach the gosepel always and when necessary use words”.
I will pray for you. Be carefull and make wise choices. I fell away from Catholicism years ago like this. I’m one of the lucky Catholics that discovered the ancient church fathers and ironically all the Catholic scripture that was in my bible all along. Read John 6.
I am a little sad that you are doing this, because that is similar to where we transitioned through from a church of Christ. We went to a non-denominational church that in essence was really Baptist. I used to attend a Baptist and mass frequently growing up. Long story short. It will be very confusing for a 10 year old. However, I understand the draw. Our children were equally drawn to it. They make it so much fun!.. But what part about leaving the Church is fun…the part when you discover you’ve been dupped into a lack of the fullness of the truth? The part when many of them renounce the Catholic Church as apostate? I’ve been there, done that and literally have many of the T-shirts. I where them to show Catholics where we came from and to show Protestants that I know their stuff too. I have lots of wonderful memories in that tradition.
But my own 13 year old rejected when I told him that he can go to one of the events similar to that. He had had enough because they don’t believe anything real. They think you don’t have to do anything to be saved. This is typically a once saved always saved and while you are pleased that your son feels good doing this they are brain washing him to believe something that is not real. In turn when he grows up and is not properly catechized he will venture out of the Catholic Church and plan Protestant probably getting married to a Protestant and never raise his children in the truth. If that’s what you want then it’s up to you. But if you want your children and grandchildren to be raised in truth, then take him to a Catholic youth group. Take him to CCD and make life better for him. Anyone that thinks Protestant Churchs gives them better anything is missing what the Catholic Church teaches and does.
Read “The Lamb’s Supper” by Dr. Scott Hahn. Your view of the mass will change. Listen to his conversion story and the 4th cup. This will make it all make better sense. Baptists typically believe in the "rapture and tousand year reign. So many others. We went to the non-denominational church that started the “small groups”. It is quite the shallow experience that I do not miss anymore. Another thing is the marginalization of certain people that do not meet certain critiria. Depends on the type of congregation. I was going to be a preacher and my wife just wouldn’t allow it and it wasn’t until her conversion to Catholicism that she finally ellaborated. Her daddy was a bishop in our previouis faith. Her 2 oldest brothers are preachers. She says that she would never tell a preacher or a bishop what she tells a priest. She gave our priests a run for the money to make sure she could trust them. The dynamics are quite different in Protestant faiths. Trust is not the same. They have lots of issues and cover it up quickly. I know, I married into it and my mother was also from a similar faith tradition rooted in man’s mistaken interpretation.
If your faith were strong and you were well educated in the faith, I say go for it but explain to your son that this is very different and that we will only observe. No altar calling, same as joining in some congregations - ours. Also, start a group for your kids age if one does not exist yet. Get some good resources to properly educate your son. This is the ripe age that we used to try to get hold of those poor lost Catholics. I’m embarrassed about it now. But it’s true. Of course they will lie, that’s okay if they can save your soul. This is not always true for all faiths. We just came right out and told you that your soul is in jeapardy. I was not quite that rough, but most around me are still that way. That is why I don’t advertise that we are Catholic now. We just do like St. Francis and “preach the gosepel always and when necessary use words”.
I will pray for you. Be carefull and make wise choices. I fell away from Catholicism years ago like this. I’m one of the lucky Catholics that discovered the ancient church fathers and ironically all the Catholic scripture that was in my bible all along. Read John 6.
S
Scanner
Guest
No, you aren’t being blunt. You people are very civil.
I am actually more comfortable in the element of Mass because it’s what I grew up with. It’s familiar to me. I’d rather just go to Mass. The wife is just saying for his sake to stay with where he feels comfortable. There may be an element of fear of Catholicism on her part too. . .although she’d never admit it and that’s just pure speculation. And like I said, this is about his spirituality, not mine, so I have to agree with that. (not that she said to me - that this is about you)
As far as “brainwashing”. . .well. . .that could be said of all religions - indoctrination is part and parcel of that and I don’t mean to say that unkindly, rather just matter-of-factly. The stakes are high - your soul is on the table and every Church makes a grab for it.
I guess I have come to grips with this personal philosophy about churches.
They are a bit like spouses. They enhance your life. They serve a lot of purpose for the family (moral instruction, grief counseling, charity in the community, salvation provision). And you grow to love them.
But like a spouse, no Church is perfect. You have to live with their imperfections like they live with yours.
This philosophy will have to be imparted to my son because I don’t want him to flee at the first imperfection he sees. It’s too high of a standard to hold.
P
puzzleannie
Guest
I think one of they key things here is that your son is asking to go to church, it is coming from inside him, whether from natural curiosity, perhaps influence of friends or others, or from a deeper movement of the spirit. It does not seem to be something imposed upon him, and it is very important to take something like this the child expresses seriously. For one thing you want to be sure he feels confident he can ask you for something like this and you will respond and give due weight to his feelings.
I would not try to anticipate his questions, just deal with them as they arise from what he observes at Mass, and in other people. just be prepared, because I have seen it before, very often it is the child who leads the way for the whole family to come back to the sacraments.
I would not try to anticipate his questions, just deal with them as they arise from what he observes at Mass, and in other people. just be prepared, because I have seen it before, very often it is the child who leads the way for the whole family to come back to the sacraments.
S
Sr_Sally
Guest
It very likely will be attractive to him because of those various elements you are uncomfortable with–the coffee bar, the big screens, etc.
My question for you to ask yourself (and even discuss with wife and son) is–If I were the God who created the whole universe (the I in ID) would I want people to sit around drinking lattes while they worship me? Doesn’t seem very respectful to me!
In the OT there are very detailed descriptions of how God wants worship to be–snacks and stadium seating are not involved. Major non-Christian (or even non-monotheistic) religions don’t have the kind of ‘casual’ worship you see in those types of churches. Observant Jews and Moslems, Hindus and Buddhists all have a sense of sacred–a sense that there are places were the ground is sacred and you shouldn’t even wear your shoes to walk there (as God said to Moses).
I think if you are to lead your son into exploring his spirituality, it should be with a true sense of the sacred and not just fun. And since your faith background (and culture) is Christian, look for the Christian faith that espouses true spirituality of the sacred, which is the Catholic Church.
T
TOP
Guest
Scanner, This is what we believe.
We believe in one God,
the Father, the Almighty,
maker of heaven and earth,
of all that is, seen and unseen.
We believe in one Lord, Jesus Christ,
the only Son of God,
eternally begotten of the Father,
God from God, light from light,
true God from true God,
begotten, not made,
of one Being with the Father;
through him all things were made.
For us and for our salvation
he came down from heaven,
was incarnate of the Holy Spirit and the Virgin Mary
and became truly human.
For our sake he was crucified under Pontius Pilate;
he suffered death and was buried.
On the third day he rose again
in accordance with the Scriptures;
he ascended into heaven
and is seated at the right hand of the Father.
He will come again in glory to judge the living and the dead,
and his kingdom will have no end.
We believe in the Holy Spirit, the Lord, the giver of life,
who proceeds from the Father [and the Son],
who with the Father and the Son is worshiped and glorified,
who has spoken through the prophets.
We believe in one holy catholic and apostolic Church.
We acknowledge one baptism for the forgiveness of sins.
We look for the resurrection of the dead,
and the life of the world to come. Amen.
newadvent.org/cathen/11049a.htm
We believe in one God,
the Father, the Almighty,
maker of heaven and earth,
of all that is, seen and unseen.
We believe in one Lord, Jesus Christ,
the only Son of God,
eternally begotten of the Father,
God from God, light from light,
true God from true God,
begotten, not made,
of one Being with the Father;
through him all things were made.
For us and for our salvation
he came down from heaven,
was incarnate of the Holy Spirit and the Virgin Mary
and became truly human.
For our sake he was crucified under Pontius Pilate;
he suffered death and was buried.
On the third day he rose again
in accordance with the Scriptures;
he ascended into heaven
and is seated at the right hand of the Father.
He will come again in glory to judge the living and the dead,
and his kingdom will have no end.
We believe in the Holy Spirit, the Lord, the giver of life,
who proceeds from the Father [and the Son],
who with the Father and the Son is worshiped and glorified,
who has spoken through the prophets.
We believe in one holy catholic and apostolic Church.
We acknowledge one baptism for the forgiveness of sins.
We look for the resurrection of the dead,
and the life of the world to come. Amen.
newadvent.org/cathen/11049a.htm
S
Scanner
Guest
Agreed.
V
vocatio
Guest
Scanner,
No offense meant by this. But you fall under a catagory of being very confused about the faith. You onn words peg you as not very devout. It is not the Church that is imperfect, it is the people withint the Church. The Church is the body of Christ.
It’s your gig. Gave you good advice but you can bring a horse to water but you can’t make him drink.
Good luck with all your doing. And I hope your son finds a church that workds for him, I just hope it’s the Church of Christ…subsisting in the Catholic Church. This will be the only place he will find real joy. From someone who’s been in a Baptist, Church of Christ and mega Church.
PAX Christi tecum
No offense meant by this. But you fall under a catagory of being very confused about the faith. You onn words peg you as not very devout. It is not the Church that is imperfect, it is the people withint the Church. The Church is the body of Christ.
It’s your gig. Gave you good advice but you can bring a horse to water but you can’t make him drink.
Good luck with all your doing. And I hope your son finds a church that workds for him, I just hope it’s the Church of Christ…subsisting in the Catholic Church. This will be the only place he will find real joy. From someone who’s been in a Baptist, Church of Christ and mega Church.
PAX Christi tecum
S
Scanner
Guest
No offense taken. I may be confused. I am positive I am not very devout. Like I said, I haven’t been to Church in years. I’m sure that makes me irreverent compared to the forum.
This is why I am putting out “a feel” - to see if this can work.
Well, what I mean by “imperfect” is that if you look at a Church, it’s doctrine, beleifs, whatever, you can always nitpick a little thing against your conscience.
If you are only going to join a Church because it reflects 100% of your values and beliefs, not many are going to fit that bill.
It’s like asking a maritial partner to be 100% anticipatory to your every need at every time.
I didn’t say you didn’t give good advice. Thanks.
I’ll talk to my wife tonight if we have time.
Maybe God is calling me to make a pilgramage though churches of some sort. Who knows.
This is why kids make life so interesting.
S
Scanner
Guest
BTW, I was looking at the Church’s website and they said they are going to be named by a magazine as one of the top 20 Church’s or something that is capitalizing on pop culture to gain parishioners.
If you listen to the minister, he says, “This is not your Grandma’s church.”
It certainly isn’t.
Interesting.
If you listen to the minister, he says, “This is not your Grandma’s church.”
It certainly isn’t.
Interesting.
S
St_Gabriel
Guest
Personally Scanner, I find it hard to have a sense of reverence in front of a big TV screen or in a theatre etc… It’s just too noisey for me to pray. But that’s just me and I’m not 10.
I think mass is the better way to go and then perhaps your son could attend a parish youth group on the side to meet and share experiences with other kids his age.
I think mass is the better way to go and then perhaps your son could attend a parish youth group on the side to meet and share experiences with other kids his age.
R
RobNY
Guest
Scanner,
I think you’ve been very open and respectful to everyone here. It’s so rare that that happens on the internet.
It’s quite a sight.
I would offer these comments.
By exposing your son to religion, you would obviously like him to get healthy ideas of religion and spirituality. My problem with many of my sincerely well-meaning Protestant brethren is that I have a serious disagreement on how worship is carried out.
Like you noted, they emphasize pop culture in marketing church. The mass, as you know, is decidedly different.
The problem with this is that entertainment can pose a serious problem in church. I think of church as essentially a way to engage in a relationship with the divine. Like with any other relationship, there is nothing wrong with enjoyment or fun. However, the problem with entertainment is its extremely ephemeral nature. It passes and changes so quickly, because our tastes as humans can only bear things for so long-- new music quickly becomes old music as it becomes boring to our ears. If a relationship is based on entertainment it will be as passing and unstable as the entertainment itself is-- and possibly discarded just as quickly.
Real relationships aren’t all fun, but also a serious commitment. You know this much better than I do-- you are a married person. There comes a point where ‘the honeymoon is over,’ and I think this is true also for living a prayer life. Excitement subsides (not that it never bubbles up again), and then the real work in the relationship beings. In the case of religion and spirituality, it is a commitment to perseverance in prayer.
I think that Protestant churches of the type that you described promote a primarily unhealthy view of relationship to the divine, which, while it is catchy enough to haul in otherwise uninterested non-believers, perhaps does not have the staying power to keep people in a life-long commitment.
I think you would be doing your son a great service to introduce him to the more sober-minded worship services of more traditional Christianity, which may not be as flashy, but perhaps would be more conducive to a stable spirituality which can nourish a truly authentic relationship with the divine for a life-time.
I’m not sure if this makes much sense, but I hope it did. I’d be happy to say something else if this came out incomprehensible.
-Rob
I think you’ve been very open and respectful to everyone here. It’s so rare that that happens on the internet.
It’s quite a sight.I would offer these comments.
By exposing your son to religion, you would obviously like him to get healthy ideas of religion and spirituality. My problem with many of my sincerely well-meaning Protestant brethren is that I have a serious disagreement on how worship is carried out.
Like you noted, they emphasize pop culture in marketing church. The mass, as you know, is decidedly different.
The problem with this is that entertainment can pose a serious problem in church. I think of church as essentially a way to engage in a relationship with the divine. Like with any other relationship, there is nothing wrong with enjoyment or fun. However, the problem with entertainment is its extremely ephemeral nature. It passes and changes so quickly, because our tastes as humans can only bear things for so long-- new music quickly becomes old music as it becomes boring to our ears. If a relationship is based on entertainment it will be as passing and unstable as the entertainment itself is-- and possibly discarded just as quickly.
Real relationships aren’t all fun, but also a serious commitment. You know this much better than I do-- you are a married person. There comes a point where ‘the honeymoon is over,’ and I think this is true also for living a prayer life. Excitement subsides (not that it never bubbles up again), and then the real work in the relationship beings. In the case of religion and spirituality, it is a commitment to perseverance in prayer.
I think that Protestant churches of the type that you described promote a primarily unhealthy view of relationship to the divine, which, while it is catchy enough to haul in otherwise uninterested non-believers, perhaps does not have the staying power to keep people in a life-long commitment.
I think you would be doing your son a great service to introduce him to the more sober-minded worship services of more traditional Christianity, which may not be as flashy, but perhaps would be more conducive to a stable spirituality which can nourish a truly authentic relationship with the divine for a life-time.
I’m not sure if this makes much sense, but I hope it did. I’d be happy to say something else if this came out incomprehensible.
-Rob
N
Neophyte_Rose
Guest
Scanner,
It sounds like you have some great kids… you must be a great dad to them.
You said you are putting out feelers to see if exploring the Catholic Church would be an okay idea for someone who hasn’t been to Church in years…
I want to tell you that you would be more than welcome.
Yet one thing I’ve noticed about Catholics (I’m a neophyte, or newly baptized convert myself and so I, too, am still learning) is that, unlike in other faiths, there is little to no confusion about why we come to Mass. We do not come to socialize, we come to worship.
Perhaps the best place to start exploring the Church is with the Catechism… it is only about twenty dollars new (online) and probably much less to get it old. It’s a good reference book to get… note, I said reference book.
A Catechism and a good Catholic Bible should be a good place to start reading about the Catholic faith - I warn you, there are a lot of adult “Catholics” out there who think they know what the Catholic Church is. But they don’t.
Sadly, there has been a lot of misteaching going on. Your generation, the same generation of my parents, bore the brunt of that misteaching. I’m not sure how or why it started. Maybe things just weren’t explained properly.
But the sad fact it, people aren’t neccessarily the best place to get the correct answers from. They will tell you what they think they know, but they might not be able to tell you what the Church teaches.
With a Catechism and a Bible, whenever you have a question concerning a particular issue, you can reference both.
Then you can see for yourself how rooted in Scripture the Catholic Traditions are… just like an evangelical would say, don’t take my word for it. Check it out for yourself.
If you want to know about the Eucharist, read about it in the Catechism. It’s an article that could be difficult to work through, but if you read just that one article - and then look to Scripture - you might find that you learn something.
(continued below)
It sounds like you have some great kids… you must be a great dad to them.
You said you are putting out feelers to see if exploring the Catholic Church would be an okay idea for someone who hasn’t been to Church in years…
I want to tell you that you would be more than welcome.
Yet one thing I’ve noticed about Catholics (I’m a neophyte, or newly baptized convert myself and so I, too, am still learning) is that, unlike in other faiths, there is little to no confusion about why we come to Mass. We do not come to socialize, we come to worship.
Perhaps the best place to start exploring the Church is with the Catechism… it is only about twenty dollars new (online) and probably much less to get it old. It’s a good reference book to get… note, I said reference book.
A Catechism and a good Catholic Bible should be a good place to start reading about the Catholic faith - I warn you, there are a lot of adult “Catholics” out there who think they know what the Catholic Church is. But they don’t.
Sadly, there has been a lot of misteaching going on. Your generation, the same generation of my parents, bore the brunt of that misteaching. I’m not sure how or why it started. Maybe things just weren’t explained properly.
But the sad fact it, people aren’t neccessarily the best place to get the correct answers from. They will tell you what they think they know, but they might not be able to tell you what the Church teaches.
With a Catechism and a Bible, whenever you have a question concerning a particular issue, you can reference both.
Then you can see for yourself how rooted in Scripture the Catholic Traditions are… just like an evangelical would say, don’t take my word for it. Check it out for yourself.
If you want to know about the Eucharist, read about it in the Catechism. It’s an article that could be difficult to work through, but if you read just that one article - and then look to Scripture - you might find that you learn something.
(continued below)
N
Neophyte_Rose
Guest
For example, did you know that in order to be saved - you do not have to be, strictly speaking, a Catholic?
All you need to be saved is to be united to Christ. Cool.
The most perfect and complete way to do this is through the Catholic Church. The Catholic Church has three visible bonds of unity - Faith, Sacraments, and Apostolic Succession - and these are the most obvious signs of salvation.
However, more important than even those is that a person follows natural law (conscience) and commits acts of charity (for example, your son making an effort to comfort another child at school might constitute an act of charity). For charity is not possible without the grace of Christ - which means that Christ is working through the charitable person.
If a person commits mortal sin (grave matter, full knowledge and full consent - people today argue that this is very hard to do - mortal sin essentially means willfully and maliciously turning away from God), and seperates themselves from Christ and the Church, they might still outwardly show the bonds of unity.
This is why it is said that salvation is impossible outside of the Catholic Church - but many who appear to be inside the Catholic Church actually are not, and many who appear to be outside of the Catholic Church actually are within her - though they may not realize it.
I didn’t know this last year, when I was seeking Baptism. I knew that God has compassion and mercy on and love for those who were not at fault for not being Catholic - either because they had never been exposed to the Catholic Church or because they had been exposed to a wrong view of the Catholic Church - and I knew that salvation was not possible outside of the Catholic Church.
but it was not until I read the Catechism’s articles on Salvation and Baptism, and went through my questions concerning the wording in those articles, that I knew what it meant.
Did you know that you can believe in evolution and still be Catholic, for another example? There are three conditions, however; it should be accepted that there were only two first parents (and there is scientific evidence, though I am unfamiliar with it, which supports such an idea), that original sin is real and that the human soul is created instantly, individually and uniquely.
I learned that, too, this year.
One doesn’t have to know everything before becoming Catholic - but it’s best to know something. Receiving Communion shows that you are fully, 100% in union with the Church - that if there is something the Church teaches with which you find difficulty, you study to find out why but assume that you, and not the Church, are in error.
That is partially why Holy Communion is a big deal, and only open to Catholics in the state of the grace.
The other reason, which you’ve already read here, is that the Eucharist is the body, blood, soul and divinity of Christ - literally. It’s the most amazing gift, the gift of Christ Himself - the Bridegroom - to the Church, His Bride.
You may not want to share this example with your son, he might not be old enough to hear it. It’s up to you. But for your own understanding, I’d like to give you an analogy.
A young man sees a beautiful woman. He spends some time with her, but he doesn’t marry her yet because he doesn’t know enough about her. Obviously, if/when they do marry, a couple doesn’t know everything about eachother. They have the whole course of their marriage to find out things about one another - that’s what makes it interesting.
But they know the important, main details of eachother. Otherwise, how could they make a lifelong commitment to one another?
Receiving Communion is like saying “I do” to Jesus and His Church. It is saying “I believe everything that the Church believes and I give you my life - make me one with you”.
To say that without meaning it is very wrong - and to say that without knowing that is what you are saying, can sign you up for a lot of commitments you didn’t intend.
So the Church says “be careful. we love you, and you are welcome here. but be careful what you promise… only promise if you mean it, if you plan to follow through. we don’t want to get hurt, and we don’t want you to get hurt, so we are going to take this slowly. we welcome you, we love you, but please be careful.” (that’s just me paraphrasing)
I know this may not be helpful for a ten year old. I’ve left it to you to bring it to his level… I’m just trying to share with you what I am learning (I’m now away at a theology school for young Catholics… I’m so lucky to be here, seeing as I only just converted!) so that you can see if it might help you understand.
I will pray for you and your family as you embark on a spiritual journey. Please, also, remember me to God if/when you pray.
Pax Christi (Peace of Christ),
Esther Rose
All you need to be saved is to be united to Christ. Cool.
The most perfect and complete way to do this is through the Catholic Church. The Catholic Church has three visible bonds of unity - Faith, Sacraments, and Apostolic Succession - and these are the most obvious signs of salvation.
However, more important than even those is that a person follows natural law (conscience) and commits acts of charity (for example, your son making an effort to comfort another child at school might constitute an act of charity). For charity is not possible without the grace of Christ - which means that Christ is working through the charitable person.
If a person commits mortal sin (grave matter, full knowledge and full consent - people today argue that this is very hard to do - mortal sin essentially means willfully and maliciously turning away from God), and seperates themselves from Christ and the Church, they might still outwardly show the bonds of unity.
This is why it is said that salvation is impossible outside of the Catholic Church - but many who appear to be inside the Catholic Church actually are not, and many who appear to be outside of the Catholic Church actually are within her - though they may not realize it.
I didn’t know this last year, when I was seeking Baptism. I knew that God has compassion and mercy on and love for those who were not at fault for not being Catholic - either because they had never been exposed to the Catholic Church or because they had been exposed to a wrong view of the Catholic Church - and I knew that salvation was not possible outside of the Catholic Church.
but it was not until I read the Catechism’s articles on Salvation and Baptism, and went through my questions concerning the wording in those articles, that I knew what it meant.
Did you know that you can believe in evolution and still be Catholic, for another example? There are three conditions, however; it should be accepted that there were only two first parents (and there is scientific evidence, though I am unfamiliar with it, which supports such an idea), that original sin is real and that the human soul is created instantly, individually and uniquely.
I learned that, too, this year.
One doesn’t have to know everything before becoming Catholic - but it’s best to know something. Receiving Communion shows that you are fully, 100% in union with the Church - that if there is something the Church teaches with which you find difficulty, you study to find out why but assume that you, and not the Church, are in error.
That is partially why Holy Communion is a big deal, and only open to Catholics in the state of the grace.
The other reason, which you’ve already read here, is that the Eucharist is the body, blood, soul and divinity of Christ - literally. It’s the most amazing gift, the gift of Christ Himself - the Bridegroom - to the Church, His Bride.
You may not want to share this example with your son, he might not be old enough to hear it. It’s up to you. But for your own understanding, I’d like to give you an analogy.
A young man sees a beautiful woman. He spends some time with her, but he doesn’t marry her yet because he doesn’t know enough about her. Obviously, if/when they do marry, a couple doesn’t know everything about eachother. They have the whole course of their marriage to find out things about one another - that’s what makes it interesting.
But they know the important, main details of eachother. Otherwise, how could they make a lifelong commitment to one another?
Receiving Communion is like saying “I do” to Jesus and His Church. It is saying “I believe everything that the Church believes and I give you my life - make me one with you”.
To say that without meaning it is very wrong - and to say that without knowing that is what you are saying, can sign you up for a lot of commitments you didn’t intend.
So the Church says “be careful. we love you, and you are welcome here. but be careful what you promise… only promise if you mean it, if you plan to follow through. we don’t want to get hurt, and we don’t want you to get hurt, so we are going to take this slowly. we welcome you, we love you, but please be careful.” (that’s just me paraphrasing)
I know this may not be helpful for a ten year old. I’ve left it to you to bring it to his level… I’m just trying to share with you what I am learning (I’m now away at a theology school for young Catholics… I’m so lucky to be here, seeing as I only just converted!) so that you can see if it might help you understand.
I will pray for you and your family as you embark on a spiritual journey. Please, also, remember me to God if/when you pray.
Pax Christi (Peace of Christ),
Esther Rose
S
Scanner
Guest
RobNY/Gabriel:
I agree with your sentiments. I guess kids are well. . .naive.
I mean, my son, up til this point thinks Church is about getting together with friends, playing basketball, getting the “Most Christ-like” award, and learning about the nature of God vs. worshiping God.
I mean, that’s fun when you think about it. Kinda like college where you go work-out with friends and then come back, sip a few beers and talk about the meaning of life.
You look back on those years and realize you were kind of a chucklehead (but there’s still fond memories).
He’s a kid.
He also thinks that you hand a person a credit card and that’s money.
I’ll have to be patient and show him.
The problem will be keeping the peace in the household. My wife is very headstrong and sensitive. She’s a fairly firm aetheist. Contrast this to my mother, she’s a devout Catholic. (the women in my family)
. I knooooowwww she would love to see him baptized in the Catholic Church.
I almost fear if he does take to this Church and he joins this Church, she’ll be more devastated than not going at all, if that makes any sense.
I may have to concede to the wife to take him to his friend’s Church, as this is about him, not me, but I will have to tell her that when he has questions, when I field them, my response will have to be measured.
As I said, I don’t think I can shepperd him through this very well, especially when he has questions but I’ll do my best. I’ll say I’ll have to study it and get back to you.
I agree with your sentiments. I guess kids are well. . .naive.
I mean, my son, up til this point thinks Church is about getting together with friends, playing basketball, getting the “Most Christ-like” award, and learning about the nature of God vs. worshiping God.
I mean, that’s fun when you think about it. Kinda like college where you go work-out with friends and then come back, sip a few beers and talk about the meaning of life.
You look back on those years and realize you were kind of a chucklehead (but there’s still fond memories).
He’s a kid.
He also thinks that you hand a person a credit card and that’s money.
I’ll have to be patient and show him.
The problem will be keeping the peace in the household. My wife is very headstrong and sensitive. She’s a fairly firm aetheist. Contrast this to my mother, she’s a devout Catholic. (the women in my family)
. I knooooowwww she would love to see him baptized in the Catholic Church.I almost fear if he does take to this Church and he joins this Church, she’ll be more devastated than not going at all, if that makes any sense.
I may have to concede to the wife to take him to his friend’s Church, as this is about him, not me, but I will have to tell her that when he has questions, when I field them, my response will have to be measured.
As I said, I don’t think I can shepperd him through this very well, especially when he has questions but I’ll do my best. I’ll say I’ll have to study it and get back to you.
S
Scanner
Guest
Neophyte Rose,
Thanks for your thoughtful response.
I am positive I will never be as “Godly” as the people here (but stranger things have happened I guess).
Like I said, if I can just stop being a Spiritual Couch Potato, I’ll be happy. I’m not looking to be a Spiritual Triathlete (yet, ).
There’s a lot to think about. . .being Catholicly Spiritual (can Catholic be an adverb?). . .it’s a life of contemplation, disipline, reflection, prayer, devotion, charity, community, study. . .wow. . .it’s a lot.
I just try to get through the week with my business and getting the kids to do their homework, take their baths, get their haircuts and make it to Little League.
Not to mention tithing. . .as the person who handles bills. . .I have to think about the practical side if our household can handle a 10% setback.
I always thought I’d will 10% to the Church or charity, not operate from there.
It’s a lot to digest.
Thanks for your thoughtful response.
I am positive I will never be as “Godly” as the people here (but stranger things have happened I guess).
Like I said, if I can just stop being a Spiritual Couch Potato, I’ll be happy. I’m not looking to be a Spiritual Triathlete (yet,
).There’s a lot to think about. . .being Catholicly Spiritual (can Catholic be an adverb?). . .it’s a life of contemplation, disipline, reflection, prayer, devotion, charity, community, study. . .wow. . .it’s a lot.
I just try to get through the week with my business and getting the kids to do their homework, take their baths, get their haircuts and make it to Little League.
Not to mention tithing. . .as the person who handles bills. . .I have to think about the practical side if our household can handle a 10% setback.
I always thought I’d will 10% to the Church or charity, not operate from there.
It’s a lot to digest.
S
stringbeanduck
Guest
Your son is on the right path, but your wife worries me. I feel sorry that she is an atheist. Have you talked to her about her faith? I wish she would come talk to a priest or at least open her mind to faith.
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