Speakers tell pope, synod that parishes should welcome same-sex couples

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You fail to focus on God’s love, mercy, and forgiveness for His children who have become lost for whatever reason. That is your choice, but as a sinner myself, I have no right to judge others. I guess you do not see yourself as a sinner, which IMO is the biggest sin of all, especially when it help you feel superior to others.
Actually it is against forum rules to personalize the issue as you are doing because you know nothing about me, or my personal struggles or my spiritual life. We really need to speak only of the content of the subject which is this. Although we may never judge the state of another’s soul, scripture actually tells us, that indeed, we must judge and discern and test everything around us to see if it conforms to God’s laws. If a SS couple is completely open about their sexual relationship I can, and should, judge that action as being opposed to God, although I certainly may not assume anything about the condition of their hearts. Not only may I rightfully judge their* action*, I am to discern the possible scandal and spiritual harm their actions could cause others who might be weak in faith and who might then be led into sin as well.

Another false premise that is rampant is that God will always be merciful and show nothing but His love. His mercy can only be accessed through true repentance and **He is unable **to forgive sin unless one actually has sorrow and repents. And those who live in a continual state of manifest sin without contrition and without turning away from that sinful state can commit another sin as well. That is the sin of presumption which is quite serious because it denies the reality of all the attributes of God, including His justice which requires satisfaction (or penance) for sin.
 
This whole thing stinks. Can anyone possibly imagine a saintly pope like St. Pius X listening to a couple telling him to “welcome” unrepentant sinners in the Church?

There have always been sinners of all kinds in the Church (I´m one to start with), but the crucial difference is that now we are being told to forget about the sin and pretend everything is hunky dory. Sin is no longer an issue, and nobody is allowed to call a spade a spade anymore. It´s all about “pastoral care”, whatever that means. It´s the “Church of Nice”, where nobody EVER says anything that could possibly hurt anyone´s feelings. Of course, Jesus NEVER offended anyone, did He?

If instead of a son taking his male partner to Christmas dinner it was a daughter taking her pimp, would we see the situation differently? Sodomy used to be called one of the four sins that cry to Heaven for vengeance. Now we are instructed to be NICE to the sodomites.

And some people think the Church is doing just fine???!!!
I agree with your assessment that we should not just let go of sin by ignoring sin. I think the best way of handling it is to make homosexual sex sin to be on par with other sexual behavior deemed disordered. This way we can treat and address all sexually disordered behavior the same and without discrimination.

According to a U Columbia report, 80% of men have masturbated in the past year and 90% of men admitted to having masturbated in their life times. The number is on the 60s for women. This sexual disordered behavior is far more prevalent than homosexual behavior. Yet we hear nothing about it in RE classes for children and rarely in discussions among Catholic adults. While homosexual sex and masturbation are considered gravely disordered actions by the Catholic Church, we seem to ignore one while pointing our fingers at the others. Let’s call it as it is. We do discriminate against people engaging in gay sex more harshly than the 80% of our male members engaging in masturbation. Both acts are unnatural, sinful and are true examples of how we weak we are when it comes to self gratification at the expense of God. Let’s make a large and louder concerted effort to address masturbation in our Catholic schools, in our pulpits, in our newsletters, in our RE classes and throughout social media since it is such a pervasive problem within our church today. I think then, our message about gay sex will ring true since we are concerned with all sexual disordered members of our church and not just gay ones. We need to stop making lame excuses for homosexual and masturbatory behaviors. No person is forced to engage in either. We can all abstain if we love and trust in God enough to make the sacrifice. And those so weak that they succumb to their desires can be counseled both pastorally and professionally if needed. There are mental techniques and/or medications that will curb desire for masturbation and homosexual behaviors if all else fails. No amount of societal influence, stress, habit, or excuse that can stop a truly committed Catholic from curbing his sexual sins when there is so many supportive therapies that can help him.

While making a loud and clear stand against the grave sin of masturbation, we also need to address oral sex involving men that does not result in the deposition of sperm into the womb. It too is a pervasive disorder.

Catechism: 2352 By masturbation is to be understood the deliberate stimulation of the genital organs in order to derive sexual pleasure. "Both the Magisterium of the Church, in the course of a constant tradition, and the moral sense of the faithful have been in no doubt and have firmly maintained that masturbation is an intrinsically and gravely disordered action."138 “The deliberate use of the sexual faculty, for whatever reason, outside of marriage is essentially contrary to its purpose.” For here sexual pleasure is sought outside of "the sexual relationship which is demanded by the moral order and in which the total meaning of mutual self-giving and human procreation in the context of true love is achieved."139

2357 Homosexuality refers to relations between men or between women who experience an exclusive or predominant sexual attraction toward persons of the same sex. It has taken a great variety of forms through the centuries and in different cultures. Its psychological genesis remains largely unexplained. Basing itself on Sacred Scripture, which presents homosexual acts as acts of grave depravity,141 tradition has always declared that "homosexual acts are intrinsically disordered."142 They are contrary to the natural law. They close the sexual act to the gift of life. They do not proceed from a genuine affective and sexual complementarity. Under no circumstances can they be approved.
 
Another false premise that is rampant is that God will always be merciful and show nothing but His love. His mercy can only be accessed through true repentance and **He is unable **to forgive sin unless one actually has sorrow and repents. And those who live in a continual state of manifest sin without contrition and without turning away from that sinful state can commit another sin as well. That is the sin of presumption which is quite serious because it denies the reality of all the attributes of God, including His justice which requires satisfaction (or penance) for sin.
You know, Jesus died on the cross for all of these sins. Every one of them. Even the sin that prevents an individual from having sorrow and repentance.

So, if our state of sin prevents us from turning away from sin, and Jesus died for those sins, where does that leave us?
 
Actually it is against forum rules to personalize the issue as you are doing because you know nothing about me, or my personal struggles or my spiritual life. We really need to speak only of the content of the subject which is this. Although we may never judge the state of another’s soul, scripture actually tells us, that indeed, we must judge and discern and test everything around us to see if it conforms to God’s laws. If a SS couple is completely open about their sexual relationship I can, and should, judge that action as being opposed to God, although I certainly may not assume anything about the condition of their hearts. Not only may I rightfully judge their* action*, I am to discern the possible scandal and spiritual harm their actions could cause others who might be weak in faith and who might then be led into sin as well.

Another false premise that is rampant is that God will always be merciful and show nothing but His love. His mercy can only be accessed through true repentance and **He is unable **to forgive sin unless one actually has sorrow and repents. And those who live in a continual state of manifest sin without contrition and without turning away from that sinful state can commit another sin as well. That is the sin of presumption which is quite serious because it denies the reality of all the attributes of God, including His justice which requires satisfaction (or penance) for sin.
Wow, I have never heard, nor do I think, God is unable to do anything. If you want to live your life that way that is your choice. I do not chose to use my faith or the Bible as justification to judge other, as I am a sinner also. You speak as if you know, but actually that is just your belie,f not fact. We have yet to learn the whole truth of God.
 
You know, Jesus died on the cross for all of these sins. Every one of them. Even the sin that prevents an individual from having sorrow and repentance.

So, if our state of sin prevents us from turning away from sin, and Jesus died for those sins, where does that leave us?
Aren’t you fundamentally denying the action of grace in the soul which God gives to every single person? Why else would Christ clearly tell us we are ALL called to be holy? The Spirit enlightens (open) hearts as to their sins, gives grace and sanctifies us with our cooperation. I think you are really speaking about the levels of culpability here which only God will ascertain at our judgment.
 
Wow, I have never heard, nor do I think, God is unable to do anything. If you want to live your life that way that is your choice. I do not chose to use my faith or the Bible as justification to judge other, as I am a sinner also. You speak as if you know, but actually that is just your belie,f not fact. We have yet to learn the whole truth of God.
I bless you, shelby, on your journey and just as you are, but every thing I wrote is basic catechesis and Catholic teaching.
 
I bless you, shelby, on your journey and just as you are, but every thing I wrote is basic catechesis and Catholic teaching.
Yes, but it is still a belief, a faith, not fact. Again, I will listen to all my priests and continue on my journey with their guidance. I hope your journey is very blessed as well.
 
Aren’t you fundamentally denying the action of grace in the soul which God gives to every single person? Why else would Christ clearly tell us we are ALL called to be holy? The Spirit enlightens (open) hearts as to their sins, gives grace and sanctifies us with our cooperation. I think you are really speaking about the levels of culpability here which only God will ascertain at our judgment.
I am not denying anything. I am only asking why you say He can’t forgive us unless we repent if our sin is preventing us from repenting. Culpability could be part of it.
 
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