SPLIT: Those Who Leave the Catholic Faith

[mj330]

Hi all,

The catachesim reads ‘…they could not be saved who, knowing that the Catholic Church was founded as necessary by God through Christ would refuse either to enter it or to remain in it.’ (846). I am a protestant who has not yet reverted.

 

[ALLFORHIM]

Hi all,

The catachesim reads ‘…they could not be saved who, knowing that the Catholic Church was founded as necessary by God through Christ would refuse either to enter it or to remain in it.’ (846). I am a protestant who has not yet reverted.

Im confused by this statement Is that saying one cannot be saved without being a memeber of the CC? I thought the CC didnt teach that?

 

[ALLFORHIM]

So you believe that all Catholics who now go to non-Catholic churches are Hellbound?

It is really good to clarify these issues for the lurkers.

Yes I would also like some clarification too

 

[mj330]

Im confused by this statement Is that saying one cannot be saved without being a memeber of the CC? I thought the CC didnt teach that?

Yes, so am I when I compare with what paramedicgirl stated in post #9. Can someone explain?

 

[mlldrl]

Here’s how I understand it.

If you were never exposed to the truth of Christ and his Church you may be saved through the mercy of God.

However, if you were exposed to the truth of Christ and his Church then reject it…reject the fullness of truth, reject Jesus in the Eucharist, reject your confirmation promises you will have to answer for your actions.

God Bless,
M

 

[kaycee]

Since the Catholic Church is the Mystical Body of Christ, yes leaving the Catholic Church is the same as leaving Jesus. Especially since the Catholics know all the teachings of the church but rejects it. It comes to these simple word, “He who hears you, hears me. He who rejects you, rejects me.”

So therefore for a Catholic to reject the Church is rejecting Jesus Christ.

Any Catholic who leaves the Catholic Church for a Protestant one is rejecting Jesus.

Hmmmm, so when God placed His spirit in me after I cried out to Him for salvation through His Son and His perfect sacrafice and left the RCC, I was rejecting Jesus?

Strange, after infant baptism, confession, communion, confirmation and near perfect mass attendance and 12 years of Catholic school with nuns, I had no more than a passing interest in spiritual things like 99% of my school mates.

After God saved me, I had an amazing thirst to read His Word, I could not get enough of it. I also wanted to Tell Everyone about the Jesus who saves sinners, but i guess I was really rejecting Jesus?

The Bible became REAL to me and the story of JESUS IS TRUE I want to shout it from the roof tops, but apparently its all for not as you tell me I have rejected my Savior? God had given me the peace that surpasses all understanding, but i guess i was just fooled.

Joh 6:37 "All that the Father gives Me will come to Me, and the one who comes to Me I will certainly not cast out.

 

[mikew262]

Any Catholic who leaves the Catholic Church for a Protestant one is rejecting Jesus.

I don’t think that is true at all. All Protestant denominations have Christ as their central focus.

 

[mikew262]

Im confused by this statement Is that saying one cannot be saved without being a memeber of the CC? I thought the CC didnt teach that?

The Church provides an exception:

CCC 847 This affirmation is not aimed at those who, through no fault of their own, do not know Christ and his Church:
Those who, through no fault of their own, do not know the Gospel of Christ or his Church, but who nevertheless seek God with a sincere heart, and, moved by grace, try in their actions to do his will as they know it through the dictates of their conscience – those too may achieve eternal salvation.1

 

[mikew262]

Here’s how I understand it.

If you were never exposed to the truth of Christ and his Church you may be saved through the mercy of God.

However, if you were exposed to the truth of Christ and his Church then reject it…reject the fullness of truth, reject Jesus in the Eucharist, reject your confirmation promises you will have to answer for your actions.

God Bless,
M

This is how I read it:

You may be exposed to Catholic Church, but if you did not accept it as the true and only Church for whatever reason, but still seek and worship God with a pure heart, then I’m not sure you can be held accountable. On the other hand, if one truly believed it was the true Church and chose to reject it anyway, then we have a problem.

 

[mlldrl]

Strange, after infant baptism, confession, communion, confirmation and near perfect mass attendance and 12 years of Catholic school with nuns, I had no more than a passing interest in spiritual things like 99% of my school mates.

kaycee,

I’m saddened that you did embrace the faith as a child. But it was your inaction that was the cause of it, not Jesus and not the Church. What I hear from many cradle Catholics and I was just as guilty, is that we expect the Church to force our hearts open and pour God in to us. You became alive in Christ when YOU decided to accept him. You could have done that when you were 12 but chose not to. I can say the same for myself. It wasn’t the Church who let us down…we let Jesus down by our laziness. Sure the catechesis could have been better for many of us. I hid behind that excuse for years but you can’t hide behind that forever. Finally I took action and started to learn and live my faith.

There are so many Catholics on fire for the Lord because they put their faith in to action. They responded to the Lord and are strengthened by him in the Eucharist. I pray that some day you’ll find your way home. Trust me, it’s better than you ever imagined.

 

[mj330]

This is how I read it:

You may be exposed to Catholic Church, but if you did not accept it as the true and only Church for whatever reason, but still seek and worship God with a pure heart, then I’m not sure you can be held accountable. On the other hand, if one truly believed it was the true Church and chose to reject it anyway, then we have a problem.

Is it not still rejection of the church’s teachings, even if you seek to worship God?

 

[mlldrl]

This is how I read it:

You may be exposed to Catholic Church, but if you did not accept it as the true and only Church for whatever reason, but still seek and worship God with a pure heart, then I’m not sure you can be held accountable. On the other hand, if one truly believed it was the true Church and chose to reject it anyway, then we have a problem.

I’m very concerned for those I know who after receiving the sacrament of confirmation leave the Church. They affirmed as young adults the ‘yes’ that their parents and Godparents made for them at their baptism then walked away. Very troubling.

 

[mikew262]

Is it not still rejection of the church’s teachings, even if you seek to worship God?

No, well maybe. However, IMO, if you truly believe the Church’s teachings are in error, which many Christians do, and your conscience tells you to seek Christ in another way, then I think that is acceptable to God. Even the Church hints this is ok.

CCC 847 This affirmation is not aimed at those who, through no fault of their own, do not know Christ and his Church:
Those who, through no fault of their own, do not know the Gospel of Christ or his Church, but who nevertheless seek God with a sincere heart, and, moved by grace, try in their actions to do his will as they know it through the dictates of their conscience – those too may achieve eternal salvation.1

Application of this CCC: If they’ve never been exposed to the Church, or their conscience tells them they should follow Christ in another way.

 

[Church_Militant]

This is how I read it:

You may be exposed to Catholic Church, but if you did not accept it as the true and only Church for whatever reason, but still seek and worship God with a pure heart, then I’m not sure you can be held accountable. On the other hand, if one truly believed it was the true Church and chose to reject it anyway, then we have a problem.

Is it not still rejection of the church’s teachings, even if you seek to worship God?

Hi Mj330!
(Good to see you here again after so long! PM me or e-mail me when ya get a second so we can catch up.)

Here’s the deal guys.

If a person has learned the truths of the Catholic faith and then knowingly rejects them for whatever reason, we can say with a certainty that they endanger their soul.

This is one reason that some of the a-C posters here should approach our most holy faith with more consideration because if, as we believe, we are indeed the one true Christian Church, (and we are) then in learning more about the Catholic faith they set themselves up for judgment. Look here what Our Lord said, “46 The lord of that servant will come in the day that he hopeth not, and at the hour that he knoweth not, and shall separate him, and shall appoint him his portion with unbelievers. 47 And that servant who knew the will of his lord, and prepared not himself, and did not according to his will, shall be beaten with many stripes. 48 But he that knew not, and did things worthy of stripes, shall be beaten with few stripes. And unto whomsoever much is given, of him much shall be required: and to whom they have committed much, of him they will demand the more.” (Luke 12)

This is one passage of scripture that the Church bases these teachings on.

This is no joke, but a very serious aspect of the faith that few people want to think about.

Reconciliation with the church is not all that difficult, but people who oppose it are going to answer for it.

Can I tell you their ultimate end? No I cannot, but I would not want to ever again put myself in that position. It is good to be home.

 

[ALLFORHIM]

Hi,

I have a question. I was never raised catholic. I was raised Episcopalian–baptized, confirmed, went to youth group, sang in the kids choir, went to Sunday school etc.

None of the above saved me.What the above did do was teach me about my faith(which I am grateful). It was not until I turned 30 and was attending a baptist church(although I think I could have been attending any church at the time)that I accepted Christ as my Savior. I not only had the head knowledge(which I had because I was churched growing up) I now had the heart knowledge as well.:extrahappy:

Ok fast forward 11 years to now and I am following Christ with all my heart, soul, mind and body. I am trying to turn away from sin and live a life worthy of calling myself a christian.

I was able to have all of the above outside the CC. I have been on this forum almost a year now. I have learned much about the CC and her teachings. So, my question is (DRUM ROLL PLEASE ) Since I have sought to learn the teachings of the CC and do reject some of the teachings as false and still am following Christ as I said above, would any of the catholics here say I have rejected Christ because I do not believe the CC to be correct in all teachings and do not plan to convert?

 

[mikew262]

Hi,

I have a question. I was never raised catholic. I was raised Episcopalian–baptized, confirmed, went to youth group, sang in the kids choir, went to Sunday school etc.

None of the above saved me.What the above did do was teach me about my faith(which I am grateful). It was not until I turned 30 and was attending a baptist church(although I think I could have been attending any church at the time)that I accepted Christ as my Savior. I not only had the head knowledge(which I had because I was churched growing up) I now had the heart knowledge as well.:extrahappy:

Ok fast forward 11 years to now and I am following Christ with all my heart, soul, mind and body. I am trying to turn away from sin and live a life worthy of calling myself a christian.

I was able to have all of the above outside the CC. I have been on this forum almost a year now. I have learned much about the CC and her teachings. So, my question is (DRUM ROLL PLEASE ) Since I have sought to learn the teachings of the CC and do reject some of the teachings as false and still am following Christ as I said above, would any of the catholics here say I have rejected Christ because I do not believe the CC to be correct in all teachings and do not plan to convert?

IMO, you are fine. You are following Christ the best way you know how and with a pure conscious. If you happen someday to convert to the CC, that would be great, however, if you feel closest to God with the way you are currently worshiping, then so be it. I personally believe God is not as picky as some others would have you believe.

I am Catholic, and to be honest, some of my fellow Catholics may disagree with me, but that’s my :twocents: .

 

[Church_Militant]

Hi,

I have a question.
I was able to have all of the above outside the CC. I have been on this forum almost a year now. I have learned much about the CC and her teachings. So, my question is (DRUM ROLL PLEASE ) Since I have sought to learn the teachings of the CC and do reject some of the teachings as false

and still am following Christ as I said above, would any of the catholics here say I have rejected Christ because I do not believe the CC to be correct in all teachings and do not plan to convert?Then those teachings are where you need to concentrate your study because there are no Catholic teachings that are false.

If you’d like to discuss these issues privately with someone who has been there, feel free to PM or e-mail me.

 

[ALLFORHIM]

IMO, you are fine. You are following Christ the best way you know how and with a pure conscious. If you happen someday to convert to the CC, that would be great, however, if you feel closest to God with the way you are currently worshiping, then so be it. I personally believe God is not as picky as some others would have you believe.

I am Catholic, and to be honest, some of my fellow Catholics may disagree with me, but that’s my :twocents: .

Thanks Mike I agree. We cant put God into a box. He is so much more then we can even comprehend. I think humans tend to think of God as a SUPER HUMAN HERO because we just cant grasp who He is.

 

[ALLFORHIM]

Then those teachings are where you need to concentrate your study because there are no Catholic teachings that are false.

If you’d like to discuss these issues privately with someone who has been there, feel free to PM or e-mail me.

Thanks Church,
I would have not expected any other answer from you. I have spoken with other people formally in my position. Actually I have concentrated on one of the teachings. Sorry still not leading me toward the Tiber.

 

[Church_Militant]

Thanks Church,
I would have not expected any other answer from you. I have spoken with other people formally in my position. Actually I have concentrated on one of the teachings. Sorry still not leading me toward the Tiber.

That’s okay…I’m still on the Tiber Rescue Swim Patrol.

Heck, who needs “formal”, let’s just talk about it.