SSPX

[Richard320]

Rumors abound that the SSPX and The Holy See have negotiated the terms of surrender.

So now what?

Will there be an amnesty period where SSPX attendees can get their Sacramental records registered in the church? Will they have to make a profession of faith? Will they need to have any Sacraments repeated due to sketchy jurisdiction to administer Confirmation?

What happens to SSPX chapels? Does the title deed get handed to the local Ordinary?

But if they get set up as a separate entity, will they be like the rest of the religious orders who need permission from the local Ordinary to set up shop? What if he doesn’t grant faculties?

 

[TrueLight]

Rumors abound that the SSPX and The Holy See have negotiated the terms of surrender.

So now what?

Will there be an amnesty period where SSPX attendees can get their Sacramental records registered in the church? Will they have to make a profession of faith? Will they need to have any Sacraments repeated due to sketchy jurisdiction to administer Confirmation?

What happens to SSPX chapels? Does the title deed get handed to the local Ordinary?

But if they get set up as a separate entity, will they be like the rest of the religious orders who need permission from the local Ordinary to set up shop? What if he doesn’t grant faculties?

I sense that a lot of threads are going to be merged.

 

[roadsend]

Rumors abound that the SSPX and The Holy See have negotiated the terms of surrender.

So now what?

Will there be an amnesty period where SSPX attendees can get their Sacramental records registered in the church? Will they have to make a profession of faith? Will they need to have any Sacraments repeated due to sketchy jurisdiction to administer Confirmation?

What happens to SSPX chapels? Does the title deed get handed to the local Ordinary?

But if they get set up as a separate entity, will they be like the rest of the religious orders who need permission from the local Ordinary to set up shop? What if he doesn’t grant faculties?

I don’t see any of the above happening.

 

[TimothyH]

I dont agree with liberals, I dont even understand them but this is not about rejoicing over how liberals will react. This is about mercy, reunification and an example to us all. It should not be used as a finger to the liberals but rather a humble example of how we personally should submit to the Church and also how unbelievably merciful the Church can be. Divine Mercy Sunday was this weekend and that is when this went down. If anything we should hope the Church would be so accommodating to a liberal group. I would rejoice either way.

Well put. Thank you.

-Tim-

 

[JReducation]

I agree, there is never an appropriate moment to celebrate someone else’s chagrin.

If the Holy Father signs off on this, it’s a moment of reconciliation. We’re talking about 500 priests, maybe 300 religious and about one million lay people. I see this as the tearing down of the Berlin Wall. The Cold War is finally over. It’s a moment to rejoice and to thank God for his grace.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, FFV

 

[The_Scott]

I agree, there is never an appropriate moment to celebrate someone else’s chagrin.

If the Holy Father signs off on this, it’s a moment of reconciliation. We’re talking about 500 priests, maybe 300 religious and about one million lay people. I see this as the tearing down of the Berlin Wall. The Cold War is finally over. It’s a moment to rejoice and to thank God for his grace.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, FFV

In one hundred years, do you think this would be seen as the Holy Father’s greatest accomplishment? (to date, I should add!!) If I remember correctly, one of Pope Benedict’s main goals, from the get go, was to get SSPX back in the flock.

 

[JReducation]

In one hundred years, do you think this would be seen as the Holy Father’s greatest accomplishment? (to date, I should add!!) If I remember correctly, one of Pope Benedict’s main goals, from the get go, was to get SSPX back in the flock.

Let’s wait to see what other rabbits he pulls out of his mitre. The man is not dead. He may outdo himself yet.

I will say this, if it’s not the greatest accomplishment of this papacy, it will certainly be in the top four.

The greatest achievement of this papacy is getting things done in a short span of time. We all know that Vatican time is a little slow. In less than 10 years he brought home the SSPX. opened the door for the Anglicans to come home, and beatified his two heroes: John Paul II and John Henry Newman. Let’s not forget that he’s the first pope in history to beatify his predecessor. I would say that he has an impressive track record.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, FFV

 

[jwinch2]

Let’s wait to see what other rabbits he pulls out of his mitre. The man is not dead. He may outdo himself yet.

I will say this, if it’s not the greatest accomplishment of this papacy, it will certainly be in the top four.

The greatest achievement of this papacy is getting things done in a short span of time. We all know that Vatican time is a little slow. In less than 10 years he brought home the SSPX. opened the door for the Anglicans to come home, and beatified his two heroes: John Paul II and John Henry Newman. Let’s not forget that he’s the first pope in history to beatify his predecessor. I would say that he has an impressive track record.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, FFV

And in his down time he seems to come out with another book about every two weeks. He really is an incredible man and we are very lucky to have him. I hope he sticks around for a long time to come, and I pray for his good health. He has done much for us, but I feel that we still have great need of him.

 

[JReducation]

And in his down time he seems to come out with another book about every two weeks. He really is an incredible man and we are very lucky to have him. I hope he sticks around for a long time to come, and I pray for his good health. He has done much for us, but I feel that we still have great need of him.

I’m not his personal physician, but from what I know about medicine and how he moves, he looks like a very healthy man. His motor planning, eye-hand coordination, gait, posture, eye movements, tenor of his voice, attention span, weight and height appear to be those of a man in his late 60s to early 70s.

Unless something very sudden happens, I believe that he will be around for a few more years.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, FFV

 

[jwinch2]

I’m not his personal physician, but from what I know about medicine and how he moves, he looks like a very healthy man. His motor planning, eye-hand coordination, gait, posture, eye movements, tenor of his voice, attention span, weight and height appear to be those of a man in his late 60s to early 70s.

Unless something very sudden happens, I believe that he will be around for a few more years.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, FFV

For 85, he looks very good indeed.

 

[JReducation]

For 85, he looks very good indeed.

I loved his reply to Fidel Castro, right in front of the cameras too. Apparently he and Castro are not that distant in age. In one of the lite moments during the conversation, Castro said to Pope Benedict, “We’re getting old aren’t we?”

To which Pope Benedict responded, “Yes, but I can still do my job.”



Fraternally,

Br. JR, FFV

 

[Corki]

I think the Church is likely to follow the model of the group in Brazil. (Campos?) IIRC, the priests were reconciled in a formal ceremony but their Sacraments did not need to be repeated. I don’t understand the theological nuances but it seems to have been something like Radical Sanation for marriage, making their Weddings and Confirmations retroactively valid.

The property issue will depend a lot on whether they are formed as a group of their own or integrated into dioceses (or the FSSP).

 

[Melchior_1]

I’m glad they’re tentatively back into the fold. Now we’re about to see a very real version of the Prodigal Son, with the SSPX hopefully being the grateful younger son, and others hopefully being the understanding and welcoming older son.

 

[jwinch2]

I loved his reply to Fidel Castro, right in front of the cameras too. Apparently he and Castro are not that distant in age. In one of the lite moments during the conversation, Castro said to Pope Benedict, “We’re getting old aren’t we?”

To which Pope Benedict responded, “Yes, but I can still do my job.”



Fraternally,

Br. JR, FFV

Did he really? Oh, how good is that?

 

[JReducation]

I’m glad they’re tentatively back into the fold. Now we’re about to see a very real version of the Prodigal Son, with the SSPX hopefully being the grateful younger son, and others hopefully being the understanding and welcoming older son.

I stick to my original position. If the Holy Father signs the Preamble, there is nothing for us to opine, to think, to feel. The conversation is over. Peter has spoken.

As I said, I disagree with the SSPX on the position of Rome on the map. But what I believe becomes null and void when the Successor of Peter says what he believes. If he says that they meet the requirements to live and work among us, there is nothing more to be said. They can move into my house in the morning.

All that is expected of the older brother is that he shut his mouth and welcome his brother home. Reconciliation cannot be imposed from the outside. It has to be self-imposed. It is I who have to tell myself that the Cold War is over and now it’s time to go on with the work of the Church and we just happen to have a few new people on the staff. Let’s welcome them and get back to work.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, FFV

 

[TimothyH]

I think the real work rests on the shoulders of the laity.

There have been many things said and many have had their feelings hurt. There is much distrust and not a small ammount of pride that will have to be put aside.

The details of sacramental records, who owns what and other such things will be easy to figure out. How the laity gets along is going to require heroic humility.

-Tim-

 

[JReducation]

Did he really? Oh, how good is that?

I actually heard it live. It was so awesome. I don’t think that Pope Benedict meant to put him down. I think it was lite banter between the two. What took the translator by surprise was probably the fact that Joseph Ratzinger is not known for having a sense of humor. He’s a true gentleman, but he’s rather shy.

I was watching it, because in Miami, the visit to Cuba was all over the TV. Fidel was speaking in Spanish and the Pope was speaking in Italian through a translator.

Fidel made his comment and smiled. The archbishop or bishop who was translating repeated it for the pope in Italian. Then the pope comes back in Italian with that response. You suddenly saw a 30 second pause on the archbishop’s face. I wonder if the man was asking himself, “Did I hear him right?” Since the pope only turned and looked at the translator momentarily, it was clear that the translator had understood. Fidel took it in good stride. He just chuckled.

I knew Cardinal Ratzinger from many years ago. Unless he’s really changed, he was a very sweet, gentle, timid man who enjoyed watching humor, but never engaged in it. That’s why I almost fell off my chair.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, FFV

 

[corsair]

I disagree. Its mainly “religious freedom”, and “ecumenism”. There is a third point but I don’t seem to remember it right now.

 

[Transformer]

So, do we know any details at all about the modifications to the doctrinal preamble?

 

[corsair]

Better read the article on Rorate Caeli Blogspot. They say Bishop Fellay has accepted the terms. But no one outside of Rome or Econe knows what they are and probably won’t for several days.(maybe weeks).

Of course some are going to be “disjointed” because the problem will be settled but this will occur on both sides of the fence.

Many people thrive on chaos.