St. Joan's in Minneapolis - Rome Has Spoken!!!

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Before you start bashing the Arch-Dioceses, remember that while their major seminary still needs some work, they have one of the top collage seminaries in the country.
 
HAHAHAHAHA I just read the SJA “Mission Statement.” I think I’ll fax it over to the Anglicans on the corner. They’d adopt that in a moment. Also, there must have been a parish contest to see how many buzz words and politically correct turns of phrase could be conglomerated into one “statement.”

I like their “Eucharistic Celebration” schedule. Hmmm . . . what is that? Is it a Mass, Exposition and Adoration, a procession with the Blessed Sacrament or what? Soujnds to me more like they should just give the schedule for the Sunday Morning Father Wurtin Show.

Bring in the wrecking ball, knock down the building, disperse the people and build a church ont he site. That’s the only appropriate thing to do on the spot of a pagan temple. 😉

– Fr. L.
 
Fr. JLT:
Bring in the wrecking ball, knock down the building, disperse the people and build a church ont he site. That’s the only appropriate thing to do on the spot of a pagan temple. 😉
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Jesus came to save sinners, Father. How do we do that if we disperse them? :confused:
 
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SaintJVMan:
Before you start bashing the Arch-Dioceses, remember that while their major seminary still needs some work, they have one of the top collage seminaries in the country.
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Yes – and the Major Sem is getting better too, quite a few wonderful priests are getting advanced degrees in Rome to come back and teach at the major seminary. A couple are already back and have begun teaching this year!

As far as Fr_JLT’s comment about dispersing the parish – I have to agree. At this point, I see no other real option. It has been 20+ years of warnings. The parish will not change on its own. Much as we desire the people to come back into full communion with Rome, leaving them like that sure isn’t going to do it. Many of them (the knowing ones, not the ignorant attendees who don’t know better) are already outside the Church.

I don’t know about disbanding the parish like he posted, but either assigning a new orthodox priest there or giving them (the parish) the choice of either obeying Rome or leaving the Catholic Church altogether would be good options – at least the scandal would be removed.

+veritas+
 
+veritas+:
I don’t know about disbanding the parish like he posted, but either assigning a new orthodox priest there or giving them (the parish) the choice of either obeying Rome or leaving the Catholic Church altogether would be good options – at least the scandal would be removed.
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I would agree with these options. But somehow, I don’t think we are going to see them quickly. We’ll have to keep up the pressure.

Some guy from “Voice of the Faithful” will give a “reflection” this weekend. It would be interesting to get a report on at what point during Mass this “reflection” will have been given.

Back in the “olden days” at St. Joan’s (when I attended there), it was the practice for the pastor to give a two or three minute homily, then introduce the guest speaker who give the 20 minute presentation.

I’m sure their canon law expert has come up with some such work-around.
 
Fr. JLT:
HAHAHAHAHA I just read the SJA “Mission Statement.” I think I’ll fax it over to the Anglicans on the corner. They’d adopt that in a moment. Also, there must have been a parish contest to see how many buzz words and politically correct turns of phrase could be conglomerated into one “statement.”

I like their “Eucharistic Celebration” schedule. Hmmm . . . what is that? Is it a Mass, Exposition and Adoration, a procession with the Blessed Sacrament or what? Soujnds to me more like they should just give the schedule for the Sunday Morning Father Wurtin Show.

Bring in the wrecking ball, knock down the building, disperse the people and build a church ont he site. That’s the only appropriate thing to do on the spot of a pagan temple. 😉

– Fr. L.
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It’s inconceivable that an ordained priest of the Church would make this sort of posting – even in jest.

Imagine a non-Catholic reading your posts. They would likely receive a stunningly negative image of the priesthood.
 
I would vote for temporarily closing St. Joan’s. It would close for 3-6 months. During that period a new (and much smaller) lay staff would be hired and the church’s furnishings would be changed to be in compliance with the Church.

When it re-opened it would have two priests (as pastor and parochial vicar) from Opus Dei in charge…
 
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Crusader:
I would vote for temporarily closing St. Joan’s. It would close for 3-6 months. During that period a new (and much smaller) lay staff would be hired and the church’s furnishings would be changed to be in compliance with the Church.

When it re-opened it would have two priests (as pastor and parochial vicar) from Opus Dei in charge…
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Crusader, weeks ago I started a thread asking people what they would do if they were the pastor of a parish with “problems” or a bishop in a diocese with a problematic parish, and NOBODY responded. Not one answer. Where WERE you? This is a pretty good beginning. Maybe extreme. But the situation is extreme.
 
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Crusader:
When it re-opened it would have two priests (as pastor and parochial vicar) from Opus Dei in charge…
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I think that they could charge admission for spectators if that were the situation! 😛
 
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Crusader:
When it re-opened it would have two priests (as pastor and parochial vicar) from Opus Dei in charge…
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Wow, that would be something.
 
This is sadly reminding me of Corpus Christi parish in the Diocese of Rochester. I think it was 1998 when Bishop Clark (with a firm insistance from Rome) insisted that a woman in the parish stop acting like a deacon (she was wearing an alb, assisting the priest at Mass, reading the gospel, etc.) There was a terrible fight. The pastor was reassigned, they put the parish under the charge of an order priest from a local monastery. The low part came at the new priest’s first Mass when supporters of the renegade priest used Communion as a time to protest. It was horrible!

In the end the original priest and his deaconess left the Church and started their own. I read in the paper not too long ago that she has since been ordained by some protestant sect.

I pray that the situation is not as volatile in Minneapolis.
 
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mercygate:
Crusader, weeks ago I started a thread asking people what they would do if they were the pastor of a parish with “problems” or a bishop in a diocese with a problematic parish, and NOBODY responded. Not one answer. Where WERE you? This is a pretty good beginning. Maybe extreme. But the situation is extreme.
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I’m sorry I missed your other posting…

Assuming I had the support of the local bishop I would do the following if I was thrust into the pastorship of a parish like this one:

First, I would close it for at least 90 days – and I mean I would have the locks changed. I would also release all the paid staff.
Each member of the parish would receive a letter in the mail that the parish was closing. The letter would include a re-opening date.

I those 90 days I would hire a full-time DRE and maybe a secretary/bookeeper. That would be it. Rather than “coordinating”, the DRE would actually teach classes – be they child’s religious formation or RCIA, or everything in between.

I would also search-out a groom about a dozen lay-people to help me re-open the parish as ushers, lawn-mowers, readers, etc.

For the first year (or maybe even two), the sole focus of the parish would be on the seven sacraments of the Church. No social justice, no bazaars, no nothing but the sacraments, particularly the Eucharist.

Anything that was not in line with the Church as far as furnishings would be trashed – or sold.

There would be a HUGE focus on the Mass and Eucharistic adoration.

From there, put it in God’s hands. There would be no “discussion” or “diologue” about the old days. It would take time, but soon enough the church rolls would certain grow back to what they are today – and it would be an actual Catholic church once more.

But it could only be done with strong support from the local Bishop…
 
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Crusader:
But it could only be done with strong support from the local Bishop…
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It is highly unlikely that your good ideas would ever be put into effect as long as Archbishop Flynn is the ordinary. 😦

Announcements from the Chancery were surely forced, because the secular press got word of this. They stressed the instigation of Rome (Look, look, everyone! It wasn’t the archbishop that started this! Don’t blame him for this lapse in political and theological correctness!), and they explained the intervention as part of the desire for uniform celebration of the Eucharist during this special year!

Only as an afterthought were the homosexual aspects mentioned. In fact, during the Friday a.m. Relevant Radio review of the latest edition of the Catholic Spirit (the archbishop’s newspaper), the situation was discussed with nary a mention of the Gay Pride prize and advocacy. :mad:

We will probably never learn exactly what went down to promote this action at St. Joan’s, but whatever it was, let’s pray that there will be lots more of it at other parishes.

Pray unceasingly,

Anna
 
Fr. JLT:
Please! My comments were clearly and obviously tongue-in-cheek.
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But not totally out of the questionhttp://forums.catholic-questions.org/images/icons/icon10.gif
 
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Crusader:
It’s inconceivable that an ordained priest of the Church would make this sort of posting – even in jest.

Imagine a non-Catholic reading your posts. They would likely receive a stunningly negative image of the priesthood.
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Then apparently you have way too much tolerance for liturgical abuses.

SJA is apparently gone beyond any discription of a church… and this is not the time to want to fight a “more sensative” war.

Go gettem Father, in jest or not.http://forums.catholic-questions.org/images/icons/icon14.gif
 
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mercygate:
We’ll ask these people to embrace the whole faith in love and to strive to leave their lifestyle but they’re as welcome as anybody else who has a struggle with living a Catholic life. Goodness knows, Catholic life isn’t EASY!
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I certainly agree with being merciful in general. However there is a point where you actually encourage sin.

What I see on that website is basically a statement that homsexuality is an acceptable lifestyle, I do not see a ministry of outreach and help, I see endorsement.

They show pictures of men and women with their arms around each other. They call for same sex parental adoption. That’s endorsement.

Greg
 
Just a thought…and not to be trite…but how do you think Jesus would react to SJA?

If he was confronted by/confronting an individual or small group of SJA parishioners…I think he would be gentle, firm, and direct. He would finish his chastizement by offering his hand and asking them to come with him and change their ways.

If Jesus walked into a Mass as parodied by SJA…how would his reaction change? If he sat at your own home computer reviewing the mission statement…how would he react?

Really, let’s think about this. Jesus wanted converts, of course…he was dying for them literally!

When he walked into the temple and overturned the moneychanger’s tables, remember what a scandal that was? Isn’t what SJA is doing SO MUCH WORSE!!!

I think he’d overturn the entire church, “string up” (not literally) the shepherd and tell EVERYONE in no uncertain terms that they are not representing him. I think he’d offer the correct path to those willing…but that he’d show the remainder the door and let them know exactly what they had to do to darken the doors of his church again.

Just my opinion based on my own limited understanding of scripture…but really…our discussion here, for the most part, as to what to do likely would pale in comparison to what the hand of God would do.

I think maybe that’s why wer’re discussing this…because nasty and sinful as we humans are…we do not and cannot carry out the true wrath of God.
 
What are the proper methods of the laity to report problems to the leaders in the Church? Apparently, some people communicated with the Vatican.

Greg
 
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