St. Patrick's Cathedral in NY to undergo $177M Renovation

[Gidras05]

ncregister.com/daily-news/new-yorks-st.-patricks-cathedral-to-undergo-177-million-dollar-renovation/

While I understand how important St. Patrick’s Cathedral is as a place of worship, I think that a statement like this can’t be good for the publicity of the Church. Already there’s whispers of “Can’t the Church be giving that money to the poor etc etc etc”.

I wonder if Jesus would have preferred people putting tons of money to restore the Temple at Jerusalem versus the poor beggars on the streets.

What a conundrum.

 

[hudson]

There is no conundrum. There is no problem with giving the best in our worship of God. What did Jesus have to say?

John 12:
1 Six days before the Passover, Jesus came to Bethany, where Laz’arus was, whom Jesus had raised from the dead.
2 There they made him a supper; Martha served, and Laz’arus was one of those at table with him.
3 Mary took a pound of costly ointment of pure nard and anointed the feet of Jesus and wiped his feet with her hair; and the house was filled with the fragrance of the ointment.
4 But Judas Iscariot, one of his disciples (he who was to betray him), said,
5 “Why was this ointment not sold for three hundred denarii and given to the poor?”
6 This he said, not that he cared for the poor but because he was a thief, and as he had the money box he used to take what was put into it.
7 Jesus said, “Let her alone, let her keep it for the day of my burial.
8 The poor you always have with you, but you do not always have me.”

So lets not think like Judas, and realize we are giving the greater glory to God who really deserves it. Everything we have comes from him, so we should give glory to him the best we can. If you want to look at it in a social way, look at all the jobs the Catholic Church will be providing to local employers by doing this work.

 

[Gidras05]

Oh don’t get me wrong- I completely agree with this sentiment.

However, what I’m trying to point out is that there is bound to be, and already is, contention on a move like this. It is the same question that a lot of non-Catholics bring up about the supposed wealth of the Vatican. The Vatican has good justification for its resources, and for its relics and treasures, which AAA forum has answered many times.

The problem is that the masses won’t see it this way, and knowing the media, it’s going to be perverted in an attempt to win more sympathy towards the anti-Catholic sentiment that’s already sweeping through the US.

 

[hudson]

I have to be honest, I personally don’t care what non Catholics think about our Churches or how we spend our money. Instead of complaining about our Churches, they should be thanking us for being the largest charitable organization in the World. When they can come close to saying that, then I will listen.

 

[ValPal]

FWIW, St. Patrick’s isn’t just any ordinary Church. Besides serving a large community of people, it is also a major tourist attraction.

 

[Gidras05]

I have to be honest, I personally don’t care what non Catholics think about our Churches or how we spend our money. Instead of complaining about our Churches, they should be thanking us for being the largest charitable organization in the World. When they can come close to saying that, then I will listen.

I agree, but the problem is that those same non-Catholics are pulling members away from our Church through their slander. This is incredibly evident by the kinds of questions Catholics post all the time on these forums, and through AAA, and through Catholic Answers Radio/Live. Too often do I hear “I heard this and this and this, and it got me thinking 'Hey that’s a good question! That doesn’t seem right!”

Granted, those people should have stronger convictions about their faith, but we are taught to bring others closer to God. Therefore, anything that can pull them away, like media blowing things out of proportion, are detrimental to both our mission, and our life as the Church.

 

[Irishmom2]

Already there’s whispers of “Can’t the Church be giving that money to the poor etc etc etc”.

Yes, as one of the comments left after the article, this is exactly what was said.

So I guess the Archdiocese of New York should just let the bricks crumble and fall down around them?

 

[edward_george]

Another thing to keep in mind too, whenever this tired old argument gets brought up. So let’s say that we give the $177 million that was intended to be used to renovate the Cathedral to feed the poor. Would that end hunger? Would there stop being poor people? Absolutely not. As Jesus said, “the poor you will always have with you.” That doesn’t mean that we should just ignore them and see their plight as hopeless. It means that we need to give people hope, and the first and foremost place we do this is in Church by the proclamation of the Gospel. Look in poorer countries where the people can barely afford to get by, and yet they devote their all to building beautiful churches–and would be quite insulted if you suggested that these beautiful places be sold off to help buy them bread. Let people complain about beautiful churches, we know the truth. To devote something to the service of God in no way contradicts service to the poor, and in fact inspires and impels it.

-ACEGC

 

[NewEnglandPriest]

While I understand how important St. Patrick’s Cathedral is as a place of worship, I think that a statement like this can’t be good for the publicity of the Church.

Would it be better publicity if a brick fell and hit someone in the head? lol

Would the city of New York prefer the archdiocese to simply abandon the structure? I doubt it.

Already there’s whispers of “Can’t the Church be giving that money to the poor etc etc etc”.

Understood but, as the Cardinal pointed out, this isn’t cosmetic this is structural. And do those same people question the use of taxes to fund museums, libraries and landmarks instead of social services?

I wonder if Jesus would have preferred people putting tons of money to restore the Temple at Jerusalem versus the poor beggars on the streets.

I don’t recall Jesus ever questioning the use of money to sustain religious structures.

What a conundrum.

I think the only conundrum will be the conditions any government money might come with. Occasionally churches can get “historical preservation” grants but they often come with conditions limiting future renovations.

 

[Gidras05]

Would it be better publicity if a brick fell and hit someone in the head? lol

Would the city of New York prefer the archdiocese to simply abandon the structure? I doubt it.

Understood but, as the Cardinal pointed out, this isn’t cosmetic this is structural. And do those same people question the use of taxes to fund museums, libraries and landmarks instead of social services?

I don’t recall Jesus ever questioning the use of money to sustain religious structures.

I think the only conundrum will be the conditions any government money might come with. Occasionally churches can get “historical preservation” grants but they often come with conditions limiting future renovations.

Very good points- and I completely agree. I was only playing Devil’s advocate on what the media might spin this into. The post above yours completely covers exactly how I’d want to argue this to the masses who decide to attack the Church based on how she spends her money.

 

[Godfollower]

ncregister.com/daily-news/new-yorks-st.-patricks-cathedral-to-undergo-177-million-dollar-renovation/

While I understand how important St. Patrick’s Cathedral is as a place of worship, I think that a statement like this can’t be good for the publicity of the Church. Already there’s whispers of “Can’t the Church be giving that money to the poor etc etc etc”.

I wonder if Jesus would have preferred people putting tons of money to restore the Temple at Jerusalem versus the poor beggars on the streets.

What a conundrum.

Not a conundrum at all. From the article:

Now, 14 decades after John Hughes first dreamed of a new cathedral for the city of New York, Cardinal Dolan is calling on New Yorkers — Catholics and others of good will — to once again support the cathedral, which, according to the cardinal, is in great need of both repair and reinforcement to safely welcome the more than 5.5 million visitors it receives each year.

During the morning press conference, Cardinal Dolan was joined by New York Gov. Andrew Cuomo and other state and city officials as he summarized the history of the cathedral and bluntly described the physical needs that have brought about the restoration campaign.

“Now we’re not talking about a nice idea, folks, or some cosmetic facelift,” noted Cardinal Dolan. “We’re talking about the very survival of our beloved cathedral. This cathedral, simply put, is cracking. The bricks are crumbling and falling; the renowned windows are rattling and splitting; the heat, the air and the plumbing is old; the outside, as you see, is crusted with grit; and the roof is leaking. We don’t really have a choice but to repair.”

The repairs have to be done. As for people making catcalls about how the money would be better spent elsewhere, the answer is to say upfront that the project has to be done – and they’re doing exectly that.

 

[57Bill]

It’s large, beautiful and needs the repairs. No problem whatsoever.

I’ve been in a few renovated and partially(ongoing) renovated Cathedrals, Basilica’s and large churches. Architecture and expression at it’s highest level.

 

[Dwyer]

Besides, it is not offensive to religious sensibilities for a Church to maintain such beautiful treasures for the glory of God.

If the Temple in Jerusalem could be richly ordained in order to glorify God and to inspire human worship, the universal Church of God can be richly ordained for the same purposes.

I also notice that when people complain about ornate churches it’s almost invariably Catholic churches they gripe about.

I never hear them complain about the wealth of the Church of England (e.g., richly ornate Westminster Abbey, St. Paul’s Cathedral, St. Stephen Walbrook) or the places of worship of other religions / faith groups (e.g., there’s a Jade Buddha in a Buddhist Temple in Thailand).

Also, they never ask the billionaire Wall Street Bankers and CEOs to give their money to the poor.

 

[OriginalJS]

This thread reminds me of the old disputes between Benedictines (rich) and Franciscans (poor). Hard to say what Jesus would have thought about immense wealth in churches. He said it was harder for a rich man to get into heaven than for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle, and he told a rich young man to sell all he had and give it to the poor, but he recognized the richly ornate temple as the house of God and drove out the money changers and merchants of sacrificial animals.