Statues: Biblical or Unbiblical?

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One knowledgeable honest person in here has admitted that the CC has taken pagan statues and renamed them. Im still being accused of saying catholics worship graven images. I never said that. Look at all my posts.Im beginning to believe its the subconscience that is bringing that out of people. I say…“why do you bow.”?..they see it as…why do you worship.Im not here to accuse people of worshiping statues. I was invited here to talk about bowing to statues. My friends, i repeat…Bowing. Let me say it again…bowing. Lots of good people have joined in here and have reminded me that they dont worship statues. Thats nice. Im here to find out why people bow to graven images when it is forbidden by commandment? And why does their religion reguire them to use graven images as part of serving god.Ive seen the big reason…“they help us direct our prayers.” " the cement chunck focuses my prayers." One thing baffles me.The majority of folks in here say the statue has no power, it is just a reminder of the person it depicts. Then, out of the other side of their mouth they say the statue cries. Millions of the faithful travel to see these crying statues.Correct me if im wrong, but it seems to be all about the statues.
 
One knowledgeable honest person in here has admitted that the CC has taken pagan statues and renamed them.

I went through all the posts and did not see that…can you cite the post number (on the upper right corner)?
Im still being accused of saying catholics worship graven images. I never said that. Look at all my posts.Im beginning to believe its the subconscience that is bringing that out of people. I say…“why do you bow.”?..they see it as…why do you worship.
 
One knowledgeable honest person in here has admitted that the CC has taken pagan statues and renamed them. Im still being accused of saying catholics worship graven images. I never said that. Look at all my posts.Im beginning to believe its the subconscience that is bringing that out of people. I say…“why do you bow.”?..they see it as…why do you worship.Im not here to accuse people of worshiping statues. I was invited here to talk about bowing to statues. My friends, i repeat…Bowing. Let me say it again…bowing. Lots of good people have joined in here and have reminded me that they dont worship statues. Thats nice. Im here to find out why people bow to graven images when it is forbidden by commandment? And why does their religion reguire them to use graven images as part of serving god.Ive seen the big reason…“they help us direct our prayers.” " the cement chunck focuses my prayers." One thing baffles me.The majority of folks in here say the statue has no power, it is just a reminder of the person it depicts. Then, out of the other side of their mouth they say the statue cries. Millions of the faithful travel to see these crying statues.Correct me if im wrong, but it seems to be all about the statues.
That reminds me of this one time I went to a Church in a Mexican neighborhood that happened to be hosting this “Travelling” statue of Mary that seemed to be very popular internationally… It was kept on the altar surrounded by flowers and was kept safe from the puckered-up lips of the parishioners by a little chain link fence… I remember kneeling down in front of the statue, praying or whatever only to become distracted by the sound of some woman from the back of the Church just whaling and crying. I turned around and watched her stumble her way to the front of the Church sobbing and crying loudly the whole way -it seemed to last for an eternity. When she finally reached the altar, she threw herself on the floor and finally her sobbing stopped.

I thought that was weird so I left with a very strange taste in my mouth.

But that’s not the way Catholics are supposed to act around statues. For all I know, she could have been a Protestant crying about what she perceived was going on there in her own opinion. Maybe her relative named Mary had just passed away moments before and the whole situation was just too coincidental or “miraculous” for her to handle… Who knows.🤷
 
My friend Tepo, no one has accused you of worshiping statues. Cant anyone see what they read? One person in here addressed my question as to bowing to graven images. He said that people bow their heads during a funeral, they bow their heads to the Lincoln memorial and so forth. Id like to add that while ive never seen anyone bow their head to the lincoln monument, doesnt mean no one has. People just walk by and look. Bowing to graven images seems to be a catholic thing. So brother Tepo, you have pics of loved ones on your wall. You dont worship them. Thats fine. Therefor its a wonderful thing to bow to graven images of males and females. You know, if you want to bow befor graven images, you dont need to justify it to me or anyone. Telling me that i have a pic of mom in my wallet is why you bow to images is not working. Just go on and bow to them. Dont mind me.
Someone asked me if i love the catholic saints and Mary. No i dont. I dont know them. That person was implying that if i loved this or that catholic saint, i should be face first down on the ground befor its statue.
One more thing that puzzles me.the Lincoln memorial looks just like Abe. We know who we are looking at. The Mary statues dont look like Mary. They arent likenesses of Mary.So who are you “venerating”? They might as well be cookie monster with a sign at the bottom saying Mary. If someone put cookie monsters head on the Lincoln monument, people would say…hey look, its cookie monster. they wouldnt say, hey look, its Abe.My point is, the Mary statues dont represent the real Mary. If you saw the real Mary yould be shocked.
 
VSdriver my friend, you got me.Ill have to admit, when Jesus said not to do vain repititions, he was just kidding. its the most glorious thing to repeat prayer, so god will hear us for our much speaking.
Two words, Sugar: Psalm 118.

Check it out.

Every second line throughout: For His love endures forever.

REPETITION.

So, obviously there is a difference between repetition, which is RIGHT THERE IN THE BIBLE, and ‘vain’ repetition.

Don’t forget also that when Jesus was praying in the garden before His Passion, he prayed THREE TIMES to the Father, and Scripture says He prayed “THE SAME WORDS”.

Just who are you to tell me that my saying the Our Father several times a day is 'vain repetition" anyway?
 
My friend Tepo, no one has accused you of worshiping statues. Cant anyone see what they read? One person in here addressed my question as to bowing to

My point is, the Mary statues dont represent the real Mary. If you saw the real Mary yould be shocked.
How do you know how the real Virgin Mary looks like? Has she shown herself to you? And why would be shocked?
 
One knowledgeable honest person in here has admitted that the CC has taken pagan statues and renamed them. Im still being accused of saying catholics worship graven images. I never said that. Look at all my posts.Im beginning to believe its the subconscience that is bringing that out of people. I say…“why do you bow.”?..they see it as…why do you worship.Im not here to accuse people of worshiping statues. I was invited here to talk about bowing to statues. My friends, i repeat…Bowing. Let me say it again…bowing. Lots of good people have joined in here and have reminded me that they dont worship statues. Thats nice. Im here to find out why people bow to graven images when it is forbidden by commandment? And why does their religion reguire them to use graven images as part of serving god.Ive seen the big reason…“they help us direct our prayers.” " the cement chunck focuses my prayers." One thing baffles me.The majority of folks in here say the statue has no power, it is just a reminder of the person it depicts. Then, out of the other side of their mouth they say the statue cries. Millions of the faithful travel to see these crying statues.Correct me if im wrong, but it seems to be all about the statues.
You’re wrong. 😃
 
One knowledgeable honest person in here has admitted that the CC has taken pagan statues and renamed them.

.
Wrong…here is what Tepo said in post 33…*That’s good… I support renaming and regaining pagan statues as Catholic. The Church has always allowed itself to adapt to the various traditions and cultures of different people -that way it helps people to be able to relate better with the truth… Because sometimes the truth is hard to swallow. For others it’s down right painful. *

Tepo supports…but did not state that the CC has done it.
 
Brother Tepo, thank you for being honest and relating that story. That lady is every bit catholic, the very flower of what catholicism is. Ill bet the good priest didnt come out and try to set the Lady straight. That its not right to attach such emotion to a graven image. But the fact that the graven image was brought there as a special treat speaks volumes. A special graven image.Flowers around it. Serving it.My fave are the statues that men bare on their shoulders and parade down the street. Then the faithful throw money or flowers at it. No idolatry there. Im sure theres a good wonderful reason why god loves it. Oh yeah, its cause i have a pic of mom in my wallet.
 
Therefor its a wonderful thing to bow to graven images of males and females. You know, if you want to bow befor graven images, you dont need to justify it to me or anyone.

.
How about answering this question…which I asked previously…Is a depiction of the passion of Christ, in statues…a graven image? Is the image of the Virgin Mary, carrying the Child Jesus in her arms…a graven image? Or is it the purpose, when used for worship is what is being talked about by the commandement, which you seem to not so far grasped?
 
My friend Tepo, no one has accused you of worshiping statues. Cant anyone see what they read? One person in here addressed my question as to bowing to graven images. He said that people bow their heads during a funeral, they bow their heads to the Lincoln memorial and so forth. Id like to add that while ive never seen anyone bow their head to the lincoln monument, doesnt mean no one has. People just walk by and look. Bowing to graven images seems to be a catholic thing. So brother Tepo, you have pics of loved ones on your wall. You dont worship them. Thats fine. Therefor its a wonderful thing to bow to graven images of males and females. You know, if you want to bow befor graven images, you dont need to justify it to me or anyone. Telling me that i have a pic of mom in my wallet is why you bow to images is not working. Just go on and bow to them. Dont mind me.
Someone asked me if i love the catholic saints and Mary. No i dont. I dont know them. That person was implying that if i loved this or that catholic saint, i should be face first down on the ground befor its statue.
One more thing that puzzles me.the Lincoln memorial looks just like Abe. We know who we are looking at. The Mary statues dont look like Mary. They arent likenesses of Mary.So who are you “venerating”? They might as well be cookie monster with a sign at the bottom saying Mary. If someone put cookie monsters head on the Lincoln monument, people would say…hey look, its cookie monster. they wouldnt say, hey look, its Abe.My point is, the Mary statues dont represent the real Mary. If you saw the real Mary yould be shocked.
I’ve actually never “bowed” to a statue before in my life. I have kneeled down to pray to God, and there have been statues around me but I don’t bow to the statues. In fact, if I was kneeled down praying and an earthquake struck and all the statues fell down and shattered, I would be amazed with God, and would begin to pray harder.
 
Brother Tepo, thank you for being honest and relating that story. That lady is every bit catholic, the very flower of what catholicism is. Ill bet the good priest didnt come out and try to set the Lady straight. That its not right to attach such emotion to a graven image. But the fact that the graven image was brought there as a special treat speaks volumes. A special graven image.Flowers around it. Serving it.My fave are the statues that men bare on their shoulders and parade down the street. Then the faithful throw money or flowers at it. No idolatry there. Im sure theres a good wonderful reason why god loves it. Oh yeah, its cause i have a pic of mom in my wallet.
Seems you have run out of arguments…and are now resorting to smug zingers and responses…🤷
 
Come on my friend Pablope, get real. He supports a pratice, not a “what if”. Dont believe me on anything. You can confer with history books. Please dont tell me you didnt know the fish hat of the pope and bishops are from babylon pagan priestly wear. Please dont tell me that.
 
Come on my friend Pablope, get real. He supports a pratice, not a “what if”. Dont believe me on anything. You can confer with history books. Please dont tell me you didnt know the fish hat of the pope and bishops are from babylon pagan priestly wear. Please dont tell me that.
Kimberly…read post 38…which I repost…this has been refuted as bad research…

The Two Babylons: A Case Study in Poor Research Methodology

By Ralph Woodrow

This article can be found in the Christian Research Journal Volume22/ Issue 2 2000 Book Reviews 54-56

Many preferred my book over The Two Babylons because it was easier to read and understand. Sometimes the two books were confused with each other, and once I even had the experience of being greeted as “Reverend Hislop”! As time went on, however, I began to hear rumblings that Hislop was not a reliable historian, I heard this from a history teacher and in letters from people who heard this perspective expressed on the Bible Answer Man radio program. Even the Worldwide Church of God began to take a second look at the subject. As a result, I realized I needed to go back through Hislop’s work, my basic source, and prayerfully check it out… I realized that no recognized history book substantiated these and many other claims.

While seeking to condemn the paganism of Roman Catholicism, Hislop produced his own myths. By so doing, he theorized that Nimrod, Adonis, Apollo, Attes, Ball-zebub, Bacchus, Cupid, Dagon, Hercules, Januis, Linus, Lucifer, Mars, Merodach, Thithra, Molock, Narcissus, Oannes, Oden, Orion, Osiris, Pluto, Saturn, Teitan, Typhon, Vulcan, Wodan, and Zoraster were all one and the same. By mixing myths, Hislop supposed that Semiramis was the wife of Nimrod and was the same as Aphrodite, Artemis, Astarte, Aurora, Bellona, Ceres, Diana, Easter, Irene, Iris, Juno, Mylitta, Proserpine, Rhea, Venus, and Vesta.

If finding a pagan parallel provides proof of paganism, the Lord Himself would be pagan. The woman called Mystery Babylon had a cup in her hand; the Lord has a cup in His hand (Ps. 78:8). Pagan kings sat on thrones and wore crowns; the Lord sits on a throne and wears a crown (Rev. 1:4; 14:14) Pagans worshipped the sun; the Lord is called the “Sun of Righteousness” (Mal. 4:2), Pagan gods were likened to stars; the Lord is called “the bright and Morning star” (Rev. 22:16). Pagan gods had temples dedicated to them; the Lord has a temple (Rev. 7:15). Pagans built a high tower in Babylon; the Lord is a high tower (2 Sam. 22:3). Pagans worshipped idolatrous pillars; the Lord appeared as a pillar of fire (Exod. 13:21-22). Pagan gods were pictured with wings; the Lord is pictured with wings (Ps. 91:4).

Do you know who Ralph Woodrow is? He actually wrote a book based on Hislop’s book…and withdrew the printing of his book after checking Hislop’s research…Sloppy.

ralphwoodrow.org/books/pages/babylon-mystery.html

My original book had some valuable information in it. But it also contained certain teachings that were made popular in a book many years ago, THE TWO BABYLONS, by Alexander Hislop. This book claims that the very religion of ancient Babylon, under the leadership of Nimrod and his wife, was later disguised with Christian-sounding names, becoming the Roman Catholic Church. Thus, two “Babylons"—one ancient and one modern. Proof for this is sought by citing numerous similarities in paganism. The problem with this method is this: in many cases there is no connection.

By this method, one could condemn Protestant and evangelical denominations like the Assemblies of God, Baptist, Church of Christ, Lutheran, Methodist, Nazarene, etc. Basic things like prayer, and kneeling in prayer, would have to be rejected, because pagans knelt and prayed to their gods. Water baptism would have to be rejected, for pagans had numerous rites involving water, etc.

By this method, the BIBLE itself would need to be rejected as pagan. All of the following practices or beliefs mentioned in the Bible, were also known among pagans—raising hands in worship, taking off shoes on holy ground, a holy mountain, a holy place in a temple, offering sacrifices without blemish, a sacred ark, city of refuge, bringing forth water from a rock, laws written on stone, fire appearing on a person’s head, horses of fire, the offering of first fruits, tithes, etc.

It is amazing how unsubstantiated teachings like these circulate—and are believed. One can go to any library, check any history book about ancient Babylon, none of these things will be found. They are not historically accurate, but are based on an arbitrary piecing together of bits and pieces of mythology.

Maybe you should follow Ralph’s advise above…just as he did…and actually do some research on your own…and not rely on the anti-catholic sites you cite and visit.
 
Brother Tepo, thank you for being honest and relating that story. That lady is every bit catholic, the very flower of what catholicism is. Ill bet the good priest didnt come out and try to set the Lady straight. That its not right to attach such emotion to a graven image. But the fact that the graven image was brought there as a special treat speaks volumes. A special graven image.Flowers around it. Serving it.My fave are the statues that men bare on their shoulders and parade down the street. Then the faithful throw money or flowers at it. No idolatry there. Im sure theres a good wonderful reason why god loves it. Oh yeah, its cause i have a pic of mom in my wallet.
I believe this was the statue I saw… pilgrimvirginstatue.com/

The purpose of this Travelling statue of the Virgin Mary is to remind the faithful about the Miracles of Fatima… Miracles that were actually witnessed by the media and thousands of actual people. The purpose of the statue is not to be worshipped itself, but is more like a reminder -which is basically what all statues in the Church are used for.
 
Brother Tepo, ive talked to a few catholics who say they have never bowed befor a statue. Its just a couple though, i mean like 2 out of hundreds. Ive saved lots of pics off the internet of the faithful on their knees befor the mary statue, and sundry others. Mary seems to be the fave. Ive was invited here to converse with a guy i met in another site.NC its called, i think.It was about indulgences. It seems Christ sacrifice isnt good enough. To me its my salvation. The finished work of Christ. To others, there still needs work to be added. What a horrible thing to lay on people. And to little children too!
 
Brother Tepo, ive talked to a few catholics who say they have never bowed befor a statue. Its just a couple though, i mean like 2 out of hundreds. Ive saved lots of pics off the internet of the faithful on their knees befor the mary statue, and sundry others. Mary seems to be the fave. Ive was invited here to converse with a guy i met in another site.NC its called, i think.It was about indulgences.

It seems Christ sacrifice isnt good enough. To me its my salvation. The finished work of Christ. To others, there still needs work to be added. What a horrible thing to lay on people. And to little children too!
The CC says Christ sacrifice is perfect and good…where does it say it is not? Can you cite the Catholic document that says otherwise…or is this just taken from anti-catholic sources.

The finished work of Chris is complete…His work…but where does it say our work is complete and done too? Did Christ not say to immitate Him? If he suffered, should we not suffer also? Did he not say to pick up one’s cross to follow Him?
 
Thanks brother Tepo. One question…when god appeared to the israelites on the mountain, he showed them no form. Later in Deut chp 4 god explains why. he didnt show them a form lest they corrupt themselfs and make an image. Why is god always down on making images. Lets exempt his temple where god has put what he wants in it. is god double minded? God killed lots of people in the old test. But he commands us…thou shalt not kill.God does as he wants, but tells us how we are to act.So Tepo, why does god consider making an image corrupting us?
 
Brother Tepo, ive talked to a few catholics who say they have never bowed befor a statue. Its just a couple though, i mean like 2 out of hundreds. Ive saved lots of pics off the internet of the faithful on their knees befor the mary statue, and sundry others.

!
How about answering this first…Is a depiction of the passion of Christ, in statues…a graven image? Is the image of the Virgin Mary, carrying the Child Jesus in her arms…a graven image? Or is it the purpose, when used for worship is what is being talked about by the commandement, which you seem to not so far grasped?
 
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