J
Jesus_N_Cherie
Guest
Who is “we”? And what else did Jesus and St. Peter say that we don’t know if they believed? And just what did He know and believe? And how can you tell the difference between the two?
- Status
E
elzoog
Guest
Why would this be surprising? People tend to make up tall tales and stories all the time. For example, in US folklore we have stories about Paul Bunyan, Wild Bill Hickok, and others.
So why would it be surprising that a group of people who occasionally see floods, would make up a tall tale about the whole world being flooded?
J
Jesus_N_Cherie
Guest
Reads to me like Jesus was talking about an actual historical event…not something He was guessing about, or something He didn’t understand. He knew exactly what He was talking about. And He referred to it as something that had definitely happened, in reference to something that definitely would happen in the future.
J
Jesus_N_Cherie
Guest
We are talking about the inspired Word of God. We are not referring to old wives tales. Is this how you see the Bible? As just some nice folk tales? Do you think you are a Christian? If so, where do you get your knowledge that Christ existed from? The Bible. And the Bible was written by the traditions of the Holy Catholic Church, which was inspired and taught by Jesus and the Holy Spirit. What reason would God, Who is perfect and can neither decieve or be decieved, tell us a lie or inspire us to tell a lie…which He cannot do because He can neither decieve or be decieved? It is totally contradictory to Christianity! Either it happened as He said it did, or He lied…which could never happen. So, you either believe in Him and follow Him, believe in Him and reject Him, or don’t believe in Him.
E
elzoog
Guest
I don’t believe in Jesus or God as described in the bible. I think that there might be a god, but so far I have not encountered any idea of god which has survived logical scrutiny.
There are so many scientific problems with an actual world wide flood (as opposed to a flood merely being so big that the primitive people at the time thought maybe it was world wide) that I am confident in asserting that such a flood never happened.
One problem with a world wide flood I bet you never though about is this. How did the fish survive such a flood? You might be thinking something like “Duh, fish live in water.” right? But consider this. Fish which live in the ocean are salt water fish. They can’t survive in fresh water. That’s how you know that stories of sharks swimming up the river a significant distance to attack people are false. Sharks can’t live long in fresh water. Now, consider what kind of water comes from rain. You guessed it, fresh water.
J
Jesus_N_Cherie
Guest
He IS God, whether you believe in Him or not. He didn’t survive it, He created all things. He is God whether you accept Him or not. I shall truly pray for your conversion to Him and His Truth.
You talk as one who puts God in His Infinite Wisdom and Power on the same level as man’s. You are not understanding Who and What He is…not that I possibly can. For man cannot fathom the Mind or Power of God. The difference between you and I is that you put human limitations on what God can do with His own creation. I do not put any limitations on God, except that He can be imperfect. And that is because He is perfect. The Bible states that, but I am not sure where…see my shortcomings. Yet I believe that it is there.
J
Jesus_N_Cherie
Guest
For those of you who do not believe in the Historical accuracy of the stories in the Bible, I would like to say this:
The beautiful faith that I recieve in the Holy Trinity from believing all that the Bible says as an historically accurate account of all that God has done and continues to do in His creation is a very wonderful thing.
This grace helps my faith in Him. It frees me to just love and believe in His Omnipotence. It is liberating. I know what sin is, and I know what is expected of me. I know also that when I fall short of His expectations and demands on me, I am freed from those sins when I recieve Absolution in the Sacrament of Reconciliation. This is a credit only to Him Who loved the world so much that He gave His only Begotten Son, that if we believe in Him, we may have eternal life.
To question Him about whether what He wrote was true or false, tears down my faith, which limits what He can do with me. It forces me to fight His Words. It forces me to sin, in that I am limiting His ability to do what He will, when He will, with what He created for His own purposes. I cannot stick Him in a box and tell Him that He has to do things according to what man can fathom. It would not only be sinful, it would be an exhausting waste of my time which is better spent in adoration and thanksgiving.
I am a simple person, of which I thank Him. My education is not a grand thing. But I have faith…which is greater than any amount of education could give my soul. It is the freedom to just believe in His Words, which He graciously allowed us to have in abundance.
Can I answer all of the questions that arise about Noah and the Flood? NO, I cannot. 10,000 years after the fact, we have to rely mostly on His words…which to the faithful make much more sense than anything else. No, not scientifically maybe to some. But theologically, and with faith, they make all of the sense in the world. It tells us in the Bible how He accomplished what He willed to happen. It is not up to us to decide whether or not it happened, as that will not change the fact that it did one little bit. He said it did. That’s all that we should NEED to know. If it is easy to prove, and, by the way, there is good evidence of it, that is all fine and good. But the most important thing is that we believe His words.
What do you recieve from denying them, except less faith that God can do what He wants to with His creation? Except maybe pride in thinking that you outsmarted God and that you are more intelligent than He wanted you to be? For, indeed, He wants you to have enough faith in Him that you would not truly question and decide that He couldn’t have done what He said He did. Faith is a gift from Him. There are many mysteries in Faith. That is why it is called Faith. It is believing in something when common sense tells you not to. But He calls us to have faith. He doesn’t call us to believe in human scientific explanations of His actions over His words.
Faith is a beautiful thing. It is liberating. It gives me confidence in Him and His ability to deal with all aspects of my life, and with the world. I didn’t have to figure out how to deal with K2000, because I knew that He was in charge. And He did. I pray that you all will ask for the gift of faith, to recieve it in abundance. Wisdom comes with faith. And wisdom is much better than intellectualism or what the world knows as science.
Please understand that I am not putting science down. Through science, God has done marvelous things…most especially medical wise. But science cannot take the place of God, as so often happens. And when there is a question of science versus the Word of God, the Word of God always trumps science. Science is a gift from God, and He did not intend for it to be used to try to discredit Him. That is turning something good into a tool for evil. I pray you all come to true Faith.
I pray for you.
The beautiful faith that I recieve in the Holy Trinity from believing all that the Bible says as an historically accurate account of all that God has done and continues to do in His creation is a very wonderful thing.
This grace helps my faith in Him. It frees me to just love and believe in His Omnipotence. It is liberating. I know what sin is, and I know what is expected of me. I know also that when I fall short of His expectations and demands on me, I am freed from those sins when I recieve Absolution in the Sacrament of Reconciliation. This is a credit only to Him Who loved the world so much that He gave His only Begotten Son, that if we believe in Him, we may have eternal life.
To question Him about whether what He wrote was true or false, tears down my faith, which limits what He can do with me. It forces me to fight His Words. It forces me to sin, in that I am limiting His ability to do what He will, when He will, with what He created for His own purposes. I cannot stick Him in a box and tell Him that He has to do things according to what man can fathom. It would not only be sinful, it would be an exhausting waste of my time which is better spent in adoration and thanksgiving.
I am a simple person, of which I thank Him. My education is not a grand thing. But I have faith…which is greater than any amount of education could give my soul. It is the freedom to just believe in His Words, which He graciously allowed us to have in abundance.
Can I answer all of the questions that arise about Noah and the Flood? NO, I cannot. 10,000 years after the fact, we have to rely mostly on His words…which to the faithful make much more sense than anything else. No, not scientifically maybe to some. But theologically, and with faith, they make all of the sense in the world. It tells us in the Bible how He accomplished what He willed to happen. It is not up to us to decide whether or not it happened, as that will not change the fact that it did one little bit. He said it did. That’s all that we should NEED to know. If it is easy to prove, and, by the way, there is good evidence of it, that is all fine and good. But the most important thing is that we believe His words.
What do you recieve from denying them, except less faith that God can do what He wants to with His creation? Except maybe pride in thinking that you outsmarted God and that you are more intelligent than He wanted you to be? For, indeed, He wants you to have enough faith in Him that you would not truly question and decide that He couldn’t have done what He said He did. Faith is a gift from Him. There are many mysteries in Faith. That is why it is called Faith. It is believing in something when common sense tells you not to. But He calls us to have faith. He doesn’t call us to believe in human scientific explanations of His actions over His words.
Faith is a beautiful thing. It is liberating. It gives me confidence in Him and His ability to deal with all aspects of my life, and with the world. I didn’t have to figure out how to deal with K2000, because I knew that He was in charge. And He did. I pray that you all will ask for the gift of faith, to recieve it in abundance. Wisdom comes with faith. And wisdom is much better than intellectualism or what the world knows as science.
Please understand that I am not putting science down. Through science, God has done marvelous things…most especially medical wise. But science cannot take the place of God, as so often happens. And when there is a question of science versus the Word of God, the Word of God always trumps science. Science is a gift from God, and He did not intend for it to be used to try to discredit Him. That is turning something good into a tool for evil. I pray you all come to true Faith.
I pray for you.
E
elzoog
Guest
If that’s your position then there is no point in talking to you further. Your mind is already made up. One thing I agree with you on, is that there is an objective reality. If I free fall from an airplane at 10,000 feet without a parachute, there is a high likelihood that I am going to die. It doesn’t matter how much I want to believe that I will suddenly get the power to fly like Superman and just fly away. The fact is, I am probably going to die.
The difference between you and me is that I want my ideas of objective reality to be tested. I want to be corrected, not by mere assertions as what you are doing, but by the process of reason and testability.
J
Jesus_N_Cherie
Guest
there is nothing that is more than God is, so His power cannot be tested by mere man’s process of reason and testability when it comes down to matters of faith. Just as with the Resurrection of Jesus. There is no scientific proof of Him rising from the dead. That takes faith. So with the argument of Noah and the Ark. For the most part, all we have is faith, and it has done us very well for 10,000 years. Then comes the arrogance of the 21 Century who refuses to acknowledge that anything that they cannot prove cannot be real. Today they argue against Noah and the Ark and the 6 days it took God to create the world. Tomorrow they will choose the Resurrection of Our Lord Jesus Christ. If we do not have our Faith intact, how will we be able to fight the coming travesty? We won’t, because we will be so used to not believing what the Bible says. It will be just one more thing that the worshippers of science will do their best to take away from the world. I choose to believe all that is in the Bible, and all that is the Tradition of the Holy Roman Catholic Church. I do not want my faith to be tested. You see, that is actually what you all who worship science are doing. You are testing your faith, not the actual happenings of the Bible. It is, “Do I have the faith to believe that God can do what He chooses with what He created?” I pray that you come to that faith. I pray that you choose for faith, because you will not have to answer to science one day…you will have to answer to Jesus, Who created the world and does with it as He pleases. He came down from Heaven, taught us by word and deed, then took our sins upon Himself, and suffered Himself to take on the punishment of our sins, so that we may live with Him eternally. And He rose from the dead and now sits at the right hand of the Father. He will come to JUDGE the living and the dead.
If you spend as much time talking to Him and asking Him to give you the faith and WISDOM not knowledge, but wisdom to know the TRUTH as you spend trying to discredit His Words, you would find much more peace in yourself.
N
Neil_Anthony
Guest
Maybe its symbolic, and the “ark” was a meteorite and “Noah” was a bacteria on the meteorite from which we all descended, and the meteorite was blown off of mars just before it turned into desert, and landed on earth, starting life here.
J
Jesus_N_Cherie
Guest
Let this be a lesson to all: This is what can happen when we do not believe with Faith in God’s Word. Once we stop having that Faith, anything they bring before us becomes believable…as long as it is not the truth.
B
Brian_Millar
Guest
Well, as long as we are going into sci fi, I have my own fun little story that the movie writers might want to follow up with, at least it’s from an original fictional story line.
How about all of mankind and life started out on Mars. And aliens saw that Mars was going to have some catastrophic changes rendering the planet non condusive to support life. They directed the residing centient being “Noah” to build an ark to their specifications so that they could transport it as well as a select series of life forms to be transported to the newly formed, yet uninhabated planet we call earth. They were told not to open it up for 40 days because it would expose them to the vaccume of space during the transport. All the while, Noah and his family thought they were simply riding out the flood.
The writers are going to have to address artifical gravity for the ark and have it gradually change to the earths gravitational pull during the journey as well. They will need a huge tractor beam to pull it along the journey as well as to control re-entry, that or simply house the ark within the mothership during transport.
N
Neil_Anthony
Guest
This could be it. Maybe thats why the bible says there were “giants” on the earth before the flood… they were on another planet!Well, as long as we are going into sci fi, I have my own fun little story that the movie writers might want to follow up with, at least it’s from an original fictional story line.
How about all of mankind and life started out on Mars. And aliens saw that Mars was going to have some catastrophic changes rendering the planet non condusive to support life. They directed the residing centient being “Noah” to build an ark to their specifications so that they could transport it as well as a select series of life forms to be transported to the newly formed, yet uninhabated planet we call earth. They were told not to open it up for 40 days because it would expose them to the vaccume of space during the transport. All the while, Noah and his family thought they were simply riding out the flood.
The writers are going to have to address artifical gravity for the ark and have it gradually change to the earths gravitational pull during the journey as well. They will need a huge tractor beam to pull it along the journey as well as to control re-entry, that or simply house the ark within the mothership during transport.
B
Brian_Millar
Guest
Niel, we can go into tangents forever with how things “could” have happened, believe me, I have a very fertile imagination. The possiblities in this area we should focus on if we are to continue along this tangent, we should look to what the future has in store for us as we begin to explore the galaxy. Observation with the past advances pretty much assures things that we deem totally impossible today, things that contradict all of what we know eventually may and likely will be considered mainstream with it’s own set of dynamic’s and principals. Elements such as travel faster then the speed of light, time travel, interdimentional travel, telepathy, etc. which are totally out of our range of understanding if we can find a way not to destroy ourselves will finally put an end to most of the arguments we face in the here and now.
J
Jesus_N_Cherie
Guest
Well, as long as we are going into sci fi, I have my own fun little story that the movie writers might want to follow up with, at least it’s from an original fictional story line.
How about all of mankind and life started out on Mars. And aliens saw that Mars was going to have some catastrophic changes rendering the planet non condusive to support life. They directed the residing centient being “Noah” to build an ark to their specifications so that they could transport it as well as a select series of life forms to be transported to the newly formed, yet uninhabated planet we call earth. They were told not to open it up for 40 days because it would expose them to the vaccume of space during the transport. All the while, Noah and his family thought they were simply riding out the flood.
The writers are going to have to address artifical gravity for the ark and have it gradually change to the earths gravitational pull during the journey as well. They will need a huge tractor beam to pull it along the journey as well as to control re-entry, that or simply house the ark within the mothership during transport.
:tiphat: :tiphat: :clapping:
P
peary
Guest
Originally Posted by **elzoog **
If that’s your position then there is no point in talking to you further. Your mind is already made up. One thing I agree with you on, is that there is an objective reality. If I free fall from an airplane at 10,000 feet without a parachute, there is a high likelihood that I am going to die. It doesn’t matter how much I want to believe that I will suddenly get the power to fly like Superman and just fly away. The fact is, I am probably going to die.
The difference between you and me is that I want my ideas of objective reality to be tested. I want to be corrected, not by mere assertions as what you are doing, but by the process of reason and testability.
But if you want your ideas of objective reality to be tested, you will by necessity need to fall from an airplane at 10,000 feet without a parachute to make sure that you will or will not die. Otherwise, it’s all surmise on your part.
If that’s your position then there is no point in talking to you further. Your mind is already made up. One thing I agree with you on, is that there is an objective reality. If I free fall from an airplane at 10,000 feet without a parachute, there is a high likelihood that I am going to die. It doesn’t matter how much I want to believe that I will suddenly get the power to fly like Superman and just fly away. The fact is, I am probably going to die.
The difference between you and me is that I want my ideas of objective reality to be tested. I want to be corrected, not by mere assertions as what you are doing, but by the process of reason and testability.
But if you want your ideas of objective reality to be tested, you will by necessity need to fall from an airplane at 10,000 feet without a parachute to make sure that you will or will not die. Otherwise, it’s all surmise on your part.
J
Jesus_N_Cherie
Guest
B
buffalo
Guest
Interesting - let’s say we were going to terraform a planet and populate it. Let’s ask the scientists how we would do this.Well, as long as we are going into sci fi, I have my own fun little story that the movie writers might want to follow up with, at least it’s from an original fictional story line.
How about all of mankind and life started out on Mars. And aliens saw that Mars was going to have some catastrophic changes rendering the planet non condusive to support life. They directed the residing centient being “Noah” to build an ark to their specifications so that they could transport it as well as a select series of life forms to be transported to the newly formed, yet uninhabated planet we call earth. They were told not to open it up for 40 days because it would expose them to the vaccume of space during the transport. All the while, Noah and his family thought they were simply riding out the flood.
The writers are going to have to address artifical gravity for the ark and have it gradually change to the earths gravitational pull during the journey as well. They will need a huge tractor beam to pull it along the journey as well as to control re-entry, that or simply house the ark within the mothership during transport.
First we have to build a ship of some sort. It has to be big enough of course to carry all the seeds and stuff we need. We would need to some male sperm and some female sperm of all kinds. It would have to survive the journey. It would have to support the life on board.
Sound feasable? You bet.
P
Philipp
Guest
You said: “I want to be corrected, not by mere assertions as what you are doing, but by the process of reason and testability” These I will try by the process of reason and testability, from a scientific perspective what I and my team members have done during the past 25 years. This alone will not provide you faith in Scripture but I suppose it could help as you proceed down the road of life as it helped me.
INTRODUCTION: I am a research chemist who has been interested in the story of Noah’s Ark and the flood for over 40 years after reading Immanuel. Velikovsky’s books, Earth in Upheaval and Ages in Chaos. I then read about the evidence for Noah’s Ark on the 17,000 foot high Greater Ararat in Eastern Turkey. Before that I had accepted the “assertion” that theistic evolution was a logical extrapolation since some folks in the Catholic media and some theologians claimed we as Catholics could believe in evolution of life from a common ancestor.
When I learned of fossil Human footprints with dinosaurs in a river bottom and also pristine ones excavated on the ledges above a river in Texas I chose to perform my own independent research. I’ve done that for the past 25 years when time permitted. Each time that I co-led an expedition to these sites with the land owner’s permission [arranged for by the archaeologist who lived in the area] we found at least one fossil human footprint with several dinosaurian ones. That is reproducibility and good science as it should be — repeatability and testability.
C-14 DATING OF CARBONIZED WOOD: A Ph.D. in geophysics joined our initial team in 1983 and asked the question: “How old might these footprints be?” Were they millions or thousands of years old? Being familiar with radiometric dating he looked for dacite and other materials that could be K/Ar dated but found none, since the five strata down to the river bottom did NOT contain volcanic material; all was limestone sedimentary rock with 1-3 inches of clay between each 12 inch thick strata.
He thus began to collect carbonized wood samples for C-14 dating in the clay, another good piece of scientific research as he thus did not assume that the dinosaur impressions were 65 million years or older as he was taught. The several C-14 dates he obtained were ~37,500 Radiocarbon years give or take 3000 years on the conventional system. When he lost his research job with a large oil company he had to quit this research and move on.
I learned later that another team in 1979 had obtained a date for “a burnt tree branch” of 12,800 radiocarbon years BP at Dr. Libby’s lab in California [partially imbedded in the bottom limestone strata of the river]. Dr. Willard Libby received the Nobel Prize for his discovery of the C-14 dating method and started with a scintillation counter. The article was published in the Creation Research Science Quarterly which I have am willing to copy for anyone who wishes to provide their PO address…
Continued-----
P
Philipp
Guest
continued:
DATING DINOSSAUR BONES: in 1984 an Acrocanthosaurus dinosaur was excavated three miles upstream by the same archaeologist, now rapidly becoming a paleontologist like Jack Horner of Jurassic Park fame, neither of whom have a degree in that field. This dinosaur was missing legs and head having lost both eons ago and was squished down to 17 inches as are fossilized trees in Colorado. I then asked myself and team members: “could dinosaur bones be C-14 dated?” We asked the archaeologist/paleontologist for bone fragments of this ~35 foot long juvenile dinosaur and he provided us with about five pounds and a copy of an initial C-14 report he had obtained for his discovery and away we went. We duplicated his results and then asked the lab to date both samples on the much more precise using the Accelerated Mass Spectrometer method:
TECHNICAL PAPERS AND C-14 TESTING OF DINOSAUR BONES.: Seven of us presented a technical paper at the International Creation conference in 1990 held at a rented conference hall at Duquesne University in Pittsburgh after we had C-14 dated four other dinosaurs.
In 1991 I lost my technical job due to downsizing as had my geophysics friend in 1987. During the period of 1991 to 2000 I held several jobs for medical insurance reasons but in 2000 I took a part time position in a RC dating lab that used an outdated scintillation counter.
C-14 TESTING OF LINEN: I mainly purified samples for C-14 testing amongst which was a heating experiment to see if heated linen would give a futuristic C-14 date. The purpose was to simulate the heating of the Shroud of Turin in the fire of 1532 AD. The scintillation counter for heated linen gave the expected “modern data” for modern, unheated linen and a “futuristic” C-14 data for modern, “heated” linen; the latter absorbed more C-14 during heating.
This demonstrated that the Shroud of Turin dates by three major licensed labs were too recent thereby discrediting their claims that the Shroud was a fake from the 13th or 14th century. They had claimed that the C-14 date they obtained was “absolute” in spite of a vast amount of other evidences to the contrary discovered by many reputable scientists historian.net/shroud.htm. All other data pointed to an age of about 2000 years BP. Another researcher discovered later that someone had used material from the edge of the linen which had been sewn on to the Shroud during repair periods of past centuries —bad sampling technique to be sure.
EXCAVATIONS SINCE 2003: I returned five times to participate in public excavations along that river as the same Paleo guy and his team of 50 or so volunteers again found human-like footprints in 2003 and 2004 but ONLY dinosaur footprint impressions in 2005 and 2006. After a 100 year flood cancelled the 2007 planned excavation I returned in 2008 and helped with the search for footprints associated with the 11 inch Alvis Delk print of 2000 brought to the Paleo guy’s attention in the spring of 2008 [details at www.creationevidence.org ]. The impressions in this fossil rock shows a 17 inch long dinosaur footprint has stepped into the arch of a distinct 11 inch long human footprint.
Two major objectives were met during this 2008 excavation: (1) The team discovered two human like prints in 8 inches of water in the cove of a creek bed heading toward 12 inches cretaceous rock and (2) excavated Elvis Delk sized rocks that had been removed and deposited in the soil of the creek bank indicating that the strata in the deep areas of this creek bed had once contained continuous rock strata that is now missing.
A spring fed into the “cove” and sandbagging was of no avail but measurements of the better of the two “right” human-like footprints showed it to be of the exact same dimensions and aspect ratio of the modern human foot and the Delk print. The left one could not be seen in the murky creek water or was missing and the other “right” one was a slide-in.
C-14 DATING 1994 TO 2008: During the above period from 1994 on I participated in C-14 dating of purified organics from an Hadrosaur bone bed along the Colville River on the Northern slopes of Alaska, un-fossilized wood from above the Arctic and fossilized wood from Colorado petrified logs. All the above data are in peer reviewed published technical papers and another is awaiting publication. The latter contains much new C-14 data which can’t be discussed until peer reviewed and accepted for publication. CONCLUSION: It’s a young earth afterall.
DATING DINOSSAUR BONES: in 1984 an Acrocanthosaurus dinosaur was excavated three miles upstream by the same archaeologist, now rapidly becoming a paleontologist like Jack Horner of Jurassic Park fame, neither of whom have a degree in that field. This dinosaur was missing legs and head having lost both eons ago and was squished down to 17 inches as are fossilized trees in Colorado. I then asked myself and team members: “could dinosaur bones be C-14 dated?” We asked the archaeologist/paleontologist for bone fragments of this ~35 foot long juvenile dinosaur and he provided us with about five pounds and a copy of an initial C-14 report he had obtained for his discovery and away we went. We duplicated his results and then asked the lab to date both samples on the much more precise using the Accelerated Mass Spectrometer method:
TECHNICAL PAPERS AND C-14 TESTING OF DINOSAUR BONES.: Seven of us presented a technical paper at the International Creation conference in 1990 held at a rented conference hall at Duquesne University in Pittsburgh after we had C-14 dated four other dinosaurs.
In 1991 I lost my technical job due to downsizing as had my geophysics friend in 1987. During the period of 1991 to 2000 I held several jobs for medical insurance reasons but in 2000 I took a part time position in a RC dating lab that used an outdated scintillation counter.
C-14 TESTING OF LINEN: I mainly purified samples for C-14 testing amongst which was a heating experiment to see if heated linen would give a futuristic C-14 date. The purpose was to simulate the heating of the Shroud of Turin in the fire of 1532 AD. The scintillation counter for heated linen gave the expected “modern data” for modern, unheated linen and a “futuristic” C-14 data for modern, “heated” linen; the latter absorbed more C-14 during heating.
This demonstrated that the Shroud of Turin dates by three major licensed labs were too recent thereby discrediting their claims that the Shroud was a fake from the 13th or 14th century. They had claimed that the C-14 date they obtained was “absolute” in spite of a vast amount of other evidences to the contrary discovered by many reputable scientists historian.net/shroud.htm. All other data pointed to an age of about 2000 years BP. Another researcher discovered later that someone had used material from the edge of the linen which had been sewn on to the Shroud during repair periods of past centuries —bad sampling technique to be sure.
EXCAVATIONS SINCE 2003: I returned five times to participate in public excavations along that river as the same Paleo guy and his team of 50 or so volunteers again found human-like footprints in 2003 and 2004 but ONLY dinosaur footprint impressions in 2005 and 2006. After a 100 year flood cancelled the 2007 planned excavation I returned in 2008 and helped with the search for footprints associated with the 11 inch Alvis Delk print of 2000 brought to the Paleo guy’s attention in the spring of 2008 [details at www.creationevidence.org ]. The impressions in this fossil rock shows a 17 inch long dinosaur footprint has stepped into the arch of a distinct 11 inch long human footprint.
Two major objectives were met during this 2008 excavation: (1) The team discovered two human like prints in 8 inches of water in the cove of a creek bed heading toward 12 inches cretaceous rock and (2) excavated Elvis Delk sized rocks that had been removed and deposited in the soil of the creek bank indicating that the strata in the deep areas of this creek bed had once contained continuous rock strata that is now missing.
A spring fed into the “cove” and sandbagging was of no avail but measurements of the better of the two “right” human-like footprints showed it to be of the exact same dimensions and aspect ratio of the modern human foot and the Delk print. The left one could not be seen in the murky creek water or was missing and the other “right” one was a slide-in.
C-14 DATING 1994 TO 2008: During the above period from 1994 on I participated in C-14 dating of purified organics from an Hadrosaur bone bed along the Colville River on the Northern slopes of Alaska, un-fossilized wood from above the Arctic and fossilized wood from Colorado petrified logs. All the above data are in peer reviewed published technical papers and another is awaiting publication. The latter contains much new C-14 data which can’t be discussed until peer reviewed and accepted for publication. CONCLUSION: It’s a young earth afterall.
- Status