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Elf01
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I appreciate you having suggestion seven if I don’t agree with all of them (mainly 4). I think too many criticize without offering suggestions on how to move forward.
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Tis_Bearself
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There are a lot of women sex abusers out there too. Just sayin’.
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SeriousQuestion
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Married people and fornicators also are abusers.
And number 5 doesn’t actually solve anything.
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Tis_Bearself
Patron
That’s for sure. Jerry Sandusky was married for decades and abused a whole bunch of kids, allegedly including one of his own kids.
There have been plenty of married non-Catholic clergy who committed sexual abuse too. The “Peeping Rabbi” Barry Freundel was married. This guy, Smitherman, was married. There are tons more.
Former children's minister guilty of sex abuse of girl
Gary L. Smitherman, 59, was convicted in Chilton County of one count of sexual abuse of a child under the age of 12. According to testimony in the three-day trial, Smitherman was a children's and youth minister at Friendship Baptist Church.
www.al.com
I think we have already made the point on here, MULTIPLE TIMES, that sex abuse is not about some guy wanting to have sex because he has a sex drive. It’s a power trip and those who commit it are married, unmarried, divorced, gay, straight, everything under the sun.
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Calliope
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I think the church distorted something by telling the people in the pews they would go to hell for doing the things that it allowed the sick members of clergy to continue doing. It didn’t step in and remove the offenders, but rather protected them and allowed them to continue to pollute those baptismal fountains.
Christ called out Judas and Peter. He didn’t protect them. He named their sin right out in front of everyone. I think that it would have been better for everyone had the Church done the same. The sense of betrayal would be far less if it was merely a case of some bad apples, but the hierarchy decided to allow those apples to rot among the others spreading untold damage.
It’s not the original unfortunate sins, it’s the fact that it was hidden protected and allowed to spread and continue, and then others were paid off in an attempt to further keep it secret. That is harder to shrug and ignore. Had Christ told folks it was ok to keep on sinning as long as no one found out, I think people would be right to question whether or not he was doing the work of his father, but instead he called sinners out and told them to sin no more.
The Church lost credibility by protecting CRIMINALS
Christ called out Judas and Peter. He didn’t protect them. He named their sin right out in front of everyone. I think that it would have been better for everyone had the Church done the same. The sense of betrayal would be far less if it was merely a case of some bad apples, but the hierarchy decided to allow those apples to rot among the others spreading untold damage.
It’s not the original unfortunate sins, it’s the fact that it was hidden protected and allowed to spread and continue, and then others were paid off in an attempt to further keep it secret. That is harder to shrug and ignore. Had Christ told folks it was ok to keep on sinning as long as no one found out, I think people would be right to question whether or not he was doing the work of his father, but instead he called sinners out and told them to sin no more.
The Church lost credibility by protecting CRIMINALS
Tis_Bearself
Patron
Cases being “settled”, which is what you are referring to, is a normal part of the US civil legal system. The courts encourage such settlements because if every case went publicly to court, the courts would not be able to handle the workload and would have to shut down very quickly.
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Calliope
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It is my understanding that the Catholic Church teaches that anyone who is saved, is saved via the grace that comes through the Church. Even if you don’t realize it and never officially join the Church, it is the vehicle through which the saving grace is funneled.
Or has something changed since I was taught that?
Perhaps you personally would never say that the Church has a monopoly on God, but the Church itself has essentially said exactly that. Look no further than the teaching concerning the Real Presence. I’m not making accusations, just repeating what I was taught. You have the real Jesus and no one else does or can partake.
Or has something changed since I was taught that?
Perhaps you personally would never say that the Church has a monopoly on God, but the Church itself has essentially said exactly that. Look no further than the teaching concerning the Real Presence. I’m not making accusations, just repeating what I was taught. You have the real Jesus and no one else does or can partake.
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Calliope
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settling publicly as opposed to paying someone off to stay quiet are rather different things.
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SeriousQuestion
Guest
That doesn’t sound that bad.
Tis_Bearself
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Settlements are almost never made publicly. The only time they would be is if a public civil legal action was already going on and the two parties came before the judge and said, “We settled the case, Your Honor, here is a motion to dismiss” so the judge can then dismiss the suit. The details of settlements are not disclosed. There are legal reasons for this, and settlements are also not considered an admission of guilt (if they were, then defendants would be less likely to settle).
Your posts reflect the impression that non-lawyers get about these cases based on the media trying to make normal legal strategy look all shady. I understand why it looks that way to non-lawyers (and that stuff like this is one reason people don’t like lawyers) but contacting plaintiffs or potential plaintiffs and proposing settlements privately is not considered a bad thing from a legal standpoint.
Your posts reflect the impression that non-lawyers get about these cases based on the media trying to make normal legal strategy look all shady. I understand why it looks that way to non-lawyers (and that stuff like this is one reason people don’t like lawyers) but contacting plaintiffs or potential plaintiffs and proposing settlements privately is not considered a bad thing from a legal standpoint.
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Calliope
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To be honest, I’m not looking at this as purely from a legal standpoint, as I feel there is more to it than legality. But if we want to set all spiritual issues aside, sure, it was handled very skillfully!
Rather like Judas and his thirty pieces of silver, not bad wages for one little kiss?
I can’t see any good reasons to allow people with seriously disordered and criminal behavior to be allowed to continue in the positions they were in or to be promoted, even if it’s legal, but that’s just me. I’m sure the Church had her reasons.
Rather like Judas and his thirty pieces of silver, not bad wages for one little kiss?
I can’t see any good reasons to allow people with seriously disordered and criminal behavior to be allowed to continue in the positions they were in or to be promoted, even if it’s legal, but that’s just me. I’m sure the Church had her reasons.
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Calliope
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I’m not sure what you are referring to.
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Calliope
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It’s refreshing to see a photo of one of these perverts that’s a mug shot. Very appropriate
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Calliope
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Yes, God may well be there for everybody, but the Church does teach that people are only saved through the Church herself and it does literally keep Jesus locked up in a Tabernacle (or an adoration chapel with a key code on the door).
I’m not knocking the teachings, just acknowledging them. If another faith made those kinds of statements and said they had God’s body locked up in their building, you might get the feeling that they had a monopoly on God, or maybe not. But there it is
I’m not knocking the teachings, just acknowledging them. If another faith made those kinds of statements and said they had God’s body locked up in their building, you might get the feeling that they had a monopoly on God, or maybe not. But there it is
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SeriousQuestion
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I haven’t seen no key code, but people are allowed to go to adoration. I wouldn’t want to let something as precious as the Eucharist getting mistreated by putting It out in the open. The negative context you are giving is very misleading.
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Calliope
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You are inferring negative context. I only posted facts as I was taught them.
You can’t be saved except through the Church. They have the actual body of Christ and keep it behind lock and key and no one else is allowed to have it. Those are the literal teachings of the Church. No reason to attach any context or be ashamed of them.
Our local churches only allow access to the adoration chapels after you register at the office. They take a photocopy of your driver’s license and then give you the key code to punch in. Things may be different in your area, but that’s how it’s handled here.
I understand why it’s done and I’m not knocking it. No offense was intended.
You can’t be saved except through the Church. They have the actual body of Christ and keep it behind lock and key and no one else is allowed to have it. Those are the literal teachings of the Church. No reason to attach any context or be ashamed of them.
Our local churches only allow access to the adoration chapels after you register at the office. They take a photocopy of your driver’s license and then give you the key code to punch in. Things may be different in your area, but that’s how it’s handled here.
I understand why it’s done and I’m not knocking it. No offense was intended.
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FiveLinden
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The Australian Royal Commission revealed a tiny percentage of women offenders.
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Elf01
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If you did you would not have accused of of keeping him under lock and key.
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Calliope
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Every Tabernacle that I know of has a lock. The priest uses a key to open it. I used the term because it’s the literal truth. I was not speaking figuratively.
www.catholic.com
What is a Tabernacle?
The tabernacle is one of the most important elements of Catholic Church architecture. Click here to see what the tabernacle is and why it is important.
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Elf01
Guest
Somebody who truly understood the reasons behind it would not make that accusation imo.
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