Stubenville course, crime, homosexual deviant

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Dale_M said:
Yes, but does it use the term “deviant?” Isn’t the DSM more value-free in its approach?

Could you give an example? I ask because what I recall from my intro to sociology class 30 years ago is that the idea of “deviant behavior” was no longer acceptable in academics because it was a normative concept.
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Here are your examples. WARNING - some material is a bit graphic and/or disturbing.

psycnet.apa.org/psycinfo/1991-04771-001

jiv.sagepub.com/content/16/3/234.short

Peace,
Ed
 
Regular_Atheist said:
I’m suprised that you guys are acting shocked by this news, as if it’s amazing that people were offended about being called sexual deviants. But, I guess if it’s a Christian school then they should be able to teach all kinds of stuff. I’m sure they teach Creationism, too. That offends me, but I’m not going to complain. 🤷
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Is claiming offense the standard now?
 
I think the NPR excerpt is hilarious. My oh my. And people still listen to that garbage?
 
ringil said:
I am a member of my neighborhood watch. Listing that would have about as much relevance I suppose. I think it’s pompous and I am sure that many would take the same opinion. It’s just an opinion.
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Ring,

I suggest you place below your hammer thing that you are a member of your neighborhood watch and if anyone asks you about this in the future you can explain.
 
Dale_M said:
I am not sure about that. Who is “society?” Who decides what is “normal?” I think in a pluralistic nation, such as the US, there is a great number of cultures and sub-cultures which are not in the majority. Is the behavior in those cultural groups deviant?

I agree that a social worker needs to be prepared to work with wide range of clients. But classifying those clients as “deviant” seems a fundamental error which will color both the interpersonal relationship and also the perceptions of the social worker.
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The American Psychiatric Association does. Pluralistic sex? I don’t think so.

Peace,
Ed
 
Joe_5859 said:
Obviously, it wouldn’t do for a social worker to go around pointing fingers at people and calling them “deviants.” But this is a college course in an academic setting. I’m sure that the Franciscan University social work program emphasizes that all people are to be treated with charity and compassion.

In my college psychology courses, the word “deviant” was used to describe behavior that was outside the norm. 🤷

I understand that the term has some pretty negative connotations from a popular perspective. But I’m trying to think of what else they could call the class. “Non-Normal Behavior”? “Behavior that is not in keeping with the Judeo-Christian Perspective”? “Behavior Engaged in by a Minority of Persons that is Destructive to Society”?
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Hi Joe,

The American Psychiatric Association has failed scholars, teachers and students by changing definitions. This should be considered criminal.

From the DSM-5 draft:

“The ‘Rationale’ page of any paraphilia in the electronic DSM-5 draft continues: “This approach leaves intact the distinction between normative and non-normative sexual behavior, which could be important to researchers, but without automatically labeling non-normative sexual behavior as psychopathological. It also eliminates certain logical absurdities in the DSM-IV-TR. In that version, for example, a man cannot be classified as a transvestite—however much he cross-dresses and however sexually exciting that is to him—unless he is unhappy about this activity or impaired by it. This change in viewpoint would be reflected in the diagnostic criteria sets by the addition of the word “Disorder” to all the paraphilias. Thus, Sexual Sadism would become Sexual Sadism Disorder; Sexual Masochism would become Sexual Masochism Disorder, and so on.”[15]”

So as long as you’re fine with cross-dressing and not unhappy or impaired by it, you are A-OK. Although, the words “normative” and non-normative" are still included.

Yep, makes no sense to me whatsoever.

“Billy! This is the fifth time I’ve caught you cross-dressing! I wish you’d stop.”

“But dad. I like it!”

“You mean you’re a transvestite?”

“Nope. Not according to the DSM-5 draft.”

“Uh huh…”

Peace,
Ed
 
Faithdancer said:
Absolutely. Our last two popes (and before, certainly) have been greatly concerned about moral relativism. I read posts by Catholics on these forums from time to time which seem to express a moral relativism point of view. This is at the least, lukewarm and at worst, evidence of delusion by the devil. There is absolute morality, and I see nothing wrong with the Steubenville course description. Just because they list the topics covered in the catalog or course announcement does not mean they are “linking” homosexuality with murder, etc. The thing all of the topics listed have in common is that they are immoral and contrary to natural and divine law! Good for Steubenville!

Parenthetically, I’ve heard that some employers in Southern California toss an employment application as soon as they see “Franciscan University of Steubenville” in the Education section of the app or resume. I’m kind of surprised I got hired as a youth minister, because I am open about my love for the spirituality of Opus Dei and my enrollment with a Cardinal Newman Society-approved school, both of which shout, “traditional, orthodox Catholicism.”

I would love to see more Catholic institutions and individuals take a stand against the permissiveness and moral relativism which seem to be spreading like a cancer within the Church.
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The present form took 40 years to take root. We didn’t go from Orthodox to practicing pagans overnight. The Church is not at fault, it is those who have been deceived and those who no longer want to endure sound doctrine.

And that is why you are seeing an outcry from the mostly pagan media.

Peace,
Ed
 
ringil said:
So what is the “point” or Focus of this class?

Is it a psychology class? If so then it makes no sense to combine murder, mental illness, rape, and homosexuality in the same context of “deviancy”.

Is it a moral theology class? If so then again, I don’t see how “deviancy” would fit into such a discussion as a common theme.

I suspect this is just a case of “muddy thinking”. Deviancy in this context is being presented as “stuff we don’t like” or “undesirable aspects of life”.

It’s a yearning for a golden age that never existed.
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Prove it. Prove any of your claims by citing the course literature itself.

Peace,
Ed
 
Lochias said:
Relativism at work, ladies n’ gentlemen.

Deviancy is deviancy. There’s no laden values dependent on the speaker. We, as a culture, are losing all of our objective truths. Soon there won’t be a “right” or “wrong” at all.
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The polarities of morality are shifting. There will always be a right and wrong. But in several decades if not sooner I imagine what we know is wrong will be heralded as right and what we defend as Truth and what is right for all will be deemed wrong and offensive. I mean it’s already happening.
 
ringil said:
The facets they list “murder, rape, homosexuality, mental illness” don’t have a common sociological underpinning to be grouped as “deviant”.

What is deviant? What is the thrust? What is the purpose of the class?

It seems to be a blending of medical, social, biological, and moral facets and calling them “deviant”.

What framework are they using in placing these factors into the same grouping being referred to as “deviant”?
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Call them and ask. Really.

Peace,
Ed
 
Regular_Atheist said:
I’m suprised that you guys are acting shocked by this news, as if it’s amazing that people were offended about being called sexual deviants. But, I guess if it’s a Christian school then they should be able to teach all kinds of stuff. I’m sure they teach Creationism, too. That offends me, but I’m not going to complain. 🤷
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You’ll have to back up your claim that they teach Creationism.

Peace,
Ed
 
SaintPatrick333 said:
The polarities of morality are shifting. There will always be a right and wrong. But in several decades if not sooner I imagine what we know is wrong will be heralded as right and what we defend as Truth and what is right for all will be deemed wrong and offensive. I mean it’s already happening.
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Those statements are ridiculous and meaningless. In every age, there were always those who wanted the truth. The Church has not changed her teachings - it’s only when men are deceived - the devil’s favorite weapon - that men become trapped. And the Church is always there to show them the way out.

Peace,
Ed
 
edwest2 said:
Those statements are ridiculous and meaningless. In every age, there were always those who wanted the truth. The Church has not changed her teachings - it’s only when men are deceived - the devil’s favorite weapon - that men become trapped. And the Church is always there to show them the way out.

Peace,
Ed
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Amen, Brother. I read a pamphlet recently which stated that the Church is “at war with the world.” I think in referring to the world the author was speaking of moral relativism and materialism, two great evils which I guess are particularly strong today. I totally agree with you- the Church will persevere!:signofcross:
 
Dale_M said:
Is the concept of “deviant activity” academically respectable for a social work class? The very concept of “deviancy” is heavily laden with the values of the whoever is speaking. Obviously, it makes sense from a religious or moral point of view, but the concept seems excessively judgmental for social work.
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Not really. Secular sociologists have looked into various deviant behaviors, defined as violating social norms. Suicide was a hot topic in the early days of sociology. Prostitution, drug culture, biker gangs, you name it.
 
Pope Benedict:

The Holy Father says:
Code: 
"If we cannot have common values, common truths, sufficient communication on the essentials of human life–how to live, how to respond to the great challenges of human life–then true society becomes impossible."
“We are moving toward a dictatorship of relativism which does not recognize anything as for certain and which has as its highest goal one’s own ego and one’s own desires. The church must defend itself against threats such as “radical individualism” and “vague religious mysticism”. [emphasis added]”

Peace,
Ed
 
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