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isaac.madsen
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I think we also have a different perception of what exactly a witch is than perhaps they did back when the law was written. For example, we have the Halloween concept of witches riding on broomsticks. A lot of witchcraft involved hallucinogenic compounds with effects to LSD (not to be confused with LDS). One suggestion is that the brooms were used in sex rituals (I don’t think further explanation is necessary, and if it is, you’re probably too young to be reading this anyhow). As you can see, it’s not really a stretch to imagine a religious leader condemning such activities, which might be repulsive enough for them to suggest death as a punishment.
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Lief_Erikson
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That’s very good.
I think the reason witches aren’t executed anymore is because society has become highly secular. If we kick God out of law and government, laws that are more accepting of things that oppose God and God’s Law are naturally going to be the result. Witchcraft, which involves dabbling in the powers of demons and using them to the glory of the enemy, is a terrible sin, brings darkness into people’s lives, and makes them reliant upon the Enemy in their lives. Such can only be destructive. Some people will use it to their own benefit, but wherever Satanic power is used, evil will result. Even if it’s for something that appears on the surface to be fine, like a healing.
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blacktiger057
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Well, seeing that I am in fact Wiccan and do consider myself a witch, I’ll put some common sense into this matter.
- If you are even considering that killing someone because of what they believe in is justified, then you need to really re-examine your moral values. And they say Wiccans morals structured!
- It also say in the Bible “They shall not kill”. Yes, killing witches is considered killing.
- The Bible was written by man, and this seems to me that this is a man-made idea, and a sick one at that.
- How can you accept the whole Bible if it’s telling you to go on a genocide? Even worse, would you consider following?
So what if I am Wiccan? So what if you are Christian? We should all work together to make peace, not slaughtering each other because we don’t agree with matter on faith that mostly cannot be proven anyways. What truly matters is your heart and what kind of person you are, not what you percieve God to be.
Yes the Bible is constantly contradicting…that is why I stopped following Christianity, personally. People believed every single word, even if they were two opposite ideas.
And, for all those who don’t know about Wicca:
- It is a nature-based religion.
- You must be loving and harm none.
- We incorporate magick into our religion. We work with the deities to help ourselves, while harming none, and the world. What difference is there between a priest changing bread and magick? Does this make priests witches?
- We don’t believe in a source of pure evil or good. So we don’t worship Satan. But you may wonder what that makes our God/Goddess. Well, people usually view a forest fire as a negative energy. But some trees can only release their seeds by fire, so that is what makes it good. Even death is perfect, while viewed negatively.
- We have a God and a Goddess, which are somtimes considered as two in one.
ANyway, Many Blessings!
Scott
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blacktiger057
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Just so you know, those are Satanic witches. Wiccan witches are much different. If they harm people with magick, then they are most definately not Wiccan. Just to clarify.
A witch does not make the person automatically evil. It is how they decide to use their magick is what determines that. I’m a witch, and those of you who know me will hopefully agree that I’m really against working with demons etc.
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isaac.madsen
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I’ve been curious about wicca for some time now. I’m curious about the magick used. How does it work? Can you give an example of magic at work? Also, do any wiccans believe in Christ?
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blacktiger057
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All magick basically works the same. For magick to work, you need to alter your consciousness, focus your intetion, and send the energy out.
Altering Consciousness- You don’t have to be in a deep meditative state, or even a light trance. All you need is to get into the ‘magick’ mindset and basically relax. SOme choose to do this by meditating before a ritual.
Intention- You must have a clear intention. If you are unclear in this part, then your results will be unclear and muddled.
Sending out the energy- This is the part where many cultures and practices differ. You may visualize energy gathering around you and you send it out, or you may choose to use a physical manisfestation, such as a certain type of inscence or burning herb. The physical tools that you use only help you attune more easily to the energy that you are trying to gather and send out into the universe.
You may wonder why I didn’t mention anything about the Goddess/God. Well, magick and wicca are two different things. But most of the times magick is used in wicca as a religious practice. A Wiccan witch may pray or give thanks to the Divine before, during, or after a ritual. Usually they are invited to watch over the ritual and help out. Ofcourse, if it is purely against Divine Will(the spell), then your spell may not work. But sometimes the Divine let us learn from our choices, and we must accept the consequences. Our sacrifice to the Divine may be planting a tree in our backyard, volunteering at a charity, cleaning up trash in a park. We believe that the God/Goddess are part of everything, especially nature. We do not worship nature, only have a great respect for it as every human should.
An example of magick at work are some of the miraculous healings that happen here on a daily basis. It is not always the magick of humans, but the magick of the Divine, otherwise known as miracles. I’ve also had many successful spells that have benefitted me in many ways, but I think you are looking for a more (name removed by moderator)ersonal example.
I feel magick/the Divine the most when I am out in nature. I just get this feeling that is not possible to get anywhere else. I feel almost perfect when I am in nature. This is the best magick for me.
Yes, some Wiccans do believe in Christ. They believe in God, but also the Goddess. They believe that Jesus is one of the God’s many forms and died to protect us from certain evils, but not nessescereily our sins. Ofcourse, there is mnay variations of this belief. One of the great things about WIcca is that you are free to make your own choices. I would talk more, but I gotta go to bed.
Bye for now!
God Bless!
Scott
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isaac.madsen
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Thanks for the info. It was useful and I appreciate it. I thought the God/Goddess concept was interesting. It’s a concept I was also raised believing in with Mormonism. After I discovered a few historical problems though, I decided perhaps Mormonism wasn’t the key to heaven. Perhaps a key, but not one that I’m comfortable using. Many concepts of the religion are very similar to what you’ve described, but I find it hard to follow a religion that doesn’t allow me the freedom of expressing free worship. Of course, that doesn’t mean I’m converted to Wicca or any other religion. I’m just interested in studying the workings of world religions.
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isaac.madsen
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Here’s an interesting discovery I made yesterday. Apparently my Tarot card is “The Magician.” I posted the results of a test on my blog: ikerspot.blogspot.com/
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Pete_1
Guest
The Bible does not contradict itself, it is our misunderstandings that contradict each other for ‘God is not a God of confusion but a God of peace’. I must warn you that if you are a practicing wiccan what you are doing is a sin, what you choose to do about this is up to you.
from the ten commandments:
*“am the LORD your God: you shall not have strange Gods before me.”
*“You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, and with all your soul, and with all your mind.”
**“You Shall Worship the Lord Your God and Him Only Shall You Serve”
from the catechism of the catholic church
vatican.va/archive/ENG0015/__P7E.HTM
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isaac it says you are a Christian on your profile, if you want my advice leave the witchcraft alone (Tarrot) it can only lead to evil.
From a christian perspective it is clear there is only one way to God.
John 14:6 Jesus answered, "I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me."
from the ten commandments:
*“am the LORD your God: you shall not have strange Gods before me.”
*“You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, and with all your soul, and with all your mind.”
**“You Shall Worship the Lord Your God and Him Only Shall You Serve”
from the catechism of the catholic church
vatican.va/archive/ENG0015/__P7E.HTM
**
This cleary proves that all forms of witchcraft form a Catholic perspective is wrong, please don’t take this as an attack on you i am merely stating the catholic viewpoint, what you choose to do with it is up to you.
isaac it says you are a Christian on your profile, if you want my advice leave the witchcraft alone (Tarrot) it can only lead to evil.
From a christian perspective it is clear there is only one way to God.
John 14:6 Jesus answered, "I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me."
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Bennie_P
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It doesn’t work, except to deceive the practitioner. Some Wiccans may believe in Christ, some in many Christs, but by practicing Wicca they reject many of the teachings of Christ and Judea-Christianity in general.
The law of the old testement to put to death a witch has to be put into historical context. Most of the burning of “witches” during the middle ages and after really had nothing to do with witchcraft or witches, but was either a way to rid of someone you didn’t like or, political reasons. St. Joan of Arc is good example of it for political reasons. Modern Witchfcraft is basically a made up idea of of an middle-age dude that rejected Judea-Christian morality.
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isaac.madsen
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My interest in the Tarrot card was mostly out of a joke from a friend. I never take those things too seriously, even though they’re often fairly accurate in my case. I consider myself a Christian, but I am welcoming to all religious ideas. i was raised a Mormon and I continue to go to LDS church regularly. At the same time, I disagree with a lot of LDS theology. I also disagree with loads of mainstream Christian theology. If I am in sin for being open to ideas, so be it.
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Pete_1
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Im not saying you are in sin for being open to new ideas but sorcery and the likes is clearly condemmed in christianity (as you are putting your faith in cards and not God).
As is mormonism
As is mormonism
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isaac.madsen
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How is that? It seems to me that modern witchcraft is more of a growth from ancient religious practices that existed long before Christianity. From my research, Christianity, Judaism, and Wicca all have the same roots. They just took different directions in the same way that Mormonism is ultimately a faith that branched off from Catholicism.
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Pete_1
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The most important thing about Christianity is to love God, how can we do this if we put our faith in witchcraft and not Gods providence?
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isaac.madsen
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Putting my faith in cards? No. I was just interested in what they would say and how accurate it would be.
However, as far as tarrot goes, I’m sure that any tarot reader would tell you their cards are merely a form of faith in God the same way Christian sacraments are.
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Pete_1
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2116 All forms of divination are to be rejected: recourse to Satan or demons, conjuring up the dead or other practices falsely supposed to “unveil” the future.48 Consulting **horoscopes, astrology, palm reading, interpretation of omens and lots, the phenomena of clairvoyance, and recourse to mediums all conceal a desire for power over time, history, and, in the last analysis, other human beings, as well as a wish to conciliate hidden powers. They contradict the honor, respect, and loving fear that we owe to God alone.
****2117 All practices of magic or sorcery, by which one attempts to tame occult powers, so as to place them at one’s service and have a supernatural power over others - even if this were for the sake of restoring their health - are gravely contrary to the virtue of religion.
**I am not expert on the matter, but it is clear from a christian point of view that sorcery is not compatible with God. No one can force God to reveal the future to them through sorcery. Tarrot is merely people attempting to tame occult powers which are contrary to God.
I’ll do some research to find the official reason the one above is just my own opinion. I just want to keep you away from it as it is something that is strictly forbidden by the church and as a Christian it is my duty to warn you of it.
****2117 All practices of magic or sorcery, by which one attempts to tame occult powers, so as to place them at one’s service and have a supernatural power over others - even if this were for the sake of restoring their health - are gravely contrary to the virtue of religion.
**I am not expert on the matter, but it is clear from a christian point of view that sorcery is not compatible with God. No one can force God to reveal the future to them through sorcery. Tarrot is merely people attempting to tame occult powers which are contrary to God.
I’ll do some research to find the official reason the one above is just my own opinion. I just want to keep you away from it as it is something that is strictly forbidden by the church and as a Christian it is my duty to warn you of it.
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Bennie_P
Guest
Well, IMHO, Mormonism may have more in common to Wicca then Christianity. Both Gardener, the father of Wicca and Joseph Smith were at one time Freemasons.
And both made up their own religions, rejected the Catholic Church, both believed in pologamy. But Smith embraced patriarchy, (too the extreme), and Gardner ejected it.
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isaac.madsen
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Astrology? Wasn’t it eastern wise men (aka: astrologisits) who recognized the star as a sign of Christ’s birth?
Interpretation of omens? Isn’t that the same of recognizing signs in the bible of catastrophic times to come?
Clairvoyance and mediums? Isn’t that just another way to refer to revelation?
It seems to me that religions merely use different terms for the same things, and often the condemning of something strange is merely out of misunderstanding what is meant.
Agreed. Trying to control others is probably not honest or kind, and is thus probably contrary to God’s good nature. However, with research I think you will find that Wicca is not a means of controlling others. I think it’s important to note that in cases in both Mormonism and Catholicism, there are rites and blessings, casting out of demons, and so on. How is that different from the Wiccan arts?
I will admit that you are correct in your assessment. My argument is not that Christianity forbids sorcery and witchcraft. Rather, I think that what Christian faiths ignore are the strong similarities between different religions.
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isaac.madsen
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Oh, sure. This is probably true. I’ve done a great deal of research on Joseph Smith, Jr. and I can say that my research seems to indicate that he was a dabbler in early American magick, which is likely what first estranged him from the locals - thus being the reason they mocked him for his visions and such.Well, IMHO, Mormonism may have more in common to Wicca then Christianity. Both Gardener [sic], the father of Wicca and Joseph Smith were at one time Freemasons.
I can’t say that Gardner and Smith were right and honorable in their practices, but at the same time, I see little reason to repudiate their beliefs. After all, they grew up in early American where there was a lot of this sort of thing going on. I’m sure that many of us on this board would have been caught up in those sorts of activities had we grown up in those times and circumstances. Many are even today, and I can’t say that I see anything wrong with it (except the practice of polygamy which is ultimately the biggest reason for my rejection of much of Mormonism).
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