Supreme Court Ruling on Health Care

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Dawnia said:
We have quite a few of the limited service clinics here. I love them! There are no appointments, little waiting and the docs do only what you ask of them.
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Yep. However, when they’re not too busy they will do much more (and not charge you anything) in the way of prevention and counseling and thoroughness – the kind of Cadillac service you used to get from your primary care physician when he/she didn’t have to spend so much time as a bureaucrat & accountant.
Dawnia said:
I used them almost exclusively when I had employer provided insurance because they were much cheaper than going to the regular doc and I had to pay all of my medical expenses out of my own pocket anyway. (Never met the $2000 deductible).
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Precisely. Just like millions of other Americans who are also not an economic liability on the medical system but who do need and should have recourse to hospital coverage, which currently most people cannot get because it is not offered without prohibitively high standard insurance. ($600/month for the stingiest coverage ever.)
Dawnia said:
My entire visit, including medication, cost less than a single office call at the regular docs office.
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Precisely. And no one else paid for you or did without so that you could be treated. What a concept.
 
PaulinVA said:
If the government wants to federalize the healthcare system, they should do things to actually treat people. They should expand the programs to pay off doctor’s student loan debt if they would dedicate 5 or ten years to practicing as a primary care doc in an underserved place.
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From a thread called “Fix America’s Health Care,” which no one wants to contribute to (most people just want to complain – not you, Paul! 🙂 ) – I posted this several days ago, It’s a portion of a longer post.
Elizabeth502 said:
I also think that the gov’t does have a role to play in incentivizing doctors. For example — just as it has done with forgiveness of portions of loans for teacher education – it could do that forgiving for physicians who begin or shift their practice to primary care in high-need locations, and in particular to the more efficient community clinics which do (not “will”) reduce costs. That helps to alleviate pressure on doctors to work in only in lucrative fields so that they can repay their high med school debt.
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Elizabeth502 said:
From a thread called “Fix America’s Health Care,” which no one wants to contribute to (most people just want to complain – not you, Paul! 🙂 ) – I posted this several days ago, It’s a portion of a longer post.
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States have done this for decades, as have the Feds in the IHS service.

hhloans.com/index.cfm?ObjectID=A85AA8AA-0CD1-EDD4-D9379C7C084059FB

ihs.gov/

If you want to see what government healthcare is like, ask someone who participates in the Indian Health Service.

Where else can you have health care delivered with the speed of the DMV, the customer service of the IRS and with the simple rules of a government construction permit office?
 
scipio337 said:
States have done this for decades, as have the Feds in the IHS service.

hhloans.com/index.cfm?ObjectID=A85AA8AA-0CD1-EDD4-D9379C7C084059FB

ihs.gov/

If you want to see what government healthcare is like, ask someone who participates in the Indian Health Service.

Where else can you have health care delivered with the speed of the DMV, the customer service of the IRS and with the simple rules of a government construction permit office?
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In Free Market Healthcare:
The secretaries are English,
the nurses are French,
the doctors are German,
the Italians are the dieticians,
and it is all organized by the Swiss.

In government run healthcare:
Code: 
  The English are the dieticians, 
  the Italians are the secretaries, 
  the nurses are German, 
  the Swiss are the doctors, 
  and it is all organized by the French.
 
Supreme Court Obamacare Decision Left Abortion Funding Intact
In a surprise ruling, the Supreme Court upheld Obamacare
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, maintaining the “individual mandate” as constitutional, not under the commerce clause, but under the taxing clause.

The only part of Obamacare the Court limited was the law’s requirements on state Medicaid programs to expand or face a loss of all Medicaid funding.

So, here are the several pro-life and religious freedom problems that now stand with the Court’s blessing, and other items of concern (section references are to PPACA, P.L. 111-148):

I. The abortion subsidies and funding scheme stand (see chart of Obamacare abortion scheme for more detail)
  1. Federal subsidies for health plans that include elective abortion in state exchanges will continue. (Section 1303)
  2. The abortion fee will require every person in a plan that has abortion coverage will pay at least $12 per year even if they do not want abortion services. (Section 1303)
  3. Allowing direct funding of abortion through direct spending in community health clinics (Section 10503), and high risk pools (Section 1101).
  4. Subsidies for the government run “multi-state” plans remains even if they include elective abortion (Section 1334).
  5. There are No conscience protections against government discrimination against businesses, providers, or health insurers who refuse abortion. The limited conscience protection is from insurers against providers, but the government can discriminate against anyone who refuses to offer or refer for abortion if they chose (Section 1303)
II. Religious Freedom infringement through HHS contraception/abortifacient mandate, which narrowly restricts religious liberties to churches (Section 1001). Penalties for failure to comply could be $100 per day per employee for the employer (and insurer) who fails to offer “preventive care services”, including contraceptives, abortifacients and sterilizations free to the patient.

III. The Independent Payment Advisory Board (IPAB) remains in effect, an entity that will reduce Medicare costs through rationing health care (Section 3403).

IV. OTHER ISSUES:
  1. The “individual mandate” continues as a tax on people who do not buy health insurance, whether from an employer or in the individual market (Section 1501).
  2. The mandate remains on mid-size and large employers to offer “minimum essential coverage” — which means plans that can’t exceed 9.6% of salary, and plans cover 60% of total health care costs (they don’t have to cover all the essential benefits). If employers don’t offer these, they face penalties (Section 1511).
  3. States are required to establish exchanges or, if they chose not to, the Federal government will establish and run them in the state (Section 1311)
lifenews.com/2012/07/05/supreme-court-obamacare-decision-left-abortion-funding-intact
 
Dawnia said:
I don’t get why there is a cap on medical spending accounts.
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Because they want uniformity and low deductibles for everyone, even those who could pay high deductibles. That way, when they give away “no deductibles” and expand coverages politically, nobody escapes paying for them. Self-pay goes hand in hand with high deductibles. They don’t want that.
 
Dawnia said:
We have quite a few of the limited service clinics here. I love them! There are no appointments, little waiting and the docs do only what you ask of them. I used them almost exclusively when I had employer provided insurance because they were much cheaper than going to the regular doc and I had to pay all of my medical expenses out of my own pocket anyway. (Never met the $2000 deductible). They are also used to working for people who don’t have insurance so they didn’t prescribe the newest most expensive drugs available. They prescribed the cheapest drug that would do the trick.

My entire visit, including medication, cost less than a single office call at the regular docs office.
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Those clinics are very convenient and they do work well, but what happens when the outpatient care you need falls outside of the ‘limited services’ they offer? Say for example, you’ve been diabetic from childhood, have a genetic blood disorder or need high risk pregnancy care?
 
Ridgerunner said:
Because they want uniformity and low deductibles for everyone, even those who could pay high deductibles. That way, when they give away “no deductibles” and expand coverages politically, nobody escapes paying for them. Self-pay goes hand in hand with high deductibles. They don’t want that.
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Actually it’s to control medical treatment. If all treatments have flow through the “government plan” and be approved they can make sure everyone “enjoys” the same level of care be it good, bad or nonexistent.

Oh, and to raise more money for the government.

Don’t kid yourself. Until the passage of President Obama’s health care tax, Congress was the only entity allowed to change what Medicare paid physicians and other health care providers for treating Medicare patients. Under Obamatax that power will be handed off to a group of unaccountable political appointees. The Independent Payment Advisory Board (IPAB) created under Obama’s law consists of a 15-member committee designed to ration health care by lowering Medicare reimbursement rates and determine “needed” treatments (remember the guidelines for fewer recommend mammograms).
 
seekerz said:
Those clinics are very convenient and they do work well, but what happens when the outpatient care you need falls outside of the ‘limited services’ they offer? Say for example, you’ve been diabetic from childhood, have a genetic blood disorder or need high risk pregnancy care?
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You go to the emergancy room.
 
Ridgerunner said:
Because they want uniformity and low deductibles for everyone, even those who could pay high deductibles. That way, when they give away “no deductibles” and expand coverages politically, nobody escapes paying for them. Self-pay goes hand in hand with high deductibles. They don’t want that.
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This is very, very confusing. :confused:
 
qui_est_ce said:
This is very, very confusing. :confused:
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All you need to remember is
  • The government helped cause the massive inflation of the automobile with CAFE standards and regulations.
  • The government helped cause the massive inflation of higher education through FAFSA and grants.
  • The government helped cause the massive inflation of energy prices through regulations and the EPA.
  • The government helped cause the massive inflation of gasoline and diesel prices through regulations, EPA fuel blend standards, refusal to build pipelines, and petrol and diesel taxes.
  • The government helped cause the massive inflation of lightbulbs through banning the sale of incandescent light bulbs.
  • The government helped cause the massive inflation housing prices (which lead to massive housing declines when the bubble burst) through CRA, Fannie Mae, Freddie Mac, FHA and other various agencies giving mortgages to people who didnt need it and made it profitable for banks.
  • The government helped cause the massive inflation of food through Farm Payments, Food subsidies, Ethanol subsidies, Price floors, Federal Reserve.
  • The government helped cause the massive inflation of everything through regulation, taxation and massive devaluation of the US dollar.
…But it’s okay, because the government is going to take over Healthcare and it will be good and affordable because government has been so good about everything else. :dancing::whistle:
 
The most common lie,“I am from the government and I am here to help.”:mad:
 
austenbosten said:
All you need to remember is
  • The government helped cause the massive inflation of the automobile with CAFE standards and regulations.
  • The government helped cause the massive inflation of higher education through FAFSA and grants.
  • The government helped cause the massive inflation of energy prices through regulations and the EPA.
  • The government helped cause the massive inflation of gasoline and diesel prices through regulations, EPA fuel blend standards, refusal to build pipelines, and petrol and diesel taxes.
  • The government helped cause the massive inflation of lightbulbs through banning the sale of incandescent light bulbs.
  • The government helped cause the massive inflation housing prices (which lead to massive housing declines when the bubble burst) through CRA, Fannie Mae, Freddie Mac, FHA and other various agencies giving mortgages to people who didnt need it and made it profitable for banks.
  • The government helped cause the massive inflation of food through Farm Payments, Food subsidies, Ethanol subsidies, Price floors, Federal Reserve.
  • The government helped cause the massive inflation of everything through regulation, taxation and massive devaluation of the US dollar.
…But it’s okay, because the government is going to take over Healthcare and it will be good and affordable because government has been so good about everything else. :dancing::whistle:
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Thanks, I understand and agree with that. It’s the health care law I find confusing.
 
stevegravy said:
The most common lie,“I am from the government and I am here to help.”:mad:
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That’s a Ronald Reagan quote that goes thus:

"The nine scariest words in the English language are, ‘I’m from the government and I’m here to help.’ "

Give the man credit when it is due.
 
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