Survey reveals why Catholics leave Church, including because of watered down teaching

[De_Maria]

I think they leave because they feel they have been lied to. At least that is what the ones I know say.

That’s true. But that leads back to not understanding the Catholic Faith. For example, the ones’ I’ve spoken to will say, “The word “pope” is not even in the New Testament, therefore the Catholic Church lied about the Pope.”

Do you have a different example of something which they claim the Catholic Church lied about?

 

[QwertyGirl]

Do you have a different example of something which they claim the Catholic Church lied about?

I think it is more general. The Catholic Church is big on claiming it is the one “Truth”. Rather than claiming it just doesn’t know on some issues, it has an answer for everything. Often times, the answers are based on opinions and ideas of men. Of course the Church says the information comes from the Holy Spirit, and that is fine as a belief. But there is no fact there. The ones I know who left did so because they were taught all the teachings of the Church, as young kids, as if it was all fact based. It isn’t, and as they grew into adults with critical thinking skills they realized that. It was presented to them as fact, when instead they were ideas borne of faith and other things. They were sold a bill of goods when they were at their most vulnerable, by people they trusted. Then, as adults, they realized the information wasn’t factually relevant to their lives.

 

[jeannetherese]

This seems like a failure of catechesis. It would be wonderful to see arguments for relevance, and examples, tied to catechetical teachings.

 

[Convert3]

“The word “pope” is not even in the New Testament, therefore the Catholic Church lied about the Pope.”

Have them show you where the word “bible” is.

 

[De_Maria]

De_Maria:

Do you have a different example of something which they claim the Catholic Church lied about?

I think it is more general. The Catholic Church is big on claiming it is the one “Truth”.

No. The Catholic Church Teaches that Jesus Christ is the Truth. And that She is the infallible Teacher of the Word of God. So, if that is their claim, then they don’t understand Catholic Teaching.

Rather than claiming it just doesn’t know on some issues, it has an answer for everything.

Lol! That’s funny. Because Protestants also come after the Church for Teaching the existence of mysteries, which no one can understand. So, again, if that is their claim, they don’t understand Catholic Teaching.

Often times, the answers are based on opinions and ideas of men.

And that’s wrong, why?

Of course the Church says the information comes from the Holy Spirit, and that is fine as a belief. But there is no fact there.

So, you’re opposed to answers coming from men and answers from the Holy Spirit. So, what’s left?

The ones I know who left did so because they were taught all the teachings of the Church, as young kids, as if it was all fact based.

Which it is. There are more facts in support of the Catholic Religion than any other religion in the world.

It isn’t, and as they grew into adults with critical thinking skills they realized that.

On the contrary, it is my experience that they simply took the word of some person who decided they didn’t like the Catholic answer.

It was presented to them as fact, when instead they were ideas borne of faith and other things. They were sold a bill of goods when they were at their most vulnerable, by people they trusted. Then, as adults, they realized the information wasn’t factually relevant to their lives.

As I see it, they were presented the truth and they didn’t like it. Rather than accept the truth, they moved to an easier religion, a Catholic lite, where they could do what they want and declare themselves saved.

So, we have different experiences with people who have left the Catholic Church. I can tell, however, that you don’t understand Catholic Teaching very well, either. So, you have listened to their complaints and accepted their errors as facts.

Whereas, I do understand Catholic Teaching and I can support Catholic Teaching from Tradition and Scripture. So, when you are ready to accept the word of men who are guided by the Spirit, we can discuss that.

 

[De_Maria]

The people whom I have met who left the Church did it because:

They never knew Christ, they had not been exposed to a real relationship with Christ and His Church.

I’m not really sure what that means. I’ve met many Catholics who were fervent, both before I left the Church and after I returned. Before I left the Church, I didn’t have time for them. Now, I seek them out.

They were never encouraged nor taught about prayer besides memorizing the Rosary mysteries for the Confirmation test.

This is not true, in my case. I was encouraged. But, I DIDN’T WANT TO. I abhorred the subject of religion. I had more important things to do, so I thought.

They fell in love with someone who was not free to marry in the Church.

That may be a large part of why I returned. I met a faithful Catholic. Not why I fell away.

They were introduced to people who showed hospitality and kindness and real fervor for Jesus and those people were not Catholic

Actually, when I fell away, I saw all Christians as oppressive. But Protestants more so. They were the ones’ who couldn’t stand an opposite opinion. They wanted to force their religion upon you.

Of course, my situation is probably unique. However, I know that it wasn’t much different from those I was raised with. And when people claim that the Church wasn’t teaching, my first response is, “I didn’t know they had suspended Catechism or RCIA.”

Those people who claim the Catholic Church wasn’t teaching, simply weren’t listening.

 

[QwertyGirl]

Whereas, I do understand Catholic Teaching and I can support Catholic Teaching from Tradition and Scripture. So, when you are ready to accept the word of men who are guided by the Spirit, we can discuss that.

All I can tell you is that if the Church and the people in it ever decide to teach by preceding statements with “The Catholic Church believes…”, or (for individuals) “As a Catholic, I believe…” The risk that the people being taught will walk away feeling they were treated in a way that was intellectually dishonest will greatly be diminished.

Many of your statements are hairsplitting, to those who were were mislead.

You can believe in a Holy Spirit, certainly, and all that entails. Just don’t present it to kids (or anyone, for that matter) as the “Truth”. Because that is what was done, and that is what continues to be done. It may be your truth, but that doesn’t make it everyone’s truth. Which kind of makes it not the truth at all.

Muting this thread, now.

 

[Crocus]

Whereas, I do understand Catholic Teaching and I can support Catholic Teaching from Tradition and Scripture.

That is of no use to an atheist unfortunately, or anyone who cannot accept the testimony of witnesses to the resurrection. I know people with the exact complaint expressed by QG. They would have had to be there, right behind Thomas to put a hand inside the wounds.

I wonder why I accepted the testimony through my parents and grandparents, and others looking at the same sources, doubted.

 

[TMC]

Wouldn’t it be more accurate to say that Catholics sometimes leave the Church because they disagree with the Church’s teaching? The term “watered down” is meaningless. It is just code for “teachings I disagree with.”

 

[De_Maria]

De_Maria:

Whereas, I do understand Catholic Teaching and I can support Catholic Teaching from Tradition and Scripture.

That is of no use to an atheist unfortunately, or anyone who cannot accept the testimony of witnesses to the resurrection. I know people with the exact complaint expressed by QG. They would have had to be there, right behind Thomas to put a hand inside the wounds.

I wonder why I accepted the testimony through my parents and grandparents, and others looking at the same sources, doubted.

That is the mystery of grace. I was one of those who did not, at first, accept the testimony of my parents and grandparents. But many years later, I came back. Yet others didn’t.

 

[De_Maria]

All I can tell you is that if the Church and the people in it ever decide to teach by preceding statements with “The Catholic Church believes…”, or (for individuals) “As a Catholic, I believe…” The risk that the people being taught will walk away feeling they were treated in a way that was intellectually dishonest will greatly be diminished.

I doubt it. Most Catholics do speak that way and people who aren’t ready to accept the truth, still walk away.

Many of your statements are hairsplitting, to those who were were mislead.

Because they want to quibble. It is an old saying which remains true, for some no proof is necessary. For others, no proof is ever enough.

You can believe in a Holy Spirit, certainly, and all that entails. Just don’t present it to kids (or anyone, for that matter) as the “Truth”. Because that is what was done, and that is what continues to be done. It may be your truth, but that doesn’t make it everyone’s truth. Which kind of makes it not the truth at all.

On the contrary, the Truth can be verified. If you don’t want to verify it, that is your problem. All we can do is present it to you.

 

[steve-b]

I should ask this: do numbers matter? No.
Jesus said to make disciples, not have as many people in your churches and meet quotas.

True

ATraveller:

It’s time to go back to what being a “disciple” means. Also, the Church’s one foundation is Jesus Christ.

True. And who did Jesus give the keys to

ATraveller:

The Church, and I say this from an Evangelical POV, doesn’t belong to us or anyone else except God Himself.

True. Yet the Church He established is the pillar and foundation of truth

ATraveller:

I don’t get to say, well, society changed, therefore I have the right to change the Church, which doesn’t belong to me, to suit popular opinion.

True

Yet that is exactly what happened in history…right? Jesus gave zero room for division from what He established on Peter and those in perfect communion with His plan. HERE.

 

[AlNg]

Not very useful, when it doesn’t even give any numbers from the survey results.

This is one of the worst summaries of a survey that I have ever read. It reveals nothing about why Catholics leave the Church. Whoever was writing this had his own bias about what’s wrong with the Church and uses that to interpret vague information. It makes it essentially impossible to glean any useful information from it.

How were these 256 respondents found?

the author acknowledges other issues (which also don’t have numbers), takes many quotes out of context (though that might be the book’s fault), and expects us to find his call to action relevant to the survey. It’s a pretty poorly written piece.

A survey of 256 people with incomplete information on the questions on the survey is not all that useful.

 

[Padres1969]

Thanks, but I’ve had that conversation on here before and would rather not get into it again