Syrian Catholicism : 2000 Years of succession from Apostle St Thomas

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mardukm said:
Among Orientals, the Syrians are popularly regarded as “the worshippers of the Cross.”
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Indeed! 👍
Denho said:
(The term Syrian Catholic or Syrian Orthodox has been frowned upon for a number of years for that very reason, it causes confusion between the nation Syria and the Soryoyo people, and the language, and the liturgy, etc…) . 😛
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I don’t know about the Syriac Catholics, but the Syriac Orthodox officially changed the name of the Church (in English) to “Syriac Orthodox Church” in 2000, specifically for that reason.
 
This list would in some case be the same for the Syro Malabar Church. We received our last bishop from the Catholicos of Seleucia in the year 1652. The sent bishop Metropolitan Mar Ahatalla reached Kerala and was captured by the Portuguese.The Portuguese kept the metropolitan in captivity on board a ship. While in persecution he got a letter out to the deacons of the St.Thomas Christians that he was captured. The letter stated "At Calamini, I have been taken prisoner by those whose profession is persecution. Soon they will make me leave for Cochin and then for Goa. Arm up some of your people to save me”.

Twenty-five thousand strong St.Thomas Christians marched to the harbor and demanded the release of their bishop. However in the cover in darkness the Portuguese rushed the metropolitan to Goa and rumored to the St.Thomas Christians that he was accidentally drowned. In the mean time in Goa the Metropolitan was condemned as a heretic and died at the stake in 1654.

This greatly pushed the latinizatoin of the St.Thomas Christians by the Portuguese which had began in 1599. It also cut off all connection to the Church of the East. In the year 1653 a few thousand St.Thomas Christians said enough to the latinization and the “Coonan Kurishu Sathyam” or the Leaning Cross Oath took place.

The deacons and representatives of the St.Thomas Christian community met at Mattancherry Church and touched the tall granite cross outside the church. Because the number of people there was so great all could not touch the granite Cross at the same time. Therefore, they held on to ropes tied to the Cross in all directions. The following oath was read aloud at the event, “By the Father, Son and Holy Ghost that henceforth we would not adhere to the Franks, nor accept the faith of the Pope of Rome”. After the oath is is said because of the pressure the great cross leaned. This caused a split in the St.Thomas Christian community with those who would stay with Rome and those who eventually professed faith to the Syriac Orthodox Church of Antioch.

Because Mar Ahatalla was no longer around the St.Thomas Christians were left without a bishop. During the Oath twelve priests of the Syrian Christians laid hands on their Arch Deacon and proclaimed him as the first native Metropolitan of Kerala. Portuguese Bishop Alexio Di Menezes had convinced a few thousand Syrian Christians that this act was heretical and that a bishop cannot be proclaimed in such a way. Because of this many St.Thomas Christians remained under the Pope of Rome. Those of the Knanaya Community were also given the decision to stay Catholic or defy Rome.

Those who stayed with Rome would eventually become the Syro Malabar Catholic Church and those who professed the oath would become Keralas Jacobite Syrian Christian Church and The Malankara Orthodox Church. Though put through heavy Latinization the St.Thomas Christian Syrian Catholics retained many of there Syriac Customs and traditions. The Portuguese even let them continue reciting Holy Quarbana in Syriac.
 
thank you for this thread and all the information ,Rev. Fr. Jacob George Chirayath is serving our parish and he is great.its interesting to learn about his rite.
 
Hi april32010,

Is this is the priest, you were mentioning? syromalankarausa.org/content/rev-fr-jacob-george-chirayath

It would appear that he is of the Syro-Malankara Church, of the Antiochian Rite rather than Syro-Malabar Church of the Mesopotamian Rite. The histories of these two churches are very closely related (apparently identical until 1653), but they are quite different since diverging. I would encourage you to investigate them both. Both ancient traditions are amazingly beautiful, and the Catholic Church is certainly enriched by both of them! 🙂
 
Is it common for Syro-Malankara Catholic priests to dress as Latins, like the priest in that link? Roman clerical collar, clean shaven, etc.

I’m only asking because I know this particular church is quite new (1930s), and such things would certainly not be found among its Orthodox counterpart (Malankara Orthodox), so I’m kind of surprised that they’re so different so quickly. (Though some of their priests seem like they almost have beards, and of course an Orthodox priest’s ability to serve the liturgy is not defined by the length of his beard anyway).
 
Malankara Catholic priests usually are not clean shaven. This is one of the only priests that I have seen who is completely clean shaven. As for Latin lay dress, yes priests serving in the United States will usually where the suit and Roman Clerical collar. Both Syro Malabar and Syro Malankara priests follow this. In Kerala both Syro Malabar and Syro Malankara priests will wear the common white or orange lay dress. As seen in this link-

Kerala-
news.catholicate.net/Images/News/new-priest.jpg

United States-
knanayaregion.us/SyroMalabar.JPG
 
You should note that this particular priest is serving in a Latin parish, so it should not be terribly surprising. In the US, the Roman color, suit etc…, are not at all uncommon. In India, the usual clerical dress is the white cassock. It should not be terribly surprising that the Syro-Malankara adopted some Latin practices, as the Malankara have only recently adopted the Antiochian Rite itself (and it seems the Indian Orthodox have done a very good job of it too :D).

But the more traditional priests can be found among the Bethany priests (OIC- Order of Imitation of Christ, the religious order founded by Mor Ivanios, the first head of the Church), who wear the distinctive orange cassock as seen in the picture posted by Brother Thomas. I am very familiar with the Bethany priests having gone to a boarding school run by them in my childhood.
 
when I had confirmation, my middle name changed to Thomas, I hear he brought Christianity to china and Japan, a proud person to have my middle name after.
 
Very interesting lists. I thought many of the people in line of apostolic succession could not be traced because names had be been lost of over the centuries. Do you have the list of bishops for Lyon, France?

Thanks
 
dzheremi said:
Indeed! 👍

I don’t know about the Syriac Catholics, but the Syriac Orthodox officially changed the name of the Church (in English) to “Syriac Orthodox Church” in 2000, specifically for that reason.
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Dont heard about syrian catholics…? Please update your knowledge about eastern catholic churches
 
No. I know the Syriac Catholics. I meant that I do not know if the Syriac Catholic Church has also changed its official name in English to avoid confusion with the polity of Syria, as the Syriac Orthodox have. Sorry for being unclear. 🙂
 
The Syrian Christians were mostly under Bishops from Mosul/Baghdad, but were administered by an Indian Archdeacon who would maintain day to day affairs. The difficulty in your question is that between the 13th-16th centuries, the Bishops in Mosul/Baghdad were having an internal dispute and were going in and out of Communion with Rome and with each other.

Initially, the Church of Baghad (also known as the Church of the East, and the Persian Church) was under the Syriac Patriarchate of Antioch. Both “Eastern” and “Western” liturgical uses were part of the liturgical practices within the Syriac Patriarch of Antioch (similar to how the Latin Church has various Liturgical uses - Ambrosian, Mozarabic, Roman, etc.)

Due to the Nestorian controversy, the Bishops in Mosul/Baghdad claimed autonomy and separated from the Syriac Patriarchate of Antioch. During this period, the Indian Church was not really aware of this and accepted both (now separated) hierarchies as equally valid - it is important to remember here that the day to day affairs in India were run by a local Archdeacon - bishops would come to India by ship for ordinations or consecration of Holy Oil, etc. For most people, it didn’t matter which bishop arrived - East or West Syriac.

Most scholar and historians of the Thomas Christians of India state that the majority (possibly all) of the Church used the “Eastern” Syriac Rites until the arrival of Mar Gregorios of Jerusalem - where they accepted the Western Rites. But remember, both Rites are not completely dissimilar - someone who knows the Eastern Syriac language and customs fluently would have no trouble adopting the Western Syriac; however, it should be noted that there are differences.
 
Mar Gregorios arrived in Kerala in the 1665. Prior to this, the Antiochian Patriarchate had the “Catholicos/Maphriyan” of the East administer affairs in the Eastern half of the Church. This connection with the Kerala Christians was usually not direct (even more indirect than how the Malabar and Malankara Churches are administered by their own bishops and not the Pope directly). It cannot be said that their were active “Western missionaries” coming to India per se (at least not after 400AD), because the Eastern and Western halves of the Syrian Church were divided firstly by political problems in the region, then the Nestorian controversy. Some connection to the Syrian Patriarchate seems to have been maintained, since the relics of St. Thomas were brought to a church belonging to the western Syriac Patriarchate in Edessa.

The difficulty again is the both “western and eastern” practices were originally (before 325) under the umbrella of the Patriarchate of Antioch. Political problems forced the Patriarchate of Antioch to give the Church in the East more autonomy and gave the Eastern head bishop the title “Catholicos of the East” and “Maphrian”. When the Nestorian controversy erupted, most of the East, being separated from Antioch, came under the (now not in Communion with Antioch) Eastern Catholicos. This is not to say that all the bishops and clergy at the time considered themselves out of Communion with Antioch (actually, the Syriac Patriarchate still claimed the Eastern half rightfully hers, even though they were now separated).
 
Cool list. I am always interested in the other apostolic churches.
 
Thomas48 said:
The deacons and representatives of the St.Thomas Christian community met at Mattancherry Church and touched the tall granite cross outside the church. Because the number of people there was so great all could not touch the granite Cross at the same time. Therefore, they held on to ropes tied to the Cross in all directions. The following oath was read aloud at the event, “By the Father, Son and Holy Ghost that henceforth we would not adhere to the Franks, nor accept the faith of the Pope of Rome”. After the oath is is said because of the pressure the great cross leaned. This caused a split in the St.Thomas Christian community with those who would stay with Rome and those who eventually professed faith to the Syriac Orthodox Church of Antioch.
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Nobody took oath like that (“nor accept the faith of the Pope of Rome”). They took oath like this " St Thomas Christians will never accept any Jesuits priests or Portuguese rulers ". Majority remained in union with Roman Catholic Church , but they were against Latinization .

syromalabarccc.org/index_files/SyroMalabarHistoryPg1.htm

The Coonan Cross Oath in 1653 at the Church of Our Lady of Life in Mattanchery was the culmination of several years of latinization by the Portuguese, and the crowd gathered there took an oath that they would not be subject to the Portuguese Archbishop of Goa, Francis Garcia. St. Thomas Christians who gathered under the leadership of the Archdeacon to receive a Bishop from Persia, took the oath touching the cross there that they would not obey any more the Jesuits who were the main European Missionaries in India at that time; Coonan Cross Oath was a revolt against the oppressive rule of the Europeans and not against the Pope or the Holy See. After the Oath 12 priests at the instigation of one of them laid hands on the head of the Archdeacon and “ordained him Bishop”. There began the division in the Church of the St.Thomas Christians into two major groups: one group continued to recognize the prelates appointed by Rome and the other which broke away from Rome and joined the West-Syrian Jacobite Church of Antioch. This group came to be known as the Jacobites (Puthankootukar) or Syrian Orthodox Church of India. The Marthomites separated from the Jacobites in the 19th century due to Anglican Church influence. The Jacobites were further divided into two groups: Methran Kakshi or the Bishop’s group (Syrian Orthodox Church of India) whose Catholicos or supreme head resides at Devalokam, Kottayam and the Bhava Kakshi or Patriarch’s Group (Jacobite Syrian Orthodox Church of India) whose head is the Antiochene Jacobite Patriach.
 
The real syrian christians in india are mebers of malankara marthoma syrian, malankara orthodox syrian, syrian orthodox (jacobites).syro malabar is not at all a real syrian church actually syro malabar not uses the syrian language during the holy mass but marthoma , indian orthodox and jacobites uses syriac.marthoma , jacobite, and indian orthodox are oriental syrian churches in india they are founded by saint thomas the apostole during his missionary work in AD. 52.catholics came to india during the rule of portugal over india.

Malankara church(reAL st thomas oriental syrian church)=marthoma syrian+indian orthodox syrian+jacobite syrian

Syro malankara church contain some syrian christians because they where derived from indian orthodox but syro malabar are not actually syrians.

Some syro malabar members say that marthoma and orthodox (jacobite+indian ort) are derived from thre church actually catholics in kerala was derived from them . During portugal period pepoles (members of malankara) where forcely converted to catholic…
 
shonejo said:
The real syrian christians in india are mebers of malankara marthoma syrian, malankara orthodox syrian, syrian orthodox (jacobites).syro malabar is not at all a real syrian church actually syro malabar not uses the syrian language during the holy mass but marthoma , indian orthodox and jacobites uses syriac.marthoma , jacobite, and indian orthodox are oriental syrian churches in india they are founded by saint thomas the apostole during his missionary work in AD. 52.catholics came to india during the rule of portugal over india.

Malankara church(reAL st thomas oriental syrian church)=marthoma syrian+indian orthodox syrian+jacobite syrian

Syro malankara church contain some syrian christians because they where derived from indian orthodox but syro malabar are not actually syrians.

Some syro malabar members say that marthoma and orthodox (jacobite+indian ort) are derived from thre church actually catholics in kerala was derived from them . During portugal period pepoles (members of malankara) where forcely converted to catholic…
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What nonsense are you saying?

Syro-Malabar is of the East Syriac -Chaldean Tradition.
Malankara Orthodox, Malankara Catholic, and Jacobite are West Syriac.

Marthoma is West Syriac blended with Anglican theology.
 
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