Taking Communion at a protestant church

[MDK]

Sorry, I am a Catholic. One who is in the pew on Sunday’s, not at the Altar. I am still learning what this Faith (religion) is all about. As St. Paul has said, I have been weaned from only milk, but I haven’t tried all the different foods that are on the table yet. Sorry if I’m a little slower then you are, but I was taught to fully chew the food in my mouth before swallowing it.

I may get to where you are… if I live long enough…

Thank you, but I hope you get beyond where I am now, and continue growing in Christ. Even if you were the priest, it doesn’t mean you know everything faithfully. The Church is more of a hospital for us sinners, than a museum of Saints. None of the Saints was perfect either, but sought to do God’s will above all. I don’t know of anyone who would have a problem with where you are. However, it may be wise to read more for now, until you have a better grasp of the basic Catholic teachings. It’s important that we as Catholics learn what Christ actually taught, and do it from the only source of infallible teaching of Christ’s deposit of faith, His one Church. When a Catholic give others their own personal opinions which very much conflict with Christ’s doctrine (and to show you the seriousness of this, was in this case essentially promoting sacrilege), then they’re not posting as a Catholic, but as someone opposing Catholicism (and therefore whether they know it or not, they are also opposing Christ). I hope you do get where I am now and beyond, as it’s taken a decent amount of work by God’s grace, and I will learn more and hopefully receive His blessings of grace as I seek to continue to walk in friendship with Him. I’ve heard it said that God loves all of us even as we are now, but He loves us too much to let us stay this way.

 

[Michael_David]

Lest we not fall into false ecumenism, and lose sight of the very Truth that can bring about unity. Even the mafia certainly puts unity above the truth. However, we are called not to.

Again, sorry, I am just one in the trenches of life. I do not wear a robe or a collar, I have not been ordained, I am merely one of Christ sheep. We have all been given a life-time to seek His Salvation. Some take it all to do, others learn quicker… Christ knows this, but that does not stop Him from still guiding us ‘slower sheep’ along.

He has not asked me to be harsh with any of the rest of His flock, as He has not been harsh with me… even in His disciplining. As He has shown me Love and Understanding (and unity), so shall I do.

 

[MDK]

Again, sorry, I am just one in the trenches of life. I do not wear a robe or a collar, I have not been ordained, I am merely one of Christ sheep. We have all been given a life-time to seek His Salvation. Some take it all to do, others learn quicker… Christ knows this, but that does not stop Him from still guiding us ‘slower sheep’ along.

He has not asked me to be harsh with any of the rest of His flock, as He has not been harsh with me… even in His disciplining. As He has shown me Love and Understanding (and unity), so shall I do.

Appreciate that you express humility, but really no need to apologize to me. I don’t wear a robe when I get out of the shower, either. But, why do you bring that up!

We are all Christ’s sheep. He asked Peter to feed us. This is why we listen to those whom Christ sent. Christ indeed does know, and thankfully, God will be the One with final determination of our eternal fates. Since we don’t know how long our lifetime will be, we act now to do what Christ asks us.

We all want unity. To be together in a false gospel won’t really do us much good. Christ has given us a means for unity in His Church, and to water that down is to water down the chance for true unity. The only unity that will work is the Way, the Truth, and the Life.

Something is normally lost in this kind of communication, as one cannot see facial expressions nor hear tone of voice. I have been firm and insistent with you, as what you were doing was getting into sacrilege. It is out of protection for God’s word and love of neighbor that we object and provide the true teachings as much as we can. Please don’t presume politeness and protocol always means love. St. Augustine told us that “Sometimes hatred seems sweet, while love must show itself severe.”

 

[Michael_David]

MDK, this what you said,“I’ve heard it said that God loves all of us even as we are now, but He loves us too much to let us stay this way.” is oh-so true! My life is an example of that. It’s a journey… at times in the woods, at times on the plains, at times in a ship, at times in the winter, at times in the summer, at times in the valley, at times with the Church, at times with the pagans, at times with the secular. Seems nothing is exempt. So be it!

And I also agree with this, “Something is normally lost in this kind of communication, as one cannot see facial expressions nor hear tone of voice.” It is hard to pick the right words, and really know what the other is up to. It’s even hard to do that in person, much less in written form, where words mean different things to different people. However, I do believe others have good intentions… until proven otherwise. (Not the other way around). It all depends where on the journey one is…

 

[jmcrae]

First post here. Though I’d like to convert it’s too late to enter RCIA for confirmation in April.

I’m wondering. My parents usually go to a small Protestant church where they live. If they are going to service on a sunday that I am there and they give a communion that day do I refuse???or do I just say, “nah I’m staying home”, or say, “nah I’m going to a Catholic church in town?”

I have no Catholics in my family so I’m sure my family would be perplexed.

I am in a similar situation - the only Catholic in a family of Protestants, and I am also a convert.

At present, since you are not yet bound by Catholic law, it is entirely up to you, how to handle the situation. But it might be a good idea to start talking about your plans with your family fairly soon, so that they aren’t caught off guard when the moment comes that you can no longer accompany them to their church.

Prior to entering the Period of Catechesis in RCIA, you are free to continue the practice of your present religion, if you so choose. This can be a time of saying good-bye and wrapping things up on a positive note.

Once you are accepted into the Catechumenate of the RCIA, you have to cease the practice of your former religion. You cannot serve two masters, nor practice two religions, simultaneously.

God has given you the grace of several months, so you are free to break it to them gently, and ease gradually into your new life as a Catholic.

Once you have said your good-byes and are ready to let go of your current religion, you can start attending Sunday Mass, even if you are not yet in RCIA. You can participate in every aspect of the Mass except for Holy Communion. You also don’t go to Confession, yet - you will be instructed and prepared before you make your First Confession, as part of your RCIA process. You can also participate in every aspect of parish life, other than certain kinds of volunteer work.

 

[po18guy]

Ah, the Good Lord does not ask that you or I have to convert the whole world… just the one’s He places in our path, the one’s journeying with us in this world. As the Lord has guided (lead) you, you should guide (lead) another… this leaves a lot to consider in how one does it.

You or I have no flock to tend… just those we meet and associate with. It is Christ that has the flock, we are only to do our ‘little share’ in time (as He directs us), the rest will follow in time perhaps with another doing their ‘little share’ in time (as He directs them). And the other may (will) come to the truth by a lot of people all doing there ‘little share’ of the conversion.

How many have been involved in your learning the truth? And it all happened at God’s Loving Guiding Hands.

The reason for my reply in the first place was that I got the impression that you somehow doubt Christ’s presence in the Eucharist. If that is not the case, please disregard my blather!

A deadly virus infecting the Church is the lack of belief in the Eucharist. We must fervently pray that all Catholics come to belief in this revealed truth. A piece of bread does not cause conversions of itself. Without such faith, the Church crumbles.

 

[dandee]

He asked for-- and received in the first three posts on this thread-- Catholic Church documentation specifying the teaching of the Catholic Church on this topic.

I did receive the information I sought and more. Thank you all very much. Now - what to do with it.

 

[Michael_David]

The reason for my reply in the first place was that I got the impression that you somehow doubt Christ’s presence in the Eucharist. If that is not the case, please disregard my blather!

Impressions, oh so mysterious. Some of what is in the heart and the soul finds no words to truly express what is there… only the person and God knows what that is.

I do not personally doubt Christ’s Presence in the Holy Eucharist, I was merely trying to understand the difference between how both you and DD2007 looked at it while comparing it to how I did. In the process of understanding, one has to go to the place the other is at (whether right or wrong to one’s own belief) to see why/how they have come to their belief. It is part of understanding the other person.

A deadly virus infecting the Church is the lack of belief in the Eucharist. We must fervently pray that all Catholics come to belief in this revealed truth. A piece of bread does not cause conversions of itself. Without such faith, the Church crumbles.

Along with that post in trying to understand both beliefs, it did come down to faith… for either belief (the common ground). And this is the difference between a piece of bread and the Eucharist: Faith.

 

[newbetx]

You have raised a wonderful son!

My new line is - This is Next Year! Have said it since 2003 - sooner or later it will be Next Year!!

 

[MDK]

The Eucharist seems to be a memorial service as Christ said to ‘do this in remembrance of me.’ Being Catholic, I know what the Church says, and that is what po18guy also says. It becomes a matter of faith in the Church down to the Priest to have this happen. Then, is our faith in the Church, or in Christ… as DD2007 says. Where should our faith be? In God… or Man? This makes it an individual thing, as faith is with each person. Where they place that faith is also an individual thing. And as DD2007 said earlier, quoting what christ said, ‘where 2 or 3 are gathered in my Name, there I will also be’. So it does seem to be hinged of faith and gathering in His Name (the remembrance service He asked us to do)…

An important distinction needs to be made between His Eucharist Presence and His Presence where two or more are gathered in His Name. In the Eucharist, it would not matter if only one were there, being the priest. Next, it really doesn’t depend on the faith of the priest doing the consecrating. If the (valid and licit) priest uses a correct form and the correct matter and intendeds to do what the Catholic Church does…, then there is a valid consecration. So, in the Eucharist, Christ is there whether or not the priest actually believes He is (although disbelief is a grave offense to God). Furthermore, Christ’s Eucharistic Presence is real and true… meaning He is there Body, Blood, Soul and Divinity. This is a much different modality of Presence than where two or more are gathered in His Name.

How is the Spiritual Presence based on two or more gathering in His Name, really supposed to be the same as the Eucharistic Presence of Christ’s Body, Blood, Soul and Divinity based on a valid consecration whether one actually believes or not? Christ’s Presence is always welcome and sought, but the differences between His Presence in these two instances are clear. Please let me say that to not believe is not simply a valid option, but is gravely sinful. We must adore Him in the Eucharist, as He is there whole and entire.

 

[newbetx]

I was referring to post #2 which included:

We look to Canon Law 844 for the answer-

Can. 844 §1. Catholic ministers administer the sacraments licitly to Catholic members of the Christian faithful alone, who likewise receive them licitly from Catholic ministers alone, without prejudice to the prescripts of §§2, 3, and 4 of this canon, and ⇒ can. 861, §2.
§2. Whenever necessity requires it or true spiritual advantage suggests it, and provided that danger of error or of indifferentism is avoided, the Christian faithful for whom it is physically or morally impossible to approach a Catholic minister are permitted to receive the sacraments of penance, Eucharist, and anointing of the sick from non-
Catholic ministers in whose Churches these sacraments are valid.

OK. Thanks!

Maybe I’m being too legalistic. I am not saying it’s OK to do. I’m just questioning what constitutes a sin in this case. There are sins, mortal and venial. There are practices that may be sinful. “Avoid near occasion to sin” is one of those I don’t quite have a firm grasp on. This looks like it falls in the category of “provided that danger of error or of indifferentism is avoided”. And that is new information to me. I will go contemplate. Thanks again!

 

[newbetx]

First post here. Though I’d like to convert it’s too late to enter RCIA for confirmation in April.

I’m wondering. My parents usually go to a small Protestant church where they live. If they are going to service on a sunday that I am there and they give a communion that day do I refuse???or do I just say, “nah I’m staying home”, or say, “nah I’m going to a Catholic church in town?”

I have no Catholics in my family so I’m sure my family would be perplexed.

HOWDY! A convert from 1988 here! Hope your RCIA experience is wonderful!

I’ve been told that you may go to the service. It does not replace the “Sunday Obligation” of Mass, but it is charitable to be with your family at their service. Caution of course that it not tempt you to leave Catholicism, once there.

You may not partake of communion. I understand, like at Catholic Mass, you may go up and instead of communion, you can get a blessing. You may notice in Mass, young children and some adults approaching the Eucuristic Minister or the Priest or Deacon with their hands crossed, palms flat on their shoulders. This is a sign that they are not in a current state to receive communion and the minister will give them a blessing.

Not sure if the symbol is the same for your family’s church but you could investigate it. It’s more charitable than staying in your seat or not going at all.

 

[Michael_David]

An important distinction needs to be made between His Eucharist Presence and His Presence where two or more are gathered in His Name. In the Eucharist, it would not matter if only one were there, being the priest. Next, it really doesn’t depend on the faith of the priest doing the consecrating. If the (valid and licit) priest uses a correct form and the correct matter and intendeds to do what the Catholic Church does…, then there is a valid consecration. So, in the Eucharist, Christ is there whether or not the priest actually believes He is (although disbelief is a grave offense to God). Furthermore, Christ’s Eucharistic Presence is real and true… meaning He is there Body, Blood, Soul and Divinity. This is a much different modality of Presence than where two or more are gathered in His Name.

How is the Spiritual Presence based on two or more gathering in His Name, really much like the Eucharistic Presence of Christ’s Body, Blood, Soul and Divinity based on a valid consecration whether one actually believes or not? Please let me say that to not believe is not simply a valid option, but is gravely sinful. We must adore Him in the Eucharist, as He is there whole and entire.

I will try to say how I see it, although it may not come out correctly to what’s in my heart.

The Eucharistic Presence is there, in the Tabernacle even if the Church is empty, the lights are out, and it is locked. And if the Church is unlocked, He is still Present through the Tabernacle door (just as He entered through the locked door of the room the Apostles were in after His resurrection). Even Thomas had doubts, and Christ came back again to validate his faith. If Thomas would not even believe the other 10 (at that time), but wanted to see with his own eye’s… Christ accommodated him, and showed him. (The Eucharistic Presence) That was real and true! No Faith needed for the 11 Apostles.

If one wants to track that to the present, 1 in 11 will be like Thomas; 1 in 12 will be like Judas; and 1 in 12 will be like St. Paul… only needing to have God ask him a question and the resulting blindness.

In our time, we have to have the Faith Thomas needed validated to fully believe… he saw Him, not only in the bread, but in Person. When the 12 in their continuing missions said Mass, did they see the bread as they saw Christ… after the resurrection?

If 2 or 3 gathered together have Christ’s Spiritual Presence there too (the Holy Spirit), isn’t that ‘overwhelming’ enough for anybody? If God pulled one hair out of His head and let it drift down to earth, everyone would know it, by the very vastness of Who God is.

Even having a little mustard seed worth of Christ is toooooooooooooooooo much to bear, being the humans that we are. Our mission is to be obedient to God’s Will, like sheep when they hear His voice… only His Spirit touching us. (Like St. Paul experience.)

It was Christ ascending into Heaven that allowed the Holy Spirit to descend on the Apostles at Pentecost. (If Christ did not go to the Father, the Spirit of Truth would not come) (Seems both cannot be at the same time? Here on earth anyway.)

With this, Faith is still the ‘Key’… unless one ‘Knows’ the Eucharist is “Christ’s Body, Blood, Soul and Divinity”… then, like the 11 Apostles, faith was not necessary anymore… THEY SAW!

 

[MDK]

I will try to say how I see it, although it may not come out correctly to what’s in my heart.

The Eucharistic Presence is there, in the Tabernacle even if the Church is empty, the lights are out, and it is locked. And if the Church is unlocked, He is still Present through the Tabernacle door (just as He entered through the locked door of the room the Apostles were in after His resurrection). Even Thomas had doubts, and Christ came back again to validate his faith. If Thomas would not even believe the other 10 (at that time), but wanted to see with his own eye’s… Christ accommodated him, and showed him. (The Eucharistic Presence) That was real and true! No Faith needed for the 11 Apostles.

If one wants to track that to the present, 1 in 11 will be like Thomas; 1 in 12 will be like Judas; and 1 in 12 will be like St. Paul… only needing to have God ask him a question and the resulting blindness.

In our time, we have to have the Faith Thomas needed validated to fully believe… he saw Him, not only in the bread, but in Person. When the 12 in their continuing missions said Mass, did they see the bread as they saw Christ… after the resurrection?

If 2 or 3 gathered together have Christ’s Spiritual Presence there too (the Holy Spirit), isn’t that ‘overwhelming’ enough for anybody? If God pulled one hair out of His head and let it drift down to earth, everyone would know it, by the very vastness of Who God is.

Even having a little mustard seed worth of Christ is toooooooooooooooooo much to bear, being the humans that we are. Our mission is to be obedient to God’s Will, like sheep when they hear His voice… only His Spirit touching us. (Like St. Paul experience.)

It was Christ ascending into Heaven that allowed the Holy Spirit to descend on the Apostles at Pentecost. (If Christ did not go to the Father, the Spirit of Truth would not come) (Seems both cannot be at the same time? Here on earth anyway.)

With this, Faith is still the ‘Key’… unless one ‘Knows’ the Eucharist is “Christ’s Body, Blood, Soul and Divinity”… then, like the 11 Apostles, faith was not necessary anymore… THEY SAW!

We need to understand what the Church infallibly teaches. There are numerous departures from that in your post. I recommend you study all these items carefully, Thomas’ faith, Christ’s appearance, what happened to Paul, Christ and the Holy Spirit, the Eucharist… you’re not ready to teach CCD class yet.

 

[Michael_David]

We need to understand what the Church infallibly teaches. There are numerous departures from that in your post. I recommend you study all these items carefully, Thomas’ faith, Christ’s appearance, what happened to Paul, Christ and the Holy Spirit, the Eucharist… you’re not ready to teach CCD class yet.

So this is where you and I differ. In CCD class you have those that are there to learn the Religious particulars, they are there freely and ‘want’ to learn. I am in the trenches of living life, trying to survive with what is found in the day-to-day activities… most here do not want to hear about religion if it has no immediate effects/gain on their living conditions. They would rather not be where they are, but find it hard to leave (especially now with the economy taking all the funds just to loose ground while staying where they already are.) They are ‘not willing’ to learn religion in this mentality. It is seen as a bunch of hoopla and smiling only to avoid what is really happening to them… they have to be REAL to survive. Those that want to get out of the ‘stew’ prefer drugs to religion. It doesn’t help taking drugs, only temporarily, and it doesn’t help through religion either… they see both as the same thing. They still have to come back home to the ‘stew’ that exists for them.

At least in CCD the people’s ‘will’ wants it… in the trenches, the people’s ‘will’ is against it. The Church wants to save there soul, but only they can do that with Christ in tow. I am on a different front line then you are, and for me, it’s more a ‘show me’, ‘don’t tell me’ thing. I have to be REAL to show them, even without saying a word. Once, ‘one of these’ is on safe ground, hopefully their interest will be stirred to seek more of the faith… but they will never forget how they made it out of the mess they were in, and all the ‘who’s’ that helped them do it (in the Flesh, hand and hand).

Talk with the Missionaries, they try to teach by example and the resulting interest (curiosity). The Nuns and Brothers of today are doing more on (this) front line then the Church-Proper is, thanks to the shortage of Priests.

May I suggest you re-read the Epistle of St. James again. You may then be ready for pulling others out of the quicksand…

 

[jmcrae]

So this is where you and I differ. In CCD class you have those that are there to learn the Religious particulars, they are there freely and ‘want’ to learn. I am in the trenches of living life, trying to survive with what is found in the day-to-day activities… most here do not want to hear about religion if it has no immediate effects/gain on their living conditions. They would rather not be where they are, but find it hard to leave (especially now with the economy taking all the funds just to loose ground while staying where they already are.) They are ‘not willing’ to learn religion in this mentality. It is seen as a bunch of hoopla and smiling only to avoid what is really happening to them… they have to be REAL to survive. Those that want to get out of the ‘stew’ prefer drugs to religion. It doesn’t help taking drugs, only temporarily, and it doesn’t help through religion either… they see both as the same thing. They still have to come back home to the ‘stew’ that exists for them.

At least in CCD the people’s ‘will’ wants it… in the trenches, the people’s ‘will’ is against it. The Church wants to save there soul, but only they can do that with Christ in tow. I am on a different front line then you are, and for me, it’s more a ‘show me’, ‘don’t tell me’ thing. I have to be REAL to show them, even without saying a word. Once, ‘one of these’ is on safe ground, hopefully their interest will be stirred to seek more of the faith… but they will never forget how they made it out of the mess they were in, and all the ‘who’s’ that helped them do it (in the Flesh, hand and hand).

Talk with the Missionaries, they try to teach by example and the resulting interest (curiosity). The Nuns and Brothers of today are doing more on (this) front line then the Church-Proper is, thanks to the shortage of Priests.

May I suggest you re-read the Epistle of St. James again. You may then be ready for pulling others out of the quicksand…

I’m not seeing how teaching theology inaccurately is going to help with that.

It is perfectly possible to be a kind, loving, and generous person, while also believing and practicing what the Church teaches. I don’t know where people get the idea that you have to be brainless, to be kind.

 

[Michael_David]

It is perfectly possible to be a kind, loving, and generous person, while also believing and practicing what the Church teaches. I don’t know where people get the idea that you have to be brainless, to be kind.

You refer to believing and practicing. So do I.

I do not know all the Pope knows; nor what the Bishops know; nor what the Priest knows. I have not went in to studying all that comes out of the Vatican, the Archdiocese, or even the Church… except what the Priest says. The Bible I have studied when I was younger, and still read it today.

So, no, I am not studied in Theology, or Dogma, or all the legalese that is put in terms that no layman can understand.

I live in a practical world, not an ‘intellectual’ one. Yes, I do think and reason and use my intellect, but not to live there. What I know has to work in ‘application’… not theory, not in ‘supposes’ or ‘wonderland’. One can day-dream, theorize, rationalize all they want, but who is making supper? Who is doing the down-to-earth labor?

I live by the Commandments, both 10 and 2; the Beatitudes; among other things found in the Bible; where Christ came to the poor and the sinners while chastising those in high places. The camel and the eye of the needle; the become as a child when you approach Him; that faith only has to know that Christ was a human, died, and raised on the 3 day… to go to the Father; that faith without works is dead; attend Mass and go back into the world doing the good things.

And the Good Lord has helped me more times then I can count. I know He lives. He lives in all of His Creation. Beyond faith and this personal knowing, I do not strive. That may be another’s calling, but it is not mine. He wants me in the fields gathering the grain, working with my hands, I’m a laborer. And as He said, the harvest is great and the laborers are few… how well I know!

 

[jmcrae]

You refer to believing and practicing. So do I.

I do not know all the Pope knows; nor what the Bishops know; nor what the Priest knows. I have not went in to studying all that comes out of the Vatican, the Archdiocese, or even the Church… except what the Priest says. The Bible I have studied when I was younger, and still read it today.

So, no, I am not studied in Theology, or Dogma, or all the legalese that is put in terms that no layman can understand.

I live in a practical world, not an ‘intellectual’ one. Yes, I do think and reason and use my intellect, but not to live there. What I know has to work in ‘application’… not theory, not in ‘supposes’ or ‘wonderland’. One can day-dream, theorize, rationalize all they want, but who is making supper? Who is doing the down-to-earth labor?

I live by the Commandments, both 10 and 2; the Beatitudes; among other things found in the Bible; where Christ came to the poor and the sinners while chastising those in high places. The camel and the eye of the needle; the become as a child when you approach Him; that faith only has to know that Christ was a human, died, and raised on the 3 day… to go to the Father; that faith without works is dead; attend Mass and go back into the world doing the good things.

And the Good Lord has helped me more times then I can count. I know He lives. He lives in all of His Creation. Beyond faith and this personal knowing, I do not strive. That may be another’s calling, but it is not mine. He wants me in the fields gathering the grain, working with my hands, I’m a laborer. And as He said, the harvest is great and the laborers are few… how well I know!

And again, it is just as easy to promulgate the correct information, as the incorrect information. There is nothing virtuous about being badly educated, nor “child-like” about teaching inaccurately.

It is also very easy to say, “I don’t know; that is not my area of expertise,” rather than pontificate longwindedly upon your personal opinions that are at variance with the Church’s teachings.

 

[Michael_David]

And again, it is just as easy to promulgate the correct information, as the incorrect information. There is nothing virtuous about being badly educated, nor “child-like” about teaching inaccurately.

It is also very easy to say, “I don’t know; that is not my area of expertise,” rather than pontificate longwindedly upon your personal opinions that are at variance with the Church’s teachings.

Thank you for the disciplining.

However, this CAF would not be needed if all the Catholics and Christians knew the “correct information”… The Truth as it is called. And even this is disputed???

Although, I still do as St. Paul said, “Test all things…”

 

[jmcrae]

Thank you for the disciplining.

However, this CAF would not be needed if all the Catholics and Christians knew the “correct information”… The Truth as it is called. And even this is disputed???

If you don’t know something for sure, you can phrase it in the form of a question, rather than stating it as a fact.

Although, I still do as St. Paul said, “Test all things…”

Very important, yes.