Tear Each Other Apart Thread

[Christ_Imitator]

That it is the world’s best-selling book does not mean it is the word of God.

Very true, which is why I never claimed that. You also realize that the Bible could very well be just as true as the Quaran, right?

Are you telling me I shouldn’t cross myself three times and turn around in a circle before I enter the church?

No. I am asking why you think you should do that at all.

PROVE that they are traditions that are NOT necessary.

Wouldn’t it be easier for you to prove to me that they are necessary? I see no where in the Bible that it mentions doing any of the things Catholics do; such as Hail Mary’s.

If it is historically accurate in everything,

I NEVER said that it was historically accurate in everything. I said that nothing has been proven inaccuarte. There are different beliefs on how the Earth was started, but that doesn’t mean that the Biblical belief in creation has been diproven.

Hellooo. Jesus said this is how you SHOULD pray. What is hard to understand about that?

But, Jesus did NOT say that it’s the way we SHOULD pray. He said:
“Pray, then,** in this way ** (or “in this manner” {NKJV}). 'Our Father who is in heaven, Hallowed be Your name…” {Matthew6:9 NASB} “in this way” that means it is an exapmle of how we should pray. I am not saying that reciting the Lord’s prayer is a bad thing to do; however, it is not a very specific prayers, and I hear people use it all the time in very different situations.

the Father already knows what we want to say before it is even on our lips.
So come to think of it why ever do we need to pray?

That’s like saying why did God bother putting us on the Earth; he should have just sent us to Heaven or Hell right away…I mean he already knows if we choose to follow his ways or not.

can be considered pagan practices

Alright, I will do that for you. All you had to do was ask.
And, maybe saying that they are “pagan” was the wrong word, and I appologize.

1. Catholics do not believe that Christ’s death paid the full penalty for sin. Thus the idea of purgatory. If they believed that, then there would be no reason for a purgatory. --If I am correct, in Catholicism, Purgatory is the place where those who are to enter Heaven must go in order to be “washed of their sins.” What I don’t understand is…if Jesus’ blood was shed to “wash away our sins”, then what is the necessity of Purgatory?
   This is one thing, the idea of a “between Heaven location”, Purgatory is a pagan idea.
2. Catholics are idolatrous, they honor/worship Mary. Isn’t one of the things Catholic say, something like: “Holy Mary, mother of God”?
   The trinity is the ONLY one we are to worship. If it was considered the quadinity or something like that (God, Mary, Jesus, Holy Spirit). But, it is simply the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. Obviously I am missing something, and I am willing to listen to what you haev to say about it; without any criticism…since I am curious, and would like to learn.
   –It just seems that unless I get right to the point, and get people fired up, I never get answers. So, I would really like to appologize for my past few posts if they sounded disrespectful and mean.
3. Unum Sanctum: From what I’ve been told about Catholic teaching is that this in some way has something to with that only Catholics can be saved. Of course, I don’t know, so I am just wondering.

 

[twopekinguys]

Very true, which is why I never claimed that. You also realize that the Bible could very well be just as true as the Quaran, right?

No. I am asking why you think you should do that at all.

Wouldn’t it be easier for you to prove to me that they are necessary? I see no where in the Bible that it mentions doing any of the things Catholics do; such as Hail Mary’s.

I NEVER said that it was historically accurate in everything. I said that nothing has been proven inaccuarte. There are different beliefs on how the Earth was started, but that doesn’t mean that the Biblical belief in creation has been diproven.

But, Jesus did NOT say that it’s the way we SHOULD pray. He said:
“Pray, then,** in this way ** (or “in this manner” {NKJV}). 'Our Father who is in heaven, Hallowed be Your name…” {Matthew6:9 NASB} “in this way” that means it is an exapmle of how we should pray. I am not saying that reciting the Lord’s prayer is a bad thing to do; however, it is not a very specific prayers, and I hear people use it all the time in very different situations.

That’s like saying why did God bother putting us on the Earth; he should have just sent us to Heaven or Hell right away…I mean he already knows if we choose to follow his ways or not.

Alright, I will do that for you. All you had to do was ask.
And, maybe saying that they are “pagan” was the wrong word, and I appologize.

1. Catholics do not believe that Christ’s death paid the full penalty for sin. Thus the idea of purgatory. If they believed that, then there would be no reason for a purgatory. --If I am correct, in Catholicism, Purgatory is the place where those who are to enter Heaven must go in order to be “washed of their sins.” What I don’t understand is…if Jesus’ blood was shed to “wash away our sins”, then what is the necessity of Purgatory?
   This is one thing, the idea of a “between Heaven location”, Purgatory is a pagan idea.
2. Catholics are idolatrous, they honor/worship Mary. Isn’t one of the things Catholic say, something like: “Holy Mary, mother of God”?
   The trinity is the ONLY one we are to worship. If it was considered the quadinity or something like that (God, Mary, Jesus, Holy Spirit). But, it is simply the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. Obviously I am missing something, and I am willing to listen to what you haev to say about it; without any criticism…since I am curious, and would like to learn.
   –It just seems that unless I get right to the point, and get people fired up, I never get answers. So, I would really like to appologize for my past few posts if they sounded disrespectful and mean.
3. Unum Sanctum: From what I’ve been told about Catholic teaching is that this in some way has something to with that only Catholics can be saved. Of course, I don’t know, so I am just wondering.

I really think you are missing the whole point of this thread, it is for poking fun

With all of the questions you have, I suggest:

1. Search previous threads…many have come and gone with everything you are saying.

forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=383949 (Idolatry)
forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=383036&highlight=purgatory (purgatory)
forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=355965 (Hail Mary)

1. Start a new one to address your questions, after you have checked those threads out

 

[Christ_Imitator]

I really think you are missing the whole point of this thread, it is for poking fun

Yes, I did.

 

[JonNC]

Catholics: You silly people and your pagan practices. You cross yourselves with your hands, say hail mary’s, recite the Lord’s prayer from memory, and so many more rituals I can’t think of at the moment.
(The Lord’s prayer was simply used as an example for how we should prayl it wasn’t meant to be something we recite word-for-word when we can’t think of any other thing to say to God. I know he wants to hear our personal praises and concerns, not some memorized prayer used in the Bible. That’s like stealing an answer from the person sitting next to you in class. The teacher wants your own work, to know what’s on your mind, or to know what you have to say).
As for hail mary’s & crossing over yourself, I don’t think those are even Biblical rituals… more like traditions that keep getting passed down, that people think are necessary.

Atheists: You people are against living your lives the way anyone else tells you to, so you refuse to admit that there may be a God. And, if there is a possibility, then don’t you think you should pick up a Bible sometime? I mean, after all, it is the world’s best-selling book! It is very unique, and has been tested several times to ve proven historically inaccurate; that has yet to be done! Also, this book has a savior within it’s pages, and I’m sure most of you know about Jesus Christ. He says to come to him as you are, he doesn’t expect anyone of us to change our lives for him. All he wants is people who are willing to follow him. He will do the rest. And, I know from personal experience, as well as from Christian friends: that once you become a Christian that you lose the desire to do a lot of things that are considered sinful. However, even the most devout Christians (even the Pope himself!) are sinful people.

Mormons: As of today, there has yet to be any archaeological evidence that the Book of Mormon is historically accruate. The Bible has that…the BOM does not.
Be fooled no longer by the words of that book.

Seems outside the intentions of the thread, but you could start a new one or two with this post.

Jon

 

[Jimmy_B]

Just created this thread to link away from mine which is being hijacked so they can continue their debate and tear each other apart within it.,

This is going to be a thread that will have no real topic to it, so there is no way to go off topic, it will be where I point people to that insist upon tearing each other down, tearing each others views down, tearing each others perspectives, and in general, showing as a shining example of how we are not in any way kind to each other and the use of tact is entirely optional.

So, let the games begin.

Hi prodigalson,

I missed the last thread, do you have a link?

Is debating theological difference, “tearing someone apart” or, are you addressing person attacks and name-calling, which is something different altogether?

 

[workingman]

Well are you all going to continue? I need some more private chuckles.

 

[FickleFreckled]

benedictus2,
That was me who suggested we poke fun at our own religions. There are quite a few people here who are serious as a heart attack about their faiths, myself included. I’m pretty old and have learned that being serious as a heart attack all the time about anything just might cause you to have one. There’s not a religion out there - Catholicism included, and probably most especially, that doesn’t have something funny about because they’re all made up of humans and humans are goofy.

So…you wanna take it outside or what?

:knight2: I have a sword and I know how to use it. Ok, it’s cardboard, but whatever.

 

[dianaiad]

benedictus2,
That was me who suggested we poke fun at our own religions. There are quite a few people here who are serious as a heart attack about their faiths, myself included. I’m pretty old and have learned that being serious as a heart attack all the time about anything just might cause you to have one. There’s not a religion out there - Catholicism included, and probably most especially, that doesn’t have something funny about because they’re all made up of humans and humans are goofy.

So…you wanna take it outside or what?

:knight2: I have a sword and I know how to use it. Ok, it’s cardboard, but whatever.

Here’s the thing, guys…

There isn’t a religion or a church out there that doesn’t have its own oddities. Mostly cultural, and mostly poke-fun-at-able. It is when we start taking our cultures so seriously that we can’t see the ‘funny’ in them, we lose all the joy in life…

And I do mean ALL of it.

Now me, I’m a TBM. That’s “True believing Mormon,” for those who don’t grok the acronym. That means that I am DEADLY serious about the basis of my faith, which first and formost is faith in the Lord Jesus Christ, the Only Begotten Son of God, the Savior, the Second Member of the Godhead. That, for me, is serious stuff.

…and no, this is NOT the thread to start telling me that I don’t either believe this, or that, or that the Christ I believe in is not your Christ, or is a 'different gospel." I don’t want to hear it, and I won’t respond to it…in THIS thread.

However, nobody appreciates the weirdnesses of Mormon culture more than I do, and I don’t figure that having some gentle fun at the expense of that culture is going to hurt me a bit. I already know all the inside jokes, after all…and Mormons as a whole generally have a fairly decent sense of humor, if the jokes aren’t mean spirited.

I think that this thread is a much needed relief valve, to remind us all that we are not aliens from different planets who cannot understand each other. We are human. We are God’s children, and we are siblings in a very real way. Let us not, for the love of heaven (quite literally) be SERIOUS in this thread!

Let us be gentle. Let us be kind. Let us be just a wee bit sly—and I promise to tell you my favorite J.Golden stories.

Diana

 

[FickleFreckled]

Omygosh,dianaiad,
You used the word GROK! Holy moley, when I read that years ago, it said it so well and so fully it became ingrained in me. I was so excited to see that word I didn’t finish your post. Sorry…will go back and do that now…

 

[FickleFreckled]

You are so right dianaiad. We don’t have to be mean-spirited even in poking fun at our own religions, much less anyone else’s on this thread. Why do we have to be so intense??? We don’t have anything to prove here. If we do, we can take it to a veritable plethora of other threads on CAF.

Now, can we get back to shredding each other? It’s been a long day and I could use a good laugh.

 

[sinnegam]

Lke Fickle Freckled (where do you guys get these names from?) my life was in a real shambles when I joined CAF. Being allowed to express myself and my beliefs as a Catholic has certainly been a great help to me.Part of it is knowing that someone somewhere on the planet is reading my thoughts and opinions just like you guys are being read here in Ireland. Alas, as you said in the first thread, things fall apart and we become arrogant, losing our humility. God likes us to discuss openly and honestly our differences. We may learn something from our non Catholic friends which may enrich our souls and vice versa.Here in N.Ireland as you know differences between Catholics and Protestants are known world wide but a lot of dialogue is taking place between different groups and very slowly the pain of the past and the deep seated suspicions are easing. God’s love and forgiveness is at work and will only be sustained by prayer.because as you well know old satan manages to stick his nose in where he’s not wanted…he’s evident in other threads and thrives on disharmony.
So, good health to this thread and let it be a haven of common sense…God Bless All

 

[FickleFreckled]

Wow, sinnegram, what a wonderful thing to say. It’s humbling to hear from someone who has lived with real religious predjudice and violence. God’s love and mercy is at work, as you say. God bless you and your countrymen and women.

 

[dianaiad]

Omygosh,dianaiad,
You used the word GROK! Holy moley, when I read that years ago, it said it so well and so fully it became ingrained in me. I was so excited to see that word I didn’t finish your post. Sorry…will go back and do that now…

Yes, well…

Heinlein liked Mormons. He thought we were way strange, but he liked us.

 

[FickleFreckled]

Yes, but Heinlein was STRANGE…

However, nothing quite says it like GROK…

If only we could grok each other fully…but in Heaven we will!

God groks us all the time.

After 70 years of marriage sometimes people grok each other.

I like that word.

Thank you for using it. It made my silly day.

 

[NotTooSmart]

This is a good thread.

This post is inspired by another thread here that seems to be 5 pages of arguing about silliness.

Anyway.

Protestants are all going to hell because they wear this barren cross that doesn’t even have Jesus on it. They are obviously ashamed of Christ crucified. And you know what Jesus will say to those who are ashamed of Him at the final judgment.

Meanwhile Catholics are all going to hell because they wear this utterly hideous crucifix with Jesus pinned on it. They obviously do not believe that Jesus rose from the dead. And you know what Jesus will say to those who do not believe He rose from the dead at the final judgment.

 

[benedictus2]

benedictus2,
That was me who suggested we poke fun at our own religions. There are quite a few people here who are serious as a heart attack about their faiths, myself included. I’m pretty old and have learned that being serious as a heart attack all the time about anything just might cause you to have one.

Being serious about one’s faith will not cause anyone to have a heart attack. Being serious about being Catholic actually makes you realize how precious it is.
Being serious about it makes you want to learn more. The more I learn, the more grateful I become that I was born into a devout Catholic family And everyday I thank God for that.

The more serious I become about my faith, the more I learn to relax because the more I learn of God’s incrdible providence. The more I see the beauty of God’s creation and the joy. Yes, joy as against fun.

There’s not a religion out there - Catholicism included, and probably most especially, that doesn’t have something funny about because they’re all made up of humans and humans are goofy.

Passionately beg to differ. While every religion is made up men, and all other religions are founded by men, the Catholic faith was founded by God. So no, nothing goofy about it at all. There may be something goofy in some odd cultural practice, but the faith itself, none. Or you would be saying that there is something goofy about God.

So…you wanna take it outside or what?

:knight2: I have a sword and I know how to use it. Ok, it’s cardboard, but whatever.

Naah, too busy being joyful.

 

[FickleFreckled]

benedictus2,
Please don’t spin what I said. Let me be perfectly clear so there will be no misunderstanding: I didn’t say there was anything goofy about the faith, nor is that what I meant. There are funny things about denominations and various religious practices because people have their hands in them. What you might call the “culture” of religion.
I wasn’t going to be serious, but I won’t be misrepresented, either.
And please don’t judge my faith. It’s a mistake, it’s tiresome and it belongs on some other thread.

 

[benedictus2]

I really think you are missing the whole point of this thread, it is for poking fun

Then it might be good to take a quick peek at the OP.

benedictus2,
Please don’t spin what I said. Let me be perfectly clear so there will be no misunderstanding: I didn’t say there was anything goofy about the faith, nor is that what I meant. There are funny things about denominations and various religious practices because people have their hands in them. What you might call the “culture” of religion.

Appreciate the clarification but you did say poke fun at our own religion.

I wasn’t going to be serious, but I won’t be misrepresented, either.
And please don’t judge my faith. It’s a mistake, it’s tiresome and it belongs on some other thread.

I wasn’t judging your faith. Merely explaining why I can’t poke fun at my own religion. And as for this belonging to some other thread, well, all I can say is refer back to the OP.

 

[benedictus2]

Hi prodigalson,

I missed the last thread, do you have a link?

Is debating theological difference, “tearing someone apart” or, are you addressing person attacks and name-calling, which is something different altogether?

Vunderbar!! Excellent clarifification.

 

[prodigalson12]

Well benedictus2, hunny, the OP was in a completely different context as to what it turned into, a very delightful response that was received with Joy the moment I checked back into it after creating it the night before, the absolute opposite of what I expected, and I feel, a gift from God, for it came so perfectly with what I was feeling at the time, just a nice breath of fresh air in all ways for me, and originally thought me alone, now seeing many more people just loving the energy it’s created, much less, grins that are on many of our faces during it as being the norm. I also think it has contagious benefits, with us joking around and having fun together here, we are going to be a lot less harsh with how we treat each other with the more serious threads.

Sooo…I meant one thing, God sent me another, I’m forever grateful for this little perk in my day, from that day, then rolling on the floor laughing seeing the spin it took of to on page two and onwards, and that’s why the context is the way it is here and why the mods haven’t moved this into the humor section already, I’m also grateful for. So, now I guess, it’s a blend of flavors, we have real debate and discussion, we have goofieness, my parish priest and most that fill in always seem to get us laughing at the end of mass and it’s all very much never against the faith at all as well with that other tangent you discussed. I’m just going to let this thing keep going and try to keep it up in the direction that it seemed to go from the beginning, so please excuse others that want to do the same.

God bless you, Brian