J
jim1130
Guest
Peace.
Thank you.
Contrary to what Tom Cruise thinks (You mean Tom Cruise thinks?) postpartum depression is a reality and I was concerned.
Peace.
- Status
Thank you.
Contrary to what Tom Cruise thinks (You mean Tom Cruise thinks?) postpartum depression is a reality and I was concerned.
Peace.
C
ChristsSoldier
Guest
Be Blessed,
I would encourage you to attend Easter Vigil again.
Pardon my assumption, but you seem more determined to leave the Church than decided.
If you know the history, learned and experienced the sacraments, I find it difficult to understand why you would choose to distance yourself and your childern from the true faith and all of its teachings - rather than rediscovering them.
It is sad that your local community is as it is, but you are in communion with all of us as long as you choose to continue to struggle with the faith.
As you know, should you leave, you can always come back.
Peace,
CS
I would encourage you to attend Easter Vigil again.
Pardon my assumption, but you seem more determined to leave the Church than decided.
If you know the history, learned and experienced the sacraments, I find it difficult to understand why you would choose to distance yourself and your childern from the true faith and all of its teachings - rather than rediscovering them.
It is sad that your local community is as it is, but you are in communion with all of us as long as you choose to continue to struggle with the faith.
As you know, should you leave, you can always come back.
Peace,
CS
M
Magicsilence
Guest
Big hug to mumof5.
Truth be told, sometimes we listen to our hearts instead of our heads. The only problem is, sometimes our hearts make all the problems.
Im not sure if you know it, but St Faustina quoted something Jesus Christ said to her:
“When boredom and discouragement beat against your heart, run away from yourself and hide in My Heart. Do not fear struggle; courage itself often intimidates temptations and they dare not attack us. Always fight with the deep conviction that I am with you. Do not be guided by feeling because it is not always control; but all merit lies in the will…Do not be unduly fearful, you are not alone”
Ever done something because you felt like doing it? Course you have. And most of the time there is not anything seriously wrong with it. The problem is, our hearts our easily swayed by emotions. Try talking reason to someone who is really angry.
The thing most people dont realise is, the blindness we experience when we are angry is not limited to anger. Love, fear, anger, anxiety, ALL cause a degree of blindness. Ever been so hungry youre happy to pay 3 times what you should be paying for a meal just to eat something?!
Unfortunately our emotions guide most of our lives. They are indeed very VERY powerful. Sometimes we can feel lost and depressed, sometimes happy and close to God, and sometimes dont see the point of it all. However, anyone looking on the outside will correctly point out that NOTHING has changed in that persons life but the way they feel.
Ever seen one of your kids refuse to come and play a board game or football because one of the others passed an unkind comment or similar? They sulk to heal the injustice they have been served. And the emotional balance is restored.
Ever broken a bone before? Was it a pleasurable experience?
We both know that it would have been much nicer to be drugged out of your mind on morphine for 3 months while it healed rather than having an awkward cast and pain for 3 months. But we also know which is better for your overall health. And, much in the same way that we have the ability to recognise the better option for our bodies, we also need to do the same for our soul. The only problem is, whereas our actions have an immediate reaction on our state of health, they dont have that instant effect on our souls.
(cont)
Truth be told, sometimes we listen to our hearts instead of our heads. The only problem is, sometimes our hearts make all the problems.
Im not sure if you know it, but St Faustina quoted something Jesus Christ said to her:
“When boredom and discouragement beat against your heart, run away from yourself and hide in My Heart. Do not fear struggle; courage itself often intimidates temptations and they dare not attack us. Always fight with the deep conviction that I am with you. Do not be guided by feeling because it is not always control; but all merit lies in the will…Do not be unduly fearful, you are not alone”
Ever done something because you felt like doing it? Course you have. And most of the time there is not anything seriously wrong with it. The problem is, our hearts our easily swayed by emotions. Try talking reason to someone who is really angry.
The thing most people dont realise is, the blindness we experience when we are angry is not limited to anger. Love, fear, anger, anxiety, ALL cause a degree of blindness. Ever been so hungry youre happy to pay 3 times what you should be paying for a meal just to eat something?!Unfortunately our emotions guide most of our lives. They are indeed very VERY powerful. Sometimes we can feel lost and depressed, sometimes happy and close to God, and sometimes dont see the point of it all. However, anyone looking on the outside will correctly point out that NOTHING has changed in that persons life but the way they feel.
Ever seen one of your kids refuse to come and play a board game or football because one of the others passed an unkind comment or similar? They sulk to heal the injustice they have been served. And the emotional balance is restored.
Ever broken a bone before? Was it a pleasurable experience?
We both know that it would have been much nicer to be drugged out of your mind on morphine for 3 months while it healed rather than having an awkward cast and pain for 3 months. But we also know which is better for your overall health. And, much in the same way that we have the ability to recognise the better option for our bodies, we also need to do the same for our soul. The only problem is, whereas our actions have an immediate reaction on our state of health, they dont have that instant effect on our souls.(cont)
M
Magicsilence
Guest
So, just as with your leg, though you might find the option of morphine more attractive at first, Im sure your husband looking after you would object, and of course common sense and reason come into play. It is the SAME for your soul, the only problem is, we let our emotions dictate instead of reaching for the better option. Of course, if you could replay your life with God giving you choices as how to nourish your soul here and there, no doubt you would always choose the better option, though it might be a little hard on your body.
The Eucharist is one of the biggest pillars of our Faith. You say that you recognise that the Catholic Church is the original Church, do a search on Catholic.com on the early Church fathers talking about the Eucharist.
Yes, you might find the prayers repetitive, the people lax and lazy in genuflecting, teenagers slumped in front of you, the mass boring at times, the music lame, and the priest unenthusiastic. But you will NEVER fail to find that jewel of our faith, that unfathomable mystery, that awesome spectacle, that core dogma, that inexpressable joy which is the Eucharist. Jesus Christ Himself. And not just there in the sense that God is everywhere. Really present in the mass. Not only does he bestow upon us a thousand graces just through his presence. But Almighty God through His Mercy and Love has allowed us, to do the unthinkable, and recieve Him in the Eucharist. THAT is why St Paul spoke of being guilty of recieving the body and blood of Our Lord. THAT is why all the saints have their lives revolving around the mass and ESPECIALLY the Eucharist. It is through the Eucharist that we find Salvation.
The sacrifice of Jesus Christ was more than all that has been done before and after His life. You cannot emulate it with happy songs about His life, or shouting at the top of your voice, singing praises to the Lord, or remembering his Sacrifice in symbol only. It is through love that He has given us the mass and the Eucharist. And it is through love that He is calling us to it.
You dont know what you’re missing!
In Christ.
Andre.
p.s Im always here if you want to PM me.
The Eucharist is one of the biggest pillars of our Faith. You say that you recognise that the Catholic Church is the original Church, do a search on Catholic.com on the early Church fathers talking about the Eucharist.
Yes, you might find the prayers repetitive, the people lax and lazy in genuflecting, teenagers slumped in front of you, the mass boring at times, the music lame, and the priest unenthusiastic. But you will NEVER fail to find that jewel of our faith, that unfathomable mystery, that awesome spectacle, that core dogma, that inexpressable joy which is the Eucharist. Jesus Christ Himself. And not just there in the sense that God is everywhere. Really present in the mass. Not only does he bestow upon us a thousand graces just through his presence. But Almighty God through His Mercy and Love has allowed us, to do the unthinkable, and recieve Him in the Eucharist. THAT is why St Paul spoke of being guilty of recieving the body and blood of Our Lord. THAT is why all the saints have their lives revolving around the mass and ESPECIALLY the Eucharist. It is through the Eucharist that we find Salvation.
Mumof5. If only you could see the amazing graces that flow from the Eucharist, you would lie outside the Church day night waiting for mass. And it would not be a concern if the congregation were bored or not concerned, for you know that the purpose of the mass is Worship of Almighty God, and to do as he commanded and recieve the Eucharist.
The sacrifice of Jesus Christ was more than all that has been done before and after His life. You cannot emulate it with happy songs about His life, or shouting at the top of your voice, singing praises to the Lord, or remembering his Sacrifice in symbol only. It is through love that He has given us the mass and the Eucharist. And it is through love that He is calling us to it.
You dont know what you’re missing!
In Christ.
Andre.
p.s Im always here if you want to PM me.
M
Mike_O
Guest
mumof5 said:
I’m sorry, but, based on your earlier comments about purgatory and other “problems” you have with Catholicism, there just isn’t any way you can claim to be aware of Biblical history and Scriptural ties to the Church.
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AugustineFL
Guest
There is but one baptism. If you’ve already been baptised this second is no baptism at all. As for calling it a ‘believers baptism’, belief in what? Protestant ‘churches’ hold to heretical doctrins and as such deny the true faith; that is to say they do NOT believe what Christ Jesus says they ought to.
Christ says that his burden is light. When you feel burdened and weighed down don’t forget that we also are called to take up our cross daily; and remember Christ is there helping us carry it.
As for man made rules, my previous baptist pastor taught plenty of man made rules that cannot be found in the bible and legalism! How about all ethanol is of the devil and a sin! That isn’t found in the bible and surly looking down on folks that inbib saying they are sinning and probably not ‘saved’ is legalism. The bible even says that Jesus consumed ethanol! And there are many more man-made doctrins: sola-scriptura, sola-fide, ‘once saved always saved’, et cetera, et cetera.
Yes God is good. If you know him more now than you did before, that is great! Now I would encourage you to continue your walk with God in all that he calls you to do; including being in his One, Holy, Catholic and Apostalic Church. Nothing is closer to God than the Most Holy Sacrament of the alter. You can’t get that in protestant churches. Yes, though they call it ‘believers baptism’ most don’t even believe in the Most Holy Eucharist. They don’t believe that God can do what he said he’d do in St. John chapter six so they deny what he said and what the Church has always taught.
Good luck on your spiritual journay, and may you allow Christ to draw you as close to him as he wills.
Extra Ecclesia nulla salus.
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AugustineFL
Guest
Speaking of man-made doctrins! You will find in history that this isn’t true. The bible also doesn’t say this. In fact it says the oposite. It says that entire familys where baptised…not just the adults. If Jesus said only adults should be then why where people not listening to him in the 1st and 2nd century? Please study the early Church and read the Church fathers. To be deep in history is to cease to be protestant! The early Church affirms this and the real presence!
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Erbey
Guest
Dear Fellow Christian,
you then you should abide in him John 15:6. Now how do you abide in him? Jesus said "He who eats my flesh and drinks my blood abides in me, and I in him"John 6:56 and the only Church where a valid Eucharist is offered is at the Catholic Church. Furthermore, St.Paul confirms this teaching when he says "Whoever, therefore, eats the bread or drinks the cup of the Lord in an unworthy manner **will be guilty of profaning the body ** and blood of the Lord in 1Corinthians 11:23. Now how can you sin against a piece of bread unless it is what the Lord said it is. He said "Now as they were eating, Jesus took bread, and blessed, and broke it, and gave it to the disciples and said, "Take, eat; this is my body " Matt 26:26. In John 6:66 many of Jesus’s so called disciples drew back and no longer went about with him because they didn’t believe Jesus when he told them to eat his flesh, Then he turned and asked the apostles if they were going to leave also but Simon Peter answered him, "Lord, to whom shall we go? You have the words of eternal life!! Here is the million dollar question, are you going to turn your back on Jesus (Eucharist) like the “so called disciples” or are you going to believe Jesus and take him at his word like Peter and the apostles which are the true Church of Jesus Christ. Please deeply think and ponder what you are about to do. 
Code:
Please consider the words that came from the lips of Christ himself when he said " unless you eat the flesh of the Son of man and drink his blood, **you have no life in you**" John 6:53. . He said that if you want him to abide or remain in
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ChristsSoldier
Guest
Mum,
To be frank, I would like you to consider your determination to leave the faith. At least consider the emotional side of your argument. As you know, once the emotions run out - there is nothing.
I say emotions because of your ‘need’ to be baptized again. You claim to be of our faith, to have participated in our sacraments, and to be knowledgeable of our teaching. Yet, you contradict these statements harshly… The grace of baptism can only be bestowed upon you once. To that end, being the baptized Catholic you claim to be, any other Christian church should be explaining this to you. Other than emotional gratification, there is a zero sum gain in being baptized again…
III. THE CONVERSION OF THE BAPTIZED
1427 Jesus calls to conversion. This call is an essential part of the proclamation of the kingdom: “The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand; repent, and believe in the gospel.”[16] In the Church’s preaching this call is addressed first to those who do not yet know Christ and his Gospel. Also, Baptism is the principal place for the first and fundamental conversion. It is by faith in the Gospel and by Baptism[17] that one renounces evil and gains salvation, that is, the forgiveness of all sins and the gift of new life.
1428 Christ’s call to conversion continues to resound in the lives of Christians. This second conversion is an uninterrupted task for the whole Church who, “clasping sinners to her bosom, [is] at once holy and always in need of purification, [and] follows constantly the path of penance and renewal.”[18] This endeavor of conversion is not just a human work. It is the movement of a “contrite heart,” drawn and moved by grace to respond to the merciful love of God who loved us first.[19]
1429 St. Peter’s conversion after he had denied his master three times bears witness to this. Jesus’ look of infinite mercy drew tears of repentance from Peter and, after the Lord’s resurrection, a threefold affirmation of love for him.[20] The second conversion also has a communitarian dimension, as is clear in the Lord’s call to a whole Church: “Repent!”[21]
St. Ambrose says of the two conversions that, in the Church, “there are water and tears: the water of Baptism and the tears of repentance.”[22]
Peace,
CS
To be frank, I would like you to consider your determination to leave the faith. At least consider the emotional side of your argument. As you know, once the emotions run out - there is nothing.
I say emotions because of your ‘need’ to be baptized again. You claim to be of our faith, to have participated in our sacraments, and to be knowledgeable of our teaching. Yet, you contradict these statements harshly… The grace of baptism can only be bestowed upon you once. To that end, being the baptized Catholic you claim to be, any other Christian church should be explaining this to you. Other than emotional gratification, there is a zero sum gain in being baptized again…
III. THE CONVERSION OF THE BAPTIZED
1427 Jesus calls to conversion. This call is an essential part of the proclamation of the kingdom: “The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand; repent, and believe in the gospel.”[16] In the Church’s preaching this call is addressed first to those who do not yet know Christ and his Gospel. Also, Baptism is the principal place for the first and fundamental conversion. It is by faith in the Gospel and by Baptism[17] that one renounces evil and gains salvation, that is, the forgiveness of all sins and the gift of new life.
1428 Christ’s call to conversion continues to resound in the lives of Christians. This second conversion is an uninterrupted task for the whole Church who, “clasping sinners to her bosom, [is] at once holy and always in need of purification, [and] follows constantly the path of penance and renewal.”[18] This endeavor of conversion is not just a human work. It is the movement of a “contrite heart,” drawn and moved by grace to respond to the merciful love of God who loved us first.[19]
1429 St. Peter’s conversion after he had denied his master three times bears witness to this. Jesus’ look of infinite mercy drew tears of repentance from Peter and, after the Lord’s resurrection, a threefold affirmation of love for him.[20] The second conversion also has a communitarian dimension, as is clear in the Lord’s call to a whole Church: “Repent!”[21]
St. Ambrose says of the two conversions that, in the Church, “there are water and tears: the water of Baptism and the tears of repentance.”[22]
Peace,
CS
A
AugustineFL
Guest
Common, you gotta be kidding, right? No Catholic should believe that. For that matter no protestant should believe that if they read history and do some research. Lorain Bottner and Chick might believe that…but then again they seem to just make up things to make the Church look bad.
Please learn about Church teachings from the Church and history…not from the likes of Bottner, Chick and his followers.
Purgatory has been taught since the early church. Buying indulgences has always been considered wrong (even if their were abuses in the past). In fact ‘buying an indulgance’ would be the sin of simony so instead of ‘buying an indulgance’ the person has only managed to purchase sin. Not backed up in scriputre? Sure it is! Do a search on purgatory on Catholic.com, the index of the CCC and other solid Catholic sources.
How do I know what I say is true? Because I was a protestant. It was the fact that the Church is the ONLY TRULY BIBLICAL CHURCH that converted me! It is the only Church that has been here since Christ. It is the only Church that fully follows the bible.
C
Church_Militant
Guest
2/ Purgatory. Introduced by the church to raise money so people would buy indulgences. Not backed up in any scripture. Looks like someone has swallowed the whole Boettner List Fiction hook line and sinker.
M
mumof5
Guest
Church Militant:
Hmmmm - interesting reading. I hadn’t actually heard of Boettner before now so had to do a google search. Chick leaflets - not aimed at intelligent people and only really good for a laugh. Boettner was much more interesting reading. Thanks for that. Learn something new every day.Looks like someone has swallowed the whole Boettner List Fiction hook line and sinker.
M
mumof5
Guest
Church Militant:
Hmmmm - interesting reading. I hadn’t actually heard of Boettner before now so had to do a google search. Chick leaflets - not aimed at intelligent people and only really good for a laugh. Boettner was much more interesting reading. Thanks for that. Learn something new every day.Looks like someone has swallowed the whole Boettner List Fiction hook line and sinker.
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Church_Militant
Guest
If you’ll check out a book called “Catholicism Vs Fundamentalism” by an obscure (
) apologist named Karl Keatinghttp://shop.catholic.com/online-store/scstore/B0121.JPG you’ll find out there’s quite a bit that you’ve been misled about.
Catholic “Inventions” catholic.com/library/Catholic_Inventions.asp
The Anti-Catholic Bible
Let’s look at a few examples of misleading charges. These are taken from Loraine Boettner’s book, Roman Catholicism, which might be called the “Bible” of the anti-Catholic movement. First published in 1962 by the Presbyterian and Reformed Publishing Company of Philadelphia, and reprinted many times since, this fat book is the source most anti-Catholic organizations rely on for information about the Church. Most borrow uncritically from Boettner, seldom giving him credit and never checking his sources. It must be admitted, though, that Boettner lists almost no sources for his claims, so the lack of documentation is not completely the responsibility of the people who have picked up his words.
Early in the book Boettner lists what he terms “Some Roman Catholic Heresies and Inventions.” These consist of beliefs that were supposedly made up centuries after the New Testament era and practices or customs that bear little similarity to those mentioned in the Bible. The reader of these several dozen charges is supposed to turn from them in such despair that he will abandon the Catholic Church (if he is a Catholic) or will actively fight it (if he is a non-Catholic). Here are a few of the “inventions.”
Several very good articles.
Pax tecum,
BTW, I suggest that you have a look at this post which deals with the scriptures concerning Purgatory.
A
AlanFromWichita
Guest
After one Mass I went to in Orange County, I now know what a “dead Church” is like. It happened to be the anticipated Mass for Pentecost 2000, and the associate pastor, alive and on fire with the spirit, was speaking of himself getting shipped out of the parish. He spoke of it being a “dead Church” and that getting rid of himself would not change that reality. He actually gave a wonderful homily, about how the Psalm response “Lord send out your spirit and renew the face of the earth” can apply to each of us as we face life’s problems.If it were possible, I would happily take you to the various Masses around here and let you see for yourself…
The place truly was amazing. Anyone who’s never been to a “dead Church” may not have this experience. We just happened to be in town because we were vacationing (our last family vacation together) in CA.
The funny thing is that a couple people started talking to us after Mass, having recognized us as newbies. They had hoped that young families were entering the Church because at that parish there were hardly any youth at all. These were old people, concerned about Catholicism, but also concerned about the reality of what the preacher had just accused the parish of being. At the time I was practically dumbfounded because I’d never felt anything like it before, plus it was a huge and beautiful historic Church. At this time in my life, if I was assigned to that parish somehow, I would have no problem in helping people liven up. Clearly the people were concerned but said nothing because the politics there were a certain way.
About politics, also keep in mind that there are politics behind every church I know of. I have several Protestant friends who are active in the music and other ministries at Protestant Churches, and they don’t necessarily reflect all that glitters on the insides as they do on the outside.
I admit in the last page or so of posts, I haven’t read each one carefully but I’m curious at this point whether you actually believe that this other Church is more aligned with the correct teachings and behavior, or whether this decision is beyond logic to the point that more discussion is just missing the boat?
Alan
C
Church_Militant
Guest
Y’know guys, if a church is “dead”, and those of us who are “alive” all leave, then do we not remove the means by which resurrection and life return to the church?
Consider the Cure D’Ars. He had a parish like that and God used him to turn it around. St. John Vianney and alos Here .
“All our religion is but a false religion, and all our virtues are mere illusions and we ourselves are only hypocrites in the sight of God, if we have not that universal charity for everyone - for the good, and for the bad, for the poor and for the rich, and for all those who do us harm as much as those who do us good.”
Saint John Vianney
Pax vobiscum,
Consider the Cure D’Ars. He had a parish like that and God used him to turn it around. St. John Vianney and alos Here .
“All our religion is but a false religion, and all our virtues are mere illusions and we ourselves are only hypocrites in the sight of God, if we have not that universal charity for everyone - for the good, and for the bad, for the poor and for the rich, and for all those who do us harm as much as those who do us good.”
Saint John Vianney
Pax vobiscum,
M
mumof5
Guest
Yes, I do and even as a Catholic, my theology has always been more Protestant than Catholic.
I feel a very strong call from the Lord to serve this year and asking him to lead me where he wants me to serve has lead me to this other church. It’s awesome - even if you can’t see it
A
AlanFromWichita
Guest
Church Militant:
It was sad to see that going on, but now I think I’ll just believe the Holy Spirit is answering the Psalm we called out from that very Church – dead or not people at least uttered the words – “Lord send out your Spirit and renew the face of the earth.”
Alan
In the church I visited, it was clear the priest was not leaving on his own decision. Also I got the idea there were some pretty divisive parish politics going on. People we talked to after Mass in the parking lot were perfectly friendly and asked about our vacation and our home churches.
It was sad to see that going on, but now I think I’ll just believe the Holy Spirit is answering the Psalm we called out from that very Church – dead or not people at least uttered the words – “Lord send out your Spirit and renew the face of the earth.”
Alan
T
thistle
Guest
I fully agree. I was a Methodist and converted to the Catholic Faith when I was given the grace to see the truth about the Catholic Church. That was after 44 years of only having part of the truth as a Protestant. Now I’m almost 58.
It is therefore now incredible to me that anyone would go the other way from the fullness of the truth of Christ to only part of it.
J
JGravel
Guest
Wow, you just described my Catholic Church!!!
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