That Crazy, "Absurd" Anmesty International

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CanonAlberic

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Gotta love ol’ GW’s recent speech where he referred to Amnesty International’s condemnation of prisoner treatment in Gitmo as “Absurd”.
Uhhh, George, I remember not that long ago you praising AI for condemning Saddam’s treatment of dissenters in Iraq.
Can ya have it both ways, George? Or is an organization only “absurd” when they disagree with you, no matter what they’ve said in the past?
I guess it doesn’t matter, since the MSM and talk radio will back you up no matter what stumbles out of your mouth. Kinda like having a weatherman for President, eh? 😃

Peace.

PS: Yes, yes, I already know that I’m a dirty, unpatriotic commie for daring to say anything bad about King George II. Spare the snide remarks and actually address the hypocrisy, if you don’t mind.

Luv y’all!!

The Canon
 
You might simply be mis-informed about history. You do know what the gulags in the USSR were like, right?
 
Amnesty International is a highly respected organization. I’ve taken an interest in AI for decades and I think that not to listen to their conclusions is ‘absurd.’
Historically, the only Governments who diss AI are those with something to hide.
Many Bush supporters are in a kind of denial about Guantanamo.
The rest of the world is trying to tell us what is happening, but we have this ‘They’re all out of step except my Johnnie’ attitude.
Other countries are always wrong, we are right. Every day we make more and more enemies.
‘Love your enemies, do good to them that persecute you.’
Would Jesus blast the ears off people with non-stop loud heavy metal (often satanic) music? Would He?
maireteresa
 
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gilliam:
You might simply be mis-informed about history. You do know what the gulags in the USSR were like, right?
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Yes in large part thanks to Amnesty International, if you read their magazines back in the 70’s and 80’s you would have seen page after page depicting Human Rights violations in the USSR and its allies (not to mention Iraq and Saudi Arabia then US allies). Thats the whole point of AI, they expose Human Rights violations wherever they occur and whoever commits them.

British policy in Ireland and Spanish policy in the Basque Lands have been frequent and often justified targets of AI criticism. Those countries that have been fighting terrorism for decades know how strong the temptation is for States to cut corners and find some torture lite shortcut to ending a conflict. They have also learnt that it does not work.

In the name of truth and justice I urge the USA to listen to the voice of AI and learn from the European experience. You cannot countenance doing wrong so that good may come from it. Firstly it will not work. Secondly, and more importantly, wrong is wrong and no Christian can countenance it for that reason alone
 
Amnesty International has changed a lot since the 70s

If you know anything about the Gulags of the USSR there is absolutely no way you would compare what is happening at the Marine base on Cuba with a Gulag. To even hint at a comparison is sophomoric.

The European experience is Naziism, and what is happening in Cuba is not the mass murder of millions of innocents. To even hint at such a comparison is silly.

I plead with you guys to use a little common sense. And maybe learn some history.
 
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gilliam:
Amnesty International has changed a lot since the 70s

If you know anything about the Gulags of the USSR there is absolutely no way you would compare what is happening at the Marine base on Cuba with a Gulag. To even hint at a comparison is sophomoric.

The European experience is Naziism, and what is happening in Cuba is not the mass murder of millions of innocents. To even hint at such a comparison is silly.

I plead with you guys to use a little common sense. And maybe learn some history.
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so one justifies the actions in Guatanamo Bay based on the Russians actions in the Gulags? i.e "They were far worse than us therefore what we do is acceptable?

Interesting hypothesis!
 
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walstan:
so one justifies the actions in Guatanamo Bay based on the Russians actions in the Gulags? i.e "They were far worse than us therefore what we do is acceptable?

Interesting hypothesis!
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No, but you don’t say they are equal. What has happened in Guatanamo Bay is really quite minor in the scheme of things (and when you compare it with what has happened in history a non-issue). In fact the real news coming out of Guatanamo Bay for historians is just how well the prisoners are being treated considering their terrorist ties, what many of them did to Americans, and the fact that many who we have released have come back to kill again.

AI is simply off track here. Probably because of political bias.
 
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CanonAlberic:
Uhhh, George, I remember not that long ago you praising AI for condemning Saddam’s treatment of dissenters in Iraq.
Can ya have it both ways, George? Or is an organization only “absurd” when they disagree with you, no matter what they’ve said in the past?
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Why, of course. When AI sides with Bush, they’re on the side of the angels, when they disagree with our Administration, they’re absurd servants of Hell. Didn’t you know?
 
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CanonAlberic:
Gotta love ol’ GW’s recent speech where he referred to Amnesty International’s condemnation of prisoner treatment in Gitmo as “Absurd”.
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He’s entitled.
Can ya have it both ways, George? Or is an organization only “absurd” when they disagree with you, no matter what they’ve said in the past?
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Here and in your title, you misrepresent his statements. He called the condemnation absurd, not the organization. Very different things.
Uhhh, George, I remember not that long ago you praising AI for condemning Saddam’s treatment of dissenters in Iraq.
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O, To live in Canon Alberic’s peach-fuzz and moonbeam world, where we need never be troubled by moral clarity as we apologize on behalf of the Po’ Wittle Would Be Tewwowists.

I hate to rain on your parade, but:
  • “dissenter” does not equal “terrorist”
  • “domestic/peacetime” does not equal “foreign/wartime”
  • “loud music/uncomfortable conditions” does not equal “beatings, dismemberment and death, both for the offender and often other family members, before their eyes”
  • “freely supplied Korans, prayer mats, stenciled arrow pointing to Mecca on cell floors, and Muslim call to prayer five times daily” does not equal … ?
You get the idea.
I guess it doesn’t matter, since the MSM and talk radio will back you up no matter what stumbles out of your mouth.
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If by “MSM and talk radio” you mean “Fox News and conservative talk radio,” then sure. Surely you couldn’t have meant CNN, ABC, NBC, MSNBC, CBS and Air America. Curious definition of “MSM”, that.
Kinda like having a weatherman for President, eh? 😃
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I didn’t get this joke.
 
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marcadam:
Here and in your title, you misrepresent his statements. He called the condemnation absurd, not the organization. Very different things.

O, To live in Canon Alberic’s peach-fuzz and moonbeam world, where we need never be troubled by moral clarity as we apologize on behalf of the Po’ Wittle Would Be Tewwowists.

I hate to rain on your parade, but:
  • “dissenter” does not equal “terrorist”
  • “domestic/peacetime” does not equal “foreign/wartime”
  • “loud music/uncomfortable conditions” does not equal “beatings, dismemberment and death, both for the offender and often other family members, before their eyes”
  • “freely supplied Korans, prayer mats, stenciled arrow pointing to Mecca on cell floors, and Muslim call to prayer five times daily” does not equal … ?
You get the idea.

.
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Good post. For people to draw moral equivalencies between Gitmo and a Soviet gulag is absurd. For Amnesty to draw such an equivalency is absurd, and makes such a comparison to appear politically motivated.

The chairman of Amnesty USA contributed $2000 to the Kerry campaign (max allowable by law). Makes you wonder just how “non partisan” he can be.
washtimes.com/national/20050602-120456-1031r.htm
 
After reading the Washington Times article and seeing on the UK Amnesty Int site how they support Pride, the gay rights marching season, I’ve emailed their membership office just now cancelling my several-years-long membership. For victims of torture/persecution I support ‘Aid to the Church in Need’ instead (it’s cleaner)
 
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Thea:
After reading the Washington Times article and seeing on the UK Amnesty Int site how they support Pride, the gay rights marching season, I’ve emailed their membership office just now cancelling my several-years-long membership. For victims of torture/persecution I support ‘Aid to the Church in Need’ instead (it’s cleaner)
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Good for you Thea. I also will only donate through Catholic groups now due to the amount of overhead that many places charge. Also you can then be sure your money isn’t going to abortion, etc.
 
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Thea:
After reading the Washington Times article and seeing on the UK Amnesty Int site how they support Pride, the gay rights marching season, I’ve emailed their membership office just now cancelling my several-years-long membership. For victims of torture/persecution I support ‘Aid to the Church in Need’ instead (it’s cleaner)
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Amnesty International supports abortion and campaigns for greater lesbian rights, too.

Amnesty International declares that the US is worse than Zimbabwe.
 
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CanonAlberic:
Uhhh, George, I remember not that long ago you praising AI for condemning Saddam’s treatment of dissenters in Iraq.
Can ya have it both ways, George? Or is an organization only “absurd” when they disagree with you, no matter what they’ve said in the past?
Click to expand...
So it’s either people tell the truth all the time or they lie all the time? I don’t know what world you live in but it sounds like some nice utopia.

In the real world, people or organizations (Anmesty Int.) who lie, slander, defame, etc also tell the truth on occasion.

I wish everything was as perfect as you see it, then electing politicians would be easy! In your world, Santorum would not have campaigned for Specter because you can’t have it both ways. Once when someone tells the truth, they cannot lie. Once someone lies, they cannot tell the truth. Or in Santorum’s case, once you are pro-life, you can’t do anything pro-choice.
 
AI seems to have a mental block.

Maybe we should call them Amnesia International from now on.
 
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Lizzie:
Amnesty International declares that the US is worse than Zimbabwe.
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Horrible. I was very clear in my email to them exactly why I was ending my membership. It won’t change 'em but it might make 'em think
 
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Matt25:
In the name of truth and justice I urge the USA to listen to the voice of AI and learn from the European experience. You cannot countenance doing wrong so that good may come from it. Firstly it will not work. Secondly, and more importantly, wrong is wrong and no Christian can countenance it for that reason alone
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I hope the US investigates all charges of abuse and reviews their procedures. But to somehow compare it to the Gulags? Are you kidding? Organizations can lose credibility by doing things like this and it distracts from the real issue of whether some prisoner abuse is going on.

If the Democrats want to bring DeLay down, the worst way to do it is by going to the extreme and accusing him of acting like Adolf Hitler. The best way to do it is to make your accusations and finish off with the desire to find out if these claims and others are true or not.

AI shot themselves in the foot by going to the extreme. For those in Canada: the “whore and prostitute” comments by conservatives is another comparison. If you want to display your disgust with the actions of a female MP who switched political parties, you do not call her a whore or prostitute - you make your argument, rationally, one by one. Now if Belinda Stronach is/was a whore/prostitute, that is another story all together.

With Dean yelling that DeLay ought to be in prison, Amnesty International calling Gitmo a present day Gulag, Canadian MPs calling a fellow MP a prostitute, etc… the public is likely to tune them all out.

I’ll tell you, Bush is alot happier answering Gulag questions which he can laugh off, he does not even need to cover anything of substance. Here’s my question: Mr. President, some have compared you with Satan himself, what say you? (Huh? Who are we kidding here?)
 
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