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Luvtosew
Guest
I don’t know PR, I really don’t.
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LittleSoldier
Guest
If there was no first marriage, which would be the case if an annulment were issued, then I would be very happy to attend the wedding. I would love to! And I would happily be a member of the wedding party. But I obey God and I feel it would be hypocritical to stand in front of Him and hear two people make vows that at least one of them has broken. It’s saying “God, I promised to love my first husband for the rest of my life and I said that in front of You and all the people who attended the wedding. Well, I’m breaking that vow, even though you said let no man put it asunder and now I’m going to marry this man and I’m going to say that same vow and well, this time I mean it. I thought I meant it before but it just didn’t work. No hard feelings, eh?”
If my husband had beaten me I would have left him and we were married in the Church (although he wasn’t Catholic). But I wouldn’t have divorced him and I would never have remarried. He tried to hurt me badly and he almost shot me - while I was carrying our child. I would have left him then but there was no reason after that night he almost shot me because he died that night. And there was really no marriage. It would have been annulled - not because of the behavior that was leading to out-and-out beatings and the almost shooting but because we both lied to the priest who married us and kept some things secret.
I sinned by lying to the priest and made a mockery of a holy, sacred Sacrament and I am deeply ashamed of my behavior. It was as much my fault as my “husband’s” - actually it was more my fault because I was the Catholic (or pretending to be the Catholic). I mocked God.
Matrimony is so important and so inter-meshed with the rest of the Catholic faith. That’s why it’s a Sacrament. I didn’t treat it as that important but now I know better.
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LittleSoldier
Guest
Helping him to leave the KKK would be a spiritual act of mercy. Praying for him would be a spiritual act of mercy. And it would be hard. I can’t imagine it but if my brother joined the KKK he would probably spit in my face (literally) because he knows how much I loathe racism and the behavior of cowards who hide under sheets and lynch people - like any of us has any choice about how much pigment there is in our skin! Praying for someone who is so hurtful is hard for me. So I offer up the sadness and hurt for the good of his soul…
and that is a spiritual act of mercy.
I’m glad you agree about the KKK. I almost made the mistake of moving to Hayden, ID (or maybe it’s WA; it’s right on the border). At that time it was the national headquarters of Aryan Nation. It was also a beautiful little town and I didn’t know what was going on there. Fortunately I found out that my border collie didn’t like snow but loved the beach so we ended up moving to the Oregon coast. She protected me in more ways than one - best friend I have ever had and I miss her so much but I have a feeling we’ll be meeting up again some day.
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Luvtosew
Guest
You know I’m very very sorry about your tragic story, but often times people change when they get married, and not for the best as we know. I do hope you forgave yourself for lying to the Priest, no you didn’t mock God, you made a mistake , like every single one of us do, and time after time, no matter how hard we try. You say when you go married you were a Catholic in name only (pretending) so I do hope your not beating yourself up over this, do you not know already God has forgiven you and has forgot, but if you can’t forgive yourself , God can’t either, whatever we bind on earth will be bound in heaven.
I agree, no one should get married without thinking of it as a life long commitment, but unfortunately we live in a very selfish society, me,me, me, now , now , now.
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Luvtosew
Guest
No people like that scare me, thankfully I don’t have to worrry about it. I would not want to live by them either, yes good you collie didn’t like snow, I"m glad she got to enjoy the beach with you and sorry she is gone. I miss my cat, we get so attached to our pets hey.Helping him to leave the KKK would be a spiritual act of mercy. Praying for him would be a spiritual act of mercy. And it would be hard. I can’t imagine it but if my brother joined the KKK he would probably spit in my face (literally) because he knows how much I loathe racism and the behavior of cowards who hide under sheets and lynch people - like any of us has any choice about how much pigment there is in our skin! Praying for someone who is so hurtful is hard for me. So I offer up the sadness and hurt for the good of his soul…
and that is a spiritual act of mercy.
I’m glad you agree about the KKK. I almost made the mistake of moving to Hayden, ID (or maybe it’s WA; it’s right on the border). At that time it was the national headquarters of Aryan Nation. It was also a beautiful little town and I didn’t know what was going on there. Fortunately I found out that my border collie didn’t like snow but loved the beach so we ended up moving to the Oregon coast. She protected me in more ways than one - best friend I have ever had and I miss her so much but I have a feeling we’ll be meeting up again some day.
Yes I think we’ll have a lot of pleasant surprises waiting for us.
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Luvtosew
Guest
Little Soldier,
didn’t you use to have a dog as an avatar, was that your dog, did he recently pass?
didn’t you use to have a dog as an avatar, was that your dog, did he recently pass?
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PRmerger
Guest
OhmyGOSH, LS! I didn’t know! Thank you for sharing your story. And your humility is a gift to all of us here.
You have shared some beautiful insights about the sanctity of marriage and why we view it as sacred.
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1voice
Guest
Originally Posted by 1voice
If you take the position that what you believe is what God said … then you would naturally conclude that any other position is a false god.
God, in the Book of Amos, uses a plumb line to illustrate God’s standard of truth. Amos is shown, by God, that he is about to execute his judgement on Israel because they have consistently refused to line up with the standard that God expected … and Israel has worshipped false gods on the high places and in the sanctuaries …
Your position is that all spiritual truth is contained in the teachings of the Catholic Church. To you, those teachings are the plumb line (the standard by which all spiritual beliefs are measured)
Therefore… any belief or teaching that does not agree with Catholic doctrine/ teaching … is naturally false…
Therefore:
Your default position is that you are clearly right as long as you believe what the Catholic Church believes… and anyone that disagrees must be wrong or confused or deluded or misinformed.
Since … you take the position that what you believe is what God said (through the Catholic Church) …
So then … you would naturally conclude that any other position is a false god (false teaching/ idea)
If you take the position that what you believe is what God said … then you would naturally conclude that any other position is a false god.
We are discussing spiritual truth.Could you please expound on this? I’m not following.
God, in the Book of Amos, uses a plumb line to illustrate God’s standard of truth. Amos is shown, by God, that he is about to execute his judgement on Israel because they have consistently refused to line up with the standard that God expected … and Israel has worshipped false gods on the high places and in the sanctuaries …
Your position is that all spiritual truth is contained in the teachings of the Catholic Church. To you, those teachings are the plumb line (the standard by which all spiritual beliefs are measured)
Therefore… any belief or teaching that does not agree with Catholic doctrine/ teaching … is naturally false…
Therefore:
Your default position is that you are clearly right as long as you believe what the Catholic Church believes… and anyone that disagrees must be wrong or confused or deluded or misinformed.
Since … you take the position that what you believe is what God said (through the Catholic Church) …
So then … you would naturally conclude that any other position is a false god (false teaching/ idea)
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1voice
Guest
My heart goes out to you. God is such a wonderful, forgiving Savior. I pray that he heals every wound in your heart and mind so that you cant even remember the pain.
I sense that you are very precious in the sight of the Lord.
God bless you and your child and all of the family that God gives to you. May you be blessed with wonderful friends and a wonderful fellowship with the Lord. The Oregon coast has got to be the best place in the world to raise kids. (have you driven by the sign on 101 that says “pig farm, No pigs” Oink!"
near Sand Lake / Tierra Del Mar ?) I spent lots of summer weekends there near Pacific City … Creating wonderful memories with my daughter.
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PRmerger
Guest
Ah, I see now.
One point of clarification with your comment that I bolded. The Catholic Church proclaims that all spiritual truth is contained in the teachings of Christ. Now, the ONLY way you or I know anything that Christ said is through the CC, so, in a sense you are correct.
So, if you could please answer the question that I’ve already asked twice to you, 1voice.
Is your fallback paradigm: if Scripture is silent, then it is forbidden? Or is it if Scripture is silent then it is permissible?
Also, is there any view/belief/issue that you’ve changed based on God’s revelation? Or have you found a church that corresponds to your own views?
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1voice
Guest
One of several areas is healing. I never understood it. never experienced “miraculous” healing … just accepted things as they were. Had no concept. Over a period of time and contact with people that had experienced “miraculous” healing … I began to study and research in the Bible and slowly … over time realized that healing is real… The revelation came when I went to Eddie Dunavan’s house/ prayer meeting… a steel worker that lived with his family off Carson St on the South Side of Pittsburgh PA every Thursday nite for about 2 years … because my friend told me that Eddie had a gift of healing and lots of people got healed and blessed when he taught out of the Bible. I was in my 20’s at the time …but I had serious stomach problems and had not been able to hold down much more than a couple of bites for over a year. Eddie taught. I listened and studied like I was taking the exam of my life. Finally one night Eddie said … there is someone sitting on the steps ( the place was packed and I got there late that night) There is someone sitting down on the steps that has had stomach problems for a long time. Dont worry about it anymore … God has healed you. I ate a big bowl of stew that night and waited… nothing happened. I was delighted and amazed and never had a problem since.Ah, I see now.
One point of clarification with your comment that I bolded. The Catholic Church proclaims that all spiritual truth is contained in the teachings of Christ. Now, the ONLY way you or I know anything that Christ said is through the CC, so, in a sense you are correct.
PRmerger;9185021:
Well, Scripture is silent on how many beers are permissible at McMiniman Pub on Friday night … but if I go much beyond 2 pints on an empty stomach … God forbid! …
Also, is there any view/belief/issue that you’ve changed based on God’s revelation? Or have you found a church that corresponds to your own views?
But Eddie was not always going to be there. … and lots of situations arose in life where people needed help and healing … so I determined to learn how to understand God and how healing worked … if possible. Long story short … Over time I learned that God wants to heal way more than people realize or understand how to receive. I learned how to pray for all kinds of things… Migraines, Cancer, Cerebral Palsy … You name it … and see people completely healed. A month or so ago I was talking with a friend from Church. I was turning to go when … In my mind I saw the interior of a heart pumping but no blood flowing. I mentioned it to him and asked if it meant anything to him… He said that his 80 yr old Dad had a valve that was not pumping correctly in his heart. He was scheduled for surgery. We prayed that Jesus would grant him perfect health. The next day his Dad (who had no idea that we had prayed) called him and said that he felt like a kid again. He hadnt been able to walk 20 feet without sotting down exhausted. His Dad didnt have to have the surgery and hes fine. It amazes me every time God does it. I just explain to people that Jesus can do anything. He lives today as much as he did 2000+ years ago and he wants to show you his love and that he is God… and he wants you well. Then I pray. Thats all.
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GaryTaylor
Guest
I hear ya, thats a good thing, if we think evangelical-mainline/oldline-Catholic, than your basically following mainline/oldline?
Yes, Luv there are Catholics who say “Yes I am Catholic but I think for myself”. I can relate.
And it really became a matter of “thinking for myself”, so I could think with the Church. I think for myself not to come up with my own teaching, but to make the Church teachings my own.
Souls often say they have a problem with one teaching or another. Thats not really a problem. The problem arises when we assume that the problem is with the teaching and not with ourselves.
Often this pattern follows like minds, in that it builds confidence in each other. So you can with confidence state. “Well lots of people even lapsed Catholics are out here doing this or that, so. we can’t all be wrong. maybe its the Church.”
St Augustine state’s “No one believes anything unless one first thought it believable. Everything that is believed, is believed after being preceded by thought. Not everyone who thinks believes, ‘SINCE MANY THINK IN ORDER NOT TO BELIEVE’; but everyone who believes thinks, thinks in believeing and believes in thinking.”
Lapsed Catholic’s are something. You notice they still claim “Catholic” though. They are like children doing wrong and not wanting to face their “Mother-Church”. And often the attitude which became the issue is Mother became just to demanding, much to overbearing. “I can think for myself now Mom”.
Which isn’t to say mainline/oldline protestants are not very good Christians. Lapsed Catholics usually use the reverse approach stating I’m Catholic but not a very good one.
But I understand the Creed from your perspective. Everyone has a Creed, some either don’t know it, or refuse to admit it. Yet its a “Doctrine” derived from the Bible. Not a strict verse in the Bible. Thus you complied a set of verse’s to conclude a Doctrine which states your belief, and that belief is “not” explicitly defined in the Bible by a specific chapter/verse. So then not hard to see how the CC devolopes Doctrine then.
Yet when you say “I meant by spread its around, although there are many verses” you would mean like Ark of Covenant verse some page’s back
Just Saying Luv.
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GaryTaylor
Guest
All good, you realize suffering in a state of Grace, is sanctifying Grace also? Apostle Paul since we been talking about him is a perfect example, or Stephan.
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GaryTaylor
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First, Christ healed specific individuals. Never once do we read a passage where Jesus say’s anything like,
A muscle condition has been healed. I give you the praise. Just now lift your hands and call upon His precious name, dear Jesus, dear Jesus, dear Jesus. Sinuses have just been healed, I give you praise. A neck injury has been healed, I give you the praise. In the audience God is touching people right now right here, the Lord is touching many of you in this audience right here in this studio, I give you praise Jesus. In your homes, many of you are being healed. Someone’s shoulders have just been released from pain, someone with a shoulder problem has just been healed, I give you praise Jesus
Yet this is standard fare among faith healers.
Which isn’t to say your stomach in not healed. Let me give you an example. I also had a stomach issue, tomato sauce, spicey foods became an issue. I was eating TUMS by the bottle and thought, well maybe I should go to the Doctor and have this checked out.
However I went to Church as usual and miraculously my stomach issue resided? Now I could say God healed me. Can I say Miracle? I have no idea what happened. I give thanks in my prayers.
Webster’s Dictionary defines a miracle as, “an extraordinary event manifesting a supernatural work of God.”
(1) Norman Geisler similarly defines a miracle as, “a special act of God in the world, a supernatural interference into nature, a special divine intervention.” (2) He further goes on to state, “A miracle is not simply an extraordinary event but one that would not have occurred without special divine intervention.” (3)This definition of miracles is significant for evaluating modern faith healers. It may be conceded that many sick and hurting people leave feeling better, but this is not the same as saying that they have been cured miraculously. There are numerous possible explanations for apparent healings as we will see. “Rev. Keith Gibson”
Now I would say for “positive” that Our Lady [MARY] appeared at Fatima. Just to bring this conversation back around to where its intended by the OP not to get off on another topic. You see their, the Miracle was predicted, dated, occured on schedule, witnessed by thousands, and defied all laws of Nature. A direct Supernatural intervention by GOD.
However, you see the Biblical difference?
A muscle condition has been healed. I give you the praise. Just now lift your hands and call upon His precious name, dear Jesus, dear Jesus, dear Jesus. Sinuses have just been healed, I give you praise. A neck injury has been healed, I give you the praise. In the audience God is touching people right now right here, the Lord is touching many of you in this audience right here in this studio, I give you praise Jesus. In your homes, many of you are being healed. Someone’s shoulders have just been released from pain, someone with a shoulder problem has just been healed, I give you praise Jesus
Yet this is standard fare among faith healers.
Which isn’t to say your stomach in not healed. Let me give you an example. I also had a stomach issue, tomato sauce, spicey foods became an issue. I was eating TUMS by the bottle and thought, well maybe I should go to the Doctor and have this checked out.
However I went to Church as usual and miraculously my stomach issue resided? Now I could say God healed me. Can I say Miracle? I have no idea what happened. I give thanks in my prayers.
Webster’s Dictionary defines a miracle as, “an extraordinary event manifesting a supernatural work of God.”
(1) Norman Geisler similarly defines a miracle as, “a special act of God in the world, a supernatural interference into nature, a special divine intervention.” (2) He further goes on to state, “A miracle is not simply an extraordinary event but one that would not have occurred without special divine intervention.” (3)This definition of miracles is significant for evaluating modern faith healers. It may be conceded that many sick and hurting people leave feeling better, but this is not the same as saying that they have been cured miraculously. There are numerous possible explanations for apparent healings as we will see. “Rev. Keith Gibson”
Now I would say for “positive” that Our Lady [MARY] appeared at Fatima. Just to bring this conversation back around to where its intended by the OP not to get off on another topic. You see their, the Miracle was predicted, dated, occured on schedule, witnessed by thousands, and defied all laws of Nature. A direct Supernatural intervention by GOD.
However, you see the Biblical difference?
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PRmerger
Guest
Beautifully said, Gary. Simply beautiful.
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GaryTaylor
Guest
My prayers are with you. Soldier for the Lord:thumbsup:
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PRmerger
Guest
Firstly, 1voice, if you would please not nest your responses. The comment above was nested and it requires extra work for me to have it appear in your response block. Thanks.
Secondly, from the comment above, plus your comment on Scripture being silent on Mary being a source of grace, it would be correct, then, to say that your position is: if Scripture is silent, then it is forbidden.
So this brings me to have a few questions for you:
-does your church have a steeple? If so, as Scripture is silent on whether churches should have steeples, it ought to be forbidden, no? And your church is doing something contrary to the Scriptures.
-does your church offer instrumental music durings its worship services? If so, as Scripture is silent on this issue, it’s forbidden, right? And your church is doing something contrary to Scripture.
(There are indeed [some denominations](Well, Scripture is silent on how many beers are permissible at McMiniman Pub on Friday night … but if I go much beyond 2 pints on an empty stomach … God forbid! …) that feel so strongly that Jesus did not say anything about musical instruments when worshipping that they have splintered off and formed their own congregation! This, sadly, is the fruit of the reformation which offered the paradigm that one can simply form his own church when one disagrees with his pastor.
)So you can see, 1voice, how having a fall back position that if Scripture is silent it’s forbidden can be a problem, right?
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LittleSoldier
Guest
That is why there is a Sacrament of Reconciliation. When I sinned I turned away from God. By confessing and atoning I not only was forgiven by God but received grace in the form of strength to not do that sort of thing again. And now I pay special attention to lying. I don’t lie. I had to forgive myself because if I didn’t I was putting myself above God and that really is pride - an awful sin.
We do. And it’s very unfortunate.
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PRmerger
Guest
Interesting, 1voice. Food for thought, to be sure.
However, that’s not quite what I was looking for. I’m looking for something that you have changed your view on, because that’s what God has said,** and for no other reason. ** What have you have conformed your views to Christ’s,** even though you would prefer that it’s the other way around.?**
Your personal experience with healing made you a believer.
I want you to provide some belief that you’ve changed because it’s God’s law, and you would prefer it to be a different law. (law here used quite loosely).
Also note, saying, “Feeding the poor is something I wish God hadn’t said, but I do it because God said to!” and things of this nature is passing the buck. That’s also* not* an example of what I’m looking for, because we all know it’s the right thing to do, even if God didn’t say so.
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LittleSoldier
Guest
I switch my avatars a lot. I don’t use pictures of my animals (I also have six cats) because I don’t know how. So I use photos I’ve found online. I’ll change it today to one of my favorites - a dog that is really grinning. I requested permission to use it and never received a response so I’m assuming it’s OK.
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