The Benedictine School

[OraLabora]

It’s as if wanting clarity makes you a demon. We can’t just ignore these things and pretend they never happened (even though I personally think that would be an excellent solution in some areas) because NCR-esque zealots still rant and rave about Vatican II, and the worst part is that it is very easy for the ignorant and new, poorly-catechized converts to fall into their traps because their language is so sympathetic to modern culture.

So I would personally like to not have to think about Vatican II, but if I did that right now then I would essentially feel as if I was betraying the Church. Sort of like a sin of omission.

I don’t think wanting clarity makes you a demon. I think though wanting clarity is an unrealistic expectation, simply given the nature of human nature. Even in a small monastic community there’s still conflict on how to interpret the 1500 year-old Rule of St. Benedict. I think it’s unrealistic to expect 100% clarity and 100% uniformity in the interpretation of Vatican II.

If I might be so bold to venture an opinion, and I hope you don’t take this the wrong way but instead take it as a bit of wisdom (I hope!) from someone who has been where you are. You have the word “young” in your handle. I’m going to interpret this, for the purpose of what I am going to share with you, as meaning “young” in faith-years, not necessarily in years since birth, because this applies to anyone new in the faith regardless of physical age.

Don’t spend too much time worrying about doctrine and correct interpretation of doctrine. The Church has theologians for that. Take it from the Benedictines, is just not something actively discussed or contemplated on a daily basis. It is there, but it is at a level in the Church that is way beyond our pay grade as it were. We let the Holy Father and the Magisterium worry about that.

What Benedictines work on is deep inner conversion. It’s in the Rule, perhaps most eloquently expressed in the 12 degrees of humility. Inner conversion is also part of our Oblate promise and part of the profession of monks. As pnewton points out there will always be teachings we wrestle with. Work, prayerfully, on those.

Satisfy yourself with the Promise of the Keys and that the gates of Hades will never prevail against the Church, in spite of all the foibles of her laity, her clergy and her hierarchy.

The rest should just all become background noise; SSPX, EF vs OF, liturgical mistakes and abuse…

However, a key thing about accepting all this with grace and working instead on our own inner conversion, is to come face-to-face with our own foibles and limitations; to accept ourselves as we are, and work on converting ourselves, by accepting our nature. Only then can we start real conversion. Alas I think it requires passing through the Dark Night of the Soul.

I don’t say this lightly. I went through a particularly challenging and long (measured in years) time in the spiritual desert before I came to realize the problem was not others (e.g. those who seem to misuse Vatican II, those who I blamed for my foibles), the problem was staring me in the mirror.

It’s only in falling ourselves that we can rise. We rise through falling, and we fall through exaltation. Jacob’s ladder. Trying to look for perfection in doctrine and adherence to doctrine, only leads to heartache.

Been there, done that, got the t-shirt…

 

[jwinch2]

Don’t spend too much time worrying about doctrine and correct interpretation of doctrine. The Church has theologians for that. Take it from the Benedictines, is just not something actively discussed or contemplated on a daily basis. It is there, but it is at a level in the Church that is way beyond our pay grade as it were. We let the Holy Father and the Magisterium worry about that.

What Benedictines work on is deep inner conversion. It’s in the Rule, perhaps most eloquently expressed in the 12 degrees of humility. Inner conversion is also part of our Oblate promise and part of the profession of monks. As pnewton points out there will always be teachings we wrestle with. Work, prayerfully, on those.

Very good advice. Advice that I stink at following, but its good nonetheless.

Peace,

 

[JReducation]

I don’t think wanting clarity makes you a demon. I think though wanting clarity is an unrealistic expectation, simply given the nature of human nature. Even in a small monastic community there’s still conflict on how to interpret the 1500 year-old Rule of St. Benedict. I think it’s unrealistic to expect 100% clarity and 100% uniformity in the interpretation of Vatican II.

If I might be so bold to venture an opinion, and I hope you don’t take this the wrong way but instead take it as a bit of wisdom (I hope!) from someone who has been where you are. You have the word “young” in your handle. I’m going to interpret this, for the purpose of what I am going to share with you, as meaning “young” in faith-years, not necessarily in years since birth, because this applies to anyone new in the faith regardless of physical age.

Don’t spend too much time worrying about doctrine and correct interpretation of doctrine. The Church has theologians for that. Take it from the Benedictines, is just not something actively discussed or contemplated on a daily basis. It is there, but it is at a level in the Church that is way beyond our pay grade as it were. We let the Holy Father and the Magisterium worry about that.

What Benedictines work on is deep inner conversion. It’s in the Rule, perhaps most eloquently expressed in the 12 degrees of humility. Inner conversion is also part of our Oblate promise and part of the profession of monks. As pnewton points out there will always be teachings we wrestle with. Work, prayerfully, on those.

Satisfy yourself with the Promise of the Keys and that the gates of Hades will never prevail against the Church, in spite of all the foibles of her laity, her clergy and her hierarchy.

The rest should just all become background noise; SSPX, EF vs OF, liturgical mistakes and abuse…

However, a key thing about accepting all this with grace and working instead on our own inner conversion, is to come face-to-face with our own foibles and limitations; to accept ourselves as we are, and work on converting ourselves, by accepting our nature. Only then can we start real conversion. Alas I think it requires passing through the Dark Night of the Soul.

I don’t say this lightly. I went through a particularly challenging and long (measured in years) time in the spiritual desert before I came to realize the problem was not others (e.g. those who seem to misuse Vatican II, those who I blamed for my foibles), the problem was staring me in the mirror.

It’s only in falling ourselves that we can rise. We rise through falling, and we fall through exaltation. Jacob’s ladder. Trying to look for perfection in doctrine and adherence to doctrine, only leads to heartache.

Been there, done that, got the t-shirt…

Excellent

This is why if you ask a Franciscan or Dominican about Vatican II and the SSPX they’ll just say

We don’t worry about what has nothing to do with us. Like St. Benedict says, so does St. Francis, work out your own salvation. Don’t make it your mission to save the world. That’s Christ’s mission. We all know what we have to do day by day. When something new comes up, we pray, we discuss it with a friend, a spiritual director, a spouse or someone with common sense and then we choose what to do.

Like the Benedictines, Dominicans and Franciscans, not only the ones who live in the cloisters, but also the lay members who live in the world, all of this is interesting and it kills time. But it’s not important to us, because our salvation depends on doing the laundry with great love. Making it to mass and praying the mass with charity and trust. Doing penance for our sins. Being less attached to our opinions, likes, and aspirations and more attached to Divine Providence. Laughter, always laughter.

I tell the novices that if they don’t learn to laugh they will not be admitted to vows. Christ always laughed at the silliness of the people around him. The novices ask me, “Father, how do you know? The bible does not mention him laughing.”

My answer is, “The bible tells us that he cried. People who cry also laugh. You can’t have a coin without head and tail. Why did the children want to come to him? Because he was non-threatening, kind and charming. You can’t fool kids.”

That’s how Benedict, Dominic and Francis would tell us to deal with all of this stuff. Focus on what pertains to our salvation. Our salvation depends on fidelity to our duties, spiritual and material duties.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, FFV

 

[Cat]

I don’t think wanting clarity makes you a demon. I think though wanting clarity is an unrealistic expectation, simply given the nature of human nature. Even in a small monastic community there’s still conflict on how to interpret the 1500 year-old Rule of St. Benedict. I think it’s unrealistic to expect 100% clarity and 100% uniformity in the interpretation of Vatican II.

If I might be so bold to venture an opinion, and I hope you don’t take this the wrong way but instead take it as a bit of wisdom (I hope!) from someone who has been where you are. You have the word “young” in your handle. I’m going to interpret this, for the purpose of what I am going to share with you, as meaning “young” in faith-years, not necessarily in years since birth, because this applies to anyone new in the faith regardless of physical age.

Don’t spend too much time worrying about doctrine and correct interpretation of doctrine. The Church has theologians for that. Take it from the Benedictines, is just not something actively discussed or contemplated on a daily basis. It is there, but it is at a level in the Church that is way beyond our pay grade as it were. We let the Holy Father and the Magisterium worry about that.

What Benedictines work on is deep inner conversion. It’s in the Rule, perhaps most eloquently expressed in the 12 degrees of humility. Inner conversion is also part of our Oblate promise and part of the profession of monks. As pnewton points out there will always be teachings we wrestle with. Work, prayerfully, on those.

Satisfy yourself with the Promise of the Keys and that the gates of Hades will never prevail against the Church, in spite of all the foibles of her laity, her clergy and her hierarchy.

The rest should just all become background noise; SSPX, EF vs OF, liturgical mistakes and abuse…

However, a key thing about accepting all this with grace and working instead on our own inner conversion, is to come face-to-face with our own foibles and limitations; to accept ourselves as we are, and work on converting ourselves, by accepting our nature. Only then can we start real conversion. Alas I think it requires passing through the Dark Night of the Soul.

I don’t say this lightly. I went through a particularly challenging and long (measured in years) time in the spiritual desert before I came to realize the problem was not others (e.g. those who seem to misuse Vatican II, those who I blamed for my foibles), the problem was staring me in the mirror.

It’s only in falling ourselves that we can rise. We rise through falling, and we fall through exaltation. Jacob’s ladder. Trying to look for perfection in doctrine and adherence to doctrine, only leads to heartache.

Been there, done that, got the t-shirt…

What a wonderful, helpful post! I have printed it out and am carrying it with me to meditate on.

JR Education, I have started a thread in the “Spirituality” section, and I have quoted this post and asked you a question about one of the paragraphs. I know you are extremely busy, but if you get a little time, please check out my thread, and perhaps you have some sage advice for me and others who might be wondering about the same question.

Thank you.

 

[TimothyH]

I don’t think wanting clarity makes you a demon. I think though wanting clarity is an unrealistic expectation, simply given the nature of human nature. Even in a small monastic community there’s still conflict on how to interpret the 1500 year-old Rule of St. Benedict. I think it’s unrealistic to expect 100% clarity and 100% uniformity in the interpretation of Vatican II.

If I might be so bold to venture an opinion, and I hope you don’t take this the wrong way but instead take it as a bit of wisdom (I hope!) from someone who has been where you are. You have the word “young” in your handle. I’m going to interpret this, for the purpose of what I am going to share with you, as meaning “young” in faith-years, not necessarily in years since birth, because this applies to anyone new in the faith regardless of physical age.

Don’t spend too much time worrying about doctrine and correct interpretation of doctrine. The Church has theologians for that. Take it from the Benedictines, is just not something actively discussed or contemplated on a daily basis. It is there, but it is at a level in the Church that is way beyond our pay grade as it were. We let the Holy Father and the Magisterium worry about that.

What Benedictines work on is deep inner conversion. It’s in the Rule, perhaps most eloquently expressed in the 12 degrees of humility. Inner conversion is also part of our Oblate promise and part of the profession of monks. As pnewton points out there will always be teachings we wrestle with. Work, prayerfully, on those.

Satisfy yourself with the Promise of the Keys and that the gates of Hades will never prevail against the Church, in spite of all the foibles of her laity, her clergy and her hierarchy.

The rest should just all become background noise; SSPX, EF vs OF, liturgical mistakes and abuse…

However, a key thing about accepting all this with grace and working instead on our own inner conversion, is to come face-to-face with our own foibles and limitations; to accept ourselves as we are, and work on converting ourselves, by accepting our nature. Only then can we start real conversion. Alas I think it requires passing through the Dark Night of the Soul.

I don’t say this lightly. I went through a particularly challenging and long (measured in years) time in the spiritual desert before I came to realize the problem was not others (e.g. those who seem to misuse Vatican II, those who I blamed for my foibles), the problem was staring me in the mirror.

It’s only in falling ourselves that we can rise. We rise through falling, and we fall through exaltation. Jacob’s ladder. Trying to look for perfection in doctrine and adherence to doctrine, only leads to heartache.

Been there, done that, got the t-shirt…

This is an excellent post.

The first time I went to the monastery I tried to engage a monk in a discussion of some doctrine or another, and he looked at me like I had three heads, as if he wanted to say “Why are you talking to me about this?”

I was very unprepared for the deep sense of spirituality and lack worry about doctrine and dogma or systematic theology.

I asked one of the monks about vows, and he said that the Benedictine’s do not vow poverty or chastity, but obedience to the abbot and the rule, stability to the community and way of life, and ongoing conversion. That deep inner conversion took me by surprise, and after my visit, for the first time in my Christian life, I was able to put down the books on doctrine and dogma and just pray, and love God.

Trying to look for perfection in doctrine and adherence to doctrine, only leads to heartache.

Been there, done that, got the t-shirt…

Well put and so bears repeating.

-Tim-

 

[Melchior_1]

I don’t think wanting clarity makes you a demon. I think though wanting clarity is an unrealistic expectation, simply given the nature of human nature. Even in a small monastic community there’s still conflict on how to interpret the 1500 year-old Rule of St. Benedict. I think it’s unrealistic to expect 100% clarity and 100% uniformity in the interpretation of Vatican II.

If I might be so bold to venture an opinion, and I hope you don’t take this the wrong way but instead take it as a bit of wisdom (I hope!) from someone who has been where you are. You have the word “young” in your handle. I’m going to interpret this, for the purpose of what I am going to share with you, as meaning “young” in faith-years, not necessarily in years since birth, because this applies to anyone new in the faith regardless of physical age.

Don’t spend too much time worrying about doctrine and correct interpretation of doctrine. The Church has theologians for that. Take it from the Benedictines, is just not something actively discussed or contemplated on a daily basis. It is there, but it is at a level in the Church that is way beyond our pay grade as it were. We let the Holy Father and the Magisterium worry about that.

What Benedictines work on is deep inner conversion. It’s in the Rule, perhaps most eloquently expressed in the 12 degrees of humility. Inner conversion is also part of our Oblate promise and part of the profession of monks. As pnewton points out there will always be teachings we wrestle with. Work, prayerfully, on those.

Satisfy yourself with the Promise of the Keys and that the gates of Hades will never prevail against the Church, in spite of all the foibles of her laity, her clergy and her hierarchy.

The rest should just all become background noise; SSPX, EF vs OF, liturgical mistakes and abuse…

However, a key thing about accepting all this with grace and working instead on our own inner conversion, is to come face-to-face with our own foibles and limitations; to accept ourselves as we are, and work on converting ourselves, by accepting our nature. Only then can we start real conversion. Alas I think it requires passing through the Dark Night of the Soul.

I don’t say this lightly. I went through a particularly challenging and long (measured in years) time in the spiritual desert before I came to realize the problem was not others (e.g. those who seem to misuse Vatican II, those who I blamed for my foibles), the problem was staring me in the mirror.

It’s only in falling ourselves that we can rise. We rise through falling, and we fall through exaltation. Jacob’s ladder. Trying to look for perfection in doctrine and adherence to doctrine, only leads to heartache.

Been there, done that, got the t-shirt…

You, sir, have done us a great service by posting this. Thank you.

This is an excellent post.

The first time I went to the monastery I tried to engage a monk in a discussion of some doctrine or another, and he looked at me like I had three heads, as if he wanted to say “Why are you talking to me about this?”

I was very unprepared for the deep sense of spirituality and lack worry about doctrine and dogma or systematic theology.

I asked one of the monks about vows, and he said that the Benedictine’s do not vow poverty or chastity, but obedience to the abbot and the rule, stability to the community and way of life, and ongoing conversion. That deep inner conversion took me by surprise, and after my visit, for the first time in my Christian life, I was able to put down the books on doctrine and dogma and just pray, and love God.

-Tim-

Tim, you know how much I love this story? Every time I read thsi I smile. Thank you, again, for sharing.

 

[JReducation]

You, sir, have done us a great service by posting this. Thank you.

Tim, you know how much I love this story? Every time I read thsi I smile. Thank you, again, for sharing.

The call to holiness has nothing to do with rites, rituals, theology, dogma and definitions. The call to holiness is about the perfection of love. When St. Bonaventure wrote the biography of St. Francis, he wrote a sequal to it called The Journey Into the Mind of God. It’s very Benedictine.

In his first work, he gives you all of the biographical details about Francis and how great he was, etc etc.

In this second work, Bonaventure proves to you that what made him the most perfect image of Christ was that he loved as Christ loved. He entered into the mind of Christ and began to think like Christ. Christ does not sit around deciding between CITH or COTT, EF or OF, Latin or Italian.

Christ obeys the will of the Father. Benedict capture this perfectly in his stages of obedience. Francis shows you what happens to you when you apply those stages. Someone like Mother Teresa shows us what Christ can achieve through you if you obey.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, FFV

 

[OraLabora]

You, sir, have done us a great service by posting this. Thank you.

Tim, you know how much I love this story? Every time I read thsi I smile. Thank you, again, for sharing.

Thanks all, for the kind words. I hesitated before posting… I didn’t want to sound like I was putting YoungTradCath down. Rather that I was in his shoes once too and I think it’s a necessary aspect of growing in spiritual maturity.

I also love Tim’s story because it’s so true.

Brother JR’s comment about laughing is also very true. I’ve seen humourless monks leave even after quite a long time. I’ve seen monks who simply say they’ll take it one day at a time hang on. One brother, now in his 40s (he was in his early 30s when I first came to the abbey), said just that, he takes it one day at a time. He works the apple orchard. In the fall it’s quite customary to see him on his tractor, and he looks so completely at ease, and obviously gets so much pleasure putting around on his tractor… you know he “gets it”. He is slowly converting.

The job of the Benedictines is not to study doctrine. Of course they have to study it if they become ordained, but once ordained it settles back into the background. Debating and determining doctrine is not part of their job. Obedience however is, not only obedience to the abbot or prior, but obedience to the Holy Father. With that obedience, they let the doctrine be dealt with where it belongs, the Holy Father and the Magisterium. Someone else has that job. The monk’s job is to live according to the Rule, and to incarnate Benedictine spirituality.

That’s why in spiritual direction, in the confessional, and in life in general the only “rule” you hear them talk about is the “Rule”. And they apply St. Benedict’s in-built flexibility that was in the context of his times, to current times. Which means that they don’t live to the letter of the rule but to its spirit. That’s why for instance there are son many Divine Office schemas among Benedictines. The main one is the one suggested by St. Benedict, but the others come from the in-built flexibility that St Benedict wisely inserted into his Rule, that allows for the abbot to select others. I apply the same flexibility to my own life, using the abbey’s schema on a 2-week cycle (the abbey does it in 1 week) during most of the year, but lightening to the Roman Office when I travel or during summer months. Sometimes I get obsessed with which Office to follow… and I have to remind myself of St. Benedict’s flexibility as it applies to my life in the secular world.

In the confessional, you won’t be directed into the type of “come in with a list” of sins type of confession that you read here, i.e. a list of “rules” that you “broke”, nor will you hear an obsession about whether your sin was “mortal” or not. The confessor is very orthodox, the abbey’s historian, over 80 years old, and extremely wise. Instead he gently moves you to work on your conversion. He pushes you towards effort, not towards result. The effort that he does help you work on, is your conversion, and it’s a life-long effort. It’s through your conversion that slowly you turn away from sin. Following the rules superficially leads to a huge fall.

I know that because it happened to me.

The monastery is a cloister. For an oblate, the only consistent cloister we have is our hearts. The thing is though, is that few of us (even oblates) dare to actually venture, really venture, into that cloister. Like a closet it contains everything about you, and many of those things simply aren’t at all pretty.

It all happened very recently to me; it happened at a monastery in France, in their small rarely used 11th century chapel on the side of a hill, where I confronted my main demon, said to God “this is who I am”, and started to feel His mercy, and conversion. It resulted in a healing process, and in a huge miracle: my faltering marriage turned around. My wife went through a similar process. We blamed each other for the wreck that our marriage was. This was the key point: only when we were ready to accept our own foibles, to accept ourselves as we are, with both its beauty and ugliness, can we come to accept the foibles of others. It’s a really important notion for living in community, including the community that is a family formed within a marriage.

This is far, far more important than any doctrinal battles, including whether the SSPX ever comes back into full communion. Whether they do or not, is immaterial to my inner conversion. Whether anyone ever fully understands and clearly expresses Vatican II in a definitive manner, is immaterial to my inner conversion. I still have work to do though, as I myself am very much attracted to the liturgical beauty of the Benedictine Mass but continue to be put off by what goes on in the parish. But that’s my bad. It’s not the parish’s fault. They are just being the imperfect humans that they are, and I demand too much of them.

Turn the gaze inwards, not outwards. That’s where you will find God waiting to help you.

 

[JReducation]

Thanks all, for the kind words. I hesitated before posting… I didn’t want to sound like I was putting YoungTradCath down. Rather that I was in his shoes once too and I think it’s a necessary aspect of growing in spiritual maturity.

I also love Tim’s story because it’s so true.

Brother JR’s comment about laughing is also very true. I’ve seen humourless monks leave even after quite a long time. I’ve seen monks who simply say they’ll take it one day at a time hang on. One brother, now in his 40s (he was in his early 30s when I first came to the abbey), said just that, he takes it one day at a time. He works the apple orchard. In the fall it’s quite customary to see him on his tractor, and he looks so completely at ease, and obviously gets so much pleasure putting around on his tractor… you know he “gets it”. He is slowly converting.

The job of the Benedictines is not to study doctrine. Of course they have to study it if they become ordained, but once ordained it settles back into the background. Debating and determining doctrine is not part of their job. Obedience however is, not only obedience to the abbot or prior, but obedience to the Holy Father. With that obedience, they let the doctrine be dealt with where it belongs, the Holy Father and the Magisterium. Someone else has that job. The monk’s job is to live according to the Rule, and to incarnate Benedictine spirituality.

That’s why in spiritual direction, in the confessional, and in life in general the only “rule” you hear them talk about is the “Rule”. And they apply St. Benedict’s in-built flexibility that was in the context of his times, to current times. Which means that they don’t live to the letter of the rule but to its spirit. That’s why for instance there are son many Divine Office schemas among Benedictines. The main one is the one suggested by St. Benedict, but the others come from the in-built flexibility that St Benedict wisely inserted into his Rule, that allows for the abbot to select others. I apply the same flexibility to my own life, using the abbey’s schema on a 2-week cycle (the abbey does it in 1 week) during most of the year, but lightening to the Roman Office when I travel or during summer months. Sometimes I get obsessed with which Office to follow… and I have to remind myself of St. Benedict’s flexibility as it applies to my life in the secular world.

In the confessional, you won’t be directed into the type of “come in with a list” of sins type of confession that you read here, i.e. a list of “rules” that you “broke”, nor will you hear an obsession about whether your sin was “mortal” or not. The confessor is very orthodox, the abbey’s historian, over 80 years old, and extremely wise. Instead he gently moves you to work on your conversion. He pushes you towards effort, not towards result. The effort that he does help you work on, is your conversion, and it’s a life-long effort. It’s through your conversion that slowly you turn away from sin. Following the rules superficially leads to a huge fall.

I know that because it happened to me.

The monastery is a cloister. For an oblate, the only consistent cloister we have is our hearts. The thing is though, is that few of us (even oblates) dare to actually venture, really venture, into that cloister. Like a closet it contains everything about you, and many of those things simply aren’t at all pretty.

It all happened very recently to me; it happened at a monastery in France, in their small rarely used 11th century chapel on the side of a hill, where I confronted my main demon, said to God “this is who I am”, and started to feel His mercy, and conversion. It resulted in a healing process, and in a huge miracle: my faltering marriage turned around. My wife went through a similar process. We blamed each other for the wreck that our marriage was. This was the key point: only when we were ready to accept our own foibles, to accept ourselves as we are, with both its beauty and ugliness, can we come to accept the foibles of others. It’s a really important notion for living in community, including the community that is a family formed within a marriage.

This is far, far more important than any doctrinal battles, including whether the SSPX ever comes back into full communion. Whether they do or not, is immaterial to my inner conversion. Whether anyone ever fully understands and clearly expresses Vatican II in a definitive manner, is immaterial to my inner conversion. I still have work to do though, as I myself am very much attracted to the liturgical beauty of the Benedictine Mass but continue to be put off by what goes on in the parish. But that’s my bad. It’s not the parish’s fault. They are just being the imperfect humans that they are, and I demand too much of them.
**
Turn the gaze inwards, not outwards. That’s where you will find God waiting to help you.**

It’s interesting how this theme is repeated by all of the spiritual masters and the majority of Catholics still don’t get it. It’s been said in so many different ways.

When the Secular Franciscans came to Francis to complain about he fact that their parish priest was living in sin with a woman, the other parish priest did not celebrate mass on Sundays, the bishop was more interested in his food than in his soul, Francis became very pensive. After a few seconds said something very similar.

God speaks to us in the silence of the soul, do not let these things steal that silence. Learn to ignore.

St. Ignatius of Loyola said something similar to the Jesuits. When confronted with the abuses of the world around him and within the Church, he taught them to discern spirits. He taught them that the good spirit is the one who leads the to self-examination, rather than examination of others.

Bl. Mother Teresa delivered the same message to her two orders. She said that Jesus was not found in the controversies, but in silence.

We have laymen like St. Gianna Molla and Bl. Pier Giorgio Frasatti who responded to the voice of God rather than worry about dogmas. They knew their catechism and that was enough. The rest, they left up to the pope and his people. They had things to do at the local level. Pier had Catholic social action and Gianna had a family.

We see Benedict’s influence continues through many people and through many traditions, religious and lay.

Fraternally,

Br. JR, FFV

 

[Melchior_1]

A fantastic read and wonderful story, OraLabora.

For me, the journey towards mendicant spirituality was gradual, but it was not always on my heart. I used to get hung up on little things, and if things weren’t done exactly how I felt they should have been I would get upset. It was fairly infuriating to see people not dressing properly, not receiving Christ the way I thought they should, not using proper actions. I would debate anyone and everyone on many things, and when I didn’t I would dwell on it constantly.

In hindsight, I fail to see how exactly that served me any tangible benefit. When I stopped thinking with my brain and started thinking with my heart, I desired something different. And when I looked inside of myself, I saw that I wasn’t doing myself or anyone else a service by making such a big deal about things, especially when I internalized things and let them stewabout.

So I started to change my attitude, and the way I carried myself and my faith. I began “thinking with my heart” rather than “feeling with my heart” or “thinking with my mind”. Awhile later I started reading more about mendicant spirituality, and I saw how they handled things. I saw Francis, Dominic, Claire, Kolbe, and several others. I saw how they handled things, and I wanted that for myself. And I noticed I was already on the path there through my thoughts, words, and actions. The rest is history.

Things became a lot less loud on the inside when I changed my perspective and stopped shouting internally at others who didn’t match up with what I wanted them to do.

 

[OraLabora]

A fantastic read and wonderful story, OraLabora.

For me, the journey towards mendicant spirituality was gradual, but it was not always on my heart. I used to get hung up on little things, and if things weren’t done exactly how I felt they should have been I would get upset. It was fairly infuriating to see people not dressing properly, not receiving Christ the way I thought they should, not using proper actions. I would debate anyone and everyone on many things, and when I didn’t I would dwell on it constantly.

In hindsight, I fail to see how exactly that served me any tangible benefit. When I stopped thinking with my brain and started thinking with my heart, I desired something different. And when I looked inside of myself, I saw that I wasn’t doing myself or anyone else a service by making such a big deal about things, especially when I internalized things and let them stewabout.

So I started to change my attitude, and the way I carried myself and my faith. I began “thinking with my heart” rather than “feeling with my heart” or “thinking with my mind”. Awhile later I started reading more about mendicant spirituality, and I saw how they handled things. I saw Francis, Dominic, Claire, Kolbe, and several others. I saw how they handled things, and I wanted that for myself. And I noticed I was already on the path there through my thoughts, words, and actions. The rest is history.

Things became a lot less loud on the inside when I changed my perspective and stopped shouting internally at others who didn’t match up with what I wanted them to do.

That was my experience exactly. And it continues to be my experience in that I am imperfect and still occasionally get hung up over things that in the end, really don’t matter.

A little anecdote, my attachment to the Divine Office. I used to really get hung up if I had to miss an Office, but for the wrong reasons. I’d be hung up because I somehow broke a “rule”. or didn’t do the day “correctly”.

Now when I miss an Office, if I get upset it’s more because I missed a beloved psalm that happened to be at that Hour. Or I had a hairy day at the office and I need the Divine Office to “come down” and have a slow transition to family life so I don’t burden my family with my day. Not so much because I broke a “rule” anymore.

I remember at the abbey, at Vigils early one morning, the monk who was doing the long reading took the reading from the wrong year (they use a 2-year lectionary). I asked my spiritual director why Fr. X had used the wrong year. Simple reply: “because Fr. X made a mistake”. No need to elaborate. Stuff happens, we’re human

Some people say “let go of it”. And they’re right.

 

[TimothyH]

Thanks all, for the kind words. I hesitated before posting… I didn’t want to sound like I was putting YoungTradCath down. Rather that I was in his shoes once too and I think it’s a necessary aspect of growing in spiritual maturity.

I also love Tim’s story because it’s so true.

Brother JR’s comment about laughing is also very true. I’ve seen humourless monks leave even after quite a long time. I’ve seen monks who simply say they’ll take it one day at a time hang on. One brother, now in his 40s (he was in his early 30s when I first came to the abbey), said just that, he takes it one day at a time. He works the apple orchard. In the fall it’s quite customary to see him on his tractor, and he looks so completely at ease, and obviously gets so much pleasure putting around on his tractor… you know he “gets it”. He is slowly converting.

The job of the Benedictines is not to study doctrine. Of course they have to study it if they become ordained, but once ordained it settles back into the background. Debating and determining doctrine is not part of their job. Obedience however is, not only obedience to the abbot or prior, but obedience to the Holy Father. With that obedience, they let the doctrine be dealt with where it belongs, the Holy Father and the Magisterium. Someone else has that job. The monk’s job is to live according to the Rule, and to incarnate Benedictine spirituality.

That’s why in spiritual direction, in the confessional, and in life in general the only “rule” you hear them talk about is the “Rule”. And they apply St. Benedict’s in-built flexibility that was in the context of his times, to current times. Which means that they don’t live to the letter of the rule but to its spirit. That’s why for instance there are son many Divine Office schemas among Benedictines. The main one is the one suggested by St. Benedict, but the others come from the in-built flexibility that St Benedict wisely inserted into his Rule, that allows for the abbot to select others. I apply the same flexibility to my own life, using the abbey’s schema on a 2-week cycle (the abbey does it in 1 week) during most of the year, but lightening to the Roman Office when I travel or during summer months. Sometimes I get obsessed with which Office to follow… and I have to remind myself of St. Benedict’s flexibility as it applies to my life in the secular world.

In the confessional, you won’t be directed into the type of “come in with a list” of sins type of confession that you read here, i.e. a list of “rules” that you “broke”, nor will you hear an obsession about whether your sin was “mortal” or not. The confessor is very orthodox, the abbey’s historian, over 80 years old, and extremely wise. Instead he gently moves you to work on your conversion. He pushes you towards effort, not towards result. The effort that he does help you work on, is your conversion, and it’s a life-long effort. It’s through your conversion that slowly you turn away from sin. Following the rules superficially leads to a huge fall.

I know that because it happened to me.

The monastery is a cloister. For an oblate, the only consistent cloister we have is our hearts. The thing is though, is that few of us (even oblates) dare to actually venture, really venture, into that cloister. Like a closet it contains everything about you, and many of those things simply aren’t at all pretty.

It all happened very recently to me; it happened at a monastery in France, in their small rarely used 11th century chapel on the side of a hill, where I confronted my main demon, said to God “this is who I am”, and started to feel His mercy, and conversion. It resulted in a healing process, and in a huge miracle: my faltering marriage turned around. My wife went through a similar process. We blamed each other for the wreck that our marriage was. This was the key point: only when we were ready to accept our own foibles, to accept ourselves as we are, with both its beauty and ugliness, can we come to accept the foibles of others. It’s a really important notion for living in community, including the community that is a family formed within a marriage.

This is far, far more important than any doctrinal battles, including whether the SSPX ever comes back into full communion. Whether they do or not, is immaterial to my inner conversion. Whether anyone ever fully understands and clearly expresses Vatican II in a definitive manner, is immaterial to my inner conversion. I still have work to do though, as I myself am very much attracted to the liturgical beauty of the Benedictine Mass but continue to be put off by what goes on in the parish. But that’s my bad. It’s not the parish’s fault. They are just being the imperfect humans that they are, and I demand too much of them.

Turn the gaze inwards, not outwards. That’s where you will find God waiting to help you.

The silence and seclusion of the cloister forces the monk into his heart - there is no other place to go - and it forces him to face what lies there, and wrestle with it, like Jacob wrestled in the night with God. It forces one to wrestle with God and like Jacob, insist that it will not let go of God until God blesses him.

I wrote about that silence, that peace here. This is the peace of the monastery, where God can operate, like the whisper of God passing Elijah in 1 Kings 19.

Catechism 2563 The heart is the dwelling-place where I am, where I live; according to the Semitic or Biblical expression, the heart is the place “to which I withdraw.” The heart is our hidden center, beyond the grasp of our reason and of others; only the Spirit of God can fathom the human heart and know it fully. The heart is the place of decision, deeper than our psychic drives. It is the place of truth, where we choose life or death. It is the place of encounter, because as image of God we live in relation: it is the place of covenant.

Whether we go to the monastery for retreat, create a cloister in our suburban backyard, or retire to the cloister of our own guarded heart in the middle of a crowded subway train, everyone needs this quiet place.

It really is where conversion happens.

-Tim-

 

[jwinch2]

Thanks all, for the kind words. I hesitated before posting… I didn’t want to sound like I was putting YoungTradCath down. Rather that I was in his shoes once too and I think it’s a necessary aspect of growing in spiritual maturity.

I also love Tim’s story because it’s so true.

Brother JR’s comment about laughing is also very true. I’ve seen humourless monks leave even after quite a long time. I’ve seen monks who simply say they’ll take it one day at a time hang on. One brother, now in his 40s (he was in his early 30s when I first came to the abbey), said just that, he takes it one day at a time. He works the apple orchard. In the fall it’s quite customary to see him on his tractor, and he looks so completely at ease, and obviously gets so much pleasure putting around on his tractor… you know he “gets it”. He is slowly converting.

The job of the Benedictines is not to study doctrine. Of course they have to study it if they become ordained, but once ordained it settles back into the background. Debating and determining doctrine is not part of their job. Obedience however is, not only obedience to the abbot or prior, but obedience to the Holy Father. With that obedience, they let the doctrine be dealt with where it belongs, the Holy Father and the Magisterium. Someone else has that job. The monk’s job is to live according to the Rule, and to incarnate Benedictine spirituality.

That’s why in spiritual direction, in the confessional, and in life in general the only “rule” you hear them talk about is the “Rule”. And they apply St. Benedict’s in-built flexibility that was in the context of his times, to current times. Which means that they don’t live to the letter of the rule but to its spirit. That’s why for instance there are son many Divine Office schemas among Benedictines. The main one is the one suggested by St. Benedict, but the others come from the in-built flexibility that St Benedict wisely inserted into his Rule, that allows for the abbot to select others. I apply the same flexibility to my own life, using the abbey’s schema on a 2-week cycle (the abbey does it in 1 week) during most of the year, but lightening to the Roman Office when I travel or during summer months. Sometimes I get obsessed with which Office to follow… and I have to remind myself of St. Benedict’s flexibility as it applies to my life in the secular world.

In the confessional, you won’t be directed into the type of “come in with a list” of sins type of confession that you read here, i.e. a list of “rules” that you “broke”, nor will you hear an obsession about whether your sin was “mortal” or not. The confessor is very orthodox, the abbey’s historian, over 80 years old, and extremely wise. Instead he gently moves you to work on your conversion. He pushes you towards effort, not towards result. The effort that he does help you work on, is your conversion, and it’s a life-long effort. It’s through your conversion that slowly you turn away from sin. Following the rules superficially leads to a huge fall.

I know that because it happened to me.

The monastery is a cloister. For an oblate, the only consistent cloister we have is our hearts. The thing is though, is that few of us (even oblates) dare to actually venture, really venture, into that cloister. Like a closet it contains everything about you, and many of those things simply aren’t at all pretty.

It all happened very recently to me; it happened at a monastery in France, in their small rarely used 11th century chapel on the side of a hill, where I confronted my main demon, said to God “this is who I am”, and started to feel His mercy, and conversion. It resulted in a healing process, and in a huge miracle: my faltering marriage turned around. My wife went through a similar process. We blamed each other for the wreck that our marriage was. This was the key point: only when we were ready to accept our own foibles, to accept ourselves as we are, with both its beauty and ugliness, can we come to accept the foibles of others. It’s a really important notion for living in community, including the community that is a family formed within a marriage.

This is far, far more important than any doctrinal battles, including whether the SSPX ever comes back into full communion. Whether they do or not, is immaterial to my inner conversion. Whether anyone ever fully understands and clearly expresses Vatican II in a definitive manner, is immaterial to my inner conversion. I still have work to do though, as I myself am very much attracted to the liturgical beauty of the Benedictine Mass but continue to be put off by what goes on in the parish. But that’s my bad. It’s not the parish’s fault. They are just being the imperfect humans that they are, and I demand too much of them.

Turn the gaze inwards, not outwards. That’s where you will find God waiting to help you.

Great post! Thanks for that.

To be fair, I think Benedictines are in fact, worried about scholarship but that the focus of the scholarship is much different. The Benedictines publish scholarly journals such as the American Benedictine Review, and the like, and obviously, there are many many books written by members of the Benedictine family. However, in my view the focus is not doctrinal in nature. Instead, it is, as you indicated, about conversion. The focus of monastic spirituality and scholarship seems to be an effort to better understand how to live the Gospel, the Holy Rule, and the writings of the Early Fathers.

I just attended a retreat put on by the Abbot at St. Gregory’s in OK about the Fruits of the Holy Spirit. The whole series of presentations was very scholarly in nature, he did a fantastic job researching the topic. However, it wasn’t scholarly in the sense of doctrine, it was scholarly in the sense of understanding how to live your life in a way that manifested itself in being a better Christian. There was some serious Scripture interpretation going on as well as very in-depth and interesting discussions of the writings of the Church Fathers, in particular St. John Cassian.

I hope that I am getting my point across and I don’t mean to discount your statement so I hope it doesn’t come across that way.

Peace,

 

[Indyann]

Thanks all, for the kind words. I hesitated before posting… I didn’t want to sound like I was putting YoungTradCath down. Rather that I was in his shoes once too and I think it’s a necessary aspect of growing in spiritual maturity.

Turn the gaze inwards, not outwards. That’s where you will find God waiting to help you.

“Listen with the ear of your heart” St. Benedict.

 

[Luigi_Daniele]

I don’t think wanting clarity makes you a demon. I think though wanting clarity is an unrealistic expectation, simply given the nature of human nature. Even in a small monastic community there’s still conflict on how to interpret the 1500 year-old Rule of St. Benedict. I think it’s unrealistic to expect 100% clarity and 100% uniformity in the interpretation of Vatican II.

If I might be so bold to venture an opinion, and I hope you don’t take this the wrong way but instead take it as a bit of wisdom (I hope!) from someone who has been where you are. You have the word “young” in your handle. I’m going to interpret this, for the purpose of what I am going to share with you, as meaning “young” in faith-years, not necessarily in years since birth, because this applies to anyone new in the faith regardless of physical age.

Don’t spend too much time worrying about doctrine and correct interpretation of doctrine. The Church has theologians for that. Take it from the Benedictines, is just not something actively discussed or contemplated on a daily basis. It is there, but it is at a level in the Church that is way beyond our pay grade as it were. We let the Holy Father and the Magisterium worry about that.

What Benedictines work on is deep inner conversion. It’s in the Rule, perhaps most eloquently expressed in the 12 degrees of humility. Inner conversion is also part of our Oblate promise and part of the profession of monks. As pnewton points out there will always be teachings we wrestle with. Work, prayerfully, on those.

Satisfy yourself with the Promise of the Keys and that the gates of Hades will never prevail against the Church, in spite of all the foibles of her laity, her clergy and her hierarchy.

The rest should just all become background noise; SSPX, EF vs OF, liturgical mistakes and abuse…

However, a key thing about accepting all this with grace and working instead on our own inner conversion, is to come face-to-face with our own foibles and limitations; to accept ourselves as we are, and work on converting ourselves, by accepting our nature. Only then can we start real conversion. Alas I think it requires passing through the Dark Night of the Soul.

I don’t say this lightly. I went through a particularly challenging and long (measured in years) time in the spiritual desert before I came to realize the problem was not others (e.g. those who seem to misuse Vatican II, those who I blamed for my foibles), the problem was staring me in the mirror.

It’s only in falling ourselves that we can rise. We rise through falling, and we fall through exaltation. Jacob’s ladder. Trying to look for perfection in doctrine and adherence to doctrine, only leads to heartache.

Been there, done that, got the t-shirt…

This is, quite simply, brilliant fratello. Wow.

 

[OraLabora]

Great post! Thanks for that.

To be fair, I think Benedictines are in fact, worried about scholarship but that the focus of the scholarship is much different. The Benedictines publish scholarly journals such as the American Benedictine Review, and the like, and obviously, there are many many books written by members of the Benedictine family. However, in my view the focus is not doctrinal in nature. Instead, it is, as you indicated, about conversion. The focus of monastic spirituality and scholarship seems to be an effort to better understand how to live the Gospel, the Holy Rule, and the writings of the Early Fathers.

I just attended a retreat put on by the Abbot at St. Gregory’s in OK about the Fruits of the Holy Spirit. The whole series of presentations was very scholarly in nature, he did a fantastic job researching the topic. However, it wasn’t scholarly in the sense of doctrine, it was scholarly in the sense of understanding how to live your life in a way that manifested itself in being a better Christian. There was some serious Scripture interpretation going on as well as very in-depth and interesting discussions of the writings of the Church Fathers, in particular St. John Cassian.

I hope that I am getting my point across and I don’t mean to discount your statement so I hope it doesn’t come across that way.

Peace,

Oh indeed the Benedictines are scholarly, there’s no doubt. They’re educated and erudite. They research their liturgy very well (the music, etc.) and do it well too.

But you’re right they do focus much of their scholarly work on the Rule, spirituality, their history, Cassian, etc.

For the Office of Readings I use Benedictine 2-year lectionary. Their choice of patristic readings is quite a revealing window into what they think is important.

Doctrine though, not so much.

 

[jwinch2]

Oh indeed the Benedictines are scholarly, there’s no doubt. They’re educated and erudite. They research their liturgy very well (the music, etc.) and do it well too.

But you’re right they do focus much of their scholarly work on the Rule, spirituality, their history, Cassian, etc.

For the Office of Readings I use Benedictine 2-year lectionary. Their choice of patristic readings is quite a revealing window into what they think is important.

Doctrine though, not so much.

Agreed. Since the OSB seems to care for quite a few seminaries, they must put some effort towards doctrinal discussion, but it certainly seems minimal in comparison to other orders such as the Dominicans, Jesuits, etc. I like the focus of the Benedictine family’s scholarship a great deal, it really seems to speak to me for whatever reason.

If you could, please send me a link to the lectionary you are using when you have a moment. I use the Roman Breviary currently because it is online and easy to use, but have been considering switching things up a bit. Thanks in advance!

Peace of Christ,

 

[OraLabora]

Agreed. Since the OSB seems to care for quite a few seminaries, they must put some effort towards doctrinal discussion, but it certainly seems minimal in comparison to other orders such as the Dominicans, Jesuits, etc. I like the focus of the Benedictine family’s scholarship a great deal, it really seems to speak to me for whatever reason.

If you could, please send me a link to the lectionary you are using when you have a moment. I use the Roman Breviary currently because it is online and easy to use, but have been considering switching things up a bit. Thanks in advance!

Peace of Christ,

I’ll post it here for the benefit of others who may wish to use it, but… caveat, French and Latin only! And it’s a book, not on-line. Well several volumes actually. I got it from Solesmes. Here’s the link for the first volume:

solesmes.eu/GB/editions/livres.php?cmY9NTQ=

 

[jwinch2]

I’ll post it here for the benefit of others who may wish to use it, but… caveat, French and Latin only! And it’s a book, not on-line. Well several volumes actually. I got it from Solesmes. Here’s the link for the first volume:

solesmes.eu/GB/editions/livres.php?cmY9NTQ=

French and Latin? Thanks anyway… Since I barely speak English, I can only pray that others will get some use out of it.

Peace,

 

[OraLabora]

French and Latin? Thanks anyway… Since I barely speak English, I can only pray that others will get some use out of it.

Peace,

Can you barely speak English because you’re originally from Texas, or because you’re originally not from Texas

Sorry for the levity!