I think we overlook goal of Qur’an(scripture). Qur’an is a religious book so other issues are secondary. Qur’an is not an anatomy book and yet God do not abstain to expound any fact but such deatils is not suitable for a scripture. The message is that: Human is created through such menial ways and although that human patronize and do not obey God.Allah is all knowing so why wouldn’t the quran give a more detailed description of where… instead of a “zone”.
But also there are very clear verses in Gospel which declare that God is one. Just one:Quran 23:12
“And certainly did We create man from an extract of clay.”
So is it allah and the angels that created life …wouldn’t only be allah?
We is often used by a speaker to refer to himself or herself and one or more other considered together. But why not use “angels” instead of “we”…unless there is truly someone else!!!
Do you mean the Janissaries?The politic Ottomans ruled in which they took children of Christians and converted them in Islam and militarized them cannot be named as slavery. That converted soldiers were paid.
So since the quran isn’t an anatomy book the quran is irrelevant in this matterI think we overlook goal of Qur’an(scripture). Qur’an is a religious book so other issues are secondary. Qur’an is not an anatomy book and yet God do not abstain to expound any fact but such deatils is not suitable for a scripture. The message is that: Human is created through such menial ways and although that human patronize and do not obey God.
“We create man” God and someone else of equal has created life…and has given life. Could it be a Son perhaps? Angels are no equal to God…nor can angels create life and give lifeBut also there are very clear verses in Gospel which declare that God is one. Just one:
29 And Jesus answered him, The first of all the commandments is, Hear, O Israel; The Lord our God is one Lord: Mark 12
And also Jesus said “our” God. So God is Jesus’ God also.
There are many verses in which God say “I” in Qur’an. In that verses God talk about personality of Himself and use I but not we.
40- O Children of Israel, remember My favor which I have bestowed upon you and fulfill My covenant [upon you] that I will fulfill your covenant [from Me], and be afraid of [only] Me.
41- And believe in what I have sent down confirming that which is [already] with you, and be not the first to disbelieve in it. And do not exchange My signs for a small price, and fear [only] Me. Al-Baqarah(2)
186- And when My servants ask you, [O Muhammad], concerning Me – indeed I am near. I respond to the invocation of the supplicant when he calls upon Me. So let them respond to Me [by obedience] and believe in Me that they may be [rightly] guided. Al-Baqarah(2)
60- And your Lord says, “Call upon Me; I will respond to you.” Indeed, those who disdain My worship will enter Hell [rendered] contemptible. Ghafir(40)
56- And I did not create the jinn and mankind except to worship Me. Adh-Dhariyat(51)
And when God talk about His actions but God act through means and intermediates so God witness those means. I again state that angels or other means have no power on their owns without God. God create everything and give life and power. God create human and give life and power so human can work for instance human cultivate etc. So when God talk about cultivating perhaps God would not say I cultivate because human is a means in this action. Yet the power which human act by is power of God which was given to human with other attributes just like life.
I don’t think they had much of a choice: “convert or die”. Sounds familiar today, doesn’t it?The politic Ottomans ruled in which they took children of Christians and converted them in Islam and militarized them cannot be named as slavery. That converted soldiers were paid.
Disagree that there “had much of a choice”. They had NO choice. They were boys when taken from family (it started by taking orphaned Christians - not difficult to make orphans out of Christians when you are the conquerors; then they took eldest son if the poorer Christian families are unable to pay the poll tax payable by non-Christians - their other choice to avoid paying is to convert; then they took boys from all Christian families). The argument was that it provides education and upbringing to non-Muslims who would otherwise not have had a proper (read: Muslim) upbringing.I don’t think they had much of a choice: “convert or die”. Sounds familiar today, doesn’t it?
They also inducted boys from Jewish families. This practice was rife in the Holy Land, a good pretext for the Jews to join up with Britain in getting rid of the Turks.Disagree that there “had much of a choice”. They had NO choice. They were boys when taken from family (it started by taking orphaned Christians - not difficult to make orphans out of Christians when you are the conquerors; then they took eldest son if the poorer Christian families are unable to pay the poll tax payable by non-Christians - their other choice to avoid paying is to convert; then they took boys from all Christian families). The argument was that it provides education and upbringing to non-Muslims who would otherwise not have had a proper (read: Muslim) upbringing.
Where did you get the information about Jewish boys, as far as I know Jews were excluded from Janissary recruitment.They also inducted boys from Jewish families. This practice was rife in the Holy Land, a good pretext for the Jews to join up with Britain in getting rid of the Turks.
Actually, we know a Muslim family who admitted they were Christian some hundred years ago or so. How this history got passed down I know know.
Many were crypto-Christians, who passes down their traditions etc until the line got broken because the kid was taken from the household into barracks.They also inducted boys from Jewish families. This practice was rife in the Holy Land, a good pretext for the Jews to join up with Britain in getting rid of the Turks.
Actually, we know a Muslim family who admitted they were Christian some hundred years ago or so. How this history got passed down I know know.
I didn’t say Janissaries but induction into the Turkish army. You can start with this:Where did you get the information about Jewish boys, as far as I know Jews were excluded from Janissary recruitment.
Not only that but the Janissaries were long gone by the end of Turkish control of the ‘Holy Land’.
That’s an entirely different matter, it wasn’t kidnapping boys and turning them into an elite Ottoman fighting force, it was typical ‘modern’ conscription - which one might argue constitutes kidnapping, of course, but many would differ.I didn’t say Janissaries but induction into the Turkish army. You can start with this:
israelnationalnews.com/News/News.aspx/207878
Qur’an is relevant in every since directly or indirectly.So since the quran isn’t an anatomy book the quran is irrelevant in this matter
It is said for about 56 millions people were killed in World War 2. And most of them were civliians. About 3 millions were killed during crusade. About 34 millionns slaves were killed and 16 millions of them were killed who were taken to America by westerns. At least 15 millions indians were killed in America by westerns… Is Islam in any case of that?I cannot fathom how any one can today deny that Islam inherently has a very big problem, both among internal warring factions and sects, and unchecked extremism and violence directed toward anyone that does not agree or practice the way these groups say everyone must do. There is no room for any disagreement or agreeing to disagree among these people. Islam has no leader, no unity, and no way to stop the folks that are claiming their religion to do murder.
Look even at a so-called “tolerant” leader, like in Turkey. There is no tolerance at all.
Comparing this to Christianity from hundreds of years ago (especially since even during the worst Crusaders massacres perpetuated, there was no action like these extremists today) is a way to avoid the problem.
Janissaries and others. The devşirme system can be faulted. But by that system a Christian child could get very importand positions in army and goverment.Do you mean the Janissaries?