The books that Martin Luther took out of the bible

[jesusismyrock]

I will first say for those who do not know me that I am a 15 year old Strong Charismatic Hardcore Roman Catholic girl who only wants to know more and more about my faith and live my life for Jesus Christ.

My question is: What 7 books did Martin Luther take out of the Bible and could there possibly be any significance in it being 7 books that were taken out since (from what I have been told) the number 7 is supposed to be an important spiritual number? (I don’t know much of anything about that Idea or if it is fact, I am simply wondering…)

Thanks so much!!

 

[Todd_Easton]

The books of Tobit, Judith, 1 Maccabees, 2 Maccabees, Wisdom, Sirach, and Baruch, as well as parts of Esther and Daniel. Collectively, these books are sometimes called the deuterocanonicals*.*

 

[peregrinus_sg]

No, I don’t think there is any significance to the number 7. It just so happened that Martin did not find these 7 books in the Jewish canon of his days and assumed that they were not in the Bible used by the early Church. We know now that he made a terrible mistake on that one.

In fact, Martin wanted to remove certain other books from the New Testament too: Hebrews, James, Jude and Revelation. He wasn’t able to convince the rest of the protesters, so Protestants still kept them. But Lutheran Bibles tend to print these books as the last books of the New Testament in memory of Martin’s dislike for these. So if Martin got his way, it would be 11 books.

 

[teachccd]

I will first say for those who do not know me that I am a 15 year old Strong Charismatic Hardcore Roman Catholic girl who only wants to know more and more about my faith and live my life for Jesus Christ.

My question is: What 7 books did Martin Luther take out of the Bible and could there possibly be any significance in it being 7 books that were taken out since (from what I have been told) the number 7 is supposed to be an important spiritual number? (I don’t know much of anything about that Idea or if it is fact, I am simply wondering…)

Thanks so much!!

Praise be to God to have a young person be so focused on Christ!! Keep up the good questions as you are quite the example for others your age. The above answers are correct and continue with those questions. You can never know too much in our beautiful, ancient faith…may God bless you…teachccd

 

[nawdy]

Hello, what a lovely way to get answers to many questions and actively take part and hear other questions. This question on taking 7 books out of the Bible has been on my mind for a while because I wondered why someone would take books out of the Bible to leave 66, isn’t the number of the devil 666.
I picked up an old Catholic Bible a few weeks ago at a Christian Shop and found Judith, if there had been a Judith in Hitlers reign perhaps many lives could have been saved. In my search for an answer why it had been taken out, I didn’t find, until your answer in this forum, that Luther also wanted to take out other books, especially Revalation where it tells us not to take out or add to, could you tell me if this applies just to the book of Revalation or to the whole Bible please.

 

[thistle]

I will first say for those who do not know me that I am a 15 year old Strong Charismatic Hardcore Roman Catholic girl who only wants to know more and more about my faith and live my life for Jesus Christ.

My question is: What 7 books did Martin Luther take out of the Bible and could there possibly be any significance in it being 7 books that were taken out since (from what I have been told) the number 7 is supposed to be an important spiritual number? (I don’t know much of anything about that Idea or if it is fact, I am simply wondering…)

Thanks so much!!

As far as the books Luther did not like the number 7 has no significance.
He didn’t like these books because they contradicted his own teachings.

 

[pablope]

Hello, what a lovely way to get answers to many questions and actively take part and hear other questions. This question on taking 7 books out of the Bible has been on my mind for a while because I wondered why someone would take books out of the Bible to leave 66, isn’t the number of the devil 666.

Hmmm…never thought of that before.

I picked up an old Catholic Bible a few weeks ago at a Christian Shop and found Judith, if there had been a Judith in Hitlers reign perhaps many lives could have been saved. In my search for an answer why it had been taken out, I didn’t find, until your answer in this forum, that Luther also wanted to take out other books, especially Revalation where it tells us not to take out or add to, could you tell me if this applies just to the book of Revalation or to the whole Bible please.

 

[Bernadette173]

I will first say for those who do not know me that I am a 15 year old Strong Charismatic Hardcore Roman Catholic girl who only wants to know more and more about my faith and live my life for Jesus Christ.

My question is: What 7 books did Martin Luther take out of the Bible and could there possibly be any significance in it being 7 books that were taken out since (from what I have been told) the number 7 is supposed to be an important spiritual number? (I don’t know much of anything about that Idea or if it is fact, I am simply wondering…)

Thanks so much!!

wonderful questions jesusismyrock! If the internet and it’s forums like these had been around when I was a teen maybe I would’ve been in in your position that you are in right now. In fact many are STILL learning about the Scriptures and differences in religious doctrines of Christianity and it’s many many splinterings off of over 33,000 denominations is the direct fruit of sola scriptura or ‘‘Bible alone’’ theology. One of which Martin Luther was deciding which books were inspired Words of God, and which were not. To change or deny the authority Christ gave to His deciples and apostles, Popes, and Bishops in determining the authenticity and incorrupt teachings of the Bible.
Luther objected to the Deuterocanical books because at that time in history there were no Hebrew counterparts to go alongside the Greek translations.
However, research into the Dead Sea Scrolls found in Qumran have discovered ancient Hebrew copies of some of Luthers disputed books! So that the grounds of them ‘‘not existing’’ is unsupportable by Lutheran theology and teachings on things in the Bible. Luther didn’t like that we as Catholics pray for the dead or to the saints. He did not believe firmly enough in their real presence in heaven with God our Father in heaven. And it is also the re-wording of some of the texts, that Luther himself makes the err of assuming that symbolism and truncating the Bible to his personal preference, will make the theology of the Bible somehow easier to follow, or make people inspired to follow Martin Luther, and not the Word of God, given to the 12 Apostles, and the RCC, to guard, govern, teach, and guide it’s followers by.

 

[Dave_Noonan]

In fact, Martin wanted to remove certain other books from the New Testament too: Hebrews, James, Jude and Revelation. He wasn’t able to convince the rest of the protesters, so Protestants still kept them. But Lutheran Bibles tend to print these books as the last books of the New Testament in memory of Martin’s dislike for these. So if Martin got his way, it would be 11 books.

I’d be curious where you’re getting this information. If you could reveal the source, perhaps we could stamp out this myth.

 

[Randal796]

I’d be curious where you’re getting this information. If you could reveal the source, perhaps we could stamp out this myth.

cogwriter.com/luther.htm

This is a very interesting read.

 

[ahs]

I’d be curious where you’re getting this information. If you could reveal the source, perhaps we could stamp out this myth.

I’m not certain of that poster’s source, but pablop provided one and here is another (New and Old Testaments, respectively):
newadvent.org/cathen/03274a.htm
newadvent.org/cathen/03267a.htm

 

[ThatOneGuy92]

Martin Luther regulated the deutercanonicals (Apocrypha) to a section between the OT and NT. He did not consider these books a source of doctrine, but edifying to read for historical and moral purposes.

As for wanting to remove certain books from the NT- there is no denying that he wished this. The reason being is that he did not see them clearly articulate the Gospel of justification by grace alone, through faith alone. However, Martin was only a man; as noted, the others put him in his place, and they were kept.

The Apocrypha were kept in their traditional spot between OT and NT until the major switch (in America, anyways) from German publishing to English publishing. At this point, they used what had already been translated by others, and it did not include the Apocrypha. Why they didn’t translate the Apocrypha themselves and put it in is anybody’s guess.

As for re-ordering the NT: Now that is something I’ve not heard before. Interesting…

 

[Dave_Noonan]

As for wanting to remove certain books from the NT- there is no denying that he wished this… However, Martin was only a man; as noted, the others put him in his place, and they were kept.

And what’s your source for this information? And who are these “others” that “made” him do what they said? Whatever you might say about Luther, he was not know for his docile theological demeanor.

 

[bogeydogg]

The books of Tobit, Judith, 1 Maccabees, 2 Maccabees, Wisdom, Sirach, and Baruch, as well as parts of Esther and Daniel. Collectively, these books are sometimes called the deuterocanonicals*.*

Nope neither Luther or Calvin removed those books from the Canon. They were removed by the English Bible Society during the 19th C long after both Luther and Calvin were dead.

You have poor information.

Luther may have disputed the canonicity of certain books but when he published his German Bible he did not remove any books.

God Bless

 

[gus]

Segregation is the first phase of ilimination.

 

[bogeydogg]

Segregation is the first phase of ilimination.

Define segregation.

I am reading Jesus of Nazareth in which the Pope declares Daniel was written 200 years before Christ, but Jesus declares it was wirrten by Daniel who was in the Court of Nebbuchadnezzer.

So what exactly do you mean by discrimination; debating Canon and changing nothing or apparently disregarding the words of Christ and saying it changes nothing?

BTW I love the book I just think the Pope is wrong about this, just like I think Luther was wrong about the Deuteros. But that does not make him responsible for something that occurred 300 later.

God Bless

 

[MarcoPolo]

I’d be curious where you’re getting this information. If you could reveal the source, perhaps we could stamp out this myth.

There may be some conjecture out there about what Luther said about this or that book, but it does seem according to my research, at least with regard to the book of James, that he would like to have nixed it from teaching use if not throw it out of the canon:***We should throw the epistle of James out of this school **Wittenberg], for it doesn’t amount to much.*It contains not a syllable about Christ. Not once does it mention Christ, except at the beginning.*I maintain that some Jew wrote it who probably heard about Christian people but never encountered any.*Since he heard that Christians place great weight on faith in Christ, he thought, ‘Wait a moment!*I’ll oppose them and urge works alone.’*This he did. He wrote not a word about the suffering and resurrection of Christ, althought this is what all the apostles preached about. Besides, there is no order or method in the epistle. No he discusses clothing and then he writes about wrath and is constatntly shifting from one to the other.*He presents a comparison: ‘As the body apart from the spirit is dead, so faith apart from works is dead.’ O Mary, mother of God!! What a terrible comparison that is!!!!LW, 54, 424-425
*Elsewhere he explicitly said James had errors in his theology:*James argues in his letter (Jas. 2:21) that Abraham was justified on the basis of his works. Because the text says:Now I see that you are righteous', he wants to conclude from this that previously Abraham was not righteous. . . . .Abraham was righteous by faith before God acknowledged him as such. Therefore **James*concluded falsely that now at last he was justified after that obedience**,*for faith and righteousness are known by works as by the fruit. But it does not follow, as James raves: Hence the fruits justify’ just as it does not follow: 'I know a tree by its fruit; therefore the tree becomes good as a result of its fruit.Therefore let our opponents be done with their James, whom they throw up to us so often(Luther 4:134).**I believe that last quote is from Luther’s Works.Saw these quotes here a while back. I’ve also seen part of the latter quote cited as LW 4.26)

 

[po18guy]

I’d be curious where you’re getting this information. If you could reveal the source, perhaps we could stamp out this myth.

He very famously called the Epistle of James “an epistle of straw” From the Wiki:

“In Reformation times a few theologians, most notably Martin Luther, argued that this epistle should not be part of the canonical New Testament.[22][23]”

As well, he did not like Hebrews, since the author was unknown (what does that have to do with inspiration?). Again, from the Wiki:

“Initially Luther had a low view of the Old Testament book of Esther and of the New Testament books of Hebrews, James, Jude, and the Revelation of John. He called the Letter of James “an epistle of straw,” finding little in it that pointed to Christ and His saving work. He also had harsh words for the Revelation of John, saying that he could “in no way detect that the Holy Spirit produced it.”[11] In his translation of the New Testament, Luther moved Hebrews and James out of the usual order, to join Jude and the Revelation at the end, and differentiated these from the other books which he considered “the true and certain chief books of the New Testament. The four which follow have from ancient times had a different reputation.”[12] His views on some of these books changed in later years.”

So, would it be 65 books, had Luther had his way with Esther?

 

[po18guy]

Nope neither Luther or Calvin removed those books from the Canon. They were removed by the English Bible Society during the 19th C long after both Luther and Calvin were dead.

You have poor information.

Luther may have disputed the canonicity of certain books but when he published his German Bible he did not remove any books.

God Bless

Luther left them in his bible, but placed them in a separate location, believing them not to be inspired. Much later, the books were eliminated altogether, but it began with Martin, who declared them uninspired.

 

[De_Maria]

I will first say for those who do not know me that I am a 15 year old Strong Charismatic Hardcore Roman Catholic girl who only wants to know more and more about my faith and live my life for Jesus Christ.

My question is: What 7 books did Martin Luther take out of the Bible

The are called, collectively, the Deuterocanonicals. Someone else has listed them for you so I won’t bother. The Protestants call them the “Apocrypha”.

and could there possibly be any significance in it being 7 books that were taken out since (from what I have been told) the number 7 is supposed to be an important spiritual number? (I don’t know much of anything about that Idea or if it is fact, I am simply wondering…)

I believe it is significant. However, neither Protestants nor Catholics like my opinion on this matter. I guess its too “mystical” or something. Anyway…

Sheva is the Hebrew word for “oath”. It is the basis of the word, “Sabbath”. It is also the basis of the word, “Seven”. As in, God made the world in “seven” days.

Therefore, in Scripture, the number, 7, is considered a “mystical” number. It is repeated many times.
God blessed the seventh day.

Look at Genesis 7 and count how many times the number 7 is repeated:
7 And the Lord said unto Noah, Come thou and all thy house into the ark; for thee have I seen righteous before me in this generation.

2 Of every clean beast thou shalt take to thee by** sevens**, the male and his female: and of beasts that are not clean by two, the male and his female.

3 Of fowls also of the air by sevens, the male and the female; to keep seed alive upon the face of all the earth.

4 For yet **seven **days, and I will cause it to rain upon the earth forty days and forty nights; and every living substance that I have made will I destroy from off the face of the earth.

5 And Noah did according unto all that the Lord commanded him.

6 And Noah …10 And it came to pass after** seven **days, that the waters of the flood were upon the earth. etc. etc.

Genesis 8:4
And the ark rested in the seventh month, on the** seven**teenth day of the month, upon the mountains of Ararat.

And on and on. Therefore, the number 7 is believed to represent both “God’s oath or covenant with mankind” and “fullness or completeness”.

So, by by Luther removing the 7 books, I believe God has given us a message. He has removed the Covenant of God and left the Protestants with an incomplete book.

If that were all, I wouldn’t blame anyone for not believing the significance of this number. But there is much more.

Let’s look at the number of books which remained in the Protestant Scriptures. 66

What is the number of the Beast? 666

Also, 7 is fullness and 6 is the lack thereof.

And finally, what is the number of Catholic books. 73.

Seven signifies fullness and signifies “oath or Covenant”. What does 3 signify?

The Trinity.

What we have here is “the complete Covenant of the Holy Trinity.” This is what Luther destroyed when he took out seven books from the Sacred Bible.

I’m just throwing it out there.

Thanks so much!!

You’re welcome.

Sincerely,

De Maria