THe boy only Altar server debate is over

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rescath said:
You will undoubtedly see altar girls at Tridentine Masses before long, along with lay lectors, and lay Eucharistic ministers.
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No you won’t. The modernists who would do such things won’t have the stamina to learn the TLM. By the time they did, they’d be converted (and opposed to such innovations).
 
All of you people who think it is OK to have EMHC’s, lay readers and altar girl/boys only prove the point that “active participation” was grossly misinterpreted in the past few decades. If you want to “actively participate,” follow along in your missal and offer yourself along with the Holy Sacrifice.

Nobody wants to shake your hand or hear your daughter sing the “responsorial psalm.”
 
eric3141 said:
And somehow the world doesn’t end when communion takes a little while longer since the army of ordinary, er…, extraordinary ministers aren’t there to distribute communion.

I’ve attended eastern orthodox divine liturgy where only a priest or deacon can do it. Communion takes quite a while every Sunday… My point? Extraordinary ministers (in most parishes in the US) are just an excuse to get lay people (and in particular women?) more involved in the celebration of the mass. They are not NEEDED as the TLM and eastern orthodox prove.
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HOW TRUE !!!
 
eric3141 said:
And somehow the world doesn’t end when communion takes a little while longer since the army of ordinary, er…, extraordinary ministers aren’t there to distribute communion.

I’ve attended eastern orthodox divine liturgy where only a priest or deacon can do it. Communion takes quite a while every Sunday… My point? Extraordinary ministers (in most parishes in the US) are just an excuse to get lay people (and in particular women?) more involved in the celebration of the mass. They are not NEEDED as the TLM and eastern orthodox prove.
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Well said!! :-))
 
In no other Particular *sui juris *Catholic Church does anyone but the celebrant (priest or bishop) distribute Holy Communion.

I have been to the Byzantine Divine Liturgy and the Holy Quorbono at the Maronite Catholic parish near my home.
All were taken care of by the priest.

So has been and will be the same in the TLM.

The Ukranian Greek Catholic Church often uses some Ukranian in their Divine Liturgy. It is the official language of the UGCC. The Maronites often use Arabic and Aramaic. One can find the same situation in all the Particular Churches.
 
JW10631 said:
In no other Particular *sui juris *Catholic Church **does anyone but the celebrant **(priest or bishop) distribute Holy Communion.
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Incorrect, in all the other sui juris Church, the assisting Deacon may also assist in the distrubution of Holy Communion. I’ve recieved so several times at our local Rutherian parish.
 
Acolytes are for boys only, period, it is more better than little priestess to serve in the Altar of God.
it seems that the NO Mass is invisibly training and experimenting female priest through altar girls???
Let us read the teachings of the Holy Bible… there are no altar girls… that’s the Law of God!

Pax!
Instaurare omnia in Christo!!!
 
Having been a member of a Chapel Ministered by the FSSP for several years I can tell you from experience that Women in the Sanctuary is prohibited. Fr. ken Baker reaffirmed as much in last nights interview. Other than possibly allowing for Readings in the Vernacular and modifications over time to the Calendar for Saints that may have been added, there seem to be no other changes being considered.
 
rescath said:
You will undoubtedly see altar girls at Tridentine Masses before long, along with lay lectors, and lay Eucharistic ministers.
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Certain ones, yes, but the idea will be to avoid them, just as we do with all irreverent Masses.
 
rescath said:
You will undoubtedly see altar girls at Tridentine Masses before long, along with lay lectors, and lay Eucharistic ministers.
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No, you will not. The 1962 rubrics are clear on who does what. There will be no women, there will be no EMHC’s.
 
Scotty_PGH said:
Nobody wants to shake your hand or hear your daughter sing the “responsorial psalm.”
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Painting with a rather broad brush, aren’t you?

The Church allows the option for the people to offer a Sign of Peace.

The Church also allows, even (gasp) encourages people to sing the Responsorial Psalm.

Nobody wants to shake your hand or hear the Responsorial Psalm sung???

Perhaps you don’t want to shake someone’s hand or hear the Responsorial Pslam sung. Fine. You have the option of not returning someone’s greeting at the Sign of Peace. As far as the Responsorial Psalm, cover your ears if you want. Maybe just offer it up.

But don’t tell me that what the Church has prescribed for her liturgy is something nobody wants.
 
Brendan said:
In addition, regardless of GIRM, a priest can never be obliged to use girls in altar service, not even by his own bishop ( the Vatican has so instructed).

And if a priest attempted to use them, the Motu Proprio addresses how issues are addressed, first to the bishop, and then an appeal may be made to Eccelsia Dei.

I imagine the same would hold true for lay readers and EMHC’s.
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On the first point, yes. I see it is highly unlikely that a priest who has gone to all the trouble to learn Latin and the rubrics for a TLM would jump on the “altar gurl” bandwagon.

I am still unclear as to whether that prohibition, however, is part of the GIRM for the 1962 Missal or whether it is from old canon law. If the latter, it would not necessarily be binding on the TLM being said under the MP. (does anyone know where to find a link to the GIRM for the 1962?)

The MP does not address using the “chain of command” that you state for problems regarding how the TLM is implemented or abuses of the TLM. That appeal to the EDC is for issues related to being unable to get a TLM for those who want to attend one.

If there were liturgical abuses occurring related to the saying of TLMs, I assume that the steps would be those listed in Redemtionis Sacramentum which would include ultimate appeal to the CDW.
 
Corki said:
(does anyone know where to find a link to the GIRM for the 1962?)
.
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Most indult parishes will have a copy. The ‘problem’ is that there is no English translation, it’s Latin only.
 
Brendan said:
The 1962 Missal also has it’s own General Instructions that apply to that particular Missal. Which makes perfect sense, because the 2003 GIRM doesn’t even address most of the actions that occur in a TLM.

In addition, regardless of GIRM, a priest can never be obliged to use girls in altar service, not even by his own bishop ( the Vatican has so instructed).

And if a priest attempted to use them, the Motu Proprio addresses how issues are addressed, first to the bishop, and then an appeal may be made to Eccelsia Dei.

I imagine the same would hold true for lay readers and EMHC’s.
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The question is whether the GIRM or rubrics either prohibit such usage or specify what must be done.

If there is the potenial for “women in the sanctuary” or “albs” or what have you, could it be legitimately done? For if it can, it certainly will at some point, as there will likely be people who at some point want to celebrate the Mass but don’t have the same committment to these particular things as the hardliners who want everything “just like it used to be” do.

So, plainly, can someone cite specific rubrics or instructions from the 1962 missal which spell out the rules which demand what is claimed as necessary?
 
Ad_Deum said:
Let us read the teachings of the Holy Bible… there are no altar girls… that’s the Law of God!
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I don’t recall altar girls (or altar boys for that matter) being mentioned in the Bible. Can you give some citations?
 
I don’t recall altar girls (or altar boys for that matter) being mentioned in the Bible. Can you give some citations?
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Well, there was that one little thing St. Paul mentioned about women being quiet in the churches. But I guess Catholics don’t talk about that anymore.
 
Well, as long as they don’t respond audibly to the prayers, they ought to be OK…😉
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Part of the 1962 rubrics is that the servers have certain Latin prayers to recite audibly. Besides, philosophically speaking, one can be quite “audible” without saying a word. Nice try, though. 🙂
 
BobP123 said:
Well, there was that one little thing St. Paul mentioned about women being quiet in the churches. But I guess Catholics don’t talk about that anymore.
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No, there’s too much commotion now to hear anyone when they mention it. :rolleyes:
 
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