The Catholic Church and its views on Ceremonial Magic, Enochian Magic and Visualization

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Hello, I was wondering what the current stance was, is it a sin? Forbidden and bad, bad, bad?

There have been several popes in the history of the Catholic Church who were said to have been involved in Ceremonial Magic and to have written Grimoires. There are also several stories of how prayer combined with visualisation is said to have had unexpected results.

What do you think? Is it tolerated and part of the more occult aspect of catholicism such as Exorcism? Or is it forbidden?

I met a Priest once who was also a ceremonial magician, he justified it saying that the power invoked was that of God and that it was like praying to God but more effective. He also insisted that the Catholic mass was a form of ceremonial magic.
 
I would require proof from all these allegations, plus a definition of the things you are calling “magic” before responding.
 
Ceremonial Magic also known as Learned Magic is mostly based on The Testament of Solomon, The Key of Solomon and The Lesser Key of Solomon. Very complicated rituals which must be followed to the letter are important in ceremonial magic, you need tools which need to be a certain colour, size and shape, and which must have been created in certain way. For example there is a knife which may never cut anything on the physical plane, you must never make a mistake when reciting the names of the Archangels etc…

Enochian Magic makes use of symbols which are supposedly the language of angels, you invoke the angels and ask for their help.

Visualisation is quite difficult to explain, you imagine something in your mind and it then really happens (It’s not that simple there are rules to follow and you must do it in a certain way etc…)

All this is based on Christian beliefs and so can not be considered to be witchcraft. But is it allowed? Or sinful?
 
III. "YOU SHALL HAVE NO OTHER GODS BEFORE ME"
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2110 The first commandment forbids honoring gods other than the one Lord who has revealed himself to his people. It proscribes superstition and irreligion. Superstition in some sense represents a perverse excess of religion; irreligion is the vice contrary by defect to the virtue of religion.
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Superstition
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2111 Superstition is the deviation of religious feeling and of the practices this feeling imposes. It can even affect the worship we offer the true God, e.g., when one attributes an importance in some way magical to certain practices otherwise lawful or necessary. To attribute the efficacy of prayers or of sacramental signs to their mere external performance, apart from the interior dispositions that they demand, is to fall into superstition.41
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Divination and magic
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2115 God can reveal the future to his prophets or to other saints. Still, a sound Christian attitude consists in putting oneself confidently into the hands of Providence for whatever concerns the future, and giving up all unhealthy curiosity about it. Improvidence, however, can constitute a lack of responsibility.
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2116 All forms of divination are to be rejected: recourse to Satan or demons, conjuring up the dead or other practices falsely supposed to “unveil” the future.48 Consulting horoscopes, astrology, palm reading, interpretation of omens and lots, the phenomena of clairvoyance, and recourse to mediums all conceal a desire for power over time, history, and, in the last analysis, other human beings, as well as a wish to conciliate hidden powers. They contradict the honor, respect, and loving fear that we owe to God alone.
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2117 All practices of magic or sorcery, by which one attempts to tame occult powers, so as to place them at one’s service and have a supernatural power over others - even if this were for the sake of restoring their health - are gravely contrary to the virtue of religion. These practices are even more to be condemned when accompanied by the intention of harming someone, or when they have recourse to the intervention of demons. Wearing charms is also reprehensible. Spiritism often implies divination or magical practices; the Church for her part warns the faithful against it. Recourse to so-called traditional cures does not justify either the invocation of evil powers or the exploitation of another’s credulity.
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I think as the you say the priest describes it, such practices fall under the category of superstition. You will often find warnings about that even when the apologists here address such things as novenas for a particular purpose.

What you provided was more a description of what you are calling magic than a definition of it. But the Mass in particular does not exactly fit it - the form of the Mass is designed so that it is sufficiently reverent and so that it accurately presents the truths involved. Priests are required to follow it for these same reasons, but should they err, the Mass can still be valid - God provides for the deficiencies.

Furthermore, the Mass is what it is because it was instituted by Christ and He keeps His promises. There is no claim that there is some sort of attribute of what goes on that makes it intrinsically more likely to get God’s attention than anything else. That is, had God not instituted the Mass Himself, it would just be a nearly idolatrous prayer service. There is no intrinsic reason why the priest should vest as he does and say what he says in the order that he does - he does so because it fits the form of what is the Mass, which makes it the same thing as what God has promised to honor.

Whereas making such suppositions (ie if I say these words in this order, God certainly will do X) about other rituals is generally unfounded and, depending on what the level of “certainty” one has, may be superstitious. (Praying a novena in the hopes that it will ultimately please God and that He will answer a prayer is fine and good, praying a novena because you think it will somehow cause a certain event to occur of it’s own power is not fine.) In the case of prayer, I think you could be phrase a definition of the word ‘magic’ sufficiently generally to make it encompass prayer, but considering the connotations of the word as a way to directly affect things and the fact that prayer is always a request for God to affect things, I do not think this would be wise and would only serve to be confusing.

And, of course, if you divorce your idea of ceremonial magic from prayer entirely, then it’s simply forbidden by the stuff above.

So no. Nearly nothing that is widely considered ‘magical’ is ok. I do not know anything about Popes writing magic books, but should such have happened then either 1) they weren’t what would normally be called magic books, 2) the popes were not trying to do magic, but science, the two being somewhat indistinct at the time (remember even Newton tried to do Alchemy), or 3) the popes messed up and did something they shouldn’t have.
 
They clearly wrote these books with the intent of summoning angels and demons and whatnot. What about Papal infallibility? Does the fact that two popes were involved in ceremonial magic not make it right?
 
Sweetie, you are dealing with the medieval or Renaissance version of someone claiming their book was written by Elvis, an alien emperor, the Queen of the Sidhe, and Ronald Reagan. This is not historic documentation. You will find out that pretty much every mathematician/churchman was claimed by somebody to be a magician, mostly out of total math envy. Frustrated students liked to think that only the demons could possibly reveal complicated formulae for math stuff, whereas the real story of Pope Sylvester’s math prowess was hard work and study, along with a hefty dose of reading books from non-European sources. Similarly, St. Albert the Great believed in reading every single book he could find, plus experiential observation and tinkering and walking all over Europe; so of course people tried to say he was a magician and named “the Grand Albert” and “the Book of Women’s Secrets” junk after him.

Other typical medieval/Renaissance claims for spellbooks, dream interpretation books, and political “prophecies”:

You know this prophecy is true, because it was written by Merlin.

This spellbook is really good, because it’s taught at the secret magical university in the caves underneath the University of Seville, where only one person can graduate and all the rest are killed by demons.

St. Cyprian the Magician wrote this before his conversion.

The poet Virgil wrote this, from his secret lair in Mt. Vesuvius, where he lives forever and keeps the golden egg that protects Naples from destruction.

One of the Sibyls wrote this.
 
I don’t know if there is evidence that Popes were involved in this, but even if they are, - if something is against Church teaching it is wrong even if the Pope is involved in it… infallibility only applies to what the Pope teaches ex cathedra, not to his actions!

I don’t know much about this but honestly it sounds like the occult or superstition to me. In the Church we never summon any spirits. We pray to God, Mary, Saints, Angels, but always with the intent of coming closer to God, - we should never pray to Angels without that intent. We must also never “summon” or “invoke” spirits and expect them to come to us, or seek any experiences - the Saints warn us of this, because this can easily invite the demonic. If we “summon” a spirit, an evil spirit can easily take that chance to disguise as an “angel of light” and deceive us. I pray to my Guardian Angel but I don’t expect to feel his presence, or see him, etc, I know that he hears what I say and that is enough… I ask him to guide me closer to God, to protect me, etc.

So I would recommend to stay away from ceremonial magic… if you want to go deeper into your spirituality, read the books by the Saints… real spirituality is growing in our love for God. This is what all our actions and prayers should be oriented towards. Not to “contact” any spirits. When we pray to Saints, etc, we don’t expect them to contact us: it is enough that they pray for us. If God wants them to contact us, that is fine. (and even then, we must discern). But never never should we seek this or seek experiences. This is very dangerous spiritually. (St Teresa of Avila says this and she had many genuine spiritual experiences). Please keep in mind that our spiritual life is not about what we experience… in the end, we will be judged by how much we loved God and neighbour, how much humility we have… but false experiences can really harm a soul, and be sinful, if they involve the occult. Seeking “hidden knowledge” is also of the occult. What you describe sounds like superstition to me. For example… why would all this detail, colours, words, etc, be so important and need to be so accurate, - when God looks at the heart? The only exception I can think of is liturgy, but it’s miles away from ceremonial or any magic, it doesn’t operate by magic but by the Holy Spirit and the intent of the priest is not to control spiritual realities but to offer worthy worship. If a priest were to make a mistake, and start the prayer over again, or accidently mispronounce something, that wouldn’t ruin the Mass. The Mass is a participation in heavenly worship. But in ceremonial magic, - everything seems to depend on detail externals which have nothing to do with Heaven, worship, prayer, or loving God… for example I don’t think anyone in Heaven would care if you used purple or blue candles while praying, or said something in a particular order… all this can distract from a healthy prayer life. I suggest leaving this magic and praying more instead. God looks at the heart when we pray. Maybe start with praying the Rosary 🙂

Also I see elements of the occult in ceremonial magic, and it has a resemblance to occult practices… which is against Church teaching. Another problem is the element of control… as in: if I do all these things right, the angels WOULD be invoked. Well we can’t control spiritual reality. We definitely can’t control angels. Demons can make it seem like we are controlling something, just to draw us in, - and thus we would sin through pride and a desire for power. In the spiritual life, we are the LEAST able to control anything… everything is up to God’s will… we just choose to either cooperate with Him, or not. We have free will. But no matter what we do, we can’t “make” an angel, a Saint, and of course God, respond to us. It’s more humble this way. The occult is based on pride… and think of the original source of pride: the devil.

God bless!
 
Anything you can find on the “Grimoire of Pope Honorius III” points towards it being fake, even from the forward of a “real” grimoire:
I believe the almost legendary reputation of this work led to the forgery of the so-called Grimoire of Pope Honorius, a ridiculous work so despised by Eliphas Levi and A. E. Waite.
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Enslaving demons to do your bidding and summoning angels to cure your wounded sure sounds great though. Is there any way to be certain that the occult is sinful? Doesn’t all power come from God?
 
Yeah…when I was Pagan, I used a ouija board. My friend invoked Paimon. Next day my familiar and my neighbor died, one as soon as I arrived home with the board, the other exactly 12 hours later. The spirit said he liked cats.

So my answer would be no.
 
Ceremonial said:
Enslaving demons to do your bidding and summoning angels to cure your wounded sure sounds great though. Is there any way to be certain that the occult is sinful? Doesn’t all power come from God?
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See the Catechism quote above to see that it’s wrong.

For the second, God created creatures with their own power and will which He allows them to exercise according to their will (possibly within certain limitations). So, sort of, but it doesn’t change the morality of the action. We have the ability to do lots of things, that ability came from God, but lots of those things are sinful.
 
The bible does say sorcery is forbidden, and thou shall not possess a familar … Enochian magic is kinda different in my opinion, if you practice it you are basically asking angels to bring your petitions before god, its a bit evasive but not complete ly sinful … However be warned , once you enter the mystical realm , you better be careful… You will be attracting alot of attention to yourself from the infernal spirits…
 
Nicodemus_777 said:
The bible does say sorcery is forbidden, and thou shall not possess a familar … Enochian magic is kinda different in my opinion, if you practice it you are basically asking angels to bring your petitions before god, its a bit evasive but not complete ly sinful … However be warned , once you enter the mystical realm , you better be careful… You will be attracting alot of attention to yourself from the infernal spirits…
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If it is so beneficial and good, then where are the Church Fathers writing in support of its practice? Which Popes have issued encyclicals describing the good works coming out of practitioners of this magick? Are there canons from ecumenical councils which give their stamp of approval?

In other words, what is so deficient of the Seven Sacraments which Christ Himself gave Holy Church, that we should seek other means of connection with the divine?
 
I have also wondered about this. Especially since King Solomon is considered to be the wisest man ever to walk the face of the earth, as well as a very holy man. King Solomon had many manuscripts written, with very detailed instructions into ceremonial magick.
 
Just when I think I’ve heard every conceivable silliness, I read about ‘papal grimoires’. This is a little bit like saying that Himmler crafted a golem.
 
Heider said:
I have also wondered about this. Especially since King Solomon is considered to be the wisest man ever to walk the face of the earth, as well as a very holy man. King Solomon had many manuscripts written, with very detailed instructions into ceremonial magick.
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First, King Solomon was the wisest up to his time. Saint John the Baptizer was greater than Solomon, as Jesus said no man born of woman has ever been greater than John the Baptist. And the least born into the Kingdom of Heaven is greater than he. So no, Solomon is no longer the wisest man who ever lived.

Secondly, it is by no means certain that King Solomon even died in the state of grace, let alone kept his wisdom until the end of his life. Scripture records that he did not, but rather was seduced by several of his many wives into idolatry.

See 1 Kings 11:1-10.
 
Love4All said:
it is by no means certain that King Solomon even died in the state of grace, let alone kept his wisdom until the end of his life.
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Saint Solomon the King is venerated in the Eastern Catholic and Orthodox Churches. Here’s an icon of him. He also frequently appears in icons of Christ’s resurrection, such as this:

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The book of Enoch was not included in the bible for a reason. The book of Enoch itself says that this book is not for everyone. It is used by occults and you should avoid anything to do with anything that calls itself magic.

Praying with visualisation is how we are supposed to pray for example when praying for a broken leg to be healed. We pray to God in the name of Jesus and visualise the Holy Spirit, the power of God, going into the person and visualise the bones realigning and being healed. Jesus said if we ask in his name he will do it. We ask on God in Jesus name, believe it, and then it manifests itself in the natural world by the power of almighty God. If you don’t believe it then it doesn’t work. If you don’t have the Holy Spirit living within you it doesn’t work either.

Doing this without God as the power is what the occult does. It’s Satans counterfiet. Only Satan can not create anything. Healing can occur just by shifting demons from one part of the body to another if the one praying has a more powerful demon than the one attacking the sick person. A healing is the taking away of something like an illness. A miracle is the addition or creating of somthing like new cartilage, organs, repairing shredded tendons and the like. If you are worried about being decieved by false signs and wonders then look for miracles not just healings. Only God can create.

The bible defines faith. Evidence of things unseen … Look that up.
Now look up the websters dictionary for the meaning of ímagination.
You will find it says the same thing only using different words. There’s a whole hours teaching on just that alone and it’s worth it’s own thread.
 
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