The Doomsday Scenario

[gracepoole]

That is probably true for the majority of Republicans, or the guy with a sketchy anti-abortion record would not have been nominated over proven and life-long anti-abortion record. However, he gained support from going against the likes of Hillary Clinton on this front. In that light, he was an angel on the issue of abortion, and only the worst of two on integrity.

I’d say they’re about even on integrity. That said, I’m so tired of both parties using the murders of the unborn to advance their political goals. I’m in a constant state of needing a shower from it all.

 

[humbleseeker]

Just trying to have a conversation on one topic

This is just the opinion of an outside observer but
what I don’t understand is that the original thread was about the government shutdown. The ‘doomsday’ scenario: Here’s what happens if the shutdown drags on

Then you introduce a new topic with this post:

“I really need someone to explain this to me. Trump ran on the promise that Mexico would pay for the wall. Now our government is shut down because he’s demanding US funding for the wall. Why is anyone supporting him in this?”

But now you won’t answer a question because the thread has shifted again? After you shifted it first?

 

[gracepoole]

gracepoole:

Just trying to have a conversation on one topic

This is just the opinion of an outside observer but
what I don’t understand is that the original thread was about the government shutdown. The ‘doomsday’ scenario: Here’s what happens if the shutdown drags on

Then you introduce a new topic with this post:

“I really need someone to explain this to me. Trump ran on the promise that Mexico would pay for the wall. Now our government is shut down because he’s demanding US funding for the wall. Why is anyone supporting him in this?”

But now you won’t answer a question because the thread has shifted again? After you shifted it first?

It wasn’t a shift in topic. The “doomsday scenario” is the topic because of the shutdown, which presumably is happening because of the dispute over paying for the wall. There’s nothing about the ACA or Obama in this topic, so these really are shifts.

 

[Dr_Meinheimer]

You pivoted to Trump voters and the claim Mexico would pay for it, which is only tangentially even relevant to the effects of a shutdown.

 

[gracepoole]

I’d argue that it’s just a tad more than tangentially related given that without Trump voters accepting his promise and allowing (in some cases demanding) his present insistence on the wall, the government might not be shut down.

 

[Dr_Meinheimer]

One could argue that if the same Dems who spoke I’m favor of a wall and a secure border now seem dug in because it is Trump across the table from them are equally to blame for the shutdown.

As I have mentioned before, in the last shutdown, it was portrayed as the Congresses fault. But you seem to blame Trump. Odd.

 

[pnewton]

That is what I noticed as well. It wasn’t until he was criticized that he flipped from signing the budget to not signing the budget.

One could argue that if the same Dems who spoke I’m favor of a wall and a secure border now seem dug in because it is Trump across the table from them are equally to blame for the shutdown.

First. President Trump said he would be the one to shut down the government. The buck does, and always has, stopped with the president. Congress appropriates. Presidents execute. Do they not teach government in high school anymore? I most definitely blame Trump and there should be nothing odd about that.

 

[Dr_Meinheimer]

I tend to agree about the buck stopping with the Chief Executive. The standard only applies to Trump it appears when it comes to government shutdowns and not Democratic Presidents, but that is nothing new, and obvious double standard that continue to keep our country and even Catholics on this board perpetually divided is a separate issue, one could argue.

As far as what they teach in civics these days, I can only speak to my youngest children. We use the Mother of Divine Grace curriculum, and I handle the Social Studies. It’s quite good, and far more civics minded than the curriculum at my 2nd graders Catholic school, to be sure. Good stuff.

Nice attempt at a lecture though. Especially when no one contested that Congress appropriates, and the President executes. I missed him failing to sign the budget, but I could just be out of the loop, and if so, my apologies.

 

[gracepoole]

I tend to agree about the buck stopping with the Chief Executive.

Trump agrees. Or rather he did in 2013:

“If you say who gets fired, it always has to be the top. Problems start from the top, and they have to get solved from the top, and the president’s the leader, and he’s got to get everybody in a room, and he’s got to lead. And he doesn’t do that, he doesn’t like doing that, that’s not his strength. [W]hen they talk about the government shutdown, they’re going to be talking about the president of the United States, who the president was at that time. They’re not going to be talking about who was the head of the House, the head the Senate, who’s running things in Washington. So I really think the pressure is on the president.”

 

[Dr_Meinheimer]

Good for Trump. Now if he changed his mind about that, it would obviously make him as inconsistent as the posters here, but I can’t say for sure, obviously.

 

[pnewton]

The standard only applies to Trump it appears when it comes to government shutdowns and not Democratic Presidents, but that is nothing new, and obvious double standard that continue to keep our country and even Catholics on this board perpetually divided is a separate issue, one could argue.

I think sometimes this double standard (here, not in public) can be an illusion of trends rather than people. I for one believe Obama to be at fault for a lot of things over his ACA, which never should have been his to begin with. And be it Obama or Trump, Democrat or Republican, this sort of intransigent attitude is ridiculous over an issue on which the public is so evenly divided. Trump won by a slim margin, and a minority of votes. The Democrats took over the House by a slim margin. If there was ever a time for compromise, now is the time.

 

[Dr_Meinheimer]

On that I agree. Would that they could set aside their egos and find some common ground.

 

[FirstFiveEighth]

You seem to want to pin Trump voters to being ok with lying, as though Trump saying Mexico will pay for the wall is the first outrageous political promise ever made. I don’t know anyone who is ok with lying, but pretty much everyone will agree with the old joke, “How do you know a politician is lying? Because his mouth is moving”. I don’t think any kind of majority of Trump voters ever thought Mexico was going to pay for the wall. What they did get out of that promise was that Trump would fight for a border wall. And that is what he has been doing recently. He also has some good will banked up as he has been surprisingly consistent in following through with his campaign promises. Where you would see Trump voters upset at him for lying is if he got in office and said “on second thought I don’t like walls, we are scratching that idea”.

You keep asking why any Trump voters would support him on this, that is why. I guess you don’t have to believe me though and you can think it is some unsolvable mystery.