The Door to Real Jewish Life

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As to Yeshua and Saul/Paul, we must charitably take them at their words. Paul defended himself by stating that he was trained at the feet of Gamaliel - a rather prominent Pharisee. This would have been immediately challenged by any Pharisee who knew better.

Would Yeshua condemn the Pharisees seven-fold (Matthew 23) if he had anything in common with them? To fall in with “whitewashed tombs” would brand Him a hypocrite. Yet, they rightfully occupied the seat of Moses, so merited obedience because of that. Any observant Jew would have said as much.

It seems much more likely that Yeshua was associated with or aligned more closely with the Essenes. Why? “You will meet a man carrying a jug of water” This rarely if ever happened outside of the Essene community, as the women carried the water, i.e. the Samaritan woman at Jacob’s well in John chapter 4.

For the sake of discussion, I must ask a huge indulgence of you: that you take your Jewish glasses off - only temporarily. Keep them handy for those uneasy moments! I respectfully ask that you endeavor to suspend disbelief for the sake of dialog.

One thing known about Talmudic scholars is that they argue! Disputation is an art form in their world, witness Job’s three friends disputing with him. But, I would rather not dispute, but reason together.

You have a 2,000 year tradition of denying Yeshua - we have the opposite. Who’s to know? The Catholic faith is one which we must affirm and defend daily - especially today!

As I mentioned, I have tremendous spiritual confirmation of my beliefs. My life being spared is but one. Heaven was stormed on my behalf and despite a 99.5% chance of succumbing to three simultaneous cancers, I am here.

Who but the Almighty can grant such a favor?
 
Mums side. They don’t speak of it much due to ww11 and Austrian experiences.
 
Don’t get me started on Isaiah 53. If you want to go there, it will have to be through email because you will be crushed. I suggest we stay off it.

You then said: “You have to understand, the Talmud is a vast collection of volumes written over many centuries by many rabbis…”

Already knew that, thanks.

You: “but as Schäfer’s book describes, it is scattered throughout the Talmudic stories makeing fun of Jesus’ birth from a virgin, fervently contest his claim to be the Messiah and Son of God…”

We don’t need to make fun of the virgin birth. We have sound reasons instead. Show me one passage from Talmud Bavil making fun, I’ve never heard of it.

I know what Finklestein was saying. I have friends who’ve lived in Eretz Yisrael for years, they’ve spoken with the Arabs there, none of them talk about oppression there, they think that’s a load a bull. They live in the most politically free country in the Middle East!
I’m not saying both sides have done some wrong, we’re not perfect, but to compare us to the Nazis is totally biased. The wall was put up for a reason, y’know, to keep terroists out.

. . .And yes, I know Shoah survivors, I’ve heard their stories time and time again. My own family was persecuted, though before the Nazi era, so I think I at least have some sense of their pain. Yes, everything’s subjective, but we can at least - at least - scratch the surface a little.
 
Rabbi said:
I see. You’re Jewish then 100%. Welcome home.
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One word of caution; when one begins to think one ethnic race is better or more special than another, then spiritual blindness always takes over. We are all part of the same human race. As for the Chosen People, people need to understand that God chose a certain people in order to prepare the world for the coming of the Messiah in order to save all peoples. Thus His command to His apostles:

All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me. 19 Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, 20 and teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you. And surely I am with you always, to the very end of the age.” Matt. 28:18-20
 
Rabbi said:
Don’t get me started on Isaiah 53. If you want to go there, it will have to be through email because you will be crushed. I suggest we stay off it., it will have to be through email because you will be crushed. I suggest we stay off it.
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I suggest everyone in this thread watch his short video of two Israeli Jews explaining Isaiah 53.

Rabbi said:
I have friends who’ve lived in Eretz Yisrael for years, they’ve spoken with the Arabs there, none of them talk about oppression there, they think that’s a load a bull. They live in the most politically free country in the Middle East!
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Obviously the ones not living under oppression and are kept in the dark from it will not complain. But for those who see it and have a conscience, they are speaking out. Here is a great video by Miko Peled, an Israeli Jew from a prominent Israeli family who travels everywhere trying to tell the world and anyone who will listen the story the mainstream media never tells the world. Listen carefully how he describes the before and after map of the region and the tactics used; make sure you also watch the Q&A period afterwards:

 
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Okay, great observation there. But why did they fall in the seat of Moses’? Is this some
Kind of chair? Of course not! I say Jesus, and then the Pharisees, all followed the Oral Law. In fact, many of the stories in Tanakh don’t make sense without it. How did Ruth convert if her people were punished for all time? Only the Oral
Torah has the answer. Where did Jesus pull out the notion that we could heal on Shabbat without the Oral Law? See? They’re countless examples.

You’ve made another great assessment with Jesus possibly being an Essen. I couldn’t agree more, but now I’ve made the prize oxymoron of the year, right? Not so fast! The Essenes WERE Pharisees. Wow! Hard to believe, isn’t? Luckily, I’ve done a lot of research in this area which proves it. In my next post, I’ll back up my claim.

While the great Chazal would debate on matters of halacha, no one ever once confronted the fact of indeed this only mesorah came from L’ Moshe MiSinai.

My friend, I agree with you, we must follow the path of truth on our journey. I’m sorry to hear about that event in your life. G-d’s has was surely at work there, for only He has such power, and He only did it because He loves you more than a mother with child ready to enter the gas chambers. You are created in His image, He’ll never let you go, and whether Jew or Gentile, G-d won’t punish us for our beliefs. If Islam, in the end, were true, G-d would still have no right for we had no idea. I believe this with a full heart. I sing in joy of your accomplishment and hope we can continue this dialogue.
 
I couldn’t agree with you more! We Jews were chosen not because we’re special or make a lot of money, but to be a light to the nations. In other words, we’re here for you, to show you the truth by example. I don’t view one race over another, that’s done the dark path of Hitler. I simply celebrated the fact of finding another Jew on this site because tradition tells us that a Jew is Jewish based on the mother. If your mother was Jewish, you’re Jewish 100%. If it’s on your father’s side however, no matter if he’s even a rabbi… if your mother was a Buddhist and never converted, you’re 100% a non-Jew. This is the way it works. I didn’t make the law, G-d did.
 
And to claim Jews make a lot of money is hogwash 101. Read about the followers of the Baal Shem Tov, you’ve never heard of the word “poor” and “poverty” if you haven’t.
 
We must look to his seemingly fantastic claim of divinity - that explains every eccentricity that we perceive. That carries the potential to lay to rest some of the more outrageous things that He said. Back on the other hand, many look upon Him as purely human, or rather think about Him as man does and not as G-d does. Can we honestly claim that G-d cannot conceive of a Son via His Holy Spirit? The One Who created all that is created e_x nihilo_? “All things are possible with…”

Again, each lawgiver was, at the very least, controversial in his time. The rebellion at Kore, for example. We know and venerate Moses, but he had those with designs on his life! Look at how many wanted to return to Egypt! They were ready to stone him! He was not delivering them according to their desires - yet G-d knew that the grumbling generation had to perish in the desert before a generation worthy of Him would be created.

Once again, for the oral Torah to have any weight, it had to have divine authority behind it - or else it was simply some (self?) appointed leader spouting off. Look at how Moses assigned his own successor, Joshua (a form of Yeshua - G-d saves). He laid hands on him and "ordained’ him. Where do we see that occurring over the past 2,000 years up to today?

You have to be daring, a risk-taker, and remove those glasses of opposition in order to see and understand the position of those with whom you are disputing. I use disputation in the purest sense here - not empty opposition or simple reactive argument.

Cogent point and counterpoint lead to greater understanding if not acceptance. Thoughtful Christians tend to (tend to only) understand the Hebrew viewpoint, as our faith is directly descended from the ancient faith. Willing suspension of disbelief is necessary in all such endeavors.
 
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Rabbi said:
We Jews were chosen not because we’re special or make a lot of money, but to be a light to the nations. In other words, we’re here for you, to show you the truth by example.
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Yes, this is the at the core of what it means to be Christian and to follow Christ. But the light has to come from God to shine through us. Christ is the pattern and example, but He is the vine and we are to be the branches. We are given power to be transformed and act through the sacraments. Unfortunately the problem with merely being religious and following rules, which often occurs among Christians, is that if we do not allow God to spiritually transform our heart, we simply become religious hypocrites, much like the pharisees whom Jesus excoriated in the gospels.

It’s a bout transformation of heart and uprooting everything from our heart that separates us from God, wether attachments to things of the world, making idols out of money and pursuing materialism.

Judaism is the root of Catholicism. Thus Judaism flowers into Catholicism.

“You are the light of the world. A town built on a hill cannot be hidden. Neither do people light a lamp and put it under a bowl. Instead they put it on its stand, and it gives light to everyone in the house. In the same way, let your light shine before others, that they may see your good deeds and glorify your Father in heaven."

I am the vine ; you are the branches . I f you remain i n me and I i n you , you will bear much fruit; apart from me you can do nothing. -John 15:5
 
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Rabbi said:
The old secular claims that Zohar was inspired by Christian Gnostic myths is far-flung and unsupported. Clearly, the Zohar is of divine origin.
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The information given on this subject is from Jewish Virtual Library - and, I don’t see any comments in regards to Christian Gnostic myths?
 
Finklestein is merely exposing the human rights abuses, ethnic cleansing and horrors perpetrated by Zionism and the state of Israel against the people of Palestine
 
Zionism is the political movement behind the ethnic cleansing, theft of lands and extreme human rights abuses by the state of Israel against the non Jewish people of Palestine. Most American Jews have no clue what Zionism is and think it’s some anti-semitic label for Judaism. Here is President Carter shedding some light on it:

Zi·on·ism
ˈzīəˌnizəm/

noun

noun: Zionism
  1. a movement for (originally) the re-establishment and (now) the development and protection of a Jewish nation in what is now Israel. It was established as a political organization in 1897 under Theodor Herzl, and was later led by Chaim Weizmann.
 
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I wish Zionism were as simple as you and President Carter state. Unfortunately, it is not. Zionism is interwoven with both the religion of Judaism and the existence of the State of Israel. It has its critics, some of whom are Jews, both very religious and more secular. But it can also be a shield for some to conceal their anti-Semitism. And from the political perspective, the historical context between the Israeli and the Palestinian people and their respective leaders is likewise far from simple.
 
Oh! I thought it was some sort of Israeli-Palestinian conflict thread, but that might be because it was…(Please Note: This uploaded content is no longer available.)
 
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