The Duggers' 17 children

[monicatholic]

Thanks, Sepharad,

Yes, that’s our littlest-- youngest of ten born, two in heaven. She’s an amazing gift from God. She turned two years old the other day.

 

[OldAgeGuru]

I have no business commenting too much on the parenting style of the Duggars, as I am not a parent (yet, I pray) myself, but I will say:

I come from a non-religious (minus myself, of course) family of 4, and my sister and I are expected to do all of the cleaning, most of tending of our garden (roughly 250 square feet of garden! ) and some of the more “manly” house repairs as well. (I learned how to fix a clogged drain this weekend- I can’t help it, I’m proud of myself!) I have to say, learning how to install sub-flooring, tile, siding etc. during the building of our new home was intensly character building- and the excitement that comes with learning more “adult” tasks (imagine my smile the first time I operated a back hoe!) has led me to lead a more productive life.

As my sister and I do this work, my parents, who have given up so much for us, have been freed up to have weekly date nights, join service groups, adopt two puppies… Not every family is the same, but perhaps this testimony of the inherent BOONS of giving a large portion of the responsibility for house and family will help some people understand the opinions of others who believe that “too much work” is 100% bad for children/teens. I work 2 jobs, am a college student (and graduate) and I still will happily take on extra responsibility at home- because this is my family, it is a unit. We all have our days where we need help, but largely, it works out.

God bless

I think it’s great that you are willing to help out around the house with your parents. I think it’s great that you use a backhoe and install subflooring. However, the difference between your family and the Duggers is that you aren’t being forced into it. You weren’t AS A TODDLER wandering around a construction site under the supervision of a 14 year old. My word, I’m a 28 year old grown woman, and I am friends with a bunch of guys who do construction management, I won’t walk into one without sturdy shoes and a hard hat, these kids were wandering around. And I’m sorry but a 14 year can baby sit, but they SHOULD NOT be responsible for raising a child, educating a child, feeding a child, etc. And it’s great to have a date night, my parents do it, my fiance and I don’t because we’re now broke since we bought a house. But your parents didn’t deposit an infant into your lap to be practically the sole caretaker for so that they could get busy creating a new one.

They do go to church, in their basement. They don’t leave to go to services, the dad performs them in the basement. I don’t even know what to call that? The first church of the holy utility sink?

 

[Sepharad]

Thanks, Sepharad,

Yes, that’s our littlest-- youngest of ten born, two in heaven. She’s an amazing gift from God. She turned two years old the other day.

You have a genuine blessing from God! Don’t listen to what anyone might say otherwise, we live in a kooky society anyway, that cannot often appreciate such gifts!

My condolences to you for the two babies you lost…I lost four myself (I have three living), so I understand {{{{{hugs}}}}}

 

[BennyBoy89]

Maybe the Duggars are doing something right? Why do you say “they need the (Catholic) church”? They are deeply spiritual Protestants, and seem very firmly committed to their understanding of Christianity. Evidently it works for them!

Laveyan Satanism works for some people. I would lack charity if I didn’t pray that the Duggars, and everyone else, would find the fullness of Christian faith that is only in the Catholic Church. The fact is, “deeply spiritual Protestant” can range anywhere from Katherine Jefferts Schorri (sp?) to the Duggar Family to Westboro Baptist Church.

Anyway, I too am no stranger to large families. I’m the oldest of five (the first in my direct line to be Catholic since the Reformation), my mom is one of four, and her sisters and brother each have four kids. We’re not overly large, but certainly not small.

mamacita - on the Duggars first documentary it showed them having church in the home with a bunch of other families. Maybe theyve changed since then, but I know at one time they did. I am glad though that their kids are allowed to dress normally. I’ve never seen them on tv dressed like it. When I said they need the Church I mean THE Church, that is, the One, Holy, Catholic, and Apostolic one.

I don’t want anyone to think that I’m entirely opposed to homeschooling. I’m opposed to it though when the parents have questionable motives or when the kids don’t want to be homeschooled. It’s also sad when the parents have no idea what they’re doing and just let their kids fall further and further behind socially and educationally. It works for some people, and doesn’t for others. I only feel the way I do because of the fact that I was homeschooled for 3 years (6th - 8th grade). It’s not that my parents are anything like I’m describing (theyre really not), it’s just that I’ve seen other homeschooled kids who are. I wanted to get out though, and finally my parents let me go to public high school, and I can tell you it’s not as bad as some would have you think. You can keep your kids from being exposed to the ways of this world, but how are they going to be equipped to handle it when they grow up? We may not be of this world, but we’re certainly in it.

 

[aimee]

Duggars expecting baby 18!
Michelle, 41, is currently 8 weeks along in her pregnancy. The 18th sibling is due to arrive around New Year’s Day 2009. “We’ve had three in January, three in December. Those two months are a busy time for us,” joked the exceptionally busy expectant mom. With an estimated 200 loads of laundry done each month in this household, there can’t possibly be a month that’s not chaotic!

surebaby.com/blog/2008/05/28/baby-18-on-the-way-for-duggar-family/

 

[CatholicSam]

the single most disturbing thing about the Duggers is this: at the very moment they are first holding in their arms an astonishing, unique, unrepeatable, eternal gift from God, they are already looking for the next one.

I have given birth to ten live children and lost two. when i am holding my newborn baby in my arms, i have absolutely no thought to who might come next. i want only one thing-- to spend the rest of my life learning who this person is, feeling completely humbled that God has given us this gift of this child.

I know this is an old thread and you’ve probably readdressed this issue. And I’m sorry for not taking the time to read through over 200 posts that have accumulated over the past year or so…

But I can assure you that loving your baby so much that you “can’t wait to do it again” has NOTHING to do with the gimme-gimme’s of secular Christmas. I felt that exact same way after the births of both my children, and I only have 2

Giving birth is such an amazing experience (and I know you’ve had some amazing birth experiences yourself, Monica–I LOVE your homebirth stories!!!), that you can’t blame someone for feeling like doing it again. We’ve never used NFP since conceiving our first baby, happy to get pregnant again as soon as God sees fit to send us another blessing. And at the same time we also know that God may not choose us to be parents to any other children, and so we try to live in the present and not in the future.

It’s not either-or. You CAN look forward to having another baby–finding out what amazing blessings God has in store for you (I must admit that I’ve had baby fever while still pregnant ), AND love and cherish and discover the children you’ve already been blessed with.

I’m also looking forward to old age and all the spiritual benefits that come with it. But that doesn’t mean I’m not enjoying and being extremely thankful for my youth and health now.

Oh, and you mentioned “scheduled baby replacement every year”. Well, to the best of my knowledge they are not seeking fertility treatments. They’re just being open to life. If they get pregnant every year, that’s God’s business. (and as for weaning at 6 months–I’ve heard that Mrs. Duggar has breastfeeding problems which make it difficult for her to even BF **that **long).

 

[monicatholic]

CatholicSam,

i have revisited this issue since i first wrote. my initial post was uncharitable in tone and i regret that a lot. but my sense of motives being unbalanced there is as strong as ever.

i’m happy you’ve enjoyed my homebirth stories. they were particularly blessed times.

see you on another thread!

 

[CatholicSam]

CatholicSam,

i have revisited this issue since i first wrote. my initial post was uncharitable in tone and i regret that a lot. but my sense of motives being unbalanced there is as strong as ever.

i’m happy you’ve enjoyed my homebirth stories. they were particularly blessed times.

see you on another thread!

I thought you probably have explained a little further somewhere in those 125 posts And I hope I didn’t come across as pointing fingers. I just wanted to explain how ***I ***felt when I had my two wonderful children. I don’t know, could it be that the desire to have more children is planted in our hearts by God, and some people experience that as “Ooooh, I can’t wait to do this again!” kind of thing? While others experience it as “Ooooooh, what a moment to treasure forever–I can’t even begin to think of doing this again!” And then some of us probably experience a bit of both…

I feel a little uneasy to think some people might look at my extended nursing and think I’m doing it to avoid a pregnancy. I bet Mrs. Duggar might feel similarly when she has to wean at 6 months for health reasons and thinks people assume she’s doing it to get pregnant again.

Once again, not pointing fingers at you or anyone else, just airing my thoughts and feelings. :tiphat:

 

[monicatholic]

CatholicSam,

i appreciate your charity toward my behavior on this thread. in fact, throughout my several (many?) contributions i remained as emphatic as my original post.

had i been emphatic without being uncharitable, i may have been better understood. maybe not.

 

[aimee]

CatholicSam,

i appreciate your charity toward my behavior on this thread. in fact, throughout my several (many?) contributions i remained as emphatic as my original post.

had i been emphatic without being uncharitable, i may have been better understood. maybe not.

What do you think of the ‘Duggars’ annoucement?

 

[Veronica7]

necessity puts an entirely diffferent spin on things, doesn’t it?

note the false alternatives presented: ungenerosity toward life vs. hyper-fecundity. there is another choice, that doesn’t lie between these extremes, but above them: that is, to be open to life and for parents to provide as far as possible for the physical and spiritual needs of their children. (ccc2252).

We should also be reminded that The fecundity of conjugal love cannot be reduced solely to the procreation of children, but must extend to their moral education and their spiritual formation. “The role of parents in education is of such importance that it is almost impossible to provide an adequate substitute.” The right and the duty of parents to educate their children are primordial and inalienable. (ccc2221)

I think the Duggar’s procreation of children with the ***intention ***their older children will fill so many roles **fails on both points of the catechism. **

Mr. and Mrs. Duggar might likely have another 6 or 8 kids before she reaches menopause. I’ll not argue this point 6 or 8 more times.

Wow, Monicacatholic, well-spoken.
I noticed this thread only recently (due to the birth of the Duggars’ 18th and their corresponding appearances on media shows), so wasn’t able to chime in at first. But- I think your perception of the situation is correct.
I’m sure none of us would think of putting our children on a reality-tv show series for monetary gain. I have nine children, plus nine more in heaven… all of the living ones naturally spaced by breastfeeding at least a year. I have never looked at my newborns and immediately (frantically) thought of the next. It’s not a race.
I think one reason why there was such a huge backlash to Humanae Vitae was precisely because so many Catholic women in the 50’s and early 60’s were bottlefeeding, having babies a year apart and ending up exhausted and worn out. There is a reason why God and nature plan it differently. You don’t have to hand off the “baby of the year” to another one of your children if they are naturally spaced. Of course, they help out, but the Duggar’s regimented lifestyle is more in line with Bill Gothard (who is unmarried, and doesn’t have the protection of the Holy Spirit like our pope does), and the Quiverfull theology.

 

[mpi]

These past 12 or 13 years, our practice at Christmas has been to give each of our children one special gift-- ie rollerblades or something of that size and two smaller gifts-- totalling three gifts-- the same number gifts scripture records Baby Jesus received at his birth.

it wasn’t always this way. years ago, i’d begin Christmas shopping in august and continue purchasing “cute stuff” or things “he’ll love” almost up till Christmas Eve.

those Christmas mornings were disgusting. the kids would tear open one of the dozen boxes designated for them, look briefly at the new toy and grab for the next wrapped package, while tossing the latest gift into the heap along side them on the floor. until the last box was opened, they were grabbing for “what’s next.”

the Duggers just gave birth to their seventeenth child. i’ve read quotes and seen them on TV since the birth of their fourteenth child. the single most disturbing thing about the Duggers is this: at the very moment they are first holding in their arms an astonishing, unique, unrepeatable, eternal gift from God, they are already looking for the next one.

I have given birth to ten live children and lost two. when i am holding my newborn baby in my arms, i have absolutely no thought to who might come next. i want only one thing-- to spend the rest of my life learning who this person is, feeling completely humbled that God has given us this gift of this child.

when people learn we are parents of ten, have homescooled for seventeen years, are actively involved with our church (the general family bio that follows us like a billboard) they often ask, “didja see that family with 16 kids on TV? are you like them?”

no. we are not like them. my children have never been required to dress alike because they are unique people, not part of a set. when they approach their first birthday, we are not actively trying to refill their baby slot. we like them to be the baby for a long time.

they are not expected to all learn violin. my pantry does not look like the new, bright, clean A+P superstore. our home looks like real people live here. even for a TV interview, this place would appear to be as loved as it is.

i don’t think the problem is some perceived overpopulation or that the Duggers have too ***many ***children.

instead i am sad that as the Dugger children emerge into the world, perfectly brand new from God, their parents can’t seem to sit still long enough to deeply relish that particular gift of that particular unique child. instead they seem like my spoiled kids on Christmases of old, insisting, “what’s next?”

I think the Duggars are a wonderful family. I admire so much of what they have done and what they believe. It will take many families like the Duggars to reverse the population decline of the West. The only flaw I see in their life is that they are not Catholic.

 

[mamacita]

I think the Duggars are a wonderful family. I admire so much of what they have done and what they believe. It will take many families like the Duggars to reverse the population decline of the West. The only flaw I see in their life is that they are not Catholic.

I agree w/ you, MPI. Maybe if someone secretly mailed them a book on Catholicism that could change? Who knows…

 

[twiceblessed]

Still like the Duggers.

This appears to be one of THE most resurrected threads. If they aren’t against us, then they are for us. Isn’t promoting a life free of contraception and birth control, striving to live a Christian life best they know how, and giving public witness to both not better than many of our own do? Why bash them?

 

[slcherian]

The Dugger family are doing what they feel God is leading them to do. They has a testimony that they lost one of their children early (after she had the first two or three) because of the birth control they were using. So, when this happened they repented and decided that they would take as many children as God decided to give to them. Did anyone know this.? You really should not judge people when you do not know the facts of what they have faced. Plus if God did not want them to have the children, then he knows how to stop it. How many women in the bible does it talk about God had shut their wombs. I am thankful for what God has given to me (my six boys). We have not done anything to stop God from giving us more, so its Gods decision if we give that to Him and not use birth control to stop Him.
Further more, she home schools and takes care of her framily, shopping and scheduling. It does not hurt the older kids to help do their part. They will one day have their own families and will have to do this for themselves. And if they don’t like it then they will use birth control until they decide to start a family if they so chose, but I believe its been one of the best things for my older children to see what its like to have a younger sibling. It makes them understand the responsability of taking care of children and I think its made them less likely to want to jump into bed with someone because they understand the reality of those choices. Cause lets face it, the society we live in does not foster saving sex till marriage even in the Catholic church. I am proud of the Duggers for allowing God to give them what he desires. Who cares how they dress or if they have short or long hair or blah, blah, blah. Do they know Christ is the most important thing, of which I believe they are teaching them and are they healthy, mentally, physically and emotionally. Those are the key issues to healthy child and I believe they are doing it the way God is leading them to do it. Praise the Lord for His goodness and faithfulness.

 

[lada]

I respect large families. However, I cannot respect the Duggars. What they are doing is unnatural - things like early weaning so they can more readily conceive again. I don’t condone such behavior. I also believe in fertility care, perhaps not contraception, but definitely common sense. I believe the Duggars have gotten caught up in the hype and are - both psychologically and financially - dependent on their fame, and their fame is, in turn, dependent on their continuing to have children every 18 months. Thus the desire to wean early and conceive often. I believe they don’t just NOT use birth control, but rather they TRY to have children that often. And, as evidenced by her last delivery, such behavior is not responsible parenting.

 

[shannyk]

I respect large families. However, I cannot respect the Duggars. What they are doing is unnatural - things like early weaning so they can more readily conceive again. I don’t condone such behavior. I also believe in fertility care, perhaps not contraception, but definitely common sense. I believe the Duggars have gotten caught up in the hype and are - both psychologically and financially - dependent on their fame, and their fame is, in turn, dependent on their continuing to have children every 18 months. Thus the desire to wean early and conceive often. I believe they don’t just NOT use birth control, but rather they TRY to have children that often. And, as evidenced by her last delivery, such behavior is not responsible parenting.

the whole weaning to conceive this is a rumor. we have to be careful with those…

babygooroo.com/index.php/2009/03/30/after-18-children-breastfeeding-for-michelle-duggar-continues-to-be-a-learning-experience/

 

[CountrySinger]

I would so have 17 children, if I could be rich and famous. I would one up them and have 25 children! I never think it is okay to have your fame based on your children. Example: “John and Kate Plus 8”
Seriously, it creeps me out. I couldn’t even remember their names, I would be like “Kid numer 13. come here”. I would never have my older children be responsible for the younger ones. My older brothers took care of me while my mom was working (father left us), and they both said that they resented it (they had to give up his teenage years, so I can’t blame them).

 

[mamacita]

I respect large families. However, I cannot respect the Duggars. What they are doing is unnatural -** things like early weaning so they can more readily conceive again. I don’t condone such behavior. ** I also believe in fertility care, perhaps not contraception, but definitely common sense. I believe the Duggars have gotten caught up in the hype and are - both psychologically and financially - dependent on their fame, and their fame is, in turn, dependent on their continuing to have children every 18 months. Thus the desire to wean early and conceive often. I believe they don’t just NOT use birth control, but rather they TRY to have children that often. And, as evidenced by her last delivery, such behavior is not responsible parenting.

Well, not sure where you got this quote because I watch the show. She said she is BREASTFEEDING when she CONCEIVES. YES, that is possible. She has said it on their Q and A episode. It’s not our job to JUDGE others actions. I have to agree w/ the above poster, if God didn’t want her having more kids, He’d not be blessing them w/ more. They are excellent parents from what I’ve seen on the show AND in person, the kids seem very happy, and we should leave well enough alone.

 

[lada]

the whole weaning to conceive this is a rumor. we have to be careful with those…

babygooroo.com/index.php/2009/03/30/after-18-children-breastfeeding-for-michelle-duggar-continues-to-be-a-learning-experience/

From that link:

“The longest I’ve been able to breastfeed is 9 months, and I’m thrilled about that,”

In comparison, the AAP recommends babies be breastfed until at least 12 months of age, and beyond that if the situation is comfortable for both mom and baby. Breastmilk is the BEST food for your child for the first year of his life. If you know you usually conceive at 8 weeks postpartum, and doing so causes your milk to dry up, then it’s your responsibility to your nursing infant to use some discretion when engaging in intercourse so that you can continue to give your infant what is best for his developing system. I, too, usually conceive very quickly after giving birth, and usually dry up quickly as well. Once we learned this (and it only took the first time to figure it out) we were more careful during that postpartum time and were very strict with our NFP practices. I’ve never had anyone tell me that using NFP to avoid pregnancy so that I could continue to nurse was against the Church teachings.

There is being open to life, and being blessed with many children…and then there’s going on a sex marathon to see how many kids you can squeeze into your childbearing years. The latter is in no way natural, or Godly.