The gates of hell shall not prevail against WHO?

[Norrin]

Perfect example you will believe anything the RCC will tell you however unfounded it may be.
What are gates and what athey used for?

I’m having a great chuckle when I read your question, “What are the gates of hell and what are they used for”? Essentially, everyone here is correct. The gates of hell are the powers of Man’s archenemy, Satan. But perhaps this can help, if you believe in the Nicene Creed, as well as sections of the Bible that corroborate Jesus’s descent into hell:

“Who was conceived by the Holy Ghost, born of the Virgin Mary, suffered under Pontius Pilate, was crucified, died, and buried; He descended into hell, the third day He rose again from the dead. Or the Athanasian Creed states: He suffered death for our salvation. He descended into hell and rose again from the dead. John Calvin, in his voluminous Institutes of the Christian Religion, treated the subject at length (1599, II.16.8-12). Calvin cited earlier theologians who agreed with him, including Hilary in his On the Trinity (IV.xlii; III.xv). The renowned medieval Catholic theologian, Thomas Aquinas, held a similar view (Summa Theol. III. 52. 5). The apocryphal Gospel of Nicodemus, which dates from the fifth century A.D., claims that Jesus descended into hell and retrieved all the Old Testament saints, including Adam, David, Habakkuk, and Isaiah (see James, 1924, pp. 125ff.).

OK. But if this is still not sufficient for you, then we can look at another part of the Catholic faith that ensures us that there are such things as the “gates of hell”. But what could this section be? Well, let’s look at Martin Malachi’s seminal book, “Hostage to the Devil”, which is basically a theologically-accurate, step-by-step manual on that Oh-So-Scary practice known as exorcism. In this book, Martin, who was a priest and exorcist (he died in the late 1990s), provides transcripts of actual dialogue between exorcist and the Evil Spirit(s). In those transcripts, the Evil Spirit frequently and consistently admit that they would rather suffer the exorcism rite rather than be forced to abandon their host body. Why? Because once they are exorcised, they are forced to go to hell, and they could never again be free. Now, again, based on those transcripts (and other scholarly screeds written by other exorcists), the Evil Spirit hints that there are many that are irreversibly held inside the “gates of hell” and that others are not. We don’t know why some were forced to enter, but we do know that it is Jesus Himself that holds the keys to those gates and who determines who will enter or leave that infernal place (if leaving it is even a possibility).

Now, again, like I said earlier, most of these people posting are correct in that the “gates of hell” is a metaphor for Satan and his minions, and your question really doesn’t have much theological value when discussing Christianity and its enemies. So what exactly were you driving at when asking this question?

 

[spockrates]

Also none. I haven’t heard of anyone being booted since I’ve been in this forum.

PAX DOMINI

Shalom Aleichem

Well, I know one. After five years he was kicked off the forum without a warning. He was not sent an email from a Forum Moderator. He was not given a chance to appeal to a Super Moderator, as the forum rules indicate. He was just kicked off for forum with no chance for appeal and no reason given why. It was someone I knew well.

 

[Javl]

Well, I know one. After five years he was kicked off the forum without a warning. He was not sent an email from a Forum Moderator. He was not given a chance to appeal to a Super Moderator, as the forum rules indicate. He was just kicked off for forum with no chance for appeal and no reason given why. It was someone I knew well.

That is news to me. I am quite surprised that the moderator or director would do it that way. It must have been a very serious incident that was commited for that to happen.

PAX DOMINI

Shalom Aleichem

 

[Hisalone]

I’m having a great chuckle when I read your question, “What are the gates of hell and what are they used for”? Essentially, everyone here is correct. The gates of hell are the powers of Man’s archenemy, Satan. But perhaps this can help, if you believe in the Nicene Creed, as well as sections of the Bible that corroborate Jesus’s descent into hell:

“Who was conceived by the Holy Ghost, born of the Virgin Mary, suffered under Pontius Pilate, was crucified, died, and buried; He descended into hell, the third day He rose again from the dead. Or the Athanasian Creed states: He suffered death for our salvation. He descended into hell and rose again from the dead. John Calvin, in his voluminous Institutes of the Christian Religion, treated the subject at length (1599, II.16.8-12). Calvin cited earlier theologians who agreed with him, including Hilary in his On the Trinity (IV.xlii; III.xv). The renowned medieval Catholic theologian, Thomas Aquinas, held a similar view (Summa Theol. III. 52. 5). The apocryphal Gospel of Nicodemus, which dates from the fifth century A.D., claims that Jesus descended into hell and retrieved all the Old Testament saints, including Adam, David, Habakkuk, and Isaiah (see James, 1924, pp. 125ff.).

OK. But if this is still not sufficient for you, then we can look at another part of the Catholic faith that ensures us that there are such things as the “gates of hell”. But what could this section be? Well, let’s look at Martin Malachi’s seminal book, “Hostage to the Devil”, which is basically a theologically-accurate, step-by-step manual on that Oh-So-Scary practice known as exorcism. In this book, Martin, who was a priest and exorcist (he died in the late 1990s), provides transcripts of actual dialogue between exorcist and the Evil Spirit(s). In those transcripts, the Evil Spirit frequently and consistently admit that they would rather suffer the exorcism rite rather than be forced to abandon their host body. Why? Because once they are exorcised, they are forced to go to hell, and they could never again be free. Now, again, based on those transcripts (and other scholarly screeds written by other exorcists), the Evil Spirit hints that there are many that are irreversibly held inside the “gates of hell” and that others are not. We don’t know why some were forced to enter, but we do know that it is Jesus Himself that holds the keys to those gates and who determines who will enter or leave that infernal place (if leaving it is even a possibility).

Now, again, like I said earlier, most of these people posting are correct in that the “gates of hell” is a metaphor for Satan and his minions, and your question really doesn’t have much theological value when discussing Christianity and its enemies. So what exactly were you driving at when asking this question?

Hello Norrin, interesting name.
Malachi Martin wasnt he a Vatican insider who was murdered by those in the Vatican who wanted to silence him?
He said the the 3rd secret of Fatima was that the Catholic Church would apostacy. Where will you guys go when it does?
You will be welcomed in my church.
Is this the Malachi Martin who said that many of the cardinals were masons and that is why JPll made so many new ones so that he could water down the influence of those who were.
Is this the same Malachi Martin that was interviewed by Kathleen Keating ----What ever happened to her?
Is this the same Malachi Martin that said that there was a group of vatican insiders who had a Black Mass said in the vatican?

BTW The Church of Christ will prevail against the entrapment of the “host” (poor soul) that is possessed.

 

[Javl]

Hello Norrin, interesting name.
Malachi Martin wasnt he a Vatican insider who was murdered by those in the Vatican who wanted to silence him?
He said the the 3rd secret of Fatima was that the Catholic Church would apostacy. Where will you guys go when it does?
You will be welcomed in my church.
Is this the Malachi Martin who said that many of the cardinals were masons and that is why JPll made so many new ones so that he could water down the influence of those who were.
Is this the same Malachi Martin that was interviewed by Kathleen Keating ----What ever happened to her?
Is this the same Malachi Martin that said that there was a group of vatican insiders who had a Black Mass said in the vatican?

BTW The Church of Christ will prevail against the entrapment of the “host” (poor soul) that is possessed.

I think you’ve been reading and believing too much of Brown’s “The DaVinci Code” and “Angels and Demons”. Where did you ever hear all this tripe? But, then again, you’d probably believe anything said detrimentally about the Catholic Church. Don’t bother to investigate these allegations, it’s too much trouble for you.

PAX DOMINI

Shalom Aleichem

 

[Norrin]

Hello Norrin, interesting name.
Malachi Martin wasnt he a Vatican insider who was murdered by those in the Vatican who wanted to silence him?
He said the the 3rd secret of Fatima was that the Catholic Church would apostacy. Where will you guys go when it does?
You will be welcomed in my church.
Is this the Malachi Martin who said that many of the cardinals were masons and that is why JPll made so many new ones so that he could water down the influence of those who were.
Is this the same Malachi Martin that was interviewed by Kathleen Keating ----What ever happened to her?
Is this the same Malachi Martin that said that there was a group of vatican insiders who had a Black Mass said in the vatican?

BTW The Church of Christ will prevail against the entrapment of the “host” (poor soul) that is possessed.

The very same one, but some of your premises I do not agree with. For instance, how do you know that he was killed by those in the Vatican who wanted him dead? Who are the sources for your presumption? Conspiracies always revolve around those who are interesting and who are correct. The fact is that no one knows “why” or “how” he died, but we do know that he fell and did not recover (some say he was hit over the head).

Martin never divulged what the 3rd Secret of Fatima was. He was under oath to NOT disclose its contents. But he did say that it was terrible.

Martin did indeed divulge that there was a penetration of the Catholic Church by Satanists in 1963. According to Martin and other Vatican insiders, there was a ritual inside the Vatican that was held, over the phone, jointly with Satanists from the U.S. In fact, Pope Paul VI publicly stated that the “smoke of Satan has penetrated the Church”. Martin also wrote that there are Satanists within the Church that hold powerful positions, and that they are trying their best to undermine it. But Malachi also added that they will never prevail in their sinister goals because Jesus himself said that Satan will never prevail against his Church.

He did say that many priests, including some Cardinals, were indeed members of the Masons. But he also said that many have been kept in check. For instance, he mentioned many advocate for the legalization of homosexual marriage, ordaining women as priests, the propagation of the heresy that there is no such thing as Satan (he is only a metaphor), and things of that nature. None of those issues have been recognized by the Catholic Church. Furthermore, Martin, as well as other chief exorcists in Rome, added that the revised ritual of exorcism (passed in 1999) was ineffective and a slap in the face to experienced, mature exorcists. Its development did not include one exorcist, which is a pretty curious thing, don’t you think? But what is more curious is not the fact that no exorcist was allowed to participate in the rite’s revision, but what the revised rite contained. The new rite was so ineffective that is was considered useless. The question then is, “why weren’t exorcists consulted and allowed to participate in the new rite’s development”? Some exorcists have hinted that it has something to do with that “penetration” that occurred over 45 years ago.

So, yes, this the very same Malachi Martin that I am referring to in my original post to you. But again, it appears you’re trying to connect his literary work about dark occurrences that happened inside the Vatican with a far-fetched assumption that the Church itself is Satanic. If I am wrong, please let me and everyone reading these posts know. Because if this is indeed your intent, then I must blatantly admit that you are completely wrong. Satan knows that it is the Catholic Church that is his greatest enemy here in this world. So it only makes sense that he will try to undermine it with all his guile, lies, and power. And, if I may add, Malachi Martin was a devout Catholic all his life and knew that it was the true Church that Christ founded 2,000 years ago.

But you haven’t answered my question: What were you getting at when you asked about the “gates of hell”? What purpose does that question serve?

And by the way, what is your church?

 

[Hisalone]

The very same one, but some of your premises I do not agree with. For instance, how do you know that he was killed by those in the Vatican who wanted him dead? Who are the sources for your presumption? Conspiracies always revolve around those who are interesting and who are correct. The fact is that no one knows “why” or “how” he died, but we do know that he fell and did not recover (some say he was hit over the head).

Martin never divulged what the 3rd Secret of Fatima was. He was under oath to NOT disclose its contents. But he did say that it was terrible.

Martin did indeed divulge that there was a penetration of the Catholic Church by Satanists in 1963. According to Martin and other Vatican insiders, there was a ritual inside the Vatican that was held, over the phone, jointly with Satanists from the U.S. In fact, Pope Paul VI publicly stated that the “smoke of Satan has penetrated the Church”. Martin also wrote that there are Satanists within the Church that hold powerful positions, and that they are trying their best to undermine it. But Malachi also added that they will never prevail in their sinister goals because Jesus himself said that Satan will never prevail against his Church.

He did say that many priests, including some Cardinals, were indeed members of the Masons. But he also said that many have been kept in check. For instance, he mentioned many advocate for the legalization of homosexual marriage, ordaining women as priests, the propagation of the heresy that there is no such thing as Satan (he is only a metaphor), and things of that nature. None of those issues have been recognized by the Catholic Church. Furthermore, Martin, as well as other chief exorcists in Rome, added that the revised ritual of exorcism (passed in 1999) was ineffective and a slap in the face to experienced, mature exorcists. Its development did not include one exorcist, which is a pretty curious thing, don’t you think? But what is more curious is not the fact that no exorcist was allowed to participate in the rite’s revision, but what the revised rite contained. The new rite was so ineffective that is was considered useless. The question then is, “why weren’t exorcists consulted and allowed to participate in the new rite’s development”? Some exorcists have hinted that it has something to do with that “penetration” that occurred over 45 years ago.

So, yes, this the very same Malachi Martin that I am referring to in my original post to you. But again, it appears you’re trying to connect his literary work about dark occurrences that happened inside the Vatican with a far-fetched assumption that the Church itself is Satanic. If I am wrong, please let me and everyone reading these posts know. Because if this is indeed your intent, then I must blatantly admit that you are completely wrong. Satan knows that it is the Catholic Church that is his greatest enemy here in this world. So it only makes sense that he will try to undermine it with all his guile, lies, and power. And, if I may add, Malachi Martin was a devout Catholic all his life and knew that it was the true Church that Christ founded 2,000 years ago.

But you haven’t answered my question: What were you getting at when you asked about the “gates of hell”? What purpose does that question serve?

And by the way, what is your church?

I do not believe the Catholic Church is evil. I do believe there are dark elements in it. At one time I had an interest in Fr Martin, it was his associates who believed he was murdered.
I dont know about the exorcism rite change. I do know of the baptismal rite prayer change. Look up the prayers said at baptism several decades ago to the ones now. The former ones were very powerfull and could be usefull to a parent or Godparent in interceeding on behalf of one so baptised. BTW Im no fan of infant baptism however I believe the prayers said over the infant at the time of the baptism can be very helpfull in intercession.
I am nonDenom.
I will build my Church and the gates of hell will not prevail against it.
I believe the standard Catholic polemic that this verse means the devil will not cause Christs Church to err is in fact not reading this verse properly.
So I keep asking What are the gates of hell? What are gates used for? The answer to my question is in finding the meaning of what the gates are used for then how they can not stand against the Church of Christ.

 

[Javl]

I do not believe the Catholic Church is evil. I do believe there are dark elements in it. At one time I had an interest in Fr Martin, it was his associates who believed he was murdered.
I dont know about the exorcism rite change. I do know of the baptismal rite prayer change. Look up the prayers said at baptism several decades ago to the ones now. The former ones were very powerfull and could be usefull to a parent or Godparent in interceeding on behalf of one so baptised. BTW Im no fan of infant baptism however I believe the prayers said over the infant at the time of the baptism can be very helpfull in intercession.
I am nonDenom.
I will build my Church and the gates of hell will not prevail against it.
I believe the standard Catholic polemic that this verse means the devil will not cause Christs Church to err is in fact not reading this verse properly.
So I keep asking What are the gates of hell? What are gates used for? The answer to my question is in finding the meaning of what the gates are used for then how they can not stand against the Church of Christ.

Once more. The gates of hell is used as a description, metaphor, analogy, whatever you may want to name it. It means that Satan and his horde will not destroy the Church because Jesus is always there to protect it and the Holy Spirit is there to guide it. It does not mean actual gates.

PAX DOMINI

Shalom Aleichem

 

[Norrin]

I do not believe the Catholic Church is evil. I do believe there are dark elements in it. At one time I had an interest in Fr Martin, it was his associates who believed he was murdered.
I dont know about the exorcism rite change. I do know of the baptismal rite prayer change. Look up the prayers said at baptism several decades ago to the ones now. The former ones were very powerfull and could be usefull to a parent or Godparent in interceeding on behalf of one so baptised. BTW Im no fan of infant baptism however I believe the prayers said over the infant at the time of the baptism can be very helpfull in intercession.
I am nonDenom.
I will build my Church and the gates of hell will not prevail against it.
I believe the standard Catholic polemic that this verse means the devil will not cause Christs Church to err is in fact not reading this verse properly.
So I keep asking What are the gates of hell? What are gates used for? The answer to my question is in finding the meaning of what the gates are used for then how they can not stand against the Church of Christ.

Yes, I am aware that the Catholic baptismal rite has been altered over the years. Charismatic Catholics have longed for the old rite, but the new rite holds well. I prefer the old rite myself.

As for infant baptism, I’m in complete support of it. Yes, it is true that the infant is not at the age of reason, but that is why we Catholics have confirmation, to confirm our commitment to Christ later on in our life.

So, you are non-denominational? What exactly does that mean? Now, I know the definition of non-denominational, but don’t all those Christian faiths that claim non-denominational end up developing their own customs over the years, which essentially and eventually make them denominational?

Now, when you say that you’re building your own church, does that mean that at this point you are the only congregant (for the lack of a better term)?

As for whether the Catholic Church can err? I am in agreement with the Catholic Church in the belief that the it is guided by the Holy Spirit, and when it comes to matters of faith, then the Church cannot and does not err. The deposit of faith has remained unchanged in 2000 years, and it will continue to remain unchanged until Christ’s return. When he returns, who knows what new things he will let the world know.

So what is my reason in believing this? It’s simple. Since the Protestant Reformation, protestant denominations have continued to splinter to the point where there are over 3000 different versions of that faith in existence today. At the same time, there remains only one Catholic Church. This tells me that one is completely grounded in Truth, and the others have Truth in them, but with some doctrinal error (hence the continued fracturing). But hey, I’m Catholic, so you’re not surprised at my conclusion, are you?

Anyway, in an earlier post, you stated that a gate is used to keep people out, or keep people in. Actually, a gate doesn’t do that. Your definition best describes a fence. A gate is primarily an opening that allows ingress or egress from an enclosure. The semantic difference is important. Why? Because it Jesus Christ who holds the “keys” to the gate of hell. In other words, Christ is the only one who will judge us, and only He will determine if you shall enter the “gate” to hell. The gate is a metaphor for Christ’s decision to give you ingress to hell, or ingress to heaven, via purgatory of course.

 

[Tomster]

Gates hold things in and keep things out.
Again I ask what are the gates of hell?

The term aons is employed by profane writers to signify the state of souls after death. The Septuagint uniformly renders this term the Hebrew which signifies in general the place of the dead. It was represented in the Old Testament as a dark subterranean land inhabited by the souls of the dead. It gates are spoken of by Isaiah: “I said in the noontide of my days, I shall go into the gates of Sheol.” (Isaiah 38:10) Thus in the Old Testament it was a vague idea to designate the state of the dead. It included the grave, but united with it that unknown state of being in which the dead remain until the resurrection.

In the New Testament the term Hades which is the equivalent of Sheol is frequently used to signify the state after death of the wicked. It also signifies Satan’s realm. Thus it is used in Revelation 20:14: “And death and Hades were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death, the lake of fire.” This is clearly the sense in which Christ employs the term here. Satan and all those agencies which work with him and are controlled by him shall wage war upon the Church, but they shall not prevail.

By a metaphor usual in Eastern languages the power of this city is spoken of as its gates. Throughout the nations of the East it was in the gates of the villages and cities that all cases were tried, and justice administered; hence figuratively the power and authority of the cities were called its gates. So well known is this in all Oriental literature that it is unnecessary to addduce citations to prove it. It is evident therefore that Christ by this figure asserts that all the power of Satan and of his servants shall not prevail against the organized Church of Christ. We believe also that in the expression “the gates of Hades” there is included also the forces of this world; it includes every force that makes for Satan.

It is evident that the entity, against which the power of Satan’s kingdom shall not prevail, is the Church, and for the reason that it is built upon a rock. It is the idea therefore of Christ that the stability of the Church comes from the nature of its foundation, and that this foundation is such that the Church cannot fail.

Of course, the Church is not built on a human foundation; the Church is built on the infinite power of Christ. But Christ has chosen to be represented in the Church by a center of authority, and hence this authority is upheld by Christ himself. Now that central authority is Peter and his successors.

cont.

 

[Tomster]

Gates hold things in and keep things out.
Again I ask what are the gates of hell?

The instrumental agent through which the power of God gives stability to the Church is the visible head of the Church which was first constituted in St. Peter and has been perpetuated through his successors, and will be until the end of time. In this sense St. Thomas declares that secundum se Christ is the foundation of the Church; and that Peter is the foundation as the vicar of Christ. And he declares that “on account of its foundation” the Catholic Church was not destroyed.

It is evident that Christ in that one sentence declared the infallibility and the indestructibility of the Church, and assigned the cause thereof. Such effects should follow because of the foundation on which Christ built the Church. In similar sense St. Leo the Great declares: “Having assumed Peter into a sharing of individual unity with himself [the Lord] declared what Peter was by affirming: ‘Thou art Peter’ etc., that the edifice of the eternal temple might by the marvelous gift of the grace of God rest on the firm foundation of Peter, so strengthening the Church by his firmness that neither human malice nor the gates of hell can prevail against it.” It is not what Peter is in himself that gives strength to the Church, but it is what Peter became under the action of the grace of God. The Lord willed to give everlasting endurance and infallibility to the Church by means of a vicarious instrument of power. Peter’s confession of faith illustrated what he and his successors should do for the Church of Christ. They should profess the true faith and promulgate it to all mankind, and this faith should be the principle of the Church’s undying life.

It is implied in the words of Christ that a terrible conflict shall be waged against the Church of Christ. Christ did not say that the gates of Hades should not harass and persecute the Church. But it is promised that the power of Satan shall not prevail. This is our firm hope in trial and adversity. This is our trust when we see coalitions of powerful agencies combined against the Church. She cannot fail either from within or from without. She cannot prove false to her trust and teach men a lie instead of the truth; she cannot fail to teach men the truth; she cannot be overthrown by all the power which Satan can bring against her.

cont.

 

[Tomster]

Gates hold things in and keep things out.
Again I ask what are the gates of hell?

The great error of the apostates of the 16th century was the assertion that the Church of Christ had failed through the corruption of her members. It is true that the corruption was there; Christ never promised that it should not invade his organization; he predicted that scandals should come; corruption invaded the original band of the twelve Apostles. But this corruption did not destroy the Church of Christ, nor neutralize its mission. This corruption wrought great havoc among the Church’s members; but still the institution of Christ did not change, but like a vigorous body threw off the diseased parts, and again returned to healthy life. If we believe the words of Christ; if we grant that from the Apostolic age there existed an organization to which Christ’s promises had been made; then the so-called reformation is no longer justifiable. Reformation was due, and was made; but the right reformation was the reformation wrought by the Council of Trent, and not by Luther and Calvin. To justify their claims, they had to contend that the Church of Christ had failed; and that they were to found and institution organically distinct from that which had been before. But Christ promised that that his Church could not fail.

The gates of Hades did not always attack her in the same way. At one time the attack was by bloody persecution, at another it was by heresy and schism; again it was by the seductive influence of worldliness, or by unjust legislation of the State; and even the personal tribulations and temptations of the Church’s members may be reckoned among the agencies by which the gates of Hades strive to overthrow the Church of God.

The spirit of the world is the devil’s close ally; and the spirit the world is Protean in character. There are open forces and silent forces always working against the Church. By nature man is a child of this world, and goes with the world. Everything around invites him to naturalism. The thought of the age is sunk in naturalism; the energy of human race moves in the groove of naturalism. Even that which outside the Catholic Church goes by the name of religion is mere naturalism. It occupies itself with respectability and manners within society. It is a religion which is not religious. The supernatural is nowhere discoverable in it. A sort of refined paganism has fastened itself upon the people. Instead of holding themselves pilgrims who have here no abiding city, men settle down with the most absolute attachment to their pursuits and their pleasures. The gloom of the thought of death is not relieved by the hope of heaven. Heaven is a dull, cold word.

cont.

 

[Tomster]

Gates hold things in and keep things out.
Again I ask what are the gates of hell?

A legitimate conclusion from this promise of Christ is that the Church is infallible. The Church was founded for a specific object. Her object is to teach men the truth, and apply to men the fruit of Christ’s Redemption until the end of time. Now in many departments of human science men are content with a degree of probability, but in religion men must have a certainty. Christ founded the Church to deliver to men an authoritative message, and to exact from them the obedience of faith. And this is the great power of the Church, the gates of Hades would naturally make the chief attack to destroy this great power by corrupting Church teachings. Satan has indeed waged a bitter warfare on this ground, and has led some of the children of the Church into apostasy; but he could not prevail against the institution, because Christ’s promise upheld it. A teaching organization, that does not teach with authority is a farce, and a deception; and in order to teach with authority the organization must be infallible. In the Old Law the prophets taught with authority, because they could say: “Thus sayeth the Lord.” The Church cannot fullfill her mission unless she can also say: “Thus sayeth the Lord.” And she does say this, because the Spirit of truth abides with her always to teach her all truth even to the end of time.

 

[Norrin]

A legitimate conclusion from this promise of Christ is that the Church is infallible. The Church was founded for a specific object. Her object is to teach men the truth, and apply to men the fruit of Christ’s Redemption until the end of time. Now in many departments of human science men are content with a degree of probability, but in religion men must have a certainty. Christ founded the Church to deliver to men an authoritative message, and to exact from them the obedience of faith. And this is the great power of the Church, the gates of Hades would naturally make the chief attack to destroy this great power by corrupting Church teachings. Satan has indeed waged a bitter warfare on this ground, and has led some of the children of the Church into apostasy; but he could not prevail against the institution, because Christ’s promise upheld it. A teaching organization, that does not teach with authority is a farce, and a deception; and in order to teach with authority the organization must be infallible. In the Old Law the prophets taught with authority, because they could say: “Thus sayeth the Lord.” The Church cannot fullfill her mission unless she can also say: “Thus sayeth the Lord.” And she does say this, because the Spirit of truth abides with her always to teach her all truth even to the end of time.

Excellent post!

 

[Hisalone]

Once more. The gates of hell is used as a description, metaphor, analogy, whatever you may want to name it. It means that Satan and his horde will not destroy the Church because Jesus is always there to protect it and the Holy Spirit is there to guide it. It does not mean actual gates.

PAX DOMINI

Shalom Aleichem

No it not a reference to support your false theology.
You cant just make stuff up and say this is how this verse should be interpreted.

 

[Hisalone]

Yes, I am aware that the Catholic baptismal rite has been altered over the years. Charismatic Catholics have longed for the old rite, but the new rite holds well. I prefer the old rite myself.

As for infant baptism, I’m in complete support of it. Yes, it is true that the infant is not at the age of reason, but that is why we Catholics have confirmation, to confirm our commitment to Christ later on in our life.

So, you are non-denominational? What exactly does that mean? Now, I know the definition of non-denominational, but don’t all those Christian faiths that claim non-denominational end up developing their own customs over the years, which essentially and eventually make them denominational?

My church was started by a pastor who came in from a foriegn land. So our history is short, within one generation. Most nonDenoms are similar started by one man. If developing customs over years is a sign for denomination then Catholicism is definetly a denomination.

Now, when you say that you’re building your own church, does that mean that at this point you are the only congregant (for the lack of a better term)?

I was quoting Jesus

As for whether the Catholic Church can err? I am in agreement with the Catholic Church in the belief that the it is guided by the Holy Spirit, and when it comes to matters of faith, then the Church cannot and does not err. The deposit of faith has remained unchanged in 2000 years, and it will continue to remain unchanged until Christ’s return. When he returns, who knows what new things he will let the world know.

Catholic teaching has changed througout the years. Do your own research examining original source documents from ceturies ago.

So what is my reason in believing this? It’s simple. Since the Protestant Reformation, protestant denominations have continued to splinter to the point where there are over 3000 different versions of that faith in existence today. At the same time, there remains only one Catholic Church. This tells me that one is completely grounded in Truth, and the others have Truth in them, but with some doctrinal error (hence the continued fracturing). But hey, I’m Catholic, so you’re not surprised at my conclusion, are you?

**
I would be suprised if you said otherwise…**

Anyway, in an earlier post, you stated that a gate is used to keep people out, or keep people in. Actually, a gate doesn’t do that. Your definition best describes a fence. A gate is primarily an opening that allows ingress or egress from an enclosure. The semantic difference is important. Why? Because it Jesus Christ who holds the “keys” to the gate of hell. In other words, Christ is the only one who will judge us, and only He will determine if you shall enter the “gate” to hell. The gate is a metaphor for Christ’s decision to give you ingress to hell, or ingress to heaven, via purgatory of course.

Hell is a prison which holds lost souls. The gates of hell cannot prevail against Christs Church in preaching the gospel and the word of God which will free those enslaved and the gates will not be able to hold them in.

 

[Hisalone]

A legitimate conclusion from this promise of Christ is that the Church is infallible. The Church was founded for a specific object. Her object is to teach men the truth, and apply to men the fruit of Christ’s Redemption until the end of time. Now in many departments of human science men are content with a degree of probability, but in religion men must have a certainty. Christ founded the Church to deliver to men an authoritative message, and to exact from them the obedience of faith. And this is the great power of the Church, the gates of Hades would naturally make the chief attack to destroy this great power by corrupting Church teachings. Satan has indeed waged a bitter warfare on this ground, and has led some of the children of the Church into apostasy; but he could not prevail against the institution, because Christ’s promise upheld it. A teaching organization, that does not teach with authority is a farce, and a deception; and in order to teach with authority the organization must be infallible. In the Old Law the prophets taught with authority, because they could say: “Thus sayeth the Lord.” The Church cannot fullfill her mission unless she can also say: “Thus sayeth the Lord.” And she does say this, because the Spirit of truth abides with her always to teach her all truth even to the end of time.

That is why God gave His Church His written word, to be used as a plumb line agianst all deviations.

 

[Hisalone]

I very infrequently post here to open your mind. If you chose to keep a closed mind that is your choice. I have simply asked for you to explain what the gates of hell are and what are gates used for. If you cant answer just skip this thread and go to another, it kinda of simple actually.

 

[adrift]

Hell is a prison which holds lost souls. The gates of hell cannot prevail against Christs Church in preaching the gospel and the word of God which will free those enslaved and the gates will not be able to hold them in.

Hell is where those who reject God go. There is no release. It is for eternity.

 

[adrift]

Well, I don’t know any forum moderator from Adam. How can I be sure the one I ask tells me the truth? But you appear sincere. Do you know of any Catholic who has ever been booted from the forum for life?

I have seen many banned, suspended and account under review. Catholics seem to be banned quicker than non catholics but that may be an unwarranted observation. I don’t understand the difference in these sanctions.One account under review has been that way for over a year. The mods do a good job providing a good atmosphere. I don’t like seeing anyone insulted. Nor do I like to be insulted.