The Gender of God

[TimeEntrance]

Not true actually (according to Catholicism anyway).

Here’s a passage from the Catholic Encyclopedia to illustrate my point:
•that the supernatural influence of the Holy Ghost extended to the birth of Jesus Christ, not merely preserving Mary’s integrity, but also causing Christ’s birth or external generation to reflect his eternal birth from the Father in this, that “the Light from Light” proceeded from his mother’s womb as a light shed on the world; that the “power of the Most High” passed through the barriers of nature without injuring them; that “the body of the Word” formed by the Holy Ghost penetrated another body after the manner of spirits.

Link to source:
newadvent.org/cathen/15448a.htm

As the encyclopedia makes clear, Jesus did not leave the womb in the natural human way. He apparently did not even make physical contact with his mother’s vagina on the way out.

What you construe “clear” and I construe “clear” must be two different things. Because I can’t make much sense of that. It’s the traditional flowery language typical of religion.

Catholicisms call’s the Virgin Mary the Mother of God and says she gave birth to Jesus. But I thank you for informing about some aspects of Catholic doctrine I was not aware of.

Nonetheless, she was pregnant with Jesus, as we know from Biblical passages when she met with her cousin and her cousin responded to the affects, “Blessed are you among women.”

Then she gave birth to Jesus and the Wise Men brought gifts.

The uterus is still part of the reproductive system of women and it’s Mary who gave Jesus his human nature and contributed her genes to him.

 

[TimeEntrance]

Points on the Virgin Mary:
**
#1. The New Eve (therefore, the salvation of mankind is led and depends on women not men).**

How is this statement in any way, matter, or form true?

According to Catholicism you need the Church to get right with God, and only men can lead the Church.

Don’t like that, eh? Bet you hate Catholicism has such a devotion to the Virgin Mary rather than to Joseph?

The Virgin Mary is called the New Eve and Jesus the New Adam.

The salvation story in the Catholic view begins with Mary’s fiat.

It’s the Eves’ that begin the fall and salvation of mankind. No Mary. No Church.

And Mary has a place in Catholicism above any Pope that ever existed. Actually, her title: Mother of God pretty much says it all. Or how about: Queen of Heaven.

Not to many apparitions of St. Peter or Pope John Paul II. Plenty of the Virgin Mary who not only has a beaded, meditative prayer (the rosary) frequently invoking her name but who is given a continuous roll to this day in the salvation history of mankind.

So, let us not act like Catholicism places priests above the Virgin Mary.

 

[Marc_Anthony]

There were no Harleys back then. Mary was also special.

Actually, I was referring to medical bikes, but that was RIDICULOUSLY besides the point. The point is that the breaking of the hymen has nothing to do with virginity. This has nothing to do with Mary. It’s just true.

Before, DURING and after is “de fide”. Whats so difficult about believing that Jesus birth was accomplished in a miraculous way?

I’ve always heard that properly translated the words in Genesis are taken to mean that pain INCREASED after childbirth, not that the pain was originally nonexistent.

Fr. Z`s no dope:
wdtprs.com/blog/2006/11/trent-nativity-did-the-blessed-virgin-experience-labor-pains/

No he’s not, but it doesn’t look to me like Trent declared anything infallibly.

 

[Marc_Anthony]

What you construe “clear” and I construe “clear” must be two different things. Because I can’t make much sense of that. It’s the traditional flowery language typical of religion.

Catholicisms call’s the Virgin Mary the Mother of God and says she gave birth to Jesus. But I thank you for informing about some aspects of Catholic doctrine I was not aware of.

Nonetheless, she was pregnant with Jesus, as we know from Biblical passages when she met with her cousin and her cousin responded to the affects, “Blessed are you among women.”

Then she gave birth to Jesus and the Wise Men brought gifts.

The uterus is still part of the reproductive system of women and it’s Mary who gave Jesus his human nature and contributed her genes to him.

I gotta agree with you on this one…

 

[Battleaxe]

Actually, I was referring to medical bikes, [Sorry!] but that was RIDICULOUSLY besides the point. ** ** The point is that the breaking of the hymen has nothing to do with virginity. **
Thanks for the info.

This has nothing to do with Mary. It’s just true.

 

[LucyLight]

Thanks for the info.

Yeah, i know. It happens with horse-riding, too.

However, in Marys case, it wouldnt have happened. And externally, her body is still unmistakably that of a virgin. i cant see any difficulty in believing that. :shrug: ( Why would Eve have suffered pain if the Fall hadnt happened?

Well have to agree to disagree. Again, considering her exalted state, i cant understand your view. Her total innocence and purity scream for it.

We`re also off topic.

Its an old belief that hymen=virgin. So theologians needed to find an explanation for how Mary could give birth and remain a virgin. Unfortunately having your hymen reconstructed
Is a common surgery in the middle east where this belief still stands. Thats fine to believe that Mary gave birth instantly, but I don’t see any need to. Mary remains a virgin and with the same amount of dignity either way.

 

[LucyLight]

Another thought is that this was a private moment for the Holy Family and perhaps its disrespectful to Mary and to Joseph for us to even discuss something like this. It would be considered rude to discuss another woman’s lower region. Just a thought.

 

[Battleaxe]

Mary remains a virgin and with the same amount of dignity either way.

i prefer to believe that she remains in a pristine state, externally anyway.
She deserves it.

The “DURING” must mean something.
No external physical change (“damage”) at any time.