the gift of tongues

[grannymh]

Corinthians has a few passages on speaking in tongues.
One passage says that if people have gifts of speaking in tongues, others have gifts of interpreting what is being said, and should interpret what is being said at the time.
So the speech and the interpretation of the speech are as important as each other.

When 1 Corinthians, chapters 12 and 14 use the terms, speaking and tongues, there are two separate distinct Holy Spirit gifts. There is the gift of praying to God. We think of an arrow pointing up. There is no need for other people to interpret the prayer sounds because God is the Person receiving the prayer. The second gift is speaking God’s message to the assembly. Here the arrow points down from God to the people. When the message from God to His people is in Tongues, then it is necessary to have someone with the gift of interpretation.

How does one know, otherwise, if a demon is not causing it, and the words said are quite sinister. Exorcists talk of people babbling gibberish.

An exorcist comes when there is sufficient evidence that an individual is in demonic possession. During an exorcism, this demon can cry out in a variety of sounds or languages.

When people are praying to God appropriately in either Tongues or the vernacular, it is hard to imagine that a demon would be working there. Let’s say that some odd actions did take place. It is the responsibility of the observer to share this with the Pastor. He is the one who is ultimately responsible for proper conduct. He needs to know what is happening. Often something odd happens, but it is harmless. In this case, the Pastor can share information with you.

Today’s problem with understanding demonic possession is that it is easy to misunderstand the action of praying in Tongues aka babbling gibberish. My sincere advice, when something really weird happens, is to speak to the Pastor. Speaking in the sense of seeking information. Often, what is seen as weird is part of acceptable protocol. It is the Pastor who needs to determine the difference between acceptable and non-acceptable. He can contact the diocese for advice. In some rare cases of non-acceptable actions, a person may have to seek advice from the appropriate people in the diocesan office. Concerns about demonic possession should be discussed with the Pastor or someone in the diocesan office.

Any non-reverend act toward the Holy Eucharist is automatically not acceptable.

In my opinion, it is helpful to learn about praying in Tongues. This does not mean one has to choose this form of prayer. When I was in a charismatic prayer group in our parish, we would praise God by praying out loud in Tongues. There was one lady who never prayed in Tongues. She would pray in English. When I was standing near her, I did not pray in Tongues. I stood by her side and praised God in English.

Another Corinthian passage says if I am speaking the language of men and of angels , but have no love, I am only ringing a gong.

This is the marvelous chapter 13 of 1 Corinthians. All of us, regardless of how we pray, need to read/pray this chapter over and over.

On healing, Australia’s St Mary of the Cross MacKillop was beong prayed to for help in healing a cancer patient. The patient held on and on, no improvement. Then one day, those praying added

If it is God’s will.

The patient then passed over.

Healing prayers, or any prayers - if it is God’s will. ’ Thy will be done’

We need to try to do God’s will. Occasionally, we will succeed.

 

[grannymh]

I do not believe that a person who sincerely yielded to the Holy Spirit would not get the gift. However, there is a possibility that an impediment would prevent the gift. I need to check the source book linked below.

My memory was half right.
It is the Baptism of the Holy Spirit where there can be an impediment and not the reception of the gift of Prayer Tongues.
If interested, check out the index of chapters in the beginning of the link.

This is from the book link around page 30, point 24, and following. Sorry about the type. That is what the link printed.

brendancase.com/uploads/Key_to_the_Charismatic_Renewal.pdf

CHAPTER THREE
THE BAPTISM OF THE HOLY SPIRIT

1. DOES IT EVER HAPPEN THAT A PERSON WHO HAS BEEN “PRAYED WITH FOR THE BAPTISM OF THE HOLY SPIRIT” DOES NOT ACTUALLY RECEIVE THIS “RELEASE OF THE SPIRIT”?

Yes, this might happen for a number of reasons:
a) If serious obstacles have not been removed by basic repentance.

 

[Roseeurekacross]

Who is Brendan Case?

The Catholic Church has this to say on Baptism , which includes the involvement of The Holy Spirit.

vatican.va/archive/ccc_css/archive/catechism/p2s2c1a1.htm

We all receive Baptism thus
1215 This sacrament is also called “the washing of regeneration and renewal by the Holy Spirit,” for it signifies and actually brings about the birth of water and the Spirit without which no one "can enter the kingdom of God."7

 

[po18guy]

…but nothing happened to me. nothing ever does…I mean it’s not a magic spell, if someone is sick, they aren’t suddenly going to get better, poof! every single time. There are reasons for these things to happen, lessons we are supposed to learn

Something will happen, but it may take weeks, months or years. The Lord is looking at the entirety of your life, not just the next 30 minutes. This thread is part of the charismatic (charisms - gifts) growth which the Lord desires for you. The realization of your gift may occur when it is needed for a specific situation or occurrence. It may also be a life-long manifestation. Your gift may be a very quiet, almost invisible one. Prophecy, for example, often consists in those who speak a comforting or encouraging word to you, or do some small thing which accomplishes the same end. The Spirit works through kindness.

These do not have to be earthshaking events - remember that the Lord made Himself present to Elijah, not in the fierce flames, or the hurricane force wind, or in the massive earthquake - but in a still, small voice. For that reason, it is important that we experience times of silence, for it is only then that we can listen for that still, small voice. I have found that time spent before our Lord in the Blessed Sacrament is ideal for this.

We often perceive the scriptures and what they describe as having occurred in the past. While that much is true, the gifts (charisms) of the Holy Spirit are given as freely today as back then. Are we expected to use our gifts? I read and ponder Matthew 25:14-30 (parable of the talents) when considering this. We do not want to answer for having a gift and hiding it or simply failing to discern it and use it.

 

[grannymh]

Who is Brendan Case?

All I know is that he put the book, *A Key to Charismatic Renewal in the Catholic Church *by Msgr. Vincent M. Walsh on the internet. This book has the Nihil obstat: James McGrath, *Censor Librorum and Imprimatur: *John Cardinal Krol, Archbishop of Philadelphia. Accodinng to Google, Brendan Case is involved in ministries. I do not know anything about these. Knowing Brendan Case does not change what is written by Msgr Walsh

The Catholic Church has this to say on Baptism , which includes the involvement of The Holy Spirit.

vatican.va/archive/ccc_css/archive/catechism/p2s2c1a1.htm

We all receive Baptism thus
1215 This sacrament is also called “the washing of regeneration and renewal by the Holy Spirit,” for it signifies and actually brings about the birth of water and the Spirit without which no one "can enter the kingdom of God."7

This explanation of the Catholic Sacrament of Baptism is one of the key points which clearly separates the Renewal from Pentecostalism. The new term “The Baptism of the Holy Spirit” is a religious experience and not a new Sacrament. A good explanation is found in chapters 2 and 3 of the linked book.

A good prayer experience can help us remember that the Holy Spirit gave us gift/talents in the Sacraments of Baptism and Confirmation and it is time to use them. There are hundreds of gifts and ministries in addition to the Pauline list of gifts.

Link to book
brendancase.com/uploads/Key_to_the_Charismatic_Renewal.pdf

 

[po18guy]

Consider: the prayer to the Holy Spirit has been omitted from US Catholic bibles since 1970. In that approximate time frame, the third Person of the Trinity has been, well, downplayed, pushed aside, diminished - whatever you call it. This coincided with the introduction of “modernist” footnotes in the scriptures - written by certain theologians who tend to reject or downplay the supernatural life. Why do I mention this?

Pentecostalism was revived among certain Protestants in the mid-60s. A few Catholics, knowing that the Church does not teach cessationism (gifts of the Spirit have stopped), recognized the growth of Pentecostalism and responded to that. It was not emulation of Protestantism, but a recapturing of that which had been in the Church since that first Pentecost.

Catholic focus on the spirit was seemingly neglected in the 19th and 20th centuries, if not earlier. It suddenly grew among Protestants. Consider: As Jesus rode the donkey into Jerusalem, his disciples shouted and sang for joy. The Pharisees admonished our Lord to quiet them. He replied that if He did that, the very stones would cry out (Luke 19:36-40).

The point? If the Spirit was neglected or even quenched in the Catholic Church, the stones (Pentecostals) would then cry out. It is right that the Catholic Church reclaims her use of the gifts of the Holy Spirit.

This has nothing to do with Protestant Pentecostalism other than the fact that they were crying out at a time when Catholics should have been.

 

[DebChris]

it’s a little more complicated than that. I was born with a disability, have accepted it. and even believe it is God’s will for my life.

of course, most people don’t believe that. they say that God would never will sickness or disability. sometimes I get requests for people to pray over me about it, which I am just a bit uncomfortable about. but I feel like I am obligated to accept and I shouldn’t say no to prayer. and most of these people are pretty insistent.

I am tired of being treated like a broken machine that someone has to fix. what’s so wrong with the idea that God did create me the way I am?

St. Paul says in his epistle, “In weakness, power reaches perfection.”
This is my response to those who question my faith since I continue to suffer from migraines despite the many prayers for healing.
As Granny posted, there are different types of healing including spiritual and emotional healing as well as the physical. The interior healing is actually more important than the physical healing that may take place in a person’s life. As you read scripture, notice how often the first thing that Jesus says when healing a person is “your sins are forgiven.” It is only after the forgiveness of sins that he exhibits the physical healing for the sake of the crowd to prove that the Son of Man has the power to heal. In other words, He is manifesting that He is indeed God.
There is such thing as a wounded healer. This person is a chosen instrument in God’s hand. Because of his pain, he has learned compassion and empathy for the pains of others. I no longer pray for my own healing. St. Paul was a man of great faith, yet as he himself was afflicted, “scourged.” He writes to Timothy of his many illnesses and tells him to take a little wine.
When I do pray for healing for a person, I pray “in accordance with God’s Will” remembering that wherever Our Lord traveled he was healing somebody, on the way to heal somebody, or had just come from healing somebody.
Charisms like praying in tongues and healing are gifts of the Holy Spirit. We can be open to receiving those gifts as we would be to the gift from anybody we love or who loves us. Remembering always that they are not rewards for good behavior, gifts for the building up of the kingdom that God gives as He chooses.