The "Hail, Holy Queen" prayer. Need thoughts please

[LilyM]

Certainly the “prayers of the righteous avail much” (James 5:16), but God is not bound by the will of His creation, even His Holy Mother.

"what you bind on earth will be bound in heaven, what you loose on earth will be loosed in heaven …’ :bible1:

Do phrases such as this, or the idea that God always grants Mary her requests, truly mean that they command Him through being more powerful than He?

Or is it simply that WHAT the Apostles choose to bind and loose, and WHAT Mary chooses to ask for, are always and in all circumstances so utterly conformed to the will of God (in the one case because the Holy Spirit guides them, in the other that she, being in the presence of God, cannot be in a state to ask for anything impure, improper, imperfect or otherwise not in total accord with His will) that they simply will never be unbound, unloosed or refused?

 

[japhy]

There are, in fact, several different English translations. I have heard the one with the second hail in it, but that is not the most commonly used version, probably because there is no second salve in the latin. It is important to remember that the original prayer Salve Regina is in Latin; all else are translations.

Salve, Regina, mater misericordiae;
vita dulcedo et spes nostra, salve.
Ad te clamamus, exsules filii Evæ.
Ad te suspiramus, gementes et flentes
in hac lacrimarum valle.
Eia ergo, advocata nostra,
illos tuos misericordes oculos ad nos converte.
Et lesum benedictum fructum ventris tui,
nobis post hoc exsilium ostende.
O clemens, O pia, O dulcis Virgo Maria

From the Latin, it is clear that Mary is being invoked as “Mother of mercy”, as “our life”, as “our sweetness”, and as “our hope”. Why?

Mater misericordiae is “Mother of-mercy”. Vita is not “of-life”, it is merely “life”. Dulcedo is not “of-sweetness”, it is merely “sweetness”. And spes is not “of-hope”, it is merely “hope”. And nostra is “our”, not “of-our”.

 

[rescath]

It is so very disheartening that while people feel that they must take every idle word uttered by John Paul II as divine oracle, the same people feel that it’s OK to question a prayer that Holy Mother Church has enshrined (infallibly by the way) in her Divine Liturgy for centuries. Ours is not to question its appropriateness but to understand its meaning.

How is She NOT our life? Without Her and Her fiat we would not have life? Without Her and Her fiat we would be without hope of salvation? Without Her and Her fiat we would have no sweetness?

Our Blessed Mother is so perfectly full of grace that She is a perfect reflection of God. God gave Her to us, to be Our Mother, as a feminine image of God’s perfections. Think of Her as a mirror. In that mirror we see the Face of God. She brings God to us in feminine form.

www.tradcathforum.net

 

[I_Believe]

This is a good thread, and it keeps getting better as we go

Justice is part of God’s nature since he is perfect. That is why purgatory and hell exist. He often uses Our Lady to bring his children back to him so that he doesn’t have to inflict his wrath.

Jesus told St. Gertrude the Great, “My love urges Me to release the Poor Souls. If a beneficent king leaves his guilty friend in prison for justice’s sake, he awaits with longing for one of his nobles to plead for the prisoner and to offer something for his release. Then the king joyfully, sets him free. Similarly, I accept with highest pleasure what is offered to Me for the Poor Souls, for I long inexpressibly to have near Me those for whom I paid so great a price. By the prayers of thy loving soul, I am induced to free a prisoner from Purgatory as often as thou dost move thy tongue to utter a word of prayer!”

I think with the exchanges that have been going on; some with an an obvious lack of Christian charity, we forget that God in his infiniteness of love and mercy gives us all a means of coming closer to him. Yes, he is the Way, the Truth and the Life. BUT, he gave us his mother as a model and as our mother also. Lets not forget that. She is the mediatrix of all grace. All grace that we receive, comes to us from God through her. This is a teaching of the Church. His grace comes to us through her, just as he became man through her, for each of us. He gave her to us as our mother while he was on the cross. Her only message to us throughout the ages has always been, “Do whatever he tells you to do”. If you don’t think she plays an important part in our salvation, just stop and think of where we would be if she had not given her “fiat” at the annunciation. We owe much to her, because she has done much for us. Do not belittle that by such exchanges as have been posted.
Prayers & blessings
Deacon Ed B

It is so very disheartening that while people feel that they must take every idle word uttered by John Paul II as divine oracle, the same people feel that it’s OK to question a prayer that Holy Mother Church has enshrined (infallibly by the way) in her Divine Liturgy for centuries. Ours is not to question its appropriateness but to understand its meaning.

How is She NOT our life? Without Her and Her fiat we would not have life? Without Her and Her fiat we would be without hope of salvation? Without Her and Her fiat we would have no sweetness?

Our Blessed Mother is so perfectly full of grace that She is a perfect reflection of God. God gave Her to us, to be Our Mother, as a feminine image of God’s perfections. Think of Her as a mirror. In that mirror we see the Face of God. She brings God to us in feminine form.

www.tradcathforum.net

Amen x 3

 

[Simon_X]

"what you bind on earth will be bound in heaven, what you loose on earth will be loosed in heaven …’ :bible1:

Do phrases such as this, or the idea that God always grants Mary her requests, truly mean that they command Him through being more powerful than He?

Or is it simply that WHAT the Apostles choose to bind and loose, and WHAT Mary chooses to ask for, are always and in all circumstances so utterly conformed to the will of God (in the one case because the Holy Spirit guides them, in the other that she, being in the presence of God, cannot be in a state to ask for anything impure, improper, imperfect or otherwise not in total accord with His will) that they simply will never be unbound, unloosed or refused?

I really like this. It’s very solid theology, and yet, simple and concise. Works for any explanation why we pray to Saints (and Mary) as intercessors…

 

[Dark_Warrior]

If one can call his wife, her husband, his girlfriend, her boyfriend, his son or daughter that "You are my life! you are my soul! You are my apple pine, pumpkin pie, honey, etc … " , then “Our life, our sweetness, and our hope” can refer to not only Christ but also Virgin Mary.

Yes, Christ is the ultimate end.
For Mary, She is also our life for She is Our Mother. She gives us Her tenderly love that no one, besides God, can. She is our hope, our intercessor.

Awesome!

I really really like the fact that Mary is my Mother, my Queen, my Helper with Christ. Though I find it fairly easy to be this way because I kind of like talking to a woman about certain things more so than I do with men, except Christ, but He’s the “God-Man.”

So giving honor to Mary, even submiting to her in respect comes fairly easy, and I also love that feeling.

 

[AveSantaMaria]

From True Devotion to Mary by St. Louis de Montfort, "Jesus gave more glory to God his Father by submitting to his Mother for thirty years than he would have given him had he converted the whole world by working the greatest miracles. How highly then do we glority God when to please him we submit ourselves to Mary, taking Jesus as our sole model.

If we examine closely the remainder of the life of Jesus Christ, we see that he chose to begin his miracles through Mary. It was by her word that he sanctified St. John the Baptist in the womb of his mother, St. Elizabeth; no sooner had Mary spoken than John was santcified. This was his first and greatest miracle of grace. At the wedding in Cana he changed water into wine at her humle prayer and this was his first miracle in the order of nature. He began and continued his miracles through Mary and he will continue them through her until the end of time."

 

[preV2tradcath]

From True Devotion to Mary by St. Louis de Montfort, "Jesus gave more glory to God his Father by submitting to his Mother for thirty years than he would have given him had he converted the whole world by working the greatest miracles. How highly then do we glority God when to please him we submit ourselves to Mary, taking Jesus as our sole model.

If we examine closely the remainder of the life of Jesus Christ, we see that he chose to begin his miracles through Mary. It was by her word that he sanctified St. John the Baptist in the womb of his mother, St. Elizabeth; no sooner had Mary spoken than John was santcified. This was his first and greatest miracle of grace. At the wedding in Cana he changed water into wine at her humle prayer and this was his first miracle in the order of nature. He began and continued his miracles through Mary and he will continue them through her until the end of time."

Thank you for posting that. It is one of my favorite parts of the writing of St. Louis de Montfort.

 

[TBolt1000T]

I’m just curious. Is the Salve Regina required for praying the Rosary? Was it in the original Rosary that was given to St. Dominic?

 

[AveSantaMaria]

*Hail Mary, full of grace, the Lord is with Thee. Blessed art Thou among women and blessed is the fruit of Thy womb, Jesus. Holy Mary, Mother of God, pray for us sinners now and at the hour of our death. Amen. *

Come Holy Spirit, come by means of the powerful intercession of the Immaculate Heart of Mary, your well beloved spouse. Come Holy Spirit, come by means of the powerful intercession of the Immaculate Heart of Mary, your well beloved spouse. Come Holy Spirit, come by means of the powerful intercession of the Immaculate Heart of Mary, your well beloved spouse.

For those who want to understand the Hail Holy Queen prayer, here is a link to explanations on its meaning by St. Alphonsus de Liguori, one of the 33 Doctors of the Catholic Church, in *The Glories of Mary * catholictradition.org/Mary/glories.htm#INTRO
Hope that this will contribute to the glory of the Sacred Heart of Jesus and the Immaculate Heart of Mary!!

Come Holy Spirit, come by means of the powerful intercession of the Immaculate Heart of Mary, your well beloved spouse. Come Holy Spirit, come by means of the powerful intercession of the Immaculate Heart of Mary, your well beloved spouse. Come Holy Spirit, come by means of the powerful intercession of the Immaculate Heart of Mary, your well beloved spouse.

*Hail Mary, full of grace, the Lord is with Thee. Blessed art Thou among women and blessed is the fruit of Thy womb, Jesus. Holy Mary, Mother of God, pray for us sinners now and at the hour of our death. Amen. *

 

[Gottle_of_Geer]

Is anyone else uncomfortable with the the phrase “Our Life, Our Sweetness, and Our Hope.”?

I am. For starters, I live for God/Jesus not Mary. To say Mary is my life is an affront to God and Christ and their Primacy.

I could live with the sweetness though, and see nothing wrong with this word to describe her.

The next words bother me though. Mary isn’t my hope, Christ is, because ultimately is through Him that I get to God.

Can anyone explain this to me in a better way perhaps because that is how I see it.

I pray the Rosary. I love Mary, she is my mother, she does intercede for me and I’m very appreciative for that but to say these things about her, I feel that it elevates her above God. I ommit this when I say the prayer.

I had this sort of problem - this helped to put things into perspective:​

Look down from heaven, holy Father, from the loftiness of that mountain to the lowliness of this valley, from that harbour of quietness and tranquillity to this calamitous sea. And now that the darkness of this world hinders no more those benignant eyes of thine from looking clearly into all things, look down and visit, O most diligent Keeper, that vineyard which thy right hand planted with so much labour, anxiety, and peril. To thee then we fly, from thee we seek for aid: to thee we give our whole selves unreservedly; thee we adopt for our patron and defender. Undertake the cause of our salvation, protect thy clients; to thee we appeal as our leader, rule thine army fighting against the assaults of the devil; to thee, kindest of rulers, we give up the rudder of our lives; steer this little ship of thine, and placed as thou art on high, keep us off all the rocks of evil desires, that with thee for our pilot and our guide we may safely come to the port of eternal bliss.

All of this is addressed to a human Saint - yet almost all of it is more fully true of God the Father. The beginning of it is ultimately inspired by a passage in Isaiah 65 that is a prayer for help to God.

So the BVM is addressed in very strong language - but she is not by any means the only Saint to be addressed in very strong language taken from the Bible, for so are others. There are litanies, novenas, consecrations, & so on in honour of other Saints than her - St. Francis Xavier, St. John Berchmans, & St.Philip Neri are three examples.

If Mary is our sweetness - which you don’t have difficulty with - isn’t Jesus Christ far far far far fafafa more so ? Any good in creatures is found in Him, as the Source of that goodness. Nothing in creation, Saint or not, is anything apart from Him: not Mary, not those other Saints, not us, not an angel, a proton, or molecule. He is the “environment” of all existence. Yet, we don’t have difficulty calling Mary “our sweetness”, or ambassadors “Excellency” or rulers “Majesty”. Yet Jesus Christ is the Eternal King, Alone Majestic, Alone Excellent: if these can be applied withouit sin to mere human beings - who may be of anything but good character, why is there a problem with other qualities that like them are found fully in Christ alone ? If it not sinful to call Queen Elizabeth II “Majesty” - how is it a sin to call the BVM “our sweetness” ? Yet neither quality belongs to creatures of themselves, both are realised fully only in Christ.

In calling the BVM “sweetness”, we are not subtracting from Him anything He possesses. If I take what belongs to you, it ceases to be in your possession, because it is now someone else’s. You no longer have it. God’s gifts to His creatures are not like that - His Holiness never ceases to be His, not even when He pours it on creatures: He is as Holy as ever. There has been a change - but not in Him; instead, creatures now have what they did not: the change is in them. So the BVM is God’s beneficiary; she is & has nothing that is not His - & it remains His. His Holiness is not lessened by being given; it is infinite, because He is. And no creature, not even her, can cease to be a creature or to receive what is infinite in a finite manner.

 

[sumergoest]

The theology of Mary can be “deep” to such an extent that a full explanation in answer to your question can not be given here:
But, to quote from St Alphonsus Liguori:
1: Mary is our Life because she intercedes and obtains for us the Pardon of our Sins and She obtains for us perseverance.(She is on our side and pleads for us with The Father as only a mother can)
2: Mary is our sweetness because she renders death sweet to Her clients.
3: Mary is our hope and the hope of all sinners. (Her sole intention is to bring us to Her Son- “Do whatever He tells you to do”)
Might I refer you to three outstanding books:
Hail, Holy Queen by Scott Hahn.
Hail, Holy Queen- An explanation of The Salve Regina by St Alphonsus Liguori.
True devotion to Mary by St. Louis De Montfort.
In summary St Louis De Montfort says so much when he says:
“The more we honour The Blessed Virgin,the more we honour Jesus Christ, because we honour Mary ONLY THAT we may more perfectly honour Jesus, since we go to Her ONLY AS THE WAY by which we are to find the end we are seeking, WHICH IS JESUS”.
Mary, as St Louis reminds us, is NOT the ONLY way to Jesus, but IS a sure fire way of coming close to Him.
She is the perfect model for our soul: Who knows Jesus better than the Mother who bore Him, tended and cared for Him: The Blessed Mother who willingly gave Her life and then the life of Her Beloved Son so that God’s will may be done and all humanity might be reunited with The Heavenly Father.
I hope this helps and we must remember that faith is a supernatural virtue:We pray that God’s light may shine upon us and enlighten us.
A child loves their mother not because of “fact”, but because they intrinsicly know and trust goodness itself.
God Bless.

 

[Miserissima]

look at the grammar of the full construction
Hail Holy Queen, Mother of Mercy, our life, our sweetness and our hope. the construction properly labels her for what she is, Mother of Mercy, that is, Mother of Jesus Christ, True God and True Man, who is Mercy, and who is our Life, our Sweetness, and our Hope. The reference IS to Jesus, not to her.

That’s how I"ve always taken it, and said so elsewhere here.

However, imagine my surprise when I read Father Serpa’s recent answer in AAA:

Hi,

Referring to Mary as our life, our sweetness and our hope is an example of hyperbole. Hyperbole is defined as an “obvious and intentional exaggeration” or “an extravagant statement or figure of speech not intended to be taken literally, as ‘to wait an eternity.’”

We honor her with such extravagance because the Father honored her by calling her to be the channel through which His Son would become man. Holy Mary, mother of God, pray for us.

Fr. Vincent Serpa, O.P.

 

[japhy]

That’s how I"ve always taken it, and said so elsewhere here. However, imagine my surprise when I read Father Serpa’s recent answer in AAA:

Right. The grammar in the English translation is ambiguous; the Latin grammar is not ambiguous:From the Latin, it is clear that Mary is being invoked as “Mother of mercy”, as “our life”, as “our sweetness”, and as “our hope”. Why?

Mater misericordiae is “Mother of-mercy”. Vita is not “of-life”, it is merely “life”. Dulcedo is not “of-sweetness”, it is merely “sweetness”. And spes is not “of-hope”, it is merely “hope”. And nostra is “our”, not “of-our”.

 

[Miserissima]

Right. The grammar in the English translation is ambiguous; the Latin grammar is not ambiguous:

I’m glad to see that my prior research wasn’t wasted!

It would still be easier to accept and understand that Mary is the “mother of mercy, [mother of] our life, [mother of] our sweetness, and [mother of] our hope,” but I just couldn’t find any supporting evidence for that.