The horrible lack of protection in U.S prsions

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It is not inconsistent the support the death penalty. It can be a just punishment. It protects men from further crimes, particularly violent crimes, by eliminating the source of all crime, a man with criminal intent. The death penalty can be used to protect innocent life.

I don’t think it is any contest. The US is by far and away the biggest jailer on the planet. Unless something has changed no one else is close in absolute numbers or rates.
We don’t need the death penalty to protect innocent life. What we do need is significantly improved protection of our inmates which will protect innocent life. That means we need a sufficient amount of guards that are armed with a variety of less then lethal weapons around every area where inmates are present. This way inmates will think twice before they decide to attack another inmate unless they want to receive some nasty looking bruises from rubber bullets.
 
We don’t need the death penalty to protect innocent life. What we do need is significantly improved protection of our inmates which will protect innocent life. That means we need a sufficient amount of guards that are armed with a variety of less then lethal weapons around every area where inmates are present. This way inmates will think twice before they decide to attack another inmate unless they want to receive some nasty looking bruises from rubber bullets.
Guards are also at risk of inmate attacks. I’m not sure that you can build a prison system that absolutely protects innocent life. Criminals are very ingenious. Some of the methods used to protect others in prison, isolation in particular, can lead to mental stress that actually encourages the prisoner to lash out. Are you aware of a prison system which never experiences an assault on guards or inmates?
 
Guards are also at risk of inmate attacks. I’m not sure that you can build a prison system that absolutely protects innocent life. Criminals are very ingenious. Some of the methods used to protect others in prison, isolation in particular, can lead to mental stress that actually encourages the prisoner to lash out. Are you aware of a prison system which never experiences an assault on guards or inmates?
I do not believe there is a prison system which never experiences an assault on guards or inmates, nor do I believe that will ever exist. What I do believe is that we can significantly reduce the assault rate for guards and prisoners. It may be true that guards are also at risk of being attacked, but I still believe that if we significantly beef up guard presence in the prisons then both the inmates and the guards will be safer. I believe that loads of inmates will decide it’s not so much of a good idea to try to attack the guards. This is because the guards will be armed with assault rifles and pistols loaded with rubber bullets that only fire in the hands of the guards thanks to modern technology. They would also be armed with tasers, batons, and pepper spray. I don’t know about you, but if I was an inmate in a prison that was loaded with guards that were armed with these kinds of weapons, then I would not even dream of attacking one of these guards even if I had a decent sized shank. Even if a group of inmates does attempt to attack these guards, then we could just develop a system where an emergency team of several guards in riot gear instantly come to help the guards who are being attacked. The government needs to use some taxpaying dollars to help make this a reality in our prisons.
 
It can only be said so many times: the technology doesn’t exist. While you’re hijacking taxpayer dollars to invent guns that only fire in guards’ hands, feel free to also build a time machine to go back in time to prevent the underlying crimes.

I’m sorry, but I’ll take a pass on any thread that can be distilled to “use taxpayer funds to create nonexistent technology for my pet project!” Social justice is different than dreaming of a taxpayer funded utopia.
 
Many people here are spouting off without real knowledge of the problem.

Mikekle: crimes against humanity for what happens in US prisons? The same prisons where prisoners misuse the courts by filing lawsuits because their free sneakers are Adidas and not Nike? The prisons where the prisoners get free access to law libraries so they can pursue these suits, or baselessly sue the prosecutors who prosecuted them?

Yet nary a word about, say, Russian or Chinese political prisons or the prison climates in places like the Middle East or Eastern Europe - or God forbid North Korea, where families are jailed or killed for (alleged) crimes committed by family members.

I can only say this with what respect I can muster: your post displays ignorance of reality vis a vis US prisons and those of the rest of the world.
Add one thing. When it comes to operations prisoners are at the front of the line. They will get that kidney before anyone else.
 
Humanity lacks in our prisons. A huge amount of assault and murder that takes place in this advanced country’s prisons is both preventable and disgusting. We shouldn’t be surprised since most of our prisons only have a handful of corecction officers per every few 100 inmates. If they see a decent sized fight take place, which is rare, they call in a team which usually arrive after some serious injuries occur. I believe that any one who has a decent moral compass and a sense of humanity should support significantly more correction officers who are armed with a sufficient amount of non lethal weapons. Imagine if every single area in the prison had multiple guards 24/7 armed with personalized assault weapons and pistols that fire rubber bullets, tasers, batons, and pepper spray. By the way, when I say “personalized” guns I mean technologically advanced guns that only fire in the hands of the officer. Anyway, if this was a reality in our prisons, then no inmate in their right mind would attack another inmate unless he was in the mood to revive some very nasty bruises from some non lethal rubber bullets. I don’t see why the rate of violence wouldn’t dramatically decrease if this was the case. I sincerely hope that you guys will make use of the Catholic Churches teaching on physical self defence and the defence of others and encourage some serious prison reform for the sake of humanity and safety of our guards and prisoners. The teaching of loving your enemy’s is also relevant when examining this issue in the U.S. prisons. I feel that there is such a disgusting lack of love and sympathy for these inmates. I could care less how horrible there crime was. NO ONE DESERVES THIS LACK OF PROTECTION! PERIOD.
We are not allowed to carry any weapons inside the fence. Any weapon we would carry could be taken and used by inmates. Even if weapons could only be used by officers, the ammunition would be. Inmates can be quite ingenious.
 
It can only be said so many times: the technology doesn’t exist. While you’re hijacking taxpayer dollars to invent guns that only fire in guards’ hands, feel free to also build a time machine to go back in time to prevent the underlying crimes.

I’m sorry, but I’ll take a pass on any thread that can be distilled to “use taxpayer funds to create nonexistent technology for my pet project!” Social justice is different than dreaming of a taxpayer funded utopia.
theverge.com/2014/5/5/5683504/gun-control-the-nra-wants-to-take-smart-guns-away

The technology certainly does exist!!! The link above shows how a pistol will not fire if it is 10 inches away from a wrist watch. Now I know that your thinking that the inmates will try to take the wrist watch of the guards. The thing is that wouldn’t happen because we could easily develop a sturdy wrist watch that only comes off a persons wrist if you type in a code. So if an inmate stole a guards assault rifle that was connected to a wrist watch he had on, all he would have to do is remain at least 10 inches from the inmate and pull out his secondary weapon (pistol) to defend himself. He could also make use of his taser, pepper spray, and baton to defend himself and press a button on his waist that would instantly send in several guards in riot gear. The waist button is currently a standard piece of equipment for our correction officers in the U.S.
 
We are not allowed to carry any weapons inside the fence. Any weapon we would carry could be taken and used by inmates. Even if weapons could only be used by officers, the ammunition would be. Inmates can be quite ingenious.
That policy should change for the safety of our inmates and guards. This county should make use of smart gun technology and provide correction officers with smart guns that fire rubber bullets. Tasers, pepper spray, and batons would not hurt either since the guards could use these less then lethal weapons to protect themselves and other inmates from violence. By the way, I noticed on your page that your a retired CO. Id like to sincerely thank you for your service. I also hope that your daughter Rachel gets better as soon as possible.

theverge.com/2014/5/5/5683504/gun-control-the-nra-wants-to-take-smart-guns-away
 
There’s nothing like personal experience to give a personal perspective. The recent book “Mr. Smith Goes to Prison,” is the account of a former state senator who spent about a year in prison. Even though it was a minimal security prison, it was enough to give him some ideas about prison reform. The incentives for inmates are all backward. They promote recidivism, promote crime, induce poverty, and make a person unfit for life outside of prison. The goal ought to be to make inmates less likely to be back, not more likely.

c-span.org/video/?328190-1/former-missouri-state-senator-jeff-smith-mr-smith-goes-prison

One thing I didn’t realize is that although prisoners do not have the right to vote, prison populations are counted for the purposes of congressional representation. Paradoxically, this gives districts an incentive to have prisons with high inmate populations.
 
That policy should change for the safety of our inmates and guards. This county should make use of smart gun technology and provide correction officers with smart guns that fire rubber bullets. Tasers, pepper spray, and batons would not hurt either since the guards could use these less then lethal weapons to protect themselves and other inmates from violence. By the way, I noticed on your page that your a retired CO. Id like to sincerely thank you for your service. I also hope that your daughter Rachel gets better as soon as possible.

theverge.com/2014/5/5/5683504/gun-control-the-nra-wants-to-take-smart-guns-away
Thank you for your concern.🙂

I was outnumbered 100 to 1. The last thing I wanted was a weapon of any kind. A weapon would have given them a reason to attack me. I agree with you on short staffing. Being forced to work double shifts makes for tired, angry, and less effective officers.
 
Jake21,
Your word isn’t good enough.
Where is your evidence the problem is at epidemic levels?

Also, these smart weapons you are imagining don’t exist in the real world.
No sane guard would agree to use a weapon that might not fire when needed, because they can’t provide a clean thumb print. All a con would need to do is smear a bit of oil or pudding on the weapon and it’s useless. Then they’d just cut off the guards finger and use the weapon against other guards/inmates.

As we’ve seen with police, there is a high risk of overusing stun devices when they are not required and they are not 100% effective when you really do need it to work.
I do not believe there is a prison system which never experiences an assault on guards or inmates, nor do I believe that will ever exist. What I do believe is that we can significantly reduce the assault rate for guards and prisoners. It may be true that guards are also at risk of being attacked, but I still believe that if we significantly beef up guard presence in the prisons then both the inmates and the guards will be safer. I believe that loads of inmates will decide it’s not so much of a good idea to try to attack the guards. This is because the guards will be armed with assault rifles and pistols loaded with rubber bullets that only fire in the hands of the guards thanks to modern technology. They would also be armed with tasers, batons, and pepper spray. I don’t know about you, but if I was an inmate in a prison that was loaded with guards that were armed with these kinds of weapons, then I would not even dream of attacking one of these guards even if I had a decent sized shank. Even if a group of inmates does attempt to attack these guards, then we could just develop a system where an emergency team of several guards in riot gear instantly come to help the guards who are being attacked. The government needs to use some taxpaying dollars to help make this a reality in our prisons.
 
Jake21,
Your word isn’t good enough.
Where is your evidence the problem is at epidemic levels?

Also, these smart weapons you are imagining don’t exist in the real world.
No sane guard would agree to use a weapon that might not fire when needed, because they can’t provide a clean thumb print. All a con would need to do is smear a bit of oil or pudding on the weapon and it’s useless. Then they’d just cut off the guards finger and use the weapon against other guards/inmates.

As we’ve seen with police, there is a high risk of overusing stun devices when they are not required and they are not 100% effective when you really do need it to work.
I’m not imagining these smart weapons. These weapons I’m describing already exist. There is a pistol called the armatix ip1 which will not fire if it is 10 inches away from a wrist watch that comes with the gun. Now I know that you’re thinking that the inmates will try to take the wrist watch of the guards. The thing is that wouldn’t happen because we could easily invent a sturdy wrist watch that only comes off a person’s wrist if you type in a code. To be honest, I think a decent amount of inmates will not try something that risky to their wellbeing. Plus multiple guards armed with guns may look very intimidating for a decent amount of the inmates. With that being said, if an inmate stole a guards assault rifle that was connected to a wrist watch he had on, all he would have to do is remain at least 10 inches from the inmate or instantly deactivate his watch. He could then make use of his taser, pepper spray, and baton to defend himself and press a button on his waist that would instantly send in several emergency guards in riot gear. The waist button is currently a standard piece of equipment for our correction officers in the U.S.

I understand your concern of excessive use of tasers, but I think we can emphasize in training for COs and police officers that we should only use them when absolutely necessary. I will admit that I have heard of some cases where the tasers have had no effect on individuals, but I’ve never heard of a report that said these cases commonly occur.

theverge.com/2014/5/5/5683504/gun-control-the-nra-wants-to-take-smart-guns-away
 
Perhaps. Nevertheless, if anyone is truly pro-life I don’t see how its possible to support capital punishment. If you are pro-life you must be pro-life consistently. That means no abortion, no abortifacient contraception, no capital punishment, and no violence of any kind except in self-defense or to protect innocent life.

The Holy Father himself agrees with me here. Regardless of the state of our prison system, capital punishment needs to be abolished yesterday.
Thankfully, it’s not. And it should be used more.
 
You are trying to solve problems we don’t have.
Guards aren’t in the habit of losing their guns to inmates, but it did happen your solution wouldn’t stop the inmate from shooting the guard with his own gun.

FYI, make a tinfoil undershirt and you’ve shorted out a stun device.
**
Where is your evidence of epidemic abuse?!?!**
I’m not imagining these smart weapons. These weapons I’m describing already exist. There is a pistol called the armatix ip1 which will not fire if it is 10 inches away from a wrist watch that comes with the gun. Now I know that you’re thinking that the inmates will try to take the wrist watch of the guards. The thing is that wouldn’t happen because we could easily invent a sturdy wrist watch that only comes off a person’s wrist if you type in a code. To be honest, I think a decent amount of inmates will not try something that risky to their wellbeing. Plus multiple guards armed with guns may look very intimidating for a decent amount of the inmates. With that being said, if an inmate stole a guards assault rifle that was connected to a wrist watch he had on, all he would have to do is remain at least 10 inches from the inmate or instantly deactivate his watch. He could then make use of his taser, pepper spray, and baton to defend himself and press a button on his waist that would instantly send in several emergency guards in riot gear. The waist button is currently a standard piece of equipment for our correction officers in the U.S.

I understand your concern of excessive use of tasers, but I think we can emphasize in training for COs and police officers that we should only use them when absolutely necessary. I will admit that I have heard of some cases where the tasers have had no effect on individuals, but I’ve never heard of a report that said these cases commonly occur.

theverge.com/2014/5/5/5683504/gun-control-the-nra-wants-to-take-smart-guns-away
 
This is a very interesting thread. Thank you for posting it! I am in favor of the creation of non-lethal weaponry for police officers for similar reasons. I think in a prison situation weaponry or other devices meant to “disable” the combatants could be implemented to prevent or limit such riots. Here is an example:

en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dazzler_(weapon

en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Active_Denial_System

In fact, the ADS is already in use in the Pitchess detention facility in Los Angeles.
 
You are trying to solve problems we don’t have.
Guards aren’t in the habit of losing their guns to inmates, but it did happen your solution wouldn’t stop the inmate from shooting the guard with his own gun.

FYI, make a tinfoil undershirt and you’ve shorted out a stun device.
**
Where is your evidence of epidemic abuse?!?!**
I can’t give you any evidence of epidemic abuse in our prisons, but if there are any prisons that hold serious offenders in the U.S that lack this kind of protection, then I believe there is a serious problem. It opens the door for tragedies like these to occur.

vice.com/read/how-to-protect-yourself-from-violence-in-prison-722

I strongly believe that the horrible stories of violence told in that article could have been prevented if we had the kind of protection I suggest. This protection I suggest would keep our correction officers and inmates who want to mind their own business and follow the rules safe from violence. I don’t believe the correction officers should be armed with a variety of less than lethal weapons. That simply wouldn’t be necessary. The people who should be armed with a variety of less than lethal weapons are guards dressed in body armor from head to toe that stand against the walls or above the inmate’s heads on watch towers. Multiple guards should be in every area in the prison where inmates are present. Any inmate who makes the horrible mistake of trying to harm another would instantly be shot at with less than lethal rubber bullets. I strongly believe the intimidating presence of these guards would make several inmates think twice before trying to harm another inmate or correction officer.

Would if an inmate tries to snatch the firearm from the guard, aren’t these guards being armed with firearms a disaster waiting to happen?

It would not be the end of the world in the unlikely event that an inmate successfully snatches a firearm from a guard. This is because technology like this exist.

theverge.com/2014/5/5/5683504/gun-control-the-nra-wants-to-take-smart-guns-away

Similar to the pistol in the link, all the guard would have to do is move a short distance of at least ten inches away from the inmate and deactivate his wrist watch that’s connected to the firearm. The guard would have to type in a code to turn the watch back on. The watch would also be extremely sturdy and would require a code to detach from his wrist.

Why would a whole group of inmates trying to attack these guards be a rare occurrence?

Because any one with common sense knows that they have a 99 percent chance of instantly being shot multiple times if they try something that stupid. All it takes is a split second reaction and the pull of a trigger to fire rubber bullets that cause a substantial amount of pain. Are inmates really willing to experience that excruciating amount of pain just too successfully beat up a guard? Keep in mind that these guards would also be able to press a button on their waist that instantly sends in an emergency team of people in riot gear to help handle the situation. These waist buttons are currently used by some COs in the U.S.

Wouldn’t guards being armed with these weapons give the inmates an even greater incentive to attack?

I think there fear of receiving wounds from rubber bullets would almost always be stronger then there desire to steal their weapons. Plus you have the waist button in case rare emergencies like that occur.
 
There’s nothing like personal experience to give a personal perspective. The recent book “Mr. Smith Goes to Prison,” is the account of a former state senator who spent about a year in prison. Even though it was a minimal security prison, it was enough to give him some ideas about prison reform. The incentives for inmates are all backward. They promote recidivism, promote crime, induce poverty, and make a person unfit for life outside of prison. The goal ought to be to make inmates less likely to be back, not more likely.

c-span.org/video/?328190-1/former-missouri-state-senator-jeff-smith-mr-smith-goes-prison

One thing I didn’t realize is that although prisoners do not have the right to vote, prison populations are counted for the purposes of congressional representation. Paradoxically, this gives districts an incentive to have prisons with high inmate populations.
Yes, you are right, but if you notice the idea is not to rehabilitate them, if that was the case, lawmakers would ensure they have the tools needed to achieve that, but instead, barriers of all kinds are put on people who have done their sentence, they will find it almost impossible to get hired on somewhere and make sure they pay for LIFE for that crime.

What better way to ensure someone has to resort to criminal activity than to take away their ability to even get a legitimate job?
 
What better way to ensure someone has to resort to criminal activity than to take away their ability to even get a legitimate job?
The vast majority of jobs are private. The ability to get a particular job is not something that is usually taken away, except maybe by the one being convicted. The commission of certain crimes, by their nature, bar entry into some fields. I do not know what you are calling a “legitimate” job, but not all jobs are affected equally, which is why some manual labor and construction jobs are open to those previously convicted of crime.
 
The vast majority of jobs are private. The ability to get a particular job is not something that is usually taken away, except maybe by the one being convicted. The commission of certain crimes, by their nature, bar entry into some fields. I do not know what you are calling a “legitimate” job, but not all jobs are affected equally, which is why some manual labor and construction jobs are open to those previously convicted of crime.
IDK about that, Im a corporate rep for a gas station/ convenience store chain, I know for a fact to even be hired on as a cashier, at minimum wage, they do background checks on ALL new hires, and will not hire if there is any felony convictions, no matter when they happened or the severity.

This is actually a big problem for my company, we are very short staffed in all the states we have locations due to this policy, usually only about 10% of applicants can pass the BG check and drug test, They are considering lowering their hiring standards but I will believe that when I see it.

Another policy I find curious is anyone convicted of a drug related offense, they cannot receive any financial aid for vocational training or college, again, even if the offense was 20 yrs ago, does not matter, yet people with murder and sexual convictions, can receive this aid, drug crimes are the number one reason why the US has so many prisons and inmates, knowing this, wouldnt it be common sense to ensure these people are able to get some kind of aid to go back to school? Wouldnt that be in everyones best interest?
 
Another policy I find curious is anyone convicted of a drug related offense, they cannot receive any financial aid for vocational training or college, again, even if the offense was 20 yrs ago, does not matter, yet people with murder and sexual convictions, can receive this aid, drug crimes are the number one reason why the US has so many prisons and inmates, knowing this, wouldnt it be common sense to ensure these people are able to get some kind of aid to go back to school?
I feel that double-standard perturbing. Vocational education and training can be a key strategy in reducing recidivism and encouraging rehabilitation and reintegration into society. While I feel that providing a college education may be seen as unfair, providing vocational schooling, literacy lessons and teaching trades all seem like sensible policies (though the jobs outside of prison have to exist). If there are of loads of potential Jean Val jeans sitting in our jails and prisons right now, wouldn’t you want to jump and help them become who they can be.
 
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